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Does it matter if we can't withdraw our CPF
Am I missing something?
I thought those who reach 55 years old - can withdraw everything out of Ordinary account, Special account - except we got to keep $181,000 in Retirement account (to be kept as gratutity - for withdrawal at the age of 65 years per month) and keep about $50,000 over in Medisave.
Who say Singaporeans cannot withdraw their CPF at 55 years old?
Many Singaporeans are not withdrawing their CPF - because of the "super high" interest rate and guaranteed, safe instrument to accumulate more wealth ---- as compared to the interest rate outside which is much lower.
I thought those who reach 55 years old - can withdraw everything out of Ordinary account, Special account - except we got to keep $181,000 in Retirement account (to be kept as gratutity - for withdrawal at the age of 65 years per month) and keep about $50,000 over in Medisave.
Who say Singaporeans cannot withdraw their CPF at 55 years old?
Many Singaporeans are not withdrawing their CPF - because of the "super high" interest rate and guaranteed, safe instrument to accumulate more wealth ---- as compared to the interest rate outside which is much lower.
In fact, some Singaporeans who wrongly believed in this fake news - draw all their CPF out - and then regret later when they discover they can't get instrument that are safe and earn so much interest.
They tried to put it back into CPF - but CPF stop it (as they are limited to annual certain cap - for voluntary contribution).
They tried to put it back into CPF - but CPF stop it (as they are limited to annual certain cap - for voluntary contribution).
Assuming, Government give back all the Retirement amount of $181,000 and Medisave of say $50,000 at 55 years old.
(1) How long can $231,000 last?
- Assume $2,000 is needed for 2 old couple per month.
- That means, it will last 9.6 years --- up to 65 years old.
- If both couple live up to 85 years old - then for 20 years - the couple will have nothing left.
- Then what do you expect the couple to do --- expect Government (which is the rest of taxpayer money to feed this 2 couples for another 20 years old?
- A responsible Government will not allow this to happen !
(2) Thus the Government will encourage people to continue working up to 62 or even to 67 years old - to earn enough savings - so that old couple can live until 85 years old.
(3) At the same time, by putting $181,000 into Retirement account - it is a compulsory gratuity insurance to ensure that people will get monthly payout from 65 years old onwards untill a person passed away --- at least people have money to put food onto the table - without having to rely on Government (taxpayer) money to feed them --- which is irresponsible.
This is a responsible Government.
(4) Also by putting aside money for Medisave - can help to pay Medishield insurance for hospitalisation and pay for medical fees during old age - ensuring people have money to take care of their old aged.
And this is a responsible Government.
(1) How long can $231,000 last?
- Assume $2,000 is needed for 2 old couple per month.
- That means, it will last 9.6 years --- up to 65 years old.
- If both couple live up to 85 years old - then for 20 years - the couple will have nothing left.
- Then what do you expect the couple to do --- expect Government (which is the rest of taxpayer money to feed this 2 couples for another 20 years old?
- A responsible Government will not allow this to happen !
(2) Thus the Government will encourage people to continue working up to 62 or even to 67 years old - to earn enough savings - so that old couple can live until 85 years old.
(3) At the same time, by putting $181,000 into Retirement account - it is a compulsory gratuity insurance to ensure that people will get monthly payout from 65 years old onwards untill a person passed away --- at least people have money to put food onto the table - without having to rely on Government (taxpayer) money to feed them --- which is irresponsible.
This is a responsible Government.
(4) Also by putting aside money for Medisave - can help to pay Medishield insurance for hospitalisation and pay for medical fees during old age - ensuring people have money to take care of their old aged.
And this is a responsible Government.
A Government who is not doing anything - to ensure Singaporeans have money for old age for retirement and for medical care ---- is a irresponsible Government - as suggested by some Singaporeans --- demanding all CPF to be return.
Else we will see many old beggars on the street starting to beg after 65 years old - when they use up all their CPF at 65 years old - if Government return all the CPF money in Retirement account and medisave account ---- and will create a huge social problem in Singapore.
In fact, all CPF money are returned at 55 years old - minus sum set aside for retirement and sum set aside for medisave.
Else we will see many old beggars on the street starting to beg after 65 years old - when they use up all their CPF at 65 years old - if Government return all the CPF money in Retirement account and medisave account ---- and will create a huge social problem in Singapore.
In fact, all CPF money are returned at 55 years old - minus sum set aside for retirement and sum set aside for medisave.
Most of the time, those people who are complaining - and who want to withdraw all their CPF at 55 years ---- are those who are the most vulnerable and who are the most financially strapped and need the CPF protection at old age.
By releasing all the CPF (retirement and medisave) - will not help this group of people --- but in fact hurt them most if they used it all up or wasted it away.
Whereas for some minority - as matter of principle - they can withdraw all their CPF (including retirement account and medisave) - by rescinding their citizenship and migrate --- then they can get all the CPF back ---- and will not pose social problem to Singapore or need taxpayer money to help them if they used up all their money.
