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Singapore reported 42 new locally transmitted COVID-19 infections as of noon on Thursday (Jul 15), of which 34 belong to the KTV lounge cluster.The licences for three food and beverage operators, which had previously been nightlife establishments, have been revoked for multiple breaches. In addition, 11 outlets and 31 individuals were fined for such breaches.
What do you think of the recent cluster of community cases? What more can we do to encourage those who have not been vaccinated to do so?
In the light of the growing KTV lounge Covid-19 cluster, the multi-ministry task force on Covid-19 is deliberating what additional measures to take, and will give an update soon, said its co-chairman Minister Lawrence Wong on Thursday (July 15).
In a Facebook post, Minister Lawrence Wong wrote, "Cases like these demonstrate how, in times of crisis, personal responsibility matters. No man is an island. The choices we make for ourselves are the choices we make for our community."
He also strongly urged those who had been to such pivoted KTV lounges to "do the right thing - get yourself tested, and isolate yourself".
๐ https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/34-more-cases-in-growing-ktv-cluster-covid-19-task-force-considering-extra-curbs
๐ https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/health/2-ktv-lounges-at-selegie-closed-due-to-likely-ongoing-covid-19-transmission-34-new
๐ https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/license-for-3-fb-outlets-former-nightlife-operators-revoked-11-others-fined
๐ https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/health/confidential-covid-19-tests-for-those-who-visited-ktv-lounges-interacted-with
[10:19 am, 16/07/2021] +Valli: Authorities should enforce stricter checks on short term & long term pass application.
There are misuse & abuse by applicants to use this loophole to gain employment illegally.
[10:22 am, 16/07/2021] +Caleb: I think should ban these KTV f&b from 1030pm. Like alcohol
[10:30 am, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: Didn’t have a chance to reply to this previously … so ..
As you may have correctly noted, these establishments tend to be run by shady characters who would find other illicit means to make money.
Is it not better then, to offer them a legitimate and safe option that the Authorities have oversight and control? How is limiting their options to only illicit ones better?
Realistically, rather than idealistically, “they” will not go away just because you to shut 1 door on them.
You probably are thinking, then we will just arrest them all and get rid of these “pests”… but how is it any better to force someone into a (bad) corner, only to then turn around and insist they pay for choosing the wrong choice?
Also, don’t be naive and think that these men (who visit sleazy joints) will turn saintly just because you remove such establishments. People are in general adaptable. You take away 1 option, they will find another - sometimes not better - alternative to survive/prosper.
[10:44 am, 16/07/2021] +Smiley face: "... thats why they legalise geylang and open 2 casinos...all these are necessary evils. There are NO CASINOS on this planet that has no vice. Its an open secret. Arrest and cease are just sideshows to appease the ignorant sheeps..."
[10:48 am, 16/07/2021] +Alvin Lim: I'm surprised that boyfriend/girlfriend are considered familial ties.
[10:49 am, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: I think the problem with Singapore, is that we are excellent on paper. Our Ministers are smart and efficient and most times, can come up with the right measures quickly. Where we always tend to fail, is on the ground. Execution and enforcement. That's where we seem to fail.
The best laid plans are useless, in fact counterproductive because it can create a false sense of security, when the execution don't match up.
[10:56 am, 16/07/2021] +Alvin Lim: I agree and some fall guy is set up to take the rap
[11:43 am, 16/07/2021] +Smiley face: TO: Distinguished - - Min LAW, Min MHF, Min MOM and All Honorable Members
RELOOK and REWRITE immigration laws and anti vice laws pertaining to allow foreign visitors to stay more than 14 days (excluding 14 days Q).
IMPOSE big ticket penalties from $100,000 onwards and jailable time of up to 24 months for" Runner/Proxy", for "boss" the penalty shall be THRIPLED from the basic rule.
Violators of foreign visiting permit shall be banned from entry for 50 years, finger prints and bio data to be documented for these offenders. The spouse or adult family members MAY subject to same treatments of the violated laws pending on further investigations.
WHISTLE BLOWER(S) will be rewarded according to the paid summons issued by the proper court. Upon collected money, the judge will issue an order for a amount of no more than 10% of the summoned money to the whistle blower(s) a contingent amount to be shared or single award.
For larger haul of "the BOSS" level offenders, the whistle blower(s) shall be awarded up to 25% of the court summoned money.
Warehouse, Industrial Park, Condominium and Bungalow will be the SWEET SPOTS for these vice activities-a RESET, a new Locale. For each location caters to each socioeconomics clientรจle with the highest valued and descreet lots available inside a bungalow!
There is a need to INCENTIVISE members of the public to be civic citizens to report such illegal activities with it vice, drugs or more serious offences!
The nature of such underground activities require BLITZ OPERATIONS to apprehend at speed beyond the "operator" aware of it. Proposd setting up of a new POLICE BLITZ task force (PBF) taken from the tactical force members, is a good training besides its main purpose for counter-terrorism initiatives. This PBF will OVERRIDE the current Anti - Vice perimeters and jurisdiction!
https://www.straitstimes.com/asia/se-asia/malaysia-reports-new-daily-record-of-13215-new-covid-19-cases Delta variants can just infect someone in 15 seconds - Director General Health of Malaysia say - as it is airborne.
R0 for Delta variants is 5 to 8.
That means 1 person can transmit to 5 to 8 person.
If Malaysia Director General of Health is correct - within 15 seconds, 5 to 8 person will be infected.
So only 2 jabs Vaccination can help to slow the spread and protect ourselves from developing severe illness.
Based on R0 of 8 - 82% need to be vaccinated to gain herd immunity to curb Delta variants transmission.
Thus only mass vaccination can help us to enter into endemic stage.
