REACH 129 - Transform business and train workers (SK)
27 Aug 2020 (12pm - 8pm)
REACH
[12:30 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Dear contributors,
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REACH
[12:30 pm, 27/08/2020] +: ๐ข Topic ๐ข
What do you think of the various initiatives to support workers and businesses to seize new opportunities and transform our economy?
To help workers stay in jobs, the MTI will work to ensure a safe and sustainable reopening of the economy amid Covid-19. It will help businesses in growth sectors to invest and expand, which will create good jobs for Singaporeans. It will also help businesses in sectors that have permanently changed to reinvent themselves, and help affected workers in these sectors develop new skills for new jobs.
MOM will aid displaced workers to return to work, and further tighten foreign workforce policies to ensure fairer outcomes for Singaporeans.
MCI, MAS and NRF will continue to invest in technology and innovation as gro…
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Rama
[12:33 pm, 27/08/2020] +: It's a start to be fine tuned along the way.
Blue and White Flag Guy
[12:34 pm, 27/08/2020] +: I like the idea of this, it's like a force multiplier but shouldn't we look at the ITM of each sector as I suggested previously and then work our way from there?
anfan
[12:49 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Yestoday i happened to be in the same lift with a chinese workercarrying tools to repair the lift. I asked him if covid-19 affected them much. He said those stay in the ้ไธญ่ฅ suffered the most. See the word ้ไธญ่ฅ，when he refereed to the dormitory.
Ken
[12:50 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Really no choice what can we do? Their mental health sure take a hit
anfan
[12:50 pm, 27/08/2020] +: I was so shocked to hear that. Anyway maybe better domitory environment should be provided.
Ken
[12:51 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Not the environment now, don’t have the freedom to roam around to interact with people outside and if you stay with lousy people no way you can change now
[1:12 pm, 27/08/2020] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Ricky Lim
(1) Industry Transformation Map (ITM)
- Idea is posted in 1 May 2012 to tackle disruptive tech and is adopted by the Government feature in Budget 2016.
- Now this idea is used in 23 industries where 15 industries led by one Minister-of-State have undergone transformation and has start to reap positive outcome - as a good number of companies have start to reap growth and profit through the newly transformed business.
Like · Reply · 1m
Ricky Lim ·
Singapore
Source of Origin of ITM :-
Ricky Lim ·
Singapore
The following is posted on:-
Tuesday, 1 May, 2012 2:57 PM
Ricky Lim
REACH RWEB Submission feedback RWEB2012050100010 via the REACH website: To raise productivity,
To raise productivity, everyone has a part to play :-
1. Business invest in capital tools and send workers for training
2. Workers upgrade skills to operate capital tools
3. Govt provide grants, provide good education, married govt R&D bodies with business etc
4. Government work with various industry to devise objective and tangible KPI to allow business, workers, union, gov, schools etc to shoot for the KPI.
5. Govt, business, bright individuals should scout overseas countries and industries that have make their industries productive and bring it back to Singapore and transform our business to be more productive.
6. Union encourage, provide relevant course for workers to upgrade
7. School train students in right course, right skills and married industry with courses.
8. Home, family members, social bodies have to support working members to provide a conducive environment for working members to be productive.
9. Look at whatever else things that can make the nation productive, to be productive.
10. Peg the wage increase vis-ร -vis our regions, our competitors, our international competition to ensure that our wage increase are competitive and will not drive away business – causing massive job losses.
Sent: Tuesday, 1 May, 2012 3:24 PM
To: reachadmin@reachadmin.com
Subject: REACH RWEB Submission: Govt agenices working with industries to devise prodictivity figures
To elaborate further :-
(1) Ministry of Comm and iDA – should work with IT industries, foreign IT MNCs, local IT vendors etc to devise objective, tangible KPI productive figures in each technology areas and skillsets vis-ร -vis global competition and regional competition – so that IT business and IT workers can target to meet the KPI productivity figures – and peg wage growth in % term and/or absolute term to the productivity figures and business profitability. Communicate this to the IT industries, business, IT workers, Union and schools. Make sure we are competitive with our global competitors and regional competitors.
(2) SLA should do the same with construction sector.
(3) Ministry of Finanace and MAS should work with the banking and financial sector. etc
ricky l
0Thumbs UpThumbs Down0Ricky L • a second agoRemove
That is, the concept above is how to transform Singapore Economy in 2016 - sector-by-sector (conceptualising the KPI for each sector) ---- and using targeted approach to transform each sector, each industry one by one.
Only then productivity in each sector, in each industry can be successfully transformed - supported by empirical, scientific measures.
Good that after 4 years --- the idea is taken up.
Like · Reply · Juvst now
Ricky Lim ·
Singapore
The origin of Industry Transformation Map (ITM).......................
Like · Reply · 1m
Jerick Tan
[1:23 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Ok that is scary! Concentration camp?! Coming from a foreign manual laborer, who's been through a much tougher life than us.. sounds really terrible
[1:24 pm, 27/08/2020] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Army barracks also concentration camp - got fence, got armed patrol.....
Blue and White Flag Guy
[1:24 pm, 27/08/2020] +: I'm sorry but doesn't the SAF have a segregated BCP in place?
Jerick Tan
[1:26 pm, 27/08/2020] +: I just hope he meant it in a light-hearted way
[1:26 pm, 27/08/2020] +: I mean, the foreign worker meant it in a light-hearted way
[1:27 pm, 27/08/2020] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
It is how we see things.
Half empty or half full.
If good intent - half empty.
If unwholesome intent - half full.
Ken
[1:27 pm, 27/08/2020] +: The problem is there is no dateline and no clear signs of dying. Every time once in a while one kena all quarantine. ๐
[1:28 pm, 27/08/2020] +: No freedom is still the key point
Blue and White Flag Guy
[1:28 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Oh don't give that philosophy thing
[1:31 pm, 27/08/2020] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Straits Times
Singapore and Thailand agree to speed up talks on essential business travel through reciprocal green lane
PUBLISHED AUG 26, 2020, 10:06 PM SGT
Singapore and Thailand have agreed to speed up discussions on setting up a reciprocal green lane for essential business travel between them, said Singapore's Ministry of Foreign Affairs on Wednesday (Aug 26).
The two Asean nations also had productive talks on strengthening the resilience of supply chains and connectivity networks during the meeting done via video-conferencing, added the ministry in its statement.
They also reviewed the progress in bilateral cooperation in various areas, including trade and investment, defence, finance, education and people-to-people ties between them.
Singapore is also considering reciprocal green lane arrangements with other regional countries, such as Indonesia and Japan.
Last month, Singapore agreed to implement such an arrangement with Malaysia to facilitate short-term essential business and official travel between them for up to 14 days.
---
Good that another ASEAN countries will hop onto our step-up "ring-fence" air-bubbles, "safe tunneling" air-corridor.
Malaysia, Indonesia, Thailand --- has come or are coming in..... not to forget to mention Japan (East Asia) --- also want to come in.
[5:14 pm, 25/08/2020] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ: Singapore need to reboot our air hub, tourism and external market - in order for our Economy to move back to positive territory.
Singapore need to reboot our air hub, tourism and external market - in order for our Economy to move back to positive territory.
[5:24 pm, 24/08/2020] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Europe is my proposed 3rd target.
I am thinking of ASEAN as my 2nd target - as part of the step up "ring-fence safe tunneling".
richard Wong
[1:50 pm, 27/08/2020] +: It’s just like House Arrest. One have no freedom to go out and don’t even know when that day will come . It’s a mental torture and stressful for the workers enclosed in the dormitories!!!
For the men who had gone through army BMT will understand .
[1:54 pm, 27/08/2020] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
---
Straits Times
18,000 jobs, skills training programmes in ICT sector available to Singaporeans: S. Iswaran
PUBLISHED AUG 26, 2020, 5:37 PM SGT UPDATEDAUG 26, 2020, 7:49 PM
During a media conference that was also attended by Trade and Industry Minister Chan Chun Sing and Manpower Minister Josephine Teo, Mr Iswaran said long-term career prospects in ICT - which cuts across all sectors of the economy - remain strong.
Mr Iswaran said there are opportunities for workers in the sector. "(In) terms of career prospects, and also in terms of its wage prospects - its median wages are higher than the national median wage. I think the long-term prospects remain strong," he added.
According to Ministry of Manpower statistics released this year, the median gross salary for information and communications jobs is $6,000 – above the national median of $4,600.
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[7:08 pm, 26/08/2020] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
That's why tripartite agreement between govt, union and employers - must institutionalise skillfuture and place certified trainees.
But first thing first, trainee must pass their cert and produce a job based project - to prove competency.
Eg. A good network engineer can configure 2 complicated routers within 30 minutes.
A good network data designer can design a data center network within 1/2 hours.
[7:13 pm, 26/08/2020] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
What I listed above will at least fetch $4000 and above.
[7:23 pm, 26/08/2020] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
If a Singaporean can do any of the above, or do all the above?
Who can take away your job?
Each one pay you $4000.
Some can do all the above.
Oh forgot to mention configure firewall, VPN, Security incident management, network management system.
---
Now :- Assistant engineer $4000
Engineer $5000
Senior Engineer $6000
Solution Architext >$10,000
[1:57 pm, 27/08/2020] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Every Country in the World is in lockdown --- like concentration camp. Cannot go out, cannot fly, must wear mask, cannot travel, cannot go to work, only can work at home, study at home. Only good things is that in this concentration camp, can surf handphone in internet, can see youtube, netflix, can see tv, can sing karaoke at home, can play computer games at home.
Yes covid 19 has created the World Concentration camp.....
[2:05 pm, 27/08/2020] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Fresh computer science graduates $4000 plus.
CQ
[2:10 pm, 27/08/2020] +: hmm... maybe my friends are getting shortchanged then. they're being offered $2400-2600
Stella
[2:10 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Fresh comp science graduates from local universities or can be for graduates from other countries with lower education costs like India, Philippines?
[2:20 pm, 27/08/2020] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Ist class honour $4000 plus and those below maybe $3000 plus.
Poly IT about $2000 plus.
[2:20 pm, 27/08/2020] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
That one ask govt and business.
CQ
[2:22 pm, 27/08/2020] +: no, i have friends from NUS computer science, graduated 2-3 years ago. 2nd Upper Honours if i'm not wrong. industry was booming. offered 2.4-2.6k. and not just one fella leh, 3 of them
[2:22 pm, 27/08/2020] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Now the current covid situation, I don't know the salary market.
But I know of final year fresh graduate already secured job at $4000 plus.
[2:24 pm, 27/08/2020] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
I also know of one fresh graduate just got into bank as IT also $4000 plus.
CQ
[2:27 pm, 27/08/2020] +: oh nice!!! anyway those 3 friends eventually decided to take the CFA together and went into the finance sector
CQ
[2:27 pm, 27/08/2020] +: that means they really kena lowballed
[2:28 pm, 27/08/2020] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
This is done Feb 2020 salary survey for fresh graduates.
Leonard Lau
[7:15 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Hmm .. I knew 3 NUS interns turned graduates drew average 5k as starting pay .
REACH
[7:16 pm, 27/08/2020] +: NTUC to set up task force to look at better protection for local PMEs
A new task force to champion the protection of professionals, managers and executives (PMEs) is being set up by the labour movement, it announced on Thursday (Aug 27).
The group will be headed by National Trades Union Congress (NTUC) assistant secretary-general Patrick Tay and Singapore National Employers Federation (SNEF) executive director Sim Gim Guan, and will likely start work in October.
Its aims are to engage PMEs and employers over a six- to 12-month period and come up with recommendations on government policy, best practices for companies and training, NTUC secretary-general Ng Chee Meng told reporters on Wednesday.
More: https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/manpower/new-tas…
Boon
[7:17 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Which level is this targeted? Is MOM expecting a middle management (PMET) to draw 4.5 or 5 (in the financial industry)...?
[7:36 pm, 27/08/2020] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Someone just updated me that 1st class honour for computer science graduates is $5000.
My post of $4000 plus is not correct.
Leonard Lau
[7:37 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Yes ..
Leonard Lau
[7:39 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Median Starting salaries
[7:41 pm, 27/08/2020] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Yes I think this chart is more accurate.
Desmond Koh
[7:46 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Must see got include employer CPF or bonuses or not
[7:48 pm, 27/08/2020] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Basic pay.
Desmond Koh
[7:51 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Oh
Leonard Lau
[7:55 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Problem is that we are not producing enough graduates especially IT and Finance
Ken
[7:55 pm, 27/08/2020] +: We have but just didn’t stay on.
[7:55 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Just like engineers forever not enough
Blue and White Flag Guy
[7:56 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Any idea on what's the oversupplied ones?
Leonard Lau
[7:56 pm, 27/08/2020] +: IT always but enough
Ken
[7:56 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Life science”
[7:57 pm, 27/08/2020] +: At least for what I know lots of my friends did not stay in the industry or cannot find related
[7:57 pm, 27/08/2020] +: PhD specially
[7:57 pm, 27/08/2020] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
IT cover all industries sectors.
And IT is not an easy topic.
[7:58 pm, 27/08/2020] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Very wide, technology change very quickly.
Leonard Lau
[7:58 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Yes .. IT is a painful job TBH
[7:59 pm, 27/08/2020] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Need depth and breadth.
Ken
[7:59 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Yup.. support is the toughest job
[8:00 pm, 27/08/2020] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
And need very fast on the feet to resolve problems.
[8:00 pm, 27/08/2020] ☸️ Danny ๅฟ:
Else SLA cannot meet - liquidated damages.
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[2:33 pm, 27/08/2020] +: It's the hirer's market now
[2:33 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Many companies are looking for talent with low-ball salaries
[2:33 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Taking advantage of glut of talent in the job market
[2:34 pm, 27/08/2020] +: That's pretty grim
[2:34 pm, 27/08/2020] +: It's supply and demand
[2:34 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Everyone is opportunistic
[2:34 pm, 27/08/2020] +: I have recruiters asking me if I am willing to jump for less pay ....
[2:34 pm, 27/08/2020] +: That's reality, unfortunately. It's only when you get multiple offers at once that you can negotiate more competitively in your favour.
[2:35 pm, 27/08/2020] +: They never even bother to ask last time
[2:35 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Yikes, that's just... Were there any notable benefits to offset any costs of jumping
[2:35 pm, 27/08/2020] +: I think almost all the offers will be low-ball offers
[2:35 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Staying put makes most sense no w
[2:36 pm, 27/08/2020] +: The job market has a glut of pple looking for jobs already
[2:36 pm, 27/08/2020] +: At least tong until market recovers and the glut gets reduced
[2:36 pm, 27/08/2020] +: They will sell you the usual bs of bigger role, more opportunities to grow etc
[2:37 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Remember the recruiter is a sales person
[2:37 pm, 27/08/2020] +: They just want you to sign
[2:37 pm, 27/08/2020] +: yah, that snake oil. don't buy k?
[2:37 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Aka more work for you but with less pay ๐
[2:37 pm, 27/08/2020] +: They don't really care what happens to u afterwards ๐
[2:37 pm, 27/08/2020] +: yes, and no skin off the headhunter's back. they still get their commission
[2:37 pm, 27/08/2020] +: That's why it's BS mah
[2:38 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Yah. I regular go interviews every year just to suss out the market
[2:38 pm, 27/08/2020] +: A number of fresh grads are taking virtual internships from better paying, more competitive, markets. It's unconventional, but imo, it makes them more competitive candidates after of they're looking in the local market
[2:38 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Get an idea of the market and pay levels
[2:39 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Also keep your skills sharp
[2:39 pm, 27/08/2020] +: I do that too! But I make it clear at the start to any recruiters who reach out that I don't plan to jump unless it's a great move overall
[2:39 pm, 27/08/2020] +: No leh
[2:39 pm, 27/08/2020] +: I just do it
[2:39 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Later u can also fabricate a reason to reject
[2:40 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Just don't do it at the end when they offer u
[2:40 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Hahahahaa
[2:40 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Still need to maintain a reputation in the market
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[2:53 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Must see which industry
[2:56 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Depends on role also bah
[2:58 pm, 27/08/2020] +: I have many years work experience also not so high lor ๐คฆ♂️
[2:58 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Is it the include bonus and cpf? ๐คฃ
[2:59 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Oh yah ah!! And include other benefits and "progression prospects" like they did for those in nursing
[3:00 pm, 27/08/2020] +: If take home basic so high I very emo Liao
[3:01 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Wah that one have to thank your ancestors and all the gods across all religions for watching over you sia ๐
[3:02 pm, 27/08/2020] +: I do know people earn so high.. lucky I can only say
[3:02 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Fresh Accenture I know is $3.8 to $4.5
[3:02 pm, 27/08/2020] +: That was like years ago
[3:03 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Wah, seems salary didn't increase much in the last decade
[3:03 pm, 27/08/2020] +: You got the point there
[3:03 pm, 27/08/2020] +: But living costs meanwhile ...
[3:04 pm, 27/08/2020] +: But then again... depends on person my pay doubled over 10 years...
[3:04 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Oohhhh wow...
[3:05 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Google is $8k lol... no big deal there
[3:05 pm, 27/08/2020] +: $6 to $8k basic ๐
[3:05 pm, 27/08/2020] +: But no OT, etc just pay
[3:06 pm, 27/08/2020] +: ๐ฒ๐ฒ๐ฒ๐ฒ upfront ah?? not the "include bonus benefits and prospects" then divide by 12?
[3:07 pm, 27/08/2020] +: i thought PMETs usually don't get OT one?
[3:07 pm, 27/08/2020] +: What I know they is flat rate, no overseas allowance etc
[3:07 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Haha not really
[3:07 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Mine side have cause pay low
[3:07 pm, 27/08/2020] +: ๐คฃ๐คฃ
[3:08 pm, 27/08/2020] +: But now WFH no more OT can do ๐ญ
[3:08 pm, 27/08/2020] +: oh serious ah. eh actually i know of people who totally exploited the OT regime until they pissed the company off so much that they were given a "free promotion" so that they can no longer claim OT
[3:09 pm, 27/08/2020] +: For us is due to this so executive also have OT. If not no one want to promote
[3:09 pm, 27/08/2020] +: But OT rate non executive is higher than us just flat rate
[3:09 pm, 27/08/2020] +: 10% per year ? That's not bad
[3:09 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Cause they count by pay then count hourly rate
[3:10 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Jump jobs will rise faster
[3:10 pm, 27/08/2020] +: I change 4 jobs.. only 2 jump got pay increment
[3:10 pm, 27/08/2020] +: The rest is same pay.
[3:11 pm, 27/08/2020] +: someone i knew totally exploited until jialat. he leaves office on the dot every day at 5.30, but he starts "clocking OT" on Saturdays cos x1.5 but especially Sundays and public holidays because x2. i told him that he would run into trouble sooner or later, he ignored. next thing i knew, he calls me and ask whether he gets any recourse under Employment Act because back then the cap was $1500 and company upped his pay to $1550, and "created" a manager title with no change in job scope.
[3:12 pm, 27/08/2020] +: totally agree. and usually you don't jump unless they give you at least 10-20% more.
[3:12 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Lol yah... but my side OT pay most of them earn more than manager like 1 to 2 k more ๐คฃ๐คฃ๐คฃ
[3:12 pm, 27/08/2020] +: So some refuse to promote ๐คฃ๐คฃ
[3:13 pm, 27/08/2020] +: lol!!! life is too cushy!
[3:13 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Money talks ma, who cares for a title that pays less right ๐คญ
[3:13 pm, 27/08/2020] +: see? liddat. are foreigners cheaper??
[3:14 pm, 27/08/2020] +: yah. the saying goes that "you can call me a roadsweeper or paper pusher, just pay me $20k/mth, tyvm."
[3:14 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Depends... labour are not cheap for sure... MNC clock OT is crazy one lar
[3:15 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Say only... when you have the pay you say so boring
[3:15 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Next
[3:15 pm, 27/08/2020] +: And then we have those fanciful titles for these jobs lol
[3:15 pm, 27/08/2020] +: a lot of MNCs these days also no OT, because "executive officer"
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[3:20 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Gross Monthly Income From Work refers to income earned from employment.
For employees, it refers to the gross monthly wages or salaries before deduction of employee CPF contributions and personal income tax. It comprises basic wages, overtime pay, commissions, tips, other allowances and one-twelfth of annual bonuses.
https://stats.mom.gov.sg/SL/Pages/Gross-Monthly-Income-from-Work-Concepts-and-Definitions.aspx?Flag=72&TRMID=537&PageNo=1
[3:21 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Hahaha psych him out ๐
[3:21 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Not familiar with that smart rank leh ๐
[3:21 pm, 27/08/2020] + The survey sometimes includes employers contributions too
[3:21 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Don't have to be ๐
[3:21 pm, 27/08/2020] +: that rank comes with a free parachute
[3:21 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Saf scholar ?
[3:21 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Other people parachute in nia, I will work my way up ๐
[3:21 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Got glass ceiling one
[3:22 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Need to be scholar then u will be on other side of the ceiling
[3:22 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Parachute into glass ceiling - piang pecah ouch
[3:22 pm, 27/08/2020] +: i don't call that a glass ceiling. i call that a full on solid concrete block
[3:23 pm, 27/08/2020] +: so you cannot see them on their way in until they're in, they also cannot see you trying to hard to climb.
[3:24 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Bulletproof glass
[3:24 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Need elite scholar than can penetrate
[3:24 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Totally peasant proof
[3:24 pm, 27/08/2020] +: ๐
[3:25 pm, 27/08/2020] +: It's ok, understanding the ground is always the better option, hands down :)
[3:25 pm, 27/08/2020] +: ๐all living in district 10?
[3:25 pm, 27/08/2020] +: You want a scholar who knows nothing about the industry he's about to enter meh?
[3:27 pm, 27/08/2020] +: it's not about what we want, it's about who's there in the right place at the right time to jump in with a parachute
[3:28 pm, 27/08/2020] +: Isn't that the case ? Philip yeo mentioned in his book, all the scholars now have no depth because they only stay for 2 yrs before they rotate out
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