By releasing all the CPF (retirement and medisave) - will not help this group of people --- but in fact hurt them most if they used it all up or wasted it away.
Whereas for some minority - as matter of principle - they can withdraw all their CPF (including retirement account and medisave) - by rescinding their citizenship and migrate --- then they can get all the CPF back ---- and will not pose social problem to Singapore or need taxpayer money to help them if they used up all their money.
Else taxpayers will have to pay very high GST, income tax etc --- to feed this people who used up all their savings and cpf ---- which will be very unfair to all the Singaporeans at large.
Imagine taxpayers need to pay additional tax of S$46.2 billion to feed 200,000 old people if these 200,000 old people waste all their CPF money at 65 years old and have to live up to 85 years old.
Which Government in the right mind will allow this to happen - putting such a heavy burden on all Singaporean taxpayers?
Thus this Government has been a responsible Government - and won't allow this to happen.
Like · Reply · 1m · Edited
Hng G Lau
Ricky Lim "Am I missing something"- problem is the changing cpf interest rates. Last time OA interest rates was >6% till 1985 and plunged further in 1999. And now 2.5%. sporeans >50 worked through those years with lower salary than today and are hit hardest. As announced in Parliament a huge% now are getting<$500/mth.. the least the givt should do is to increase interest rates for MA. And also not allow rates to fluctuate so badly with market forces as in the 2000s. GIC vs CPF
Ricky Lim
Hng G Lau - In 1985, Singapore experience a deep recession where growth fall into minus territory.
Wages are too high and our cost are too high.
If 6% is given to CPF Ordinary Account and other accounts = S$384 billion x 6% = $23 billion need to be given each year.
That means the Government need to charge 10% of interest on all loans - housing loan, CPF loan, Government loan etc to borrowers like banks, business, individuals - in order to give CPF interest at 6%.
Can Singapore Economy sustain and survive under such high interest rate - without causing Singapore Economy to go into recession, drive business bankrupt and jobs loss?
Suggest for those who does not have sufficient income despite receiving CPF monthly gratutity payout to look for some full-time or part-time jobs designed for elderly.
Monthly income of at least $1,800 and above is not a problem.
Wages are too high and our cost are too high.
If 6% is given to CPF Ordinary Account and other accounts = S$384 billion x 6% = $23 billion need to be given each year.
That means the Government need to charge 10% of interest on all loans - housing loan, CPF loan, Government loan etc to borrowers like banks, business, individuals - in order to give CPF interest at 6%.
Can Singapore Economy sustain and survive under such high interest rate - without causing Singapore Economy to go into recession, drive business bankrupt and jobs loss?
Suggest for those who does not have sufficient income despite receiving CPF monthly gratutity payout to look for some full-time or part-time jobs designed for elderly.
Monthly income of at least $1,800 and above is not a problem.
Like · Reply · 1m · Edited
Hng G Lau
Ricky Lim actually I respect your attempt to reason with numbers. But in all honesty, only a select few, not even some ministers have access to the actual data let alone you and i. Rem IT was only recently that tharman revealed that GIC invests cpf $. Which makes it impossible for anyone to suggest a solution and any numbers is just second guessing. So in the overall scheme of things, the problem is when Josephine teo announced 74% receives <<$500/mth. Those who feel cpf is enough don't really need it to be honest.
Hng G Lau
Ricky Lim actually I respect your attempt to reason with numbers. But in all honesty, only a select few, not even some ministers have access to the actual data let alone you and i. Rem IT was only recently that tharman revealed that GIC invests cpf $. Which makes it impossible for anyone to suggest a solution and any numbers is just second guessing. So in the overall scheme of things, the problem is when Josephine teo announced 74% receives <<$500/mth. Those who feel cpf is enough don't really need it to be honest.
Like · Reply · 18h
Ricky Lim
Hng G Lau -
Thought the CPF retirement sum payout is a fixed published figure?
How is it related to GIC investment?
You seems to have confused the promised retirement sum payout by the Government and how GIC invest to bring more NIRC (Net Investment Return Contribution).
As Singaporeans public at large - we just need to be concerned with what we received after 65 years old - and not worried about how the Government grow our wealth.
1. Basic Retirement Sum $88,000 ----- Monthly payout after 65 years old = $730 - $790.
2. Full Retirement Sum $176,000 ----- Monthly payout after 65 years old = $1,350 - $1,450.
3. Enhanced Retirement Sum $264,000 ----- Monthly payout after 65 years old = $1,960 - $2,110.
As contribution has revised upward recently to 2. $181,000 - payout may be higher.
Thought the CPF retirement sum payout is a fixed published figure?
How is it related to GIC investment?
You seems to have confused the promised retirement sum payout by the Government and how GIC invest to bring more NIRC (Net Investment Return Contribution).
As Singaporeans public at large - we just need to be concerned with what we received after 65 years old - and not worried about how the Government grow our wealth.
