REACH 209 - View on tudung in nursing (SK)
24 Mar 2021 (11am - 7pm)
REACH
[12:36 pm, 24/03/2021] +REACH: Dear contributors,
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[0:56 pm, 24/03/2021] +REACH: 📢 Topic 📢
💬 How can we as a community continue to ensure a strong social fabric in a multi-racial and multi-religious Singapore?
On Tuesday, Minister Shanmugam made clear that at a previous closed-door dialogue he had at the same mosque on 31 Aug last year, Ustaz Hasbi had asked him about the issue of nurses wearing the tudung, or headscarf.
He said the Government was consulting the community before making a change, and had discussed the matter with the Islamic Religious Council of Singapore (Muis) and taken into account its views, which were helpful.
However, Minister also said the Government had to weigh the different considerations against each other, and reach a judgment.
👉https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/muslim-leaders-told-last-august-that-position-on-nurses-wearing-tudung-under-review-likely
-----
[1:02 pm, 24/03/2021] +Nat: Just took a paid survey on racial and religious issues recently, the main balance drawn is do we want to encourage more conversation on the topic at the expense of offending some or do we want to keep the status quo
As much as we know that we are multicultural, there will always be deep-seated cultures in us with opinions about other races, even unintentional ones
I personally think that it isn't too hard to address these issues as long as everyone approaches the issues with an open mind and not resort to personal attacks
As for the tudung issue, I think it's a perception issue, we should ask ourselves - are we thinking too much? Whether one assumes one that wears a tudung is a Muslim or a Malay is a personal perception issue and if anybody requests to…
[1:24 pm, 24/03/2021] +Franco: Hmm....tudung for nurses...tough and sensitive issue. Then wat about tudung for our SQ stewardess, our lady military personnel or other uniformed organizations?
[1:24 pm, 24/03/2021] +Caleb: A good stArt from Nurses
[1:31 pm, 24/03/2021] +KS Foong: I think wear or not wear a tudung is not the issue. The issue is, if that would affect how the service is carried out.
[1:36 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
1. Psychologically there will always be 2 consciousness affecting a Human :-
i Perception front
a. How human see things - 5 sensory stimuli, their feelings arising, their perception that will develop and finally form a mental judgement.
eg. When Human see a person with turban, Human conceptualise - "Oh I am dealing with a Singh".
Now with tudung to be introduce in the nursing profession, human will conceptualise - "Oh I am dealing with a Muslim".
---- This is the psychological aspect that Singapore residents will conceptualise via the Perception front when tudung is roll out in the nursing profession.
How will public reconcile with such perception front?
- Some people may have neutral feeling.
- Some people may have positive feeling.
- But some people could have negative feeling.
ii. Reconciliation Front
- Some people may have neutral feeling --- oh she is a Singaporean, no problem I can accept it.
- Some people may have positive feeling - oh this is her culture, I can accept diversity, it make our society colorful.
- But some people could have negative feeling - oh I prefer to be serve by someone more secular, or someone of my kind. This is natural response for some people.
2. Now a survey need to be done to determine what is the percentage of the people that fall into :-
- Neutral feeling
- Positive feeling
- Negative feeling
3. This will determine the impact of the tudung rollout on our Society.
4. As for me, I have a neutral feeling of the tudung rollout - just like how Singh with the turban on.
[1:54 pm, 24/03/2021] +Fulgrim: The tudung issue is complicated
[1:55 pm, 24/03/2021] +Fulgrim: It can be a slippery slope and open the door to more issues
[1:56 pm, 24/03/2021] +Fulgrim: My personal opinion is that all government workplaces or sites , the employees shouldn’t wear tudung . Similar to schools
[1:56 pm, 24/03/2021] +Fulgrim: If u make an acception now, other religions will be asking also
[1:56 pm, 24/03/2021] +Caleb: 👍
[1:56 pm, 24/03/2021] +Caleb: Ya
[2:03 pm, 24/03/2021] +jimmy chew: I agree, we are a secular society so religion should be shown in their good behaviours and values. Not external manifestation of fulfilment. If not others who want to show their seriousness or piousness by outward manifestation doesn't help in the profession
[2:04 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Good point.
Good value is inherent in the Heart and Mind.
It is not what is display.
[2:07 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
My close friend comments:-
Why is this even a discussion point?
Uniforms are there for a purpose. Identity and functional.
Why introduce beliefs, customs or even religion into uniforms.
Then no more uniformity.
Is it because we want to attract certain ethnic groups into the service and therefore bending a rule?
Then we should approach the discussion differently.
[2:09 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: First police officer to wear tudung in Western Australia is from Singapore: 'I was born and raised in a multi-cultural society':: https://www.asiaone.com/singapore/first-police-officer-wear-tudung-western-australia-singapore-i-was-born-and-raised-multi?utm_source=whatsapp&utm_medium=social-media&utm_campaign=addtoany
[2:10 pm, 24/03/2021] +CQ: i don't think it's for one group of people to determine how another group of people display/show/manifest their religion/race/beliefs/whatever...
[2:14 pm, 24/03/2021] +jimmy chew: Agree but let's be professional. We're multinational. If I decided to wear my pajamas to woke is it okay
[2:15 pm, 24/03/2021] +jimmy chew: *work
[2:15 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: 😅😂🤣😱😨
[2:16 pm, 24/03/2021] +Nat: To work maybe ok, to wake maybe not 😂
[2:23 pm, 24/03/2021] +jimmy chew: More to cater for the foreigners who don't trust the police
[2:24 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: I think the wearing of headwear is ok as long as it doesn't impede the work (might be dangerous if working near machinery or life saving related role where it blocks the person's vision, etc) or if the corp identity is strict (eg. SIA stewardess etc.). Other than that, I don't see the need to debate all these stuff.
[2:27 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: woke as in the new age "stay woke" or typo of work?
[2:28 pm, 24/03/2021] +CQ: i actually don't see a problem with it. not like what i wear affects my ability to do the work... unless it's a safety gear, then that's understandable. otherwise, whether i'm wearing a full suit or tshirt and berms won't affect the functionality of my brain (that's the coffee's job)
[2:28 pm, 24/03/2021] +CQ: yep, this^
[2:29 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: I think it's the same with Singh wearing their turban
[2:30 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: it's ok if it doesn't impede their work
[2:30 pm, 24/03/2021] +CQ: yah lor. so i don't see any issue whether turban or tudung
[2:32 pm, 24/03/2021] +Caleb: 👍
[2:35 pm, 24/03/2021] +jimmy chew: It's auto correct. Should be wake
[2:35 pm, 24/03/2021] +jimmy chew: Indicated
[2:36 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Honestly in the army, I heard a rumor that a Singh was posted as a guard during a live firing exercise.
A round richocet and hit the Singh head who is wearing a turban and lose his life - as a commander told us to put our helmet on if we are performing our guard duty during live firing exercise.
If he wear a helmet, it could have save his life.
Also inside the armour carrier and 3 tonners, the helmet protect the soldier's head from knocking against hard object and bleed when the vehicle move.
But Singh wearing turban is exposé to the risk of head injury.
[2:41 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
So it may end up SAF not deploying Singh into combat duty - as they are vulnerable to head injury because of the headgear.
[2:43 pm, 24/03/2021] +Fulgrim: Now already short of manpower Liao
[2:44 pm, 24/03/2021] +Fulgrim: Short until have to revamp pes system
[2:44 pm, 24/03/2021] +Fulgrim: Maybe we can look into developing armoured turbans ? Not sure what the Indian army uses
[2:44 pm, 24/03/2021] +Fulgrim: But got
[2:44 pm, 24/03/2021] +Fulgrim: Hot
[2:44 pm, 24/03/2021] +Fulgrim: Hor
[2:44 pm, 24/03/2021] +Fulgrim; Singh cna wear turban
[2:45 pm, 24/03/2021] +Fulgrim: Why Malays cannot wear hijab
[2:45 pm, 24/03/2021] +Fulgrim: I mean tudung
[2:45 pm, 24/03/2021] +Fulgrim: And it’s a short stretch to why cannot wear burqa
[2:45 pm, 24/03/2021] +YT: Aren't there some professions that require certain dress codes? Like clean rooms. And maybe even surgery rooms where loose clothing may pose hazards?
[2:46 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: Possibly
[2:47 pm, 24/03/2021] +CQ: that's why there was an earlier comment that unless it affects with the work or impacts safety, it shouldn't be treated as an issue
[2:47 pm, 24/03/2021] +YT: When I was growing up, very few people wore tudungs. I remember my teachers and neighbours don't even wear them. These days, there are more. Is there a reason for this? Or is there undue influence and pressure from outside of Singapore or within Singapore amongst a small number of people in terms of religious teachings?
[2:48 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: Extreme religious ideology online!?
[2:50 pm, 24/03/2021] +Nat: Good analysis
[2:51 pm, 24/03/2021] +YT: Is this a cause for concern?
[2:55 pm, 24/03/2021] +Fulgrim: I think it’s from Saudi Arabia
[2:55 pm, 24/03/2021] +Fulgrim: U see this increasing hardline interpretation of Islam from the Middle East countries
[2:55 pm, 24/03/2021] +Fulgrim: Because of oil money, they have been preaching a lot of their more extreme version of islam
[2:56 pm, 24/03/2021] +Fulgrim: The influence is growing in our region
[2:56 pm, 24/03/2021] +Fulgrim: Same thing happening in Indonesia
[2:56 pm, 24/03/2021] +Fulgrim: It’s already starting to affect the politics and government policy in Indonesia
[2:56 pm, 24/03/2021] +Leonard Lau: https://www.malayheritage.gov.sg/en/-/media/mhc2017/document/online-resource_malay-traditonal-outfit.pdf
[2:56 pm, 24/03/2021] +Fulgrim: Their constitution was supposed to be secular
[2:57 pm, 24/03/2021] +Fulgrim: Just like ours
[2:57 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: Promote
Keep up with promoting racial harmony among our races as we have constantly done so over the years.
Protect
Protect religious institutions from any threats. Could be external could be internal. Keep vigilant. Agree to "discreet" guards by Min. K Sham.
Advocate
Continue supporting and speaking up for religious faiths. Ensure that all are given their fair share of access for their followers.
Partnership
Something rarely seen is religious leaders of various faith coming together for common good which is quite frequent here in Sg. Keep this up and have frequent exchanges between various faith.
PPAP (if you all still remember that crazy Japanese dude)
My 2.14 cents
[2:57 pm, 24/03/2021] +Nat: These acronyms are getting cringy
[2:59 pm, 24/03/2021] +Nat: While this issue is pretty pointless to talk about, I like that it surfaced the issue of racism (like the point mentioned where certain people may pinpoint certain race and not want to be served by them)
We should definitely have a deeper conversation on the ingrained racism we have in all of us
[3:01 pm, 24/03/2021] +YT: I don't know why people don't want to be served by certain races. To me, I just want my requests attended to, doesn't matter who is doing it! Haha...
[3:01 pm, 24/03/2021] +Desmond Koh: is actually of historical reasons... in UK N US, Sikh still kept the traditional outlook... although US army got some restrictions on it 😂
[3:03 pm, 24/03/2021] +Nat: Exactly but this world is full of different people lol so definitely interesting to look into why there are such people with their funny demands
[3:10 pm, 24/03/2021] +REACH: REACH in partnership with Varsity Voices invites you on a tour with REACH Deputy Chair Parliamentary Secretary Rahayu Mahzam at the Ministry of Health and at her home - all while answering your questions on Jobs & Economy! 💼
Check out the video here: https://fb.watch/4qtoTXWnDy/ 📽
Want more of this series? Let us know! 😊
[3:14 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: https://mustsharenews.com/you-tiao-man-halal/
[3:14 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ben: I'm against religion dictating what people should wear in every day life. https://eresources.nlb.gov.sg/infopedia/articles/SIP_2013-09-30_123324.html
[3:15 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: it works both ways actually
[3:15 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: both sides need to be tolerant otherwise something's gonna give
[3:17 pm, 24/03/2021] +Nat: The paid survey I mentioned also asked one's religious beliefs, drawing a comparison to the practicality of it in modern life
I'd say the survey was more targeted at those with religions that have dietary restrictions where I don't, cuz I know some Muslims are very strict about what they eat and whether it's 100% clean in their sense while some give and take, knowing it's difficult to completely go with the restrictions in question
[3:18 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ben: I respect religion as a personal choice. I'm not in favour religious impositions on society as a whole nor on individuals against their wishes.
[3:19 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ben: 👍
[3:20 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ben: Valid question. Why is society polarising? Why is it important to declare a religion publicly?
[3:23 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ben: Generally yes, it depends on the beliefs of that religion maybe? If they are breaking the law then we would not accept it. If people are being suppressed we would not accept it. Religion or not.
[3:23 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ben: WFH, then yes 😆
[3:31 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ana: Agreed.
[4:05 pm, 24/03/2021] +REACH: 15 new Covid-19 cases in Singapore, all imported
https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/15-new-covid-19-cases-in-singapore-all-imported-1
[4:44 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
1. Let me relate a life example.
2. I was in one NTUC fairprice queuing up to pay for my groceries.
3. There are long queues in 3 checkout.
4. Then I notice one checkout point got very short queue serve by a receptionist with tudung.
5. I asked my wife let go to the shorter queue and she wink at me.
6. I asked her you want to check out faster or wait longer in the queue.
7. She say ok and we move to the shorter queue.
8. Then I notice that receptionist look uncomfortable - as she have realised the customers are avoiding her check out counter.
9. But I display calmness and not perturbed by what she wear.
10. After she picked up most of my groceries and realise one item is pork in a package, she hesitated and pause for a while.
11. I observed her to see what she will do as at the back of my mind, I am conducting a social experiment.
12. She pause, and fidgeted and I thought she will asked me to pick up the pork myself and scan it.
13. Then I was relief that she picked up a small plastic bag to pick up the pork in the package and scan it.
14. After I make payment, I noticed that she feel quite conscious about the customers avoiding her.
15. In my next visit, I discovered that she is no longer working with the NTUC fairprice.
[4:46 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: I will always take a plastic bag and cover all my frozen or refrigerated food. It’s both in case of Muslim cashier and hygienic also.
[4:47 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Well I am climate conscious to use less plastic.
[4:48 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: Haha true. Single use plastic is lesser devil I guess.
[4:55 pm, 24/03/2021] +Stella Yip: I know of 2 ladies who change out of their tudung before work and change back after work. To me, they are respecting the company’s dress code for all staff. They do not demand that the company revise their dress code to suit their personal choice.
[4:56 pm, 24/03/2021] +KS Foong: This is ideal !
[5:00 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: Point 15 - Sad!
[5:00 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: Fine
[5:01 pm, 24/03/2021] +CQ: imagine if the tables were turned.... the company imposes a rule that all employees need to wear a head-dress as part of the company's dress code or uniform...
[5:02 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
I think she resigned out of her own accord.
I don't think it is anything that do with NTUC fairprice.
[5:34 pm, 24/03/2021] +REACH: NIE launches new research centre to study science of learning
A research centre that aims to develop effective learning methods and tools for students based on research in neuroscience and other disciplines has opened at the National Institute of Education (NIE).
More: https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/parenting-education/nie-launches-new-research-centre-to-study-science-of-learning
[5:40 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ben: 👍 the food I the packaging I not kept cleaner by the additional plastic bag.
[5:40 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ben: Lesser devil than?
[5:41 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ben: 👍
[5:42 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ben: Yes, that would be wrong too. Imagine if religion imposed a dress code that women had to wear a head dress.
[5:42 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ben: 😁
[5:43 pm, 24/03/2021] +Kevinn Wang: this topic should never be brought up
[5:43 pm, 24/03/2021] +Kevinn Wang: is too sensitive and will bring up funny ideas
[5:43 pm, 24/03/2021] +Kevinn Wang: example can i bring my lion dance head gear to work also cos i pray to lion dance god
[5:44 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ben: Fair point
[5:44 pm, 24/03/2021] +Kevinn Wang: surprise that it is brought up by a MP! omg
[5:44 pm, 24/03/2021] +CQ: thus my point right, that no one should impose any dress code requirements on anyone, unless it is of safety concerns. if it's wrong to impose a head-dress must be worn, then why would it be right to impose a rule that it can't be worn?
[5:44 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ben: Is the religion imposing the rule in the first place? I don't know the answer, but I read that it was.
[5:45 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ben: Should we ban all rules about dress code, unless required for health safety etc.
[5:45 pm, 24/03/2021] +Kevinn Wang: also dun compare what other country do
[5:46 pm, 24/03/2021] +Kevinn Wang: because what they do MIGHT NOT BE RIGHT
[5:46 pm, 24/03/2021] +REACH: Experts Explain - Vaccines Part 1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dsHOTdSmFP0&list=PLH2CR4s1lqyiECXvMCQYeWHOlBLTzRG_g
[5:46 pm, 24/03/2021] +REACH: Experts Explain: Vaccines Part 1 (Chinese) 专家讲解疫苗 第1部
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXlFyXXsqeQ&list=PLH2CR4s1lqyiECXvMCQYeWHOlBLTzRG_g&index=4
[5:46 pm, 24/03/2021] +REACH: Experts Explain: Vaccines Part 1 (Malay) Pakar Menjelaskan Tentang Vaksin Bahagian 1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o3f4Z5de2vU&list=PLH2CR4s1lqyiECXvMCQYeWHOlBLTzRG_g&index=6
[5:46 pm, 24/03/2021] +Kevinn Wang: if they are right why are there so many racial and religious violent
[5:46 pm, 24/03/2021] +REACH: Experts Explain: Vaccines Part 1 (Tamil) தடுப்பூசிகள் குறித்த நிபுணர்களின் விளக்கம் (பாகம் 1)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rx8SZ1sjw8&list=PLH2CR4s1lqyiECXvMCQYeWHOlBLTzRG_g&index=8
[5:46 pm, 24/03/2021] +Kevinn Wang: keep to out own belief and practice and may this multi racial society keep on going for many years and generations to come PEACE ALL
[5:47 pm, 24/03/2021] +CQ: as in workplace. a person's religion may impose certain rules/guidelines, so just respect that lah. but a job is just a job. a workplace is just there. if whatever you wear doesn't impact the safety of your tasks, why should it matter?
[5:47 pm, 24/03/2021] +CQ: yeah, i was quite surprised that this was brought up...
[5:48 pm, 24/03/2021] +Kevinn Wang: if it is mean to win votes is a dam wrong move!
[5:48 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: Lesser devil than letting Muslim cashier hesitate to pick up the frozen pork abd feel outcast
[5:48 pm, 24/03/2021] +Kevinn Wang: multi racial society
[5:48 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ben: Yes, I 100% understand that point. However, are we saying it's ok for religion to impose a dress code? Some people may not want to wear but are pressured to do so.
[5:48 pm, 24/03/2021] +Kevinn Wang: we respect many cultures and its practices but there are place where these have to be keep one side
[5:49 pm, 24/03/2021] +Kevinn Wang: seriously if i am a believer of s Satan meaning i can wear horns to work and bring my satan idol out also i knwo is rubbish example but practically that is what the MP is indicating
[5:49 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ben: Muslim may not be allowed to touch Pork, but there is no rule about touching the packaging is there? Holding a packet of Pork is OK since they are not touching the meat. Putting additional plastic around it doesn't change it.
[5:51 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: Hmm... let me put it this way. Wearing a condom there’s still a chance of getting pregnant but wearing another one confirm no chance
[5:51 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ben: Erm, how so?
[5:51 pm, 24/03/2021] +Kevinn Wang: wrong will still kenna
[5:51 pm, 24/03/2021] +CQ: they can impose whatever they want, and it's for the individual to practice what they choose to subscribe to. eg the very traditional orthodox christian/catholics do have a head covering when they are in church, though I don't think it's very common in Singapore. but even if a church does impose this, it's for the believers to choose what. not for us to say "this religious practice is ok, this practice is not"
[5:52 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ben: If the pork inside the packet is exposed to the air then please do not buy it. The meat will be off.
[5:52 pm, 24/03/2021] +Kevinn Wang: cos got loop hole hahahahaha
[5:52 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Just curious which MP bring it up?
[5:52 pm, 24/03/2021] +Kevinn Wang: WP side one lor
[5:52 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Oh I see.
[5:52 pm, 24/03/2021] +Kevinn Wang: see this what happen when such things gets blown out of proportion making it like a one sided case
[5:52 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ben: Yes this makes sense. They are wearing what is appropriate in the church.
[5:52 pm, 24/03/2021] +Kevinn Wang: https://mothership.sg/2021/03/ustaz-zahid-zin-yellow-letter/?fbclid=IwAR2XOH_3qmMVJ0baTBIjNOLN-nQ7MxAJ39wVKixGMpZ8ExczEz_0v_Jee_A
[5:53 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: Lol
[5:53 pm, 24/03/2021] +Kevinn Wang: plus the society now still believe what the west do is correct if correct we will not have so many deaths and racisms in the western world
[5:53 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: Plastic one layer sharp fingernail might poke a hole
[5:54 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: But with another layer of plastic bag won’t be so easy
[5:54 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ben: Again, don't buy it if the packet is spoiled. Pork or lamb or chicken.
[6:08 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: I agree with you
[6:21 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Btw, I have posted all my comments about the key to resolve China and US tension in SCMP (South China Morning Post).
Our politicians need not bring up any solutions that are deem sensitive to China politicians that could compromise our national interest.
China leaders are very smart people.
They will determine whether it will help them or not.
[6:22 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
No netizens in SCMP attack my posts unlike some posts that is critical to China were relentlessly attack by China netizens.
[6:23 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
1. Mr LKY in the 1970s coax Mr Deng Xiaoping to transform China from Central Planned Economy into Market Economy - and China become the 2nd largest economy in the World. (Economic transformation)
2. Now in year 2021, I coax China to transform from Communism into the Hybrid system of Democracy in Communism - to prevent China-US confrontation. (Political transformation)
Not sure can succeed or not. (Transformation into a great nation - must transform not only economically but also politically)
If successful, China will have successfully transformed into a modern developed nation - not only economically but also politically - the last inflection point - the most difficult part of the journey (transforming the political system).
[6:23 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
China can:-
不发一粒子弹。
以心收服天下。
Not firing a bullet.
But using your heart to win over the world.
[6:25 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
======
共产 = 同志 = 以民为主 以人为本 = 党领导同志 = 同志普选制 = 一种社会组织的理论或系统，其中所有财产归社区所有，每个人根据自己的能力和需要作出贡献和接受。.
Communism = Comrade = With Citizens and Humanity at its Core = Party Leader Comrade = Universal Suffrage = a theory or system of social organization in which all property is owned by the community and each person contributes and receives according to their ability and needs.
This is democratic process in Communism.
这是共产主义中的民主进程。
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[6:27 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
See, the irreconcilable differences between US and China is "autocratic" versus "democracy".
[6:32 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Btw SCMP is own by Communist party members.
[6:39 pm, 24/03/2021] +REACH: COVID-19: More employees may return to the workplace, split teams not required from Apr 5
More employees may return to the workplace from Apr 5 and split team arrangements will no longer be mandatory as Singapore eases some COVID-19 measures.
More: https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/more-employees-can-return-workplace-split-teams-work-from-home-14480076
[6:39 pm, 24/03/2021] +REACH: COVID-19 vaccination now open to Singapore residents aged 45 to 59
People aged 45 to 59 years old can start registering interest to be vaccinated against COVID-19 with immediate effect, as the Government expands its vaccination programme to younger age groups.
More: https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/covid-19-vaccination-younger-age-groups-14480078
[6:39 pm, 24/03/2021] +REACH: Weddings, live performances to have increased capacities with pre-event COVID-19 tests
Marriage solemnisations, wedding receptions and live performances can have increased capacity limits from next month if they implement pre-event testing for their attendees, Singapore's COVID-19 task force said on Wednesday (Mar 24).
More: https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/weddings-solemnisations-performances-capacity-covid-19-test-14480114
[6:40 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: This is interesting
[6:40 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: Can discuss more on this tomorrow
[6:40 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
US assessment that China could invade Taiwan sooner than thought.
https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/asia/china-threat-to-taiwan-closer-than-most-think-us-admiral-14474544
[6:41 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Asia Pacific war could be around the corner if not urgently intercepted.
[6:41 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Our armour base is still in Taiwan.
[6:43 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: Hugh!?
[6:43 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ken: No more
[6:44 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Yes. It is still there - needs month to extract them out.
It is beside the Taiwan armour base.
The base will definitely be targeted.
[6:47 pm, 24/03/2021] +Caleb: Is it?
[6:48 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Remember our terrex.
[6:48 pm, 24/03/2021] +Caleb: Only send there before Ex
[6:48 pm, 24/03/2021] +Caleb: Then send back when Ex ends
[6:48 pm, 24/03/2021] +Caleb: Don't think it is store there for a long time?
[6:48 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: We don't have foresight contingencies!?
[6:49 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
There are mechanics station there to maintain our base.
And we do have some physical assets there
[6:50 pm, 24/03/2021] +REACH: Dear contributors,
We will be extending the chat to 9pm today
Thank you
[6:50 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: There will always be men in Taiwan base even without exercise
[6:50 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: And yes there’s inventory there
[6:51 pm, 24/03/2021]Caleb: Only 55 percentage of seniors who have took or made appointments for vaccination 🤔
[6:51 pm, 24/03/2021] +Caleb: No wonder can open up the age grp so quickly
[6:51 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
It is political sensitive to do extraction.
1. We could suggest that, we run when our host are attack. The host and the allies don't like it.
2. If we extract, does it means attack is impending?
3. So it's a catch 22 for us.
[6:51 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: I believe our government and military is keeping a close eye on china's provocation of Taiwan's military to wear them down for possible confrontation
[6:51 pm, 24/03/2021] +Leonard Lau: Why are we discussing about Taiwan based on a piece of speculative posting from US ?
[6:51 pm, 24/03/2021] +Caleb: Ya
[6:51 pm, 24/03/2021] +Caleb: Maybe is US want to go in taiwan
[6:52 pm, 24/03/2021] +Caleb: Malaysia, Singapore use blockchain technology for COVID-19 vaccination certificates https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/asia/malaysia-singapore-covid-19-vaccine-certificate-blockchain-14479270#.YFsZ09p44J4.whatsapp
[6:52 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
No we should not take sides.
[6:53 pm, 24/03/2021] +Leonard Lau: With the simpleton view , US military needs $$$ funding from the new Dem Govt ... as the general understanding is that Biden is going to reduce military spending. They got to make themselves looks worthy and stir tension.
[6:55 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: Tbh I was surprise there was no war during Trump presidency
[6:55 pm, 24/03/2021] +Leonard Lau: This is good progress .
[6:55 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: Most republican president have a war during their term
[6:56 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: He is afraid of starting one
[6:56 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Trump didn't start a war.
But Trump sow the seeds for World War 3.
[6:56 pm, 24/03/2021] +Leonard Lau: Harsh Reality - US can’t afford to start a war anymore
[6:58 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: Agree
[6:58 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: True
[6:59 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
China airforce and navy are intruding into Taiwan air space and sea space daily.
This is grey invasion and prodding Taiwan's loopholes in air defence, naval defense as well as all their missile bases.
China also has a mock up of Taiwan critical sites that they train in storming them.
All these are sign of planned invasion.
[7:00 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: Yes
[7:00 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: No sure about that he’s a showman so if you piss him off might happen
[7:01 pm, 24/03/2021] +Caleb: https://www.facebook.com/592308557475467/posts/4192927034080250/
[7:01 pm, 24/03/2021] +65 9009 7919: I did not expect we open up to fast and steep
[7:02 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Also China has reinforced all the offshore islands and armed with carrier killer missiles.
US carriers cannot get close to Taiwan to help - as all their carrier fighter planes are out of range.
[7:03 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
So strategically and tactically, China are ready for a swift win - if they decide to take Taiwan.
[7:05 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Japan and SKorea bases are the only 2 bases to provide support.
But I wonder whether Japan and SKorea will want to be draw into this war - as they may get bomb.
[7:05 pm, 24/03/2021] +REACH: Covid-19: Why is Singapore still capping social gatherings to groups of 8?
While capacity limits for some events like weddingswill be increased from April 24 with precautions in place, social gatherings still have to be limited to eight people as a relaxation of this measure could considerably increase the risk of Covid-19 transmission, said Health Minister Gan Kim Yong on Wednesday (March 24).
More: https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/covid-19-why-is-singapore-still-capping-social-gatherings-to-groups-of-8
[7:07 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: 🤔
[7:07 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
US carriers has no answer to hypersonic missiles.
[7:07 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: They will be drag japan and south korea inby virtue of America military presence there for logistics support.
[7:07 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: Agree
[7:08 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
So it is no joke if we don't intercept and persuade everyone to cool the tension.
This scenario can happen if everyone is not careful.
[7:10 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: We must use diplomatic means
[7:10 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ben: This does seem a little odd in light of the zero cases, vaccination drive, plus opening up workplaces.
[7:10 pm, 24/03/2021] +Caleb: Can open up for outdoor
swimming pools?
[7:10 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: Yeah
[7:12 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
US carriers Stealth fighter like f35b and f35c that can evade radar is out of range to even get close to Taiwan.
And China mainland bases will far exceeds the capacity of 3 US carriers.
So if China decide to fight US may not win in a conventional war.
Then nuclear become a possible next option.
Humanity may end.
See the repercussions.
[7:13 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Yes diplomacy is the only peaceful way out.
But US and China must genuinely want to resolve their differences - and not try to play tough.
[7:14 pm, 24/03/2021] +Caleb: Else is Singapore liao
[7:14 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Singapore better stay out.
[7:15 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: 250 for wedding and 750 for events
[7:15 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
That's why I am so concern about our Taiwan armour base and in future Guam airbase that will house our f35s.
[7:15 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: But dinner can’t exceed 8?
[7:15 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: Lol
[7:16 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: Guess I have to get married to have a gathering lol
[7:17 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ben: Yes, this is a bit odd.... and still no live music at a venue where alcohol is served....
[7:18 pm, 24/03/2021]Caleb Think they learned from the outbreaks in korea
[7:19 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Now you see why south China sea Islands are so critical to China?
Because it is a very effective A2AD military strategy.
Anti-access, Area Defence military strategy.
No airforce, navy and troop can get close.
[7:19 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: Yes
[7:19 pm, 24/03/2021] +Leonard Lau: For now , No live music and alcohol please . There will be still pockets of people that will stretch our enforcers. Pls keep ourselves safe
[7:20 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: I hope we can and not be forced
[7:20 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: Another target!
[7:20 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: 😅😂🤣
[7:21 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: Agree
[7:21 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
If we don't bite no one can force us.
But if missiles start flying, the whole Pacific region will not be spared.
[22 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: https://www.todayonline.com/singapore/annual-vaccination-could-be-necessary-prevent-future-covid-19-outbreaks-spore-study-finds?cid=telegram_tg-single_social-free_26012019_today
[7:26 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: I mean I understand live music lah... but dinner still 8 pax when wedding can have 50 per group
[7:26 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: Weird rule
[7:27 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ben: Fair enough - I remember the problems last year!
[7:28 pm, 24/03/2021]Caleb: I think 8 to a table
[7:29 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: https://mothership.sg/2021/03/social-gathering-limit/
[7:29 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: Similarly, the limit for wedding receptions will be increased from 100 attendees to 250 attendees in total (including the wedding couple, excluding vendors), in zones or time slots of up to 50 attendees each.
[7:31 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: How about this? Give us an option for swab test at restaurant for those up to 10 pax. If no issue we can gather as 10 pax.
[7:32 pm, 24/03/2021] +CQ: i find it odd that we're opening up workplaces but not opening up recreation. so all work no play
[7:32 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: Ask Gan Kim Yong/Lawrence Wong
[7:33 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: COVID-19 vaccination now open to Singapore residents aged 45 to 59
https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/covid-19-vaccination-younger-age-groups-14480078
[7:34 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: Or those vaccinated show their certificates for 10 pax gathering
[7:34 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: Just throwing out ideas Hee
[7:34 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: *here
[7:34 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: Close proximity issues!?
[7:34 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ben: Not sure this is working. I went and registered but didn't get the confirmation SMS so went back to do it again (as instructed) and the site now says 60s and above.....
[7:35 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: Oh!
[7:35 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Those are interested in China thinking, you can see the drama video - "Crossing the Yalu river" on Korean War.
China use the art of war superbly even though they are poorly arm - and push back the far more superior US air force and tanks.
[7:36 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
In YouTube.
[7:36 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: Yankees got caught with their pants down!
[7:37 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
《跨过鸭绿江》第1集 中苏签订友好互助条约 朝鲜内战爆发【CCTV热播剧场】
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hyN2i2HiWyA
[7:38 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: I think it’s not properly started yet
[7:38 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: Maybe try again tomorrow
[7:39 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Their political thinking, including Taiwan issue, their art of war and how they view the world - are still very relevant to the current US-China context.
It hasn't changed.
[7:40 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
And their alliance with Russia and NKorea as well as their cooperation are still relevant in todays context.
[7:41 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: Not sure if the 1m queue will still work once full workforce back in office
[7:43 pm, 24/03/2021] +CQ: of course not.... i was in Adelphi today, and cos it was raining, the food places were all crowded. seating was quite packed, queues were long and NO ONE was keeping the 1m distance. so i ordered coffee on the right, moved to the lane on the left for collection. between left and right definitely not 1m
[7:44 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: SDA!?
[7:45 pm, 24/03/2021] +CQ: i think everyone relax already
[7:45 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: Jialat like that 75% and WFH no more how?
[7:51 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ben: The proper url is https://preregister.vaccine.gov.sg/
[7:53 pm, 24/03/2021]Caleb I received this sms, After the pre registration
[7:53 pm, 24/03/2021] +Rama: Complacency has set in!?
[7:55 pm, 24/03/2021] +Kevinn Wang: long time ago already complacency set in
[7:56 pm, 24/03/2021] +CQ: even from way before. i think 5 April onwards it'll be mayhem
[7:59 pm, 24/03/2021] +Ben: hmm ok - not getting the OTP for some reason.
[7:59 pm, 24/03/2021] +Caleb: Maybe try later
[7:59 pm, 24/03/2021]Caleb: Guess alot are on it
[8:18 pm, 24/03/2021] +Stella Yip: https://www.todayonline.com/singapore/nurses-likely-be-allowed-wear-tudung-religious-leaders-informed-govts-position-over-six
[8:21 pm, 24/03/2021] +Stella Yip: My friend ask me if allow tudung, then Catholic can also wear the lace head scarf? Buddhists and taoist can also wear their religious stuff? Hindus too? Those with Japanese religion also can? Or is this just for the religion that complain?
[8:22 pm, 24/03/2021] +Stella Yip: The key question is about how to maintain fairness, I think.
[8:26 pm, 24/03/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Then uniform group very colourful.
No longer call uniformed group.
Can call un-uniform group.
[8:27 pm, 24/03/2021] +Stella Yip: 🤭🤣
[8:46 pm, 24/03/2021] +REACH: Dear Contributors,
⏰ We will be closing the chat in 15 minutes ⏰
Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.
Goodnight!
Megan
[8:46 pm, 24/03/2021] +Alvin Lim: gdnite Megan!
[9:01 pm, 24/03/2021] +REACH: Dear Contributors,
We will be closing the chat for today.
Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.
Goodnight!
Megan
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