[0:19 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ: https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/asia/covid-19-clusters-ktv-nightlife-overseas-15225952 Nightlife clusters is the major source of outbreak in Asia.
In South Korea, whereby nightclub outbreak occur - nobody want to come forward because nobody want to be identified.
Authorities had to resort to combing through mobile phone data, credit card statements and CCTV footage to identify nearly 2,000 people who were not contactable.
Singapore to ring-fence this KTV cluster - may have to resort to similar techniques to contact trace close contact - before it spread out of control to the large community.
1. Comb mobile phone data
2. CCTV footage
3. Credit card statements
4. Tracetogether data for those that carry them.
Without water tight contact tracing - it will not be possible to effectively ring-fence.
And it may spread to the community in every corner stealthily.
Singapore will have to adopt the same technique similar to zero day attack - when we first detected our 1st covid case.
Now driving center, hawker centre satay man, kindergarten.
And don't know where else.
Got to use the primitive way to contact trace - and hopefully bring it down to single digit and zero again.
[0:37 pm, 16/07/2021] +YT: Spreading to the community in every corner stealthily will be inevitable, especially when there sympathizers of these rule breakers. Even in this forum, there are still people speaking up for those who break the rules. So, in my opinion, it would be inevitable since there are still people who believe that the virus won't affect them or that only a small number of people are affected and it's ok.
[1:00 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Do we have any data on the recent cases? How many were vaccinated? How many are ill? Have they infected any others and if so are they ill?
[1:00 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: We seem obsessed with the number regardless of the consequence.
[1:01 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: 50 cases sounds like a lot, but if they are all vaccinated, aren't ill and not spreading it, do we really care?
[1:03 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: I'm not saying saying be reckless, or not take action, I'm just asking if we know the consequence if these new cases.
[1:03 pm, 16/07/2021] +Boon: Dear REACH, in the additional measures, pls don’t punish Singapore and Singapore business because of our open border policy. If we choose to allow short term visitors and dependents, the first question is whether if our border Covid controls are sufficient, timely and fit for purpose. The Changi airport episode shows it’s not necessary this case. So, pls focus on how to better tighten/refine our visitor filters and not seek to punish Singapore biz and people as your default measure.
[1:04 pm, 16/07/2021] +Boon: If an infection cluster occurs in a KTV, and we would ban all KTV, then, why didn’t we ban Changi airport and hawker centers that also had their fair share of Covid infections and clusters?
[1:04 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: It's very easy to just tighten restrictions, and use case numbers as a reason. However it is very damaging to business and might not make much difference. That's why we need data and not just case numbers.
If 59% are either unvaccinated or received only 1 jab - and we let Delta variants spread - is not only reckless but irresponsible.
Even Ministers are frustrated and disappointed by the KTV cluster - and may introduce additional measures to arrest the KTV cluster.
https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/task-force-to-give-update-soon-as-ktv-covid-19-cluster-grows-lawrence-wong
[1:19 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ: https://www.straitstimes.com/world/europe/biden-keeps-us-travel-ban-on-europeans-despite-pleas-for-easing-it EU unhappy with Biden for travel ban to US - due to Delta variants.
[1:19 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ: https://sg.yahoo.com/news/delta-variants-rise-plunges-europe-into-uncertainty-and-offers-a-warning-to-the-us-090002409.html
Delta variant's rise plunges Europe into uncertainty — and offers a warning to the U.S.
https://sg.news.yahoo.com/hundreds-doctors-scientists-attack-johnson-194946260.html
Hundreds of doctors and scientists against freedom Day.
Freedom Day without achieving mass vaccination - herd immunity > 80% - is not only reckless but irresponsible.
We are risking 59% people's life.
[1:32 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: Yup....sounds fishy. Wonder if any under-table transactions took place. ๐ค
[1:34 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ: https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1462170/Covid-deaths-UK-latest-cases-coronavirus-news-variant-vaccine-lockdown-end-Freedom-Day UK Freedom day cause infection number to spike and covid death to spike. This is the price paid for being reckless and irresponsible - when herd immunity through mass vaccination of >80% is not achieved.
Saying that endemic can be right and wrong depending on when it is said.
My comments: Yes.
Everything must be based on math and science.
Cannot suka suka open means open - like try try.
We cannot afford to take people's lives to try.
Everything must be based on scientific facts and math.
Only until we have reached mass vaccination > 80% herd immunity - then we can no need to just look at infection number, but also at hospital number, oxygen support, ICU and death number - as we declare endemic.
By doing so prematurely - are risking 59% of our population lives - and disregarding science and math in formulating our public health policy.
[2:42 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Is anyone saying we should let this spread?
[2:44 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Providing infection number is still paramount if our mass vaccination has not reached > 80%.
[2:44 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Ignoring infection number now is a fatal mistake.
[2:46 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
No countries in the West is ignoring infection number.
We will be the first one to do so - if we ignore infection number.
[2:48 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Because it will defeat our ability to trace, test and ring-fence if we ignore infection number and source of cluster outbreak.
[2:50 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Eg if 1 week then report infection - it will be all over Singapore already.
[2:57 pm, 16/07/2021] +jimmy chew: I think we should be tracking hospitalizations numbers rather than covid-19 infection. It may be mild and not deadly like the flu virus. We don't announce how many citizen's got flu daily ❤️
[2:57 pm, 16/07/2021] +Caleb: ๐
[2:58 pm, 16/07/2021] +Boon: ๐
[3:00 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Let see what additional measures the MTF announce to curb this KTV cluster.
[3:01 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
I think we can trust the government to adopt rational measures based on math and science.
[3:05 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Good that the government is still tracking the infection number by the day - and detected the KTV cluster.
[3:08 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Good that the MTF will come out with counter measures to curb the KTV cluster.
This is a competent and responsible government!
Not a reckless one - not based on math and science.
[3:19 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: I may be wrong, but I think the Govt did not say that they will not be tracking/recording daily numbers going forward, rather, it is that they will not be publishing the "daily numbers" and last visited locations of new cases.
[3:21 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Well the infection number is still published daily - which is good for community to keep track.
Else no one know of KTV cluster until 1 week later which will be too late.
[3:26 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: I think the Govt also did not say that they are not going to stop reporting/publishing any CV19 related information. My understanding of what was being announced, is that only relevant information will be reported going forward as we transit to a "new normal".
In fact, publishing low daily case numbers as we had done previously, may have the unintended effect of causing complacency.
So, only reporting on significant events/breakouts which warrants everyone's extra attention/vigilance does make sense, in my opinion.
[3:28 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Well. Seems like government still reporting infection number daily - which I felt is useful.
Until we reached 80% full vaccination rate, adjustment of daily reporting will be more suitable.
[3:31 pm, 16/07/2021] +Caleb: Can the gov.sg Whatsapp and telegram channel post more meaningful things
[3:32 pm, 16/07/2021] +Caleb: If not more People is going to unsubscribe.
[3:33 pm, 16/07/2021] +KS Foong: Own Goal. But no penalty.
What most Singaporeans do not realise is that this was an 'own goal' by the government.
KTVs and bars have historically been licensed by the police, who have the surveillance capacity through officers dedicated compliance, powers of arrest and warrants to raid premises. These powers were codified under the Public Entertainment Act, the Criminal Procedure Code and the Liquor Licensing Act.
However once these premises were designated as Food and Beverage establishments and licensed as such, primary responsibility for surveillance and compliance shifted to the Ministry of Sustainability and Environment or MSE, which have none of these powers or the capacity, experience or intelligence set up to ensure compliance of such seedy joints.
A leopard does not change its spots. The action taken to revoke only the F&B of only the 3 KTVs connected to the latest cluster is an inadequate response to this regulatory short coming.
First, all KTVs should be recategorised as entertainment outlets and not F&B outlets and thus come under the supervision of the police once again.
Second, their licenses should all be mandatorily suspended indefinitely or at least till 80% or more of the population are vaccinated.
Third, when allowed to reopen police surveillance of these types of outlets should be reinforced and stepped up.
Fourth, the ICA should more tightly control the travel and so called family ties channel with respect to certain target countries which are known origins of these hostesses, namely Vietnam and the Philippines.
Fifth, fines and warnings should be dispensed with and immediate revoking of licenses should be the appropriate punishment of any breaches.
Sixth, once all the population have been given the opportunity to be vaccinated, any that remain unvaccinated should not be permitted to patronise bars, KTVs, public events and even restaurants unless they are subject to and pass an ART, the costs of which should be borne by them.
Seventh, the entire population should not be penalised for the actions of a few even if leads to a jump in cases. We must stay on track and on pace to opening up. Opening up should be indexed to the vaccination ratio not the number of daily cases.
Eight, vaccination should be made a condition for employment or dependent stay in Singapore. Singapore should remain an open economy and society but that does not mean it should be open to risks it can avoid.
Singapore and Singaporeans must be resilient and the MTF needs to be less naรฏve and more resolute and firm in a targeted manner and not use a sledge hammer on the entire economy and population. But be prepared to bang the gavel on those who are non compliant, who have the propensity to be non compliant or choose to remain unvaccinated. by Devadas[3:34 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: Out of curiosity, do you, or anyone you know, go about with your daily activities any differently when the "daily number" changes from 5 - 15? In fact, with this KTV cluster, did you do anything differently?
My point is, is it wise for everyone to live "by the number"? Or is it more important to understand that with the emergence of CV19, we all have to re-think/re-learn how we do things, and adapt/change our habits accordingly, regardless of the daily case numbers?
[3:35 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Yes agree only if 80% are fully vaccinated.
Not now when 58% are not fully vaccinated - when it can easily overwhelm the hospitalisation.
[3:57 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: You seem to like data/numbers a lot from the way you always tie your arguments back to it. I believe that data/numbers/statistics, when used in the right way, can be very useful/powerful.
From your observations, after a prolonged period of low (and lowering) daily cases, how often do we then see a subsequent spike in numbers - including the most recent cases? Conversely, how frequently have you observed a trend of falling daily new cases after a spike in the number?
Could rising complacency - after seeing a falling trend - and the subsequent rise in infection numbers, be a result of daily reports of daily single digit cases, bearing in mind that the % of Vaccinated persons and the rate of vaccination had actually been increasing since the pandemic began.
Its our habits/behavior that results in rising infection numbers. Reporting low-to-nil cases(which should be the case, hopefully), if results in complacency (negative habits/behavior), whereas, only sudden increase/large numbers has the effect of encouraging safer behavior, then, it makes sense to me to not publish/report on days when the numbers are low.
[3:59 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: Just my opinion... not insisting that that is the only/right way.
[4:03 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
1. To defeat the covid, not only the government must do the right thing.
2. The community must do the right thing - because community is the one that contribute to spreading the virus.
3. Only with the right information, community can do the right thing.
4. This KTV cluster display this truth.
5. Scientists all over the world including our local medical experts based on scientific facts and math using transmission model that has guided the combat in all pandemic - work out that to defeat Delta variants - > 80% full Vaccination is the minimum effective rate.
6. So public health policy should based on science and math correspond to effectively defeat this covid pandemic.
[4:07 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
1. Without reaching 80% vaccination rate, we should hold what is most effective.
2. Our 1 jab vaccination has reached 71%.
3. By 1 to 2 months time, we will have achieved 80% mass full Vaccination.
4. Why can't we wait 1 to 2 months to do the reporting adjustment?
[4:07 pm, 16/07/2021] +phone no: Today hong lim hawker cluster, and school cluster yesterday, so it an on-going cluster if ppe are caming in from abroad, and affected the local
[4:08 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: Agree with you on all counts, except Point 4 .. which contradicts Point 3 ๐
The information that you are so fervent about - daily case data - has not stopped. In fact, prior to this outbreak, we had 1 day when there were ZERO cases on 10 JULY.
Also, the alleged KTV hostess who is causing this outbreak, had been in SG since Feb (if I am not wrong), and from what I know, these "F&B" outlets with freelance hostesses, had been in operation at almost the same time the Govt restricted operations for KTVs.
[4:09 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: There was no less information (related to the publishing of daily numbers) before the most recent outbreak, or the other outbreaks before that.
[4:10 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Hahaha..
You got me with the pants down - when this KTV owners and hostess decide to do illegal things.
But to majority of the people who are law abiding - the numbers help.
2 more months to adjust - I think we can and should wait.
[4:10 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: In fact, if you speak to people around you, most will cite the fact that daily numbers are (or had been) in low single digits, to justify loosening of restrictions
[4:10 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
And then KTV cluster spike.
[4:11 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: To the law abiding ones - defintely you; and I included - we don't need to look at the numbers to decide to be careful ๐
[4:12 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
So only >80% Vaccination can help the community.
Not now.
[4:12 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: I absolutely agree that we need the % of fully vaccinated to be at least 70%, and ideally 80% or more, before we can more confidently loosen restrictions
[4:13 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: but we need to also consider people and businesses who are suffering because of the restrictions.
[4:13 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: Its a delicate balancing act
[4:13 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Because if we don't, people will go complacent and do what they like.
It will be worst than the KTV cluster.
We will end up like India, Indonesia and Malaysia.
[4:14 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
I agree.
We need to protect the business.
A delicate balancing act.
[4:15 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: Hmmm... i think when we hit 80% vaccination level, a lot more people will rightly or not, abandon caution
[4:16 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: The more uncertainty the situation, the more likely that more people will be cautious
[4:17 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Hope they don't abandon caution.
20% is more than 1 million people unvaccinated.
It will definitely overwhelm the hospitals.
Each and every life is important.
[4:22 pm, 16/07/2021] +Caleb: Figure 11: Percentage of Vaccinated Individuals who Received At Least First Dose by Age Group6
[4:22 pm, 16/07/2021] +Caleb: this was from MOM press release yesterday.
The total population is it exclude 11 YO and below?
[4:28 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: I think you can see the Govt is slowly easing everyone towards "living with Covid19". Its probably because their data shows that we are on track to hit our vaccination targets by National Day, and Global data/statistics seem to suggest that the mRNA vaccines have a high enough level of effectiveness in terms of limiting the harmful effects of the virus, and have demonstrated a (surprisingly) high success rate even against new variants of significance.
It is a fact that the vaccinated can still catch the virus, but it seems that the majority do not fall very ill. Hopefully it becomes like the common flu, where therapeutics - both currently available ones, and those which are still in development - will be able to address/arrest patients' symptoms, much like how paracetamol is common prescribed as an effective drug against cold/fever/flu.
There will be those who will fall seriously ill or even die from CV19 whether vaccinated or not, but as long as the % is still lower than the common flu, then more likely than not, our current medical capabilities will be able to manage, and we have less to worry about.
[4:28 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
11 and below not included.
So it is not the total population.
[4:29 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: Population as in "Population of persons eligible for vaccination"
[4:29 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
So by 1 to 2 months times, 80% total population can be reached.
[4:29 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: 80% of those who are eligible to be vaccinated
[4:30 pm, 16/07/2021] +phone no: Anybody know where we can get local death cases of pnumonia, heart attack, liver and accident. which are far higher than covid.
[4:30 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Including those ineligible for vaccination.
Because virus infect won't consider eligible or not.
As long as there are humans, it infect.
[4:30 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: Singstats probably
[4:30 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: free Govt resource
[4:31 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: can get it instantly online. If the data series you are looking for is not there, you can request a special report, usually FOC from Singstats
[4:32 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Do remember those infected has a high chance of serious long term effects like lungs, heart, brain inflammation, blood clot and dementia.
Covid is not like normal flu - when one recover, your long term health is not affected.
[4:33 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Covid also change the red blood cells.
[4:36 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Causing red blood cells difficulty in absorbing oxygen.
Thus some covid patients have difficulty breathing and low oxygen rate below 95.
Else why Temasek Holdings issue oxidometer?
Covid is unlike flu where flu has no long term serious health effects.
Covid is very troublesome.
[4:43 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: We were probably too young and too far removed from the example that I am about to cite.. but there was a time when Polio was one of the most feared disease in the Western countries...it was only 30 years ago that Developed countries declared victory over this dreaded disease.
- Children are the most vulnerable to it
- Vaccine only available in the mid 70s
- Low mortality rate, but causes permanent debilitating damage
The only defense for our kids who are too young - for now - to be safely vaccinated, to be extra careful and practice better personal hygiene
[4:50 pm, 16/07/2021] +YT: Those KTV hostesses and operators ought to be severely punished for causing the outbreak. Wasting public resources.
[4:50 pm, 16/07/2021] +Alvin Lim: The increase of unlink cases is very worrying.
[4:51 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: Unlinked probably only because denying link to KTV case ๐
[4:52 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Sigh 53 community cases - running everywhere...
[4:52 pm, 16/07/2021] +Alvin Lim: 88 + 32 = 120 ktv cases
[4:53 pm, 16/07/2021] +Rama: ๐ฑ๐จ๐คฆ♀️๐๐๐
[4:54 pm, 16/07/2021] +Laurent: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=huZ-RNrHny4
[4:59 pm, 16/07/2021] +REACH: Singapore reports 53 new locally transmitted COVID-19 cases, including 32 linked to KTV cluster
https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/covid-19-cases-singapore-ktv-cluster-moh-local-unlinked-jul-16-15231412
More news on the new cluster:
➡️ Family karaoke outlets petition for separate classification from tarred KTV lounges linked to Covid-19 cluster
https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/family-karaoke-outlets-petition-for-separate-classification-from-tarred-ktv-lounges-clubs
➡️ Nightlife industry worried about business impact, stricter rules if KTV COVID-19 cluster continues to grow
https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/nightlife-industry-worried-business-impact-stricter-rules-ktv-15232200
[5:04 pm, 16/07/2021] +Caleb: maybe should give a new name, KTV+
differential from family KTV
[5:14 pm, 16/07/2021] +jimmy chew: KTVx
[5:27 pm, 16/07/2021] +REACH: [Sent by Gov.sg – 16 Jul]
As of 12pm, MOH has preliminarily confirmed 53 new cases of locally transmitted COVID-19 infection.
There are 8 imported cases today, who have already been placed on Stay-Home Notice or isolated upon arrival in Singapore. In total, there are 61 new cases of COVID-19 infection in Singapore today.
MOH will share further updates in its press release that will be issued later tonight.
go.gov.sg/moh160721update
1️⃣ Seniors aged 60 and above can walk into any Vaccination Centre (except polyclinics and GP clinics) to get vaccinated.
2️⃣ Seniors who walked in to a Vaccination Centre may approach any Community Clubs/Centres’ counter service to bring forward their second dose. They can also call the COVID-19 hotline at 1800-333-9999 to reschedule.
[5:33 pm, 16/07/2021] +Valli: ๐
[5:36 pm, 16/07/2021] +YT: Next big cluster will come from those sleazy massage parlours and spas. I hope the authorities learn from this mistake and quickly put a stop to these sleazy spas.
[5:38 pm, 16/07/2021] +Alvin Lim: Possible but if you have token or TT app can’t escape. They view the data and see the Vietnamese lady token detected during the time period means you’re there.
[5:41 pm, 16/07/2021] +Caleb: OYK already said,maybe never bring token or turn BT on HP
[5:41 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: These fellows will just turn off their bluetooth and/or leave the TT token at home
[5:42 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: Exactly.. he already anticipated this ๐
[5:42 pm, 16/07/2021] +Alvin Lim: Then confirm kena charge if they investigate out
[5:43 pm, 16/07/2021] +Alvin Lim: CID is still helping with all the contact tracing iirc
[5:43 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Agreed
[5:45 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Why?
[5:46 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: I mean don't ignore it, but give it some context
[5:46 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Yes
[5:46 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Yes, but without context what does it mean?
[5:47 pm, 16/07/2021] +Alvin Lim: All nightlife businesses that pivoted to F&B to be suspended for 2 weeks as KTV COVID-19 cluster grows
https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/ktv-covid-19-cluster-nightlife-businesses-pivot-f-b-suspended-15232634
[5:47 pm, 16/07/2021] +Alvin Lim: Unfortunately one spoilt apple and the rest get pulled down
[5:48 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Yes exactly
[5:48 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Yes
[5:51 pm, 16/07/2021] +Caleb: Till date I don't see any SE gateway or much QR code posters in Hawker centers.
If 1 case in a hawker lead to a clousure of the whole hawker center. And eating is a high risk.
Not sure what is the gov doing
[5:52 pm, 16/07/2021] +Boon: If this is the case, what about our Immigration Dept, if this news is true : that a Sg boyfriend can sponsor an overseas girlfriend into Sg…? https://sg.yahoo.com/news/first-ktv-cluster-vietnam-woman-singaporean-boyfriend-035845938.html
[5:53 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Let's talk smoking then. If lives are so important why don't we ban it?
[5:53 pm, 16/07/2021] +Boon: ๐
[5:54 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Lol
[5:54 pm, 16/07/2021] +Timothy Low: Good move by the Government. Now more incentive to be vaccinated. No vaccination cannot dine in groups of 5
[5:55 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: ๐
[5:56 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Is that a new rule?
[5:56 pm, 16/07/2021] +Timothy Low: [JUST IN] S'pore will revert to the 2-person limit for dining in hawker centres, food courts & coffeeshops, from July 19 to Aug. 8, 2021.
However, dining-in for groups of up to 5 persons may be allowed for dining in at select F&B establishments, subject to certain conditions.
➡️ https://bit.ly/3z9pQGV
Follow us on @mothershipsg for the latest updates.
[5:57 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Thanks
[6:00 pm, 16/07/2021] +Caleb: No wonder Teo Heng cannot survive. But these KTVx still can
[6:01 pm, 16/07/2021] +YT: How to check? How to enforce?
[6:02 pm, 16/07/2021] +Timothy Low: Show this upon entry?
[6:04 pm, 16/07/2021] +REACH: Latest COVID-19 MTF Announcements
➡️ COVID-19: Dining-in group size back to 2; groups of 5 only if all fully vaccinated
https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/covid-19-how-many-can-dine-in-vaccinated-groups-of-5-2-15232846#
➡️ All nightlife businesses that pivoted to F&B to be suspended for 2 weeks as KTV COVID-19 cluster grows
https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/ktv-covid-19-cluster-nightlife-businesses-pivot-f-b-suspended-15232634#
➡️ Group sizes for indoor high-intensity mask-off activities reduced amid tighter COVID-19 measures
https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/group-sizes-for-indoor-high-intensity-mask-off-activities-15232800
➡️ Growing KTV cluster of COVID-19 infections a 'major setback': Gan Kim Yong
https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/covid-19-growing-ktv-cluster-major-setback-vaccination-15232602#
➡️ MOH to take 4-ring approach to contain Covid-19 spread from KTV cluster
https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/health/moh-to-take-4-ring-approach-to-contain-covid-19-spread-from-kt-v-cluster
[6:04 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
COVID-19: Dining-in group size back to 2; groups of 5 only if all fully vaccinated
https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/covid-19-how-many-can-dine-in-vaccinated-groups-of-5-2-15232846
[6:05 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Nah.
Government take tighter measures already.
Who say government won't act?
[6:05 pm, 16/07/2021] +YT: Create more work for everyone. Again, the hostesses and the KTV operators should be severely punished to the fullest extent of the law. Waste of public resources tracing, and treating the sick. Entirely preventable.
[6:05 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: I feel bad for families where kids cannot yet be vaccinated and the family has to be split up , increasing the risk of infection
[6:06 pm, 16/07/2021] +YT: That's the problem. Always playing catch-up. No foresight to clamp down. Next big cluster coming from sleazy spas and massage parlours. Mark my words.
[6:06 pm, 16/07/2021] +YT: But of course, government won't act until it happens.
[6:08 pm, 16/07/2021] +CQ: "Since children below the age of 12 are not eligible for any COVID-19 vaccine under Singapore’s national vaccination programme, these unvaccinated children can also dine with members of the same household without pre-event testing, the press release read."
This is provided for in the article
[6:11 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: "Even if they test negative, MOH said they could still be incubating the virus" doesn't bode well for our testing programme
[6:11 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/health/moh-to-take-4-ring-approach-to-contain-covid-19-spread-from-kt-v-cluster
[6:11 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Thanks!
[6:14 pm, 16/07/2021] +YT: Sure will have a few brave ones who will open back door. Punishment just not severe enough. Fine of $3000. What's that to most of these people?
[6:15 pm, 16/07/2021] +CQ: It's so small that it's "cost of business" lor. You one night 2 tables that open XO can cover already
[6:16 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: What happens if the group is partially vaccinated? Is it a maximum of 2 unvaccinated people in the group of 5?
[6:17 pm, 16/07/2021] +YT: Exactly. So far, the fines are just that. $3K, $10K. Close for two weeks etc., all these mlbusinesses have fall guys as someone rightly put earlier today.
[6:17 pm, 16/07/2021] +CQ: What do you mean by "partially vaccinated"?
[6:17 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: I mean 3 people are fully vaccinated and 2 are not
[6:17 pm, 16/07/2021] +CQ: Should disgorge the profits...
[6:17 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: https://www.unilad.co.uk/news/chaos-erupts-in-france-and-vehicles-set-ablaze-amid-violent-protests-against-covid-laws/
[6:17 pm, 16/07/2021] +anntat: Over 200,000 people quarantined as part of wide net cast to contain KTV Covid-19 cluster: Ong Ye Kung
“The worry now is who else that they come into contact with before they get themselves tested and are they infected. And this is the bigger worry, which is the secondary infection,” said Health Minister Ong Ye Kung.
➡️ https://tdy.sg/3hEPygp
@todayonlinesg
[6:17 pm, 16/07/2021] +Rama: Jail time is a must!
[6:17 pm, 16/07/2021] +Linda: How about those who have 1st dose vaccine only?
[6:18 pm, 16/07/2021] +anntat: 200k????
[6:18 pm, 16/07/2021] +CQ: Then have to split 3 and 2. The 2 unvax or not fully vaxxed, too bad.
[6:18 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Type lol
[6:19 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Typo
[6:19 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Not vaccinated
[6:19 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
200,000 quarantine because of KTV cluster.
๐คฆ
[6:19 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: Get vaccinated. That is the only defense we have. The hostesses were here since Feb. Which means they got infected from someone here. These establishments have been circumventing the law and running the biz this way for over a year now, so it’s not about what kind of places/biz.
If someone is a carrier and goes into a restaurant, gym, on the same flight.. same bus, train etc .., it will still spread. Are you then going to propose to ban all that as well?
[6:19 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: I see, so unvaccinated is max 2
[6:19 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Typo!!
[6:19 pm, 16/07/2021] +CQ: I read it in the strictest sense. Even if you've gotten 2 jabs but haven't cleared the 14days after, your TT/Healthhub won't show (and therefore won't count) as fully vaxxed.
[6:19 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: It's over 2,000
[6:20 pm, 16/07/2021] +Linda: ๐
[6:21 pm, 16/07/2021] +anntat: Fake news?
[6:21 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Its a typo
[6:21 pm, 16/07/2021] +anntat: Quite alarming
[6:22 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Or maybe clickbait
[6:22 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Today Singapore is not the mainstream media?
[6:22 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Read the article, it's clearly a few over 2,000
[6:23 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Unless I am wrong, lol, but I read the other reports that made more sense
[6:23 pm, 16/07/2021] +Wilson Loo: refresh the article - they updated: CORRECTION: An earlier version of the article stated that 202,480 individuals have been quarantined. The figure should be 2,480. We are sorry for the error.
[6:23 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: 200,000 in the KTV, is it bigger than the Singapore Stadium?
[6:23 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Lol thought so
[6:24 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: ๐คฃ๐คฃ
[6:24 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Sorry, shouldn't laugh at my own jokes
[6:32 pm, 16/07/2021] +YT: I believe ICA has some major explaining to do too. How did this "boyfriend" got the approval to bring the Vietnamese woman in? Did someone in ICA overlook the processes or was someone doing this "boyfriend" a favour? This guy is obviously not the boyfriend. He is a pimp! Which boyfriend will allow his girlfriend to work in such places as a hostess and be caressed and fondled by hundreds of unknown men every single day?
[6:32 pm, 16/07/2021] +Rama: They will skirt around with the reply!?
[6:32 pm, 16/07/2021] +CQ: I think they're not gonna reply......
[6:33 pm, 16/07/2021] +YT: So, please send this feedback up. ICA needs to explain. I know of many people who can't even get get elderly parents to come back. There was even a couple who want their son to come here but was rejected. And here we are, ICA allowed this pimp to bring his girlfriend here to be a prostitute and spread the disease and waste public resources.
[6:34 pm, 16/07/2021] +Rama: ๐ฑ๐จ๐๐๐๐ ๐ก๐๐คฆ♀️๐คท♂️
[6:36 pm, 16/07/2021] +CQ: Yah lor. But even though they will do their internal investigations, they will probably not issue any official explanation as to how it happened. Cos it's going to reveal too much insight as to their approval considerations and procedures, which can then be gamed and exploited by other people in future.
[6:37 pm, 16/07/2021] +Rama: MTF then must thank ICA for a job well done!?
[6:37 pm, 16/07/2021] +CQ: ๐คท๐ป♀️๐คท๐ป♀️๐คท๐ป♀️ "no blame culture", remember?
[6:38 pm, 16/07/2021] +Fulgrim: ICA again... First that let an unvaccinated officer do fronting duty and sparked the prev wave, now they let her in...
[6:38 pm, 16/07/2021] +Fulgrim: I still don't see heads rolling..
[6:39 pm, 16/07/2021] +Rama: BOI then on ICA!?
[6:40 pm, 16/07/2021] +Fulgrim: Whatever u like to call it, someone screwed up and that need to fix this
[6:40 pm, 16/07/2021] +Fulgrim: No more light taps on the wrist and no blame cultures. How many more of such "honest mistakes" can we afford to take?
[6:41 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Agreed this is a scandal.
[6:42 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Im not commenting on the lady involved, or her job, just that it's an opaque system for why some can come in and others cannot
[6:43 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Their approval process should be transparent.
[6:43 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Otherwise at risk of corruption accusqtions
[6:43 pm, 16/07/2021] +Dan: I second YT's proposition
[6:45 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: Agree. The penalty should be much much higher.
[6:45 pm, 16/07/2021] +CQ: But it cannot be too open. Cos then it opens up an opportunity for people to fabricate background facts/evidence just to tick the box. I'm not saying that it's right for it to be so opaque, all I'm saying is that I can see why they don't want to make certain things so clear, such that once you fulfil certain conditions, it will be approved.
[6:45 pm, 16/07/2021] +CQ: conditions, it will be approved.
[6:46 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Not sure i understand. If there are agreed qualifications to be approved, why not make them public? Applications will need to be supported by proven facts, not fabrications.
[6:47 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: But it's not my area of expertise!
[6:47 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: These are the types of people that needs to be thrown into jail.. together with other CV19 positive ones. Obviously will only protest if refuse to be vaccinated. ๐
[6:48 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: Unfortunately, the ones going to jail are only the fall guys.
[6:50 pm, 16/07/2021] +REACH: Dear Contributors,
Thank you for your views so far, We want to HEAR MORE from you! ๐ค
⏰ We will be extending the chat to 9pm today. ⏰
[6:50 pm, 16/07/2021] +CQ: There are clear criteria, that's set out via the application forms. So you cannot anyhow say this is my parent without providing supporting proof. But certain things like the purpose of coming in rely purely on declaration and how you explain. You cannot list "if you say this I will approve, if you say that then I cannot approve". So this kind of open ended questions require the approving unit to exercise discretion, which in itself means at least this part will be opaque.
[6:50 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: Yes. I won’t be surprised if some under-table transactions was involved ๐ค
[6:51 pm, 16/07/2021] +CQ: And you'll be surprised at the kind of "evidence" that can be fabricated, cos not every piece of information can be verified, not every country has a robust registration system like we do. Some places don't even have birth cert...
[6:53 pm, 16/07/2021] +REACH: S'pore's Covid-19 vaccination programme to focus on 140,000 seniors aged 70 and above
The nation's vaccination programme in the coming weeks will focus on 140,000 unvaccinated seniors aged 70 and above, said Health Minister Ong Ye Kung on Friday (July 16).
This represents about 29 per cent of the seniors in the age group.
https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/health/140000-unvaccinated-seniors-aged-70-and-above-focus-of-singapores-covid-19
[6:53 pm, 16/07/2021] +CQ: Even if there is, the question I have is: if you were the person reviewing this case here and now, would you have approved? What more would you have needed this person to prove? If say fiancรฉ, there's no registration what. What's your proof? Diamond ring? No 'gram no count?
[6:53 pm, 16/07/2021] +Laurent: There are so many safe distancing officer and they never went to check the F&B KTV
[6:54 pm, 16/07/2021] +Laurent: This is a big mismanagement
[6:54 pm, 16/07/2021] +Alvin Lim: ๐คญ
[6:54 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ken: No OT for night work leh
[6:54 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: Those “papers” can easily be fabricated. So being too transparent will probably backfire.
[6:54 pm, 16/07/2021] +Rama: Yup!
[6:54 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: yup
[6:55 pm, 16/07/2021] +Rama: Fixation will be done behind closed doors, away from public scrutiny!?
[6:55 pm, 16/07/2021] +Stella Yip: Unvaccinated people with a valid negative pre-event COVID-19 test (PET) result or recovered individuals can also participate in such groups of five, the press release read. https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/covid-19-how-many-can-dine-in-vaccinated-groups-of-5-2-15232846
[6:55 pm, 16/07/2021] +Stella Yip: but how can we be sure that doc is not fake?
[6:55 pm, 16/07/2021] +CQ: Exactly my point to Ben lor. Not everything can be set out that clear.
[6:58 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: A lot of them are just doing it to get paid for putting on the uniform and standing around… once in a while question the “easy” ones. For those that really needs to be dealt with, even our SPF cannot do a proper job as seen on many video recordings circulating around. If shouldn’t be a surprise that these underpaid part-timers will prefer not to get involved.
[6:58 pm, 16/07/2021] +Laurent: So what is the point
[6:59 pm, 16/07/2021] +Laurent: The hierarchy should take the consequences of this mismanagement
[6:59 pm, 16/07/2021] +Rama: Public perception of SPF must be corrected decively!
[7:00 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: It will automatically self-correct when they can actually do a proper job of policing as policemen.
[7:01 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: Hahahah … are you calling for a Minister to resign? If that can really solve the problem, then i am onboard too ๐
[7:04 pm, 16/07/2021] +Laurent: Safe distancing officers can bother families with young children at the hawker centre but dont enter KTV
[7:04 pm, 16/07/2021] +Rama: Wait long long!
[7:04 pm, 16/07/2021] +YT: Only 6 out of 88 KTV cases are fully vaccinated. Looks like someone may just die from having fun at the KTVs.
[7:04 pm, 16/07/2021] +Laurent: I am asking the question Y
[7:04 pm, 16/07/2021] +Rama: ๐ฑ๐จ๐คฆ♀️๐๐๐
[7:05 pm, 16/07/2021] +YT: Gutless. Just don't want trouble. Get into argument, still same pay. Look other way, also same pay. So. Why bother.
[7:05 pm, 16/07/2021] +Rama: Lack of foresight from the MTF!?
[7:05 pm, 16/07/2021] +Laurent: I moved to singapore for this
[7:05 pm, 16/07/2021] +Laurent: It doesnt seem that it is applied in every day life
[7:05 pm, 16/07/2021] +Rama: Only on paper seems impressive!
[7:06 pm, 16/07/2021] +YT: Always play catch-up lor. If the government is reading this forum, please, please close the sleazy massage parlours before another big boom in cases!
[7:06 pm, 16/07/2021] +Laurent: With LKY it was impressive every day.
[7:08 pm, 16/07/2021] +Rama: Definitely!
[7:09 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: I think you misinterpreted my comment ๐ What I meant to say is calling for “hierarchy” to “take consequences (sic)” sounds a lot to me like opportunistic call by anti-Govt people, to sack a Minister. ๐
I am saying IF sacking a Minister of a political party you dislike can resolve this pandemic, then i will support it… otherwise……. ๐
[7:09 pm, 16/07/2021] +Rama: Right to put conditions on monetary help but for how long if current measure is like playing see saw!?
[7:11 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: Because a family of diners is an “easy target” compared to the hardcore-KTV-patrons.
They need to be seen questioning/doing something once in a while. Wayang wayang to earn their keep ๐
[7:12 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: Sounds like you are describing our SPF as well ๐
[7:12 pm, 16/07/2021] +Rama: Paymaster too soft to ensure compliance!?
[7:13 pm, 16/07/2021] +CQ: That description applies to a lot of people leh. The "act blur live longer" spirit ๐
[7:13 pm, 16/07/2021] +Joseph Ong: Indeed ๐
[7:14 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
1. See now 1 social hostess causing this KTV cluster - people already crying for blood to spill.
2. If we anyhow relax and trigger widespread outbreak - like India, Indonesia and Malaysia - wonder whether people will call for blood revolution or not?
[7:14 pm, 16/07/2021] +YT: Yes, perhaps can consider clawback of the aid given to these "KTVs" and other nightlife joints found to be errand.
[7:20 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Channel 8 news - local infectious expert say our current 71% 1 dose vaccination - not good and effective against Delta variants.
Must ramp up our double vaccination beyond 80% before we can see good outcome.
He say:-
1. 1 jab only provide 30% protection.
2. 2 jabs with mask 88% protection.
3. 2 jabs without mask drop to 50% protection. Thus at home, can still spread to family members.
Only when reach beyond 80% full Vaccination rate - then Delta variants can then be greatly reduced.
This is science and math.
Great that MTF formulate their public health policy based on math and science.
[7:26 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
I already know this will be the reaction.
When nothing happen, people ask for free for all.
The moment anything happens - people will cry for blood.
Just look at UK, Malaysia, Brazil, India etc.
[7:32 pm, 16/07/2021] +CQ: A useful infographic from CNA
[7:44 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: This is very helpful thanks
[7:45 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: French culture is to protest the government, especially at this time of the year, ironically around Bastille day!
[7:45 pm, 16/07/2021] +CQ: Thanks CNA! Also not I do one. ๐
[7:46 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Maybe, but if the criteria is based on things that can be proven and not in the hands of 'friends' then it is simple enough is it not? As I say, I don't know, so will take your word for it.
[7:46 pm, 16/07/2021] +Ben: Fair point
[7:47 pm, 16/07/2021] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
1. So propose that government should adopt a principle approach in tackling this covid pandemic - amidst those who advocate free-for-all style and those who are silent majority but more conservative group.
2. Agree with the current tightening of measures to tackle the KTV cluster.
3. Continue with the current publishing of infection number to keep people on the toes.
4. Ramp up mass vaccination to achieve 80% herd immunity of 2 jabs - based on the transmission model.
5. Then adjust the reporting as we move towards endemic.
6. Continue to encourage and get the remaining 20% vaccinated - for those who are medically eligible but refused to especially elderly.
7. The aim is to protect each and every one.
[8:59 pm, 16/07/2021] +REACH: Dear Contributors,
We will be closing the chat for today.
Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.
Goodnight!
Megan ๐
======
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