1. Basic Retirement Sum $88,000 ----- Monthly payout after 65 years old = $730 - $790.
2. Full Retirement Sum $176,000 ----- Monthly payout after 65 years old = $1,350 - $1,450.
3. Enhanced Retirement Sum $264,000 ----- Monthly payout after 65 years old = $1,960 - $2,110.
As contribution has revised upward recently to 2. $181,000 - payout may be higher.
Like · Reply · 1m
Hng G Lau
Ricky Lim you didn't get my last response at all. In any case, your last reply is rather shocking. ""promised retirement sum payout by the G"" I hope you're not thinking everyone is getting that amount... Again, 74% sg is getting <<$500/mth as the Govt announced this week.. so all the basic retirement sum you pasted is simply irrelevant because most sg don't even have that amount in their cpf. Less than $500/mth. What do you think about this figure? Meet the mission of cpf?
Hng G Lau
Ricky Lim says " the promised retirement sum payout by the Government"" - Ricky, sorry again but this is serious, hope you clarify this with a close kin for your own retirement.
Like · Reply · 19h
Ricky Lim
Hng G Lau - There are 3 options :-
(1) More than 90% of Singaporeans own a flat, upon retirement if anyone does not have sufficient money for retirement - Singaporeans can sell their flat back to the Government for a lease or sell the bigger flat and buy a smaller flat and use the money for retirement (as their CPF money is lock up in the flat).
(2) Singaporeans can look for job and work until 67 years old - as there are jobs for elderly.
(3) Singaporeans must saved enough for retirement such as saving through insurance with gratutity and other means or put money into CPF for retirement account and let the Government save on our behalf.
(1) More than 90% of Singaporeans own a flat, upon retirement if anyone does not have sufficient money for retirement - Singaporeans can sell their flat back to the Government for a lease or sell the bigger flat and buy a smaller flat and use the money for retirement (as their CPF money is lock up in the flat).
(2) Singaporeans can look for job and work until 67 years old - as there are jobs for elderly.
(3) Singaporeans must saved enough for retirement such as saving through insurance with gratutity and other means or put money into CPF for retirement account and let the Government save on our behalf.
Ho Weiwei
Singaporean should able to draw out our cpf money why they wanted to control is our money not their money we ownself cannot control he think we all kindergarden children in many country they draw out their cpf money and all the old man very happy life you see singapore they control you see singapore old man and women whole ownself cant control still need to work pap should walk around and cover their face if the pap parent working like this see how their feeling
Ho Weiwei
Setting aside every have interest you should give back to us why add inside if i draw out all the money from cpf i put in the bank end of the year i still can draw out the interest to support my family but now pap hold same as we are in prison waiting to hand cant touch anything
Ricky Lim
If you draw out all the CPF savings and keep it in the bank for interest to feed yourself - then you will not be able to last beyond 70 years old.
(1) A bank highest interest (in good time) now is about 2%.
For $231,000 - it will give you $4,620 - which can last you only for 2.5 months - and then you need to draw from your capital of $231,000 - and the ability for you to earn interest keep depleting over the years.
So when you reach 65 years old all your capital will have been depleted - are you expecting the Government to use taxpayers money to feed you?
(2) When keep with CPF Retirement account - If set aside $161,000 in CPF retirement account - the final total payout is $317,000 - and this will be paid over the lives of CPF older every month from 65 years old onwards until he/she passed away.
And every year, your CPF Retirement account will draw interest of 6, 5 and 4% - higher than any bank intersest outside that will go into your Ordinary account that you can withdraw.
So a simple math already prove that you can't handle your money by yourself - and indeed your thinking is like kindergarden.
(1) A bank highest interest (in good time) now is about 2%.
For $231,000 - it will give you $4,620 - which can last you only for 2.5 months - and then you need to draw from your capital of $231,000 - and the ability for you to earn interest keep depleting over the years.
So when you reach 65 years old all your capital will have been depleted - are you expecting the Government to use taxpayers money to feed you?
(2) When keep with CPF Retirement account - If set aside $161,000 in CPF retirement account - the final total payout is $317,000 - and this will be paid over the lives of CPF older every month from 65 years old onwards until he/she passed away.
And every year, your CPF Retirement account will draw interest of 6, 5 and 4% - higher than any bank intersest outside that will go into your Ordinary account that you can withdraw.
So a simple math already prove that you can't handle your money by yourself - and indeed your thinking is like kindergarden.
Lawrence Seow
The issue here is CPF is our money. The government has no right to decide for us what to do with it. If even this simple point cannot be understood or agreed upon, then people are really stupid. If a citizen chooses to withdraw everything and then squander it all, that is a separate issue altogether. We must not confuse or connect the two.
Lau Lan Chu
Why not? CPF is a scheme that replace the old pension scheme that goes with the retirement age. If retirement age change the withdrawal age should follow suit. If CPF is our money why don't government let us withdraw our CPF at any time as everyone has his different needs. I need a sum of money to set up my own business at my 30's can I use my CPF? So this argument cannot stands.
Lawrence Seow
Lau Lan Chu why did they stop the pension scheme? Answer this and you get your answers
Sebastian Png
Let put it simple ,if you got no money in your cpf ,you think the gov going to feed you
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