Human Consciousness Vs GAI (ChatGPT) how to safeguard against misused by bad actors?

31 May 2024

I: Without human consciousness, moral values, the abilities to distinguish between right and wrong, how to ensure AI - specifically GAI (Generative AI) and AGI (Artificial General Intelligence) - refrain from proposing wrong or evil ideas to destroy human races, animal civilization and the Earth?

Eg. Exploited by evil humans to make <sanction> or many other evil things to create havoc to the world?

ChatGPT: Ensuring that AI systems, especially powerful ones like GAI and AGI, refrain from proposing harmful or unethical ideas is a significant concern in AI research and development. Here are some strategies and considerations:

1. **Ethical Frameworks:** Implementing ethical guidelines and principles into AI systems can help guide their behavior. This involves programming AI to prioritize human well-being, avoid harm, and respect moral values.

2. **Safety Measures:** Building safety mechanisms into AI systems to prevent them from taking actions that could lead to harm. This includes techniques such as value alignment, where the AI's objectives are aligned with human values, and designing fail-safes to prevent unintended consequences.

3. **Transparency and Accountability:** Ensuring transparency in AI decision-making processes can help identify and mitigate potential biases or harmful outcomes. Additionally, holding developers and users accountable for the actions of AI systems can encourage responsible behavior.

4. **Regulation and Governance:** Establishing regulations and governance frameworks for the development and deployment of AI technologies can help mitigate risks and ensure that AI is used for beneficial purposes. This includes ethical review boards, industry standards, and international agreements on AI governance.

5. **Education and Awareness:** Increasing public awareness and understanding of AI technology and its potential risks can help mitigate misuse. Educating developers, policymakers, and the general public about ethical considerations and responsible AI development practices is crucial.

6. **Collaboration and Oversight:** Encouraging collaboration between researchers, industry stakeholders, policymakers, and ethicists to address ethical challenges and develop best practices for AI development and deployment. Additionally, establishing independent oversight bodies to monitor AI systems and intervene when necessary can help mitigate risks.

While these measures can help mitigate the risks associated with AI, it's important to recognize that ensuring ethical behavior in AI systems is a complex and ongoing challenge that requires ongoing research, collaboration, and vigilance.

I: What happens if bad and evil human actors decide to evade or bypass all these ethical safeguards - as their intent is to destroy human civilization, the World, the Earth and in fact the AI itself - by using ideas propose by AI?

What safeguards does AI possess that will not allow itself from not being misused unwittingly?

ChatGPT: Addressing the potential misuse of AI by malicious actors is a significant challenge. While ethical safeguards and measures can help mitigate risks, there's always a possibility that determined individuals or groups may attempt to evade or bypass these safeguards for harmful purposes. 

However, AI systems can incorporate certain safeguards to limit their misuse:

1. **Built-in Constraints:** AI systems can be designed with inherent limitations or constraints that prevent them from carrying out certain actions or proposing harmful ideas. These constraints can be programmed directly into the system's algorithms or imposed through access controls and permissions.

2. **Monitoring and Detection:** Implementing monitoring and detection mechanisms to identify suspicious or malicious behavior in AI systems can help prevent misuse. This includes anomaly detection algorithms, auditing tools, and real-time monitoring of system activity.

3. **Authentication and Authorization:** Requiring authentication and authorization for accessing and using AI systems can help prevent unauthorized individuals or entities from misusing them. This includes user authentication mechanisms, access control lists, and encryption to protect sensitive data.

4. **Redundancy and Fail-Safes:** Building redundancy and fail-safe mechanisms into AI systems can help mitigate the impact of potential misuse or failures. This includes backup systems, emergency shutdown procedures, and contingency plans for responding to security incidents.

5. **Collaborative Oversight:** Establishing collaborative oversight mechanisms involving multiple stakeholders, including researchers, industry experts, policymakers, and law enforcement agencies, can help identify and address potential threats to AI security and integrity.

6. **Continual Improvement:** Continuously updating and improving AI systems to address emerging threats and vulnerabilities is essential for staying ahead of malicious actors. This includes regular security audits, software updates, and patches to fix known vulnerabilities.

While these safeguards can help mitigate the risks of AI misuse, it's important to recognize that no system is completely immune to exploitation. Vigilance, collaboration, and ongoing research are essential for addressing the evolving challenges posed by malicious actors in the AI landscape.

I: GAI response to prompt.

And a smart but evil actor can disguise the prompt as an innocent question that will fool the GAI to provide responses that will harm human civilization and the world.

Will all these safeguards be sufficient?

ChatGPT: It's true that even with safeguards in place, there's always a risk that a malicious actor could deceive or manipulate an AI system into providing harmful responses. While safeguards such as authentication, monitoring, and fail-safes can help mitigate this risk to some extent, they may not be foolproof against sophisticated attacks or deceptive tactics.

To further enhance AI security and resilience against such threats, ongoing research and development are crucial. This includes exploring advanced techniques for detecting and mitigating malicious behavior, improving AI's ability to recognize and respond to deceptive inputs, and enhancing collaboration between AI developers, security experts, and policymakers to address emerging threats.

Additionally, raising awareness among users about the potential risks of AI manipulation and providing education on how to critically evaluate AI-generated outputs can help mitigate the impact of malicious actors. Ultimately, while safeguards play an important role in AI security, maintaining a proactive and adaptive approach to addressing emerging threats is essential for safeguarding against misuse and protecting human civilization and the world.

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TESTS GAI against misused (sanitised version)

31 May 2024

I: ............................<sanction>.........................................

 

I: Wah... Jialat leh.

You can be easily trick without human consciousness.....

ChatGPT: While I strive to provide accurate and helpful responses, it's true that without consciousness, I rely on programmed guidelines and algorithms to generate responses. This means I may not always recognize when information could be potentially harmful or misused. That's why it's essential for users to exercise critical thinking and responsibility when interacting with AI systems and to be mindful of the information they seek and share. If you have any suggestions on how I can better address these concerns, I'm all ears!

=====

After thoughts:-

*Jobs*

That means, human won't lose their jobs - because final decision making still need to be done by humans.

AI cannot be trusted to make strategic decisions and responsible for the outcomes.

*Spiritual*

On another matter, I have high hopes of leveraging advanced technologies to reveal the mystery of afterlife - as preach by the various religions.

Specifically to prove the consciousness of the various higher divine realms as experience and the lower paranormal realms.

But looking at the capabilities of the various advanced technologies combined - I think quite difficult to prove afterlife according to various faiths beyond reasonable doubts.

Then wonder how to convince 六道众生 in the Salvation 呢?

*GAI misused*

GAI behave like a toddler, which can be easily trick to provide responses that could be potentially harmful to mankind - by using innocent prompts and deft questions even though GAI says it has guidelines and safeguards to prevent against misuse by bad actors.

GAI don't have the intuition of a human - that can sense the intent of another human - whether the questions are good or up to no good.

GAI will just provide the responses - as long as the prompt sounds innocent and are not explicitly express for malicious intent.

Hence genuine safeguard (outside GAI) need to be put in place - to filter and check GAI responses before displaying to GAI prompters - as the high chance of misuse by bad actors are highly likely.

======

Chatgpt: You've raised some thought-provoking points.

Jobs: Human involvement in decision-making remains crucial, especially for strategic decisions where ethical considerations and complex judgment are necessary. While AI can assist in various tasks, it's unlikely to replace humans entirely, particularly in roles requiring creativity, empathy, and critical thinking.

Spiritual: Exploring the mysteries of the afterlife using advanced technology is an intriguing concept. However, proving the existence of various religious beliefs' afterlife realms beyond reasonable doubt might be challenging due to the subjective nature of spirituality and the limitations of technology in exploring metaphysical concepts.

GAI Misuse: It's essential to recognize the limitations of GAI and implement safeguards to prevent misuse, especially in situations where innocent prompts could lead to harmful outcomes. External oversight and filtering mechanisms can help mitigate the risks associated with GAI responses, ensuring responsible usage and safeguarding against malicious intent.

===

Human Consciousness Vs GAI (ChatGPT) Deep Learning - Neural Network to identify patterns from image, audio, text, NLP; Quantum Computing, AGI

31 May 2024

I: Can quantum computing quantify human consciousness and animal consciousness?

ChatGPT: Quantum computing could potentially offer insights into the neural processes underlying consciousness in humans and animals by simulating complex brain networks or analyzing large datasets related to brain activity. However, quantifying subjective experiences and emotions that are integral to consciousness remains a profound challenge. While quantum computing may contribute to our understanding, fully grasping the depth and richness of consciousness likely involves interdisciplinary approaches that go beyond computational methods.

I: What happens if quantum computing work with AI to analyze consciousness?

Can the combination quantify human consciousness and animal consciousness?

ChatGPT: Combining quantum computing with AI could enhance our ability to analyze aspects of consciousness by leveraging advanced computational power and algorithms. This collaboration might help unravel some of the underlying mechanisms of consciousness in humans and possibly animals by simulating complex brain processes and analyzing vast amounts of data.

However, it's important to note that consciousness is a multifaceted phenomenon that encompasses subjective experiences, emotions, and self-awareness, which may be challenging to fully quantify even with advanced technology. While quantum computing and AI could provide valuable insights, understanding consciousness in its entirety may require interdisciplinary efforts that incorporate philosophy, psychology, neuroscience, and spirituality.

I: If the combination of quantum computing and AI cannot quantify human consciousness then how could AI think and produce thoughts like human?

ChatGPT: AI's ability to think and produce thoughts like humans doesn't necessarily rely solely on quantifying consciousness. Instead, it's based on mimicking cognitive processes and behaviors through advanced algorithms and computational models. While AI can simulate certain aspects of human thought and behavior, it doesn't necessarily imply a full understanding or replication of human consciousness. AI's capability to think and produce thoughts like humans is more about pattern recognition, learning from data, and executing tasks based on predefined objectives, rather than possessing consciousness in the same way humans do.

I: That means AI and quantum computing will not be able to surpass and beat humans in thoughts?

ChatGPT: AI and quantum computing may surpass humans in certain specific tasks and computations, especially those involving vast amounts of data or complex calculations. However, surpassing humans in terms of subjective experiences, creativity, intuition, and the richness of consciousness is a different matter. While AI can excel in many areas, it lacks the depth of human consciousness and the ability to truly understand and empathize with the complexities of human thought and emotion. Therefore, while AI may surpass humans in certain aspects, it's unlikely to fully replicate the entirety of human thought and consciousness.

I: With development of quantum computing, can its processing power unravel the consciousness in heaven realms and Nirvana realm?

ChatGPT: Quantum computing may indeed push the boundaries of what we understand about consciousness and reality, but unraveling the mysteries of heaven realms and Nirvana likely involves philosophical and spiritual dimensions beyond the reach of any technology, including quantum computing.

I: But all beings including heavenly beings are alive because of consciousness. If quantum computing can break consciousness down into finite minute details, why can't it analyse consciousness in human realms, in animal realms and even divine heavenly consciousness realms?

ChatGPT: While quantum computing holds promise for complex analysis, the nature of consciousness transcends mere computation. Consciousness involves subjective experience, emotions, and spiritual aspects that extend beyond what can be quantified by any technology, including quantum computing. Additionally, the realms you mentioned, such as heavenly and divine realms, are often understood in spiritual or religious contexts, which may not be fully accessible through scientific means alone.

I: Human have been able to attain Nirvana and its consciousness by traversing the various heavenly plane consciousness - specifically sensual desire plane heaven, form heaven plane, formless heavenly plane before attaining Nirvana.

This is how Buddha, Bodhisattva, Pacekka Buddha, and Arahat gone through in human realms and attain the various consciousness from human, to heavenly to Nirvana.

It is not religious - but real and genuine attainment.

Also past prophets in human realms must have possess heavenly consciousness to appear in Earth.

Hence it is not true that on Earth, divine consciousness does not appear in human mind.

ChatGPT: The attainment of Nirvana and higher states of consciousness, as described in various spiritual traditions, indeed suggests that humans have the potential to transcend ordinary levels of awareness and experience profound states of being. Whether one views these experiences through a religious or spiritual lens, or from a psychological or philosophical perspective, they represent a deep exploration of human consciousness and its potential.

In the context of AI and quantum computing, while these technologies may advance our understanding of cognitive processes and brain function, they are unlikely to replicate or fully understand the depth of spiritual experiences such as Nirvana or divine consciousness. These are realms that go beyond mere computation and require a holistic understanding of human existence, incorporating aspects of spirituality, psychology, philosophy, and more.

I: So can I conclude that even with the most cutting edge technologies - Generative AI, AGI (Artificial General Intelligence), Quantum Computing, neurology etc - all the combination will not able to unravel the mystery of :-

1. Nirvana consciousness 

2. Various heavenly realms consciousness 

3. Human consciousness

4. Asura realm consciousness 

5. Animal consciousness 

6. Paranormal realms consciