REACH 174 - Royal Caribbean cruise ship infection (SK)
09 Dec 2020 (11am - 7pm)
REACH
[10:10 am, 09/12/2020] +: Royal Caribbean cruise ship returns to S'pore after passenger tests positive for Covid-19
Royal Caribbean cruise ship Quantum of the Seas arrived in Singapore on Wednesday (Dec 9) after turning back on day three of a four-day cruise to nowhere due to a confirmed Covid-19 case on board.
More: https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/suspected-covid-19-case-on-royal-caribbean-cruise-to-nowhere-ship-returns-to-singapore-mid
+ changed this group's settings to allow all participants to send messages to this group.
REACH
[11:07 am, 09/12/2020] +: Dear contributors,
Welcome back! π
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Megan π
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[11:08 am, 09/12/2020] +: LAI MEGAN
We worried how come those not in close contact still can balik
Cannot say let them mix around then after 14 days then check back ma
Later δΈεδΈε―ζΆζΎ how?
[11:11 am, 09/12/2020] +: Agree, why take the risk leh...
[11:11 am, 09/12/2020] +: UPDATE: Royal Caribbean passengers who were not in close contact with the Covid-19 case can leave the ship when disembarking starts.
They can proceed with their usual activities but will have to take a swab test at the end of a 14-day monitoring period, says MOH. https://str.sg/JakG
Stay in the know:
https://t.me/TheStraitsTimes
[11:12 am, 09/12/2020] +: Once again, MOH is SLOW in communication
[11:12 am, 09/12/2020] +: Gov.sg no communication
[11:12 am, 09/12/2020] +: I hope gahmen revises its internal policy of relying on MSM to disseminate information
If not, what is gov.sg for?
[11:13 am, 09/12/2020] +: MOH need to reach MCI. then MCI pass down
[11:13 am, 09/12/2020] +: π€£
[11:13 am, 09/12/2020] +: hmmm think there are protocols have been established beforehand, and emergency response plans have been activated?
[11:14 am, 09/12/2020] +: Even so, those are just so-called adequate measures
It should've been stricter
[11:14 am, 09/12/2020] +: I agree as well. There’s too much risk involved.
[11:15 am, 09/12/2020] +: stricter in what way?
[11:15 am, 09/12/2020] +: Is MOH contact trace the person activities before boarding the ship?
[11:16 am, 09/12/2020] +: Like testing them ALL before letting them disembark, regardless of whether they were in close contact with the infected person
[11:16 am, 09/12/2020] +: They should at least implement all much have TT app or token.
[11:16 am, 09/12/2020] +: or not
[11:16 am, 09/12/2020] +: This is a very interesting test case to see the testing, contact tracing works. The ship represent a smaller version of close community.
[11:17 am, 09/12/2020] +: Do they have SE for different sections onboard the cruise?
After all it's like a mini city onboard
[11:17 am, 09/12/2020] +: Government should be very transparent on what happened in the ship, the safety procedure taken
+left
[11:18 am, 09/12/2020] +: On one hand, govt's messages to the public has been to take Covid seriously. How does this gel with MOH's permissibility that the rest of the cruise passengers can go about their normal activities after disembarking - despite precedences that enclosed space allow Covid to spread fast, it may not be realistic that people practice real social distancing in a cruise ship, and infected Covid humans may not immediately show symptoms. What's the trade-off here?
[11:24 am, 09/12/2020] +: Trade off is as much as possible back to normal if not many industries will just no long exist. Transport hub we have to have people traveling here
[11:25 am, 09/12/2020] +: I guess the ship is like a building.
[11:26 am, 09/12/2020] +: I think the trade-off points to how MOH handles the situation, rather than why we had the cruise in the first place
I understand it's needed to boost the economy so now we want to know why MOH's stance is let them go back and self-monitor
[11:26 am, 09/12/2020] +: I dont disagree with you. I think there is a moral hazzard issue in this case. I go play. Get Covid. Pass to you who have been staying safe. Who pays for your medical?
[11:26 am, 09/12/2020] +: So only those in the same shop or fnb need to be on SHN?
[11:26 am, 09/12/2020] +: But soul garden reopen the following day after cleaning
[11:26 am, 09/12/2020] +: Agreed. What is the policy i.e. how would this situation be handled is important.
[11:27 am, 09/12/2020] +: "Pandemic safety measures include pre-boarding testing for passengers. Mask wearing is mandatory and passengers must have the Trace Together mobile application or token on their person at all times."
Based on article, have leh
[11:27 am, 09/12/2020] +: I mean for the next 14 days when they roam around in Sg
[11:27 am, 09/12/2020] +: What's the topic ah
[11:27 am, 09/12/2020] +: Yup!
[11:27 am, 09/12/2020] +: i see
[11:27 am, 09/12/2020] +: The Cruise case
[11:27 am, 09/12/2020] +: The Cruise case
[11:27 am, 09/12/2020] +: Ya ah dw them later pa pa zao everywhere
[11:28 am, 09/12/2020] +: I think MOH guidelines of SHN is close contact of at least 30 mins
[11:28 am, 09/12/2020] +: Posted from REACH?
[11:28 am, 09/12/2020] +: This is likely another potential explosion case like the past dorm situation. Plus those who are on board the cruise were tested beforehand and thought that they were all free from covid, so pretty sure all were complacent and not entirely following SMM measures.
[11:28 am, 09/12/2020] +: Hahaha did you happen to type the same thing with the same capitalisation π
[11:28 am, 09/12/2020] +: So waiter don't have close contact.
[11:28 am, 09/12/2020] +: The next 14 days will be crucial
[11:28 am, 09/12/2020] +: Yes, think they understand we are all very anxious about this
[11:28 am, 09/12/2020] +: π
[11:28 am, 09/12/2020] +: The thing is this is not gonna end... even with vaccine. Just face the fact. It will be like any other flu.
[11:29 am, 09/12/2020] +: We don't have social distancing requirements with flu!
[11:29 am, 09/12/2020] +: With teeth drop out of nowhere. Lol
[11:29 am, 09/12/2020] +: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/11/26/health/covid-teeth-falling-out.html
[11:29 am, 09/12/2020] +: Actually some auto have hahaha
A-CHOO! Even before COVID, everyone siam you π
[11:34 am, 09/12/2020] +: MOH got no press release. https://www.moh.gov.sg/news-highlights/
[11:35 am, 09/12/2020] +: The infected pax haven't take the serology test.
Could be a past infection ya
[11:47 am, 09/12/2020] +: I'm not sure, but isn't one of the pre-trip tests a serology test? I think there are 2, one to be taken 3 days before and one at the point of boarding. I had the impression the one to be taken 3 days prior include serology
[11:48 am, 09/12/2020] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
Don't know how stringent they do SafeEntry and tracetogether on the ship - to determine close contact.
If there are slippage and some close contact are not identified, then infection could spread.
[11:50 am, 09/12/2020] +: IMHO, the other passengers shouldn't be allowed to disembark freely. At the very least, there should be a SHN of at least 5 days just so that we don't run the risk of community spread. Just because there's no close contact and everyone wearing masks doesn't mean they can't pick up the virus through surfaces and touching their masks/faces.
[11:51 am, 09/12/2020] +: Yes! By now a bit too late to contain already
Sadly this is another case of gahmen never think properly
[11:53 am, 09/12/2020] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
Also the infected person may visit toilet, eat and drink, touch other surfaces.
Wonder how stringent and thoroughness is the disinfection process?
[11:53 am, 09/12/2020] +: Need to pick up next incoming group for the cruise. Important the risk is reduced
[11:57 am, 09/12/2020] +: So the message is "go out, do whatever you want, as long as you're not deemed a close contact, you won't kena the troublesome SHN." What kind of message is this for the rest of us who are proceeding with caution and choosing to suppress our own wanderlust for the greater good? Are we supposed to throw that caution to the wind and just go since garmen say never mind?
[0:00 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Even if not close contact, Covid is known to stay on surfaces, which can be passively picked up on the ship
[0:00 pm, 09/12/2020] +: ‘Definitely I’ll go again’: Some Royal Caribbean passengers say no regrets going on cruise that was cut short by COVID-19 case
https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/covid-19-royal-caribbean-cruise-passengers-positive-test-13732850
Eh seriously........
[0:05 pm, 09/12/2020] +: "No regrets": this is the kind of mentality that we can't encourage. It's essentially saying high risk high return. Even if your first bet failed and someone onboard kena, you can still bet on not being listed as close contact. Why are we encouraging this kind of punters' mentality omg...
[0:05 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Outbreak of salmonella and stomach flu at Newton pre-school, 3 kids hospitalised:: https://www.asiaone.com/singapore/outbreak-salmonella-and-stomach-flu-newton-pre-school-3-kids-hospitalised?utm_source=whatsapp&utm_medium=social-media&utm_campaign=addtoany
[0:06 pm, 09/12/2020] +: agree
[0:12 pm, 09/12/2020] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
Thought it will be safer if all are tested before releasing them into the community.
[0:18 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Oh, and it's reported that the passengers allowed to disembark will be contacted for testing 1 week later and it seems that the testing fees will be borne by the State? Why should taxpayers have to bear the cost?
[0:20 pm, 09/12/2020] +: All of the passengers were wearing contact tracing wrist bands so they know who came into contact and who did not.
[0:25 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Royal Caribbean’s Quantum of the Seas is still set to sail on Dec 10, the company says. This is after a COVID-19 patient was detected on board today and the cruise had to return to Singapore ahead of schedule.
These are the measures it’s undertaking to keep passengers and crew safe: https://cna.asia/2K0wTxg
[0:28 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Odd, were there tests being done daily on board, or were they still waiting for results when the boat disembarked?
[0:30 pm, 09/12/2020] +: True, seems they are scared of putting people off going on cruises...
[0:31 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Except 10 time more deadly and 100 times more infectious?
[0:33 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Agreed. Shd test b4 let them disembark. Like that no shn etc.. Wabder ard.. Later firm cruise community
[0:35 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Yeah.
[0:35 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Are they...?
[0:36 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Common surfaces. Like that a lot of close contact..
[0:37 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Seems really odd not to test and do a SHN until results are goven
[0:37 pm, 09/12/2020] +: *given
REACH
[0:37 pm, 09/12/2020] +: π’ Topic π’
Singapore can play a critical role in distributing vaccines to the region as an air cargo hub, said the Civil Aviation Authority of Singapore (CAAS) and Changi Airport Group (CAG) on Tuesday (Dec 8).
“We are able to handle not only vaccine shipments to Singapore for our own needs, but also transshipments to Singapore for distribution to the rest of the region.”
π¬ What do you think of Singapore’s move to position itself as a hub to distribute COVID-19 vaccines to the region?
The airport authority highlighted that the airport’s cargo handlers, dnata and SATS, have been investing in cold chain infrastructure and equipment over the years to support transportation of temperature-controlled cargo.
Vaccines require cold chain transportation as some of them need to be kept at specific temperatures. It ensures that the vaccines will remain unspoilt as they get from where they are being manufactured to where they will be administered - hospitals and clinics.
π https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/singapore-air-cargo-hub-covid-19-vaccines-changi-airport-caas-13725180
[0:40 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Now still can turn back anot?
Why wait till potentially spread then test? Who's genius idea?
[0:40 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Right move to give our aviation hub a boost and stamp our status around the world.
[0:42 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Then for those who blindly follow gahmen one my word to you is, don't
We have our own brains to think, that's why we have countless things to give feedback about
Sometimes gahmen also blindsided but that's where we come in and comment and put them back on track π
[0:44 pm, 09/12/2020] +: I think cleaners got high risk of getting covid-19. Based on so many cases in SG already.
Maybe this group should get vaccine first, after healthcare workers got it.
[0:44 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Clever turnaround
[0:51 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Yes: "Each guest will be provided with a wearable device that allows rapid tracing in the event it is necessary."
https://www.royalcaribbean.com/sgp/en/faq/questions/how-does-contact-tracing-work
[0:52 pm, 09/12/2020] +: No change in school fees for Singaporeans, PRs and ASEAN students next year: MOE https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/no-change-school-fees-singaporeans-prs-asean-students-moe-13733168#.X9BXwNqhMBo.whatsapp
[0:53 pm, 09/12/2020] +: But what is the point of having tracing in that case?
If person tests positive for Covid, do we close every lift, bus, MRT that they have touched in the proceeding few days? Or test everyone who has subsequently travelled in/on that lift, bus, MRT? No. Because we have contact tracing apps and wrist-bands to avoid that.
[0:54 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Ahem
[0:54 pm, 09/12/2020] +: This cruise is isolated environment
You can't just compare that to PT
[0:54 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Is a chance thing... you can’t just clean up everywhere the person walk pass lol
[0:56 pm, 09/12/2020] +: ??
[0:56 pm, 09/12/2020] +: So is MRT and bus
[0:56 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Nope
[0:56 pm, 09/12/2020] +: This cruise isn't as typical as a mode of journey as PT is
[0:56 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Does this help? https://www.royalcaribbean.com/sgp/en/faq/questions/how-is-air-circulated-and-filtered-onboard
[0:59 pm, 09/12/2020] +: ππ
[1:00 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Don't is two words.
[1:00 pm, 09/12/2020] +: I wasn't referring to air circulation
[1:00 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Don't try to be funny
[1:02 pm, 09/12/2020] +: On the topic of surface contamination, there are sprays out there that coats the surfacr
[1:02 pm, 09/12/2020] +: sdst
[1:02 pm, 09/12/2020] +: I think the ship interiors should be coated with them
[1:02 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Sdst pro*
[1:02 pm, 09/12/2020] +: No need so exact with the name anyway
[1:02 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Sdst is the weaker version
[1:03 pm, 09/12/2020] +: But my opinion ah
[1:04 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Goverbment can try to coat the whole country, but if individuals dont practise good personal hygiene, it is still useless
[1:12 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Easy to read comparison between the 4 main vaccines. I note that singapore choice, Moderna, is nearly SG$90 per person, but likely the most effective.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-55212787
[1:19 pm, 09/12/2020] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
1. SIA have good track record of transporting and distributing vaccines that requires very stringent temperature control at very low temperature.
2. Very few other airlines have such cap.
3. Thus SIA role in transporting and distributing vaccines via Changi airport from US and EU to other parts of the world - will reinforce Singapore Changi airport as a irreplaceable airhub.
4. This may ramp up our cargo freight many fold as we are waiting for passengers travel to pick up.
[1:20 pm, 09/12/2020] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
With no domestic air travel, vaccines distribution will help to mitigate our lost in international travelling.
[1:26 pm, 09/12/2020] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
1. This cruise infection is not something unexpected- as we open up slowly and carefully for cruise business - to keep the tourism sector going.
2. However, when unfortunate event such as this infection occur, stringent procedure that are put in place must be activated to arrest the infection and prevent it from spreading.
3. When this is done, and we are confident that infection can be arrested and prevent from spreading to the community, we must continue to open up the cruise carefully and ensure all safeguard are put in place.
[1:30 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Singapore’s potential to perform this well & within safety standards is highly recognised.
[1:31 pm, 09/12/2020] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
Balancing public health and ensuring economic activities - is a fine balancing act - to ensure public safety while ensuring people continue to have business and jobs.
With all the experience, knowledge and technology in controlling the pandemic behind us, we can put them into good use - to balance public health and economic activities.
This will have to go on - until mass vaccination starts.
I feel that we can achieve this.
[1:31 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Transference of virus can still occur over different surfaces on the cruise ship. Everyone on board should be suspected covid patient.
[1:35 pm, 09/12/2020] +: how about soul garden case? those in there at the same period did not get SHN.
[1:35 pm, 09/12/2020] +: the cleaners and workers in the mal, were not tested or on SHN too
[1:41 pm, 09/12/2020] +: No news about tat one liao is it
[1:51 pm, 09/12/2020] ☸️ Danny εΏ: https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/world/in-covid-19-milestone-for-west--britain-starts-mass-vaccination-13726444 UK is the 1st in the World to start mass vaccination (outside trial).
[2:04 pm, 09/12/2020] +: - Women must not breastfeed or get pregnant for 2 months after immunization
- Children, pregnant and breastfeeding mothers should not be immunized
- Effects on fertility are unknown.
https://www.naturalnews.com/2020-12-08-pfizer-coronavirus-vaccine-no-breastfeeding-getting-pregnant.html
[2:06 pm, 09/12/2020] +: On LIFESG app
[2:07 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Till date no reply or change being made on the app.
[2:07 pm, 09/12/2020] +: I hope is a mistake in puting the wrong url. And not staff who misunderstood.
[2:08 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Thanks for sharing!
[2:14 pm, 09/12/2020] +: School fees unchanged for S'poreans, PRs next year; small rise for non-Asean foreign students
The Ministry of Education (MOE) said on Wednesday (Dec 9) it will not be making any changes to school fees for Singapore citizens, permanent residents and students from Asean.
More: https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/parenting-education/school-fees-unchanged-for-spore-citizens-prs-next-year-small-rise-for
[2:16 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Err off topic
[2:20 pm, 09/12/2020] +: 2 Billion Doses in 2021, will vaccinate 1 billion people. Far short of the 5 billion+ required for Herd Immunity. Likely to need to wear masks until full vaccination is complete. So, let's plan for 3 years more of this across the world, BUT if Singapore can complete vaccinations next year (200,000 jabs per week required) then maybe 2022 will start to look different.
[2:22 pm, 09/12/2020] +: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/health/coronavirus-pfizer-vaccine-legal-indemnity-safety-ministers-b1765124.html?amp
I wonder if we also did the same for getting it so fast?
[2:28 pm, 09/12/2020] +: https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/royal-caribbean-covid-19-case-not-unexpected-chan-chun-sing-13733690
[2:28 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Well done. π
[2:39 pm, 09/12/2020] +: In the US, all vaccine manufacturers are exempted from legal action. Any vaccine injuries the injured party has to sue the government.
In Singapore, Sanofi Pasteur withheld safety information for Dengvaxia and was never prosecuted by our G. Instead, HSA scientists (paid for by taxpayers) have to help them amend the package insert.
[2:39 pm, 09/12/2020] +: we are expecting up to 30 cases per day
[2:40 pm, 09/12/2020] +: ?
[2:45 pm, 09/12/2020] +: π±π¨ no legal protection for citizens!?
[2:46 pm, 09/12/2020] +: https://www.straitstimes.com/opinion/dont-get-hung-up-over-when-phase-3-will-happen
Singaporeans have already been warned to be mentally prepared that the number of community cases will rise - possibly up to the 30s - when measures are eased further.
[2:49 pm, 09/12/2020] +: The citizens have to sue the government coz their government indemnify the vaccine manufacturers. They have to prove that the injury or death is caused by the vaccine. The court cases can go on for years. Only a minority won their cases.
[2:50 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Big pHARMa π¬
[3:05 pm, 09/12/2020] +: I believe if u choose to vaccinate yourself w this new vacine, before u hv it, you may be asked to sign a consent form to waive them for any possible liabilities.
[3:08 pm, 09/12/2020] +: It is similar to taking part in some dangerous sports. As this mement, we all know that the approval of these vacines r fast track. It may or may not work, it may or may not hv side effects. U just hv to keep your fingers crossedπ if u want to try it.
[3:14 pm, 09/12/2020] +: So meaning since these Covid 19 vaccines are fast tracked and have no long term safety record, our G and employers have no right to enforce mandatory vaccinations on us?
[3:17 pm, 09/12/2020] +: What about the mandatory vaccines all of us have to take during our childhood? If someone in a rare case gets injured or killed, who is liable? Also, when parents of children or adults go for vaccination, are they truly given sufficient information for them to give informed consent, or are they just told: “It is safe!”
[3:18 pm, 09/12/2020] +: I will wait for one more year before thinking of taking this COVID-19 vaccine.
[3:21 pm, 09/12/2020] +: πππ
[3:21 pm, 09/12/2020] +: It depends on whether one injury or death was attributed solely to the vaccine or if there was any human negligence involved in the administration
[3:22 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Unless there are agreements with all countries that we can travel freely with any market Covid-19 vaccines. Then I will think about taking one with most successful rate 6 months later or at least 1/5 of the population take vaccines.
[3:30 pm, 09/12/2020] +: If injury or death is solely due to the vaccine? Who is liable? Or are we just the collateral damage with no party liable?
[3:35 pm, 09/12/2020] +: It depends on your cause of action. If it's negligence, then it's a question whether the pharma company was negligent in the development of the vaccine or whether they've done everything reasonably expected, but just so happened that the person vaccinated fell within that tiny percentage where things went horribly wrong. There's also the issue of how the vaccine was administered. Was there a medical condition known to the patient/parents and the attending physician where the vaccine shouldn't have been administered to this class of patients and if so, the liability shouldn't fall to the pharma company but to the physician or even on the patient or parents for not informing the physician of the known condition
[3:36 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Singapore Flyer launches Time Capsule attraction
The Singapore Flyer on Wednesday (Deb 9) unveiled its new Time Capsule attraction, aimed at providing visitors a "multi-sensory journey" of Singapore’s 700-year history.
More: https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/singapore-flyer-time-capsule-attraction-robot-13733984
[3:36 pm, 09/12/2020] +: On TraceTogether-only SafeEntry, when gov is going to start communicating to Building owners on this?
[3:37 pm, 09/12/2020] +: better start now
[3:37 pm, 09/12/2020] +: and not few days before going to implement it
[3:43 pm, 09/12/2020] +: So if the patient is healthy and has no known medical condition and is one of the rare ones that suffer injury or death and the vaccine manufacturer has done everything according to peocedure, the patient is simply a collateral damage? Even in cases of mandatory vaccination or the doctor simply says “it is very safe” and did not show the patient the package insert? For the “it is very safe” cases, the doctor can simply get away with “oh, this injury or death case is so rare, I’ve never encountered it before.”
[3:47 pm, 09/12/2020] +: In a case like Dengvaxia where the manufacturer withheld safety information, why was it not prosecuted? Do we have to wait for an actual injury to occur before we take action? Or can any action be taken at all?
[4:08 pm, 09/12/2020] +: From what I know if the Dengvaxia issue, the risks were uncovered by the manufacturer after a longer period of study and research and the risks were updated accordingly. I'm not sure what liability you're seeking here for a company which is seeking continued research, or are you proposing that vaccines should be rolled out only after a very extended period of study and guaranteed 100% safe for everybody and for any medical condition, known or unknown.
[4:12 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Dengvaxia was rolled out to Philippines and a few children became very ill and some of them died. After that Sanofi Pasteur announced that the vaccine can only be used for those who already had dengue before. After Singapore heard the news, some doctors were so shocked they refused to use the vaccines after that. HSA then ‘helped’ Sanofi Pasteur to update the package insert with the new information. So Sanofi Pasteur in this case did not withhold information?!?
[4:39 pm, 09/12/2020] +: There is no way to know all the risks associated with any drug or vaccine. There are certain segments of the population who will react badly to them. That is why we have long term drug safety surveillance. HSA has the mandate to take drug safety data Ave update package inserts. It's not a favour to the drug companies it is for doctors and patients to be able to make informed decisions regarding risks and benefits.
[4:43 pm, 09/12/2020] +: The point of vaccine now is to ensure we are safe. But if you don’t travel often I really don’t think we need just wear mask and maintain hygiene.
I would wait till it is more stable or when higher population have taken over a long period of time for such a rush up vaccine
[4:44 pm, 09/12/2020] +: All drugs and vaccine have risk is just how often the side effects presented itself then the benefit of vaccination against the disease.
So unless mandatory I think I will hold for a while and just keep social contact minimum
[4:46 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Dengvaxis is not in the list of National Adult Immunisation Schedule π
https://www.healthhub.sg/programmes/163/vaccinate?utm_source=google&utm_medium=sem&utm_campaign=fy20-immunisation-campaign&utm_content=generic&gclid=CjwKCAiAiML-BRAAEiwAuWVggj4IJmwKWUrpvPIpe2LAwduKPZMgbm4ly9yNZQ0Sw1530wkvmrOuNBoC_jEQAvD_BwE
[4:50 pm, 09/12/2020] +: hope Gov will allow us to use medisave for COVID-19 vaccine
[4:52 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Top public servant in statutory board acquitted of 5 molest charges against colleagues, convicted of one https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/public-servant-statutory-board-molest-charges-13734388#.X9CQU8YBSfM.whatsapp
[4:54 pm, 09/12/2020] +: 67 still working should be quite high up
[4:58 pm, 09/12/2020] +: In the case of Dengvaxia, were the patients given the necessary information to make informed decision? No. Were the doctors provided with necessary information to give the correct recommendation to the patient? No.
When the vaccinated children became ill with dengue and some children died, Sanofi very quickly made the announcement that the vaccine should only be dosed to those who had already contracted with dengue before. This is not the result of manufacturer doesn’t know what’s wrong, or the manufacturer over time has more data to adjust changes. In this case they knew about it and withheld the information.
I’m asking in this case of deliberately withholding information from HSA and the doctors, should the drug companies be held liable, even when we ar…
[5:02 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Yup
[5:05 pm, 09/12/2020] +: https://mothership.sg/2020/12/nus-new-bacteria-sewage-treatment/
[5:16 pm, 09/12/2020] +: Just to be clear- no one died from the vaccine. They died from symptoms related to dengue and other underlying conditions. It was a political and PR issue - dengvaxia still remains approved in all the developed countries. There was no hiding of phase 3 clinical trial data - that is available to all regulators who choose to approve a vaccine. Again, side effects are often not known post clinical trials until the drug or vaccine are deployed in the larger population. Once these rare adverse events are known, the approvals/inserts/risks are adjusted accordingly. You should still consider that vaccine if you've gotten dengue once before. The risks of the vaccine could outweigh risks of multiple dengue infections especially if you are older etc.
Same for montel…
[5:26 pm, 09/12/2020] +: No one died from Dengvaxia? Wrong. Some children in Philippines died. That’s why some doctors here have decided not to use the vaccine at all. A friend of mine had dengue twice. Her doctor informed her about the vaccine. To her surprise, her doctor REFUSED to recommend her the jab. My friend, after doing some research, said that Dengvaxia is a very dangerous vaccine, and said her doctor is a very good doctor and did right by refusing to recommend the vaccine to her.
As for Singulair, I brought it up since you mentioned the ‘long term drug safety surveillance’, where a doctor dismissed a patient feedback and claimed the drug is ‘very safe’. If doctors dismiss patient or parent feedback on side effects, how useful is this surveillance? What is the disciplinary action for doctors who dismiss such feedback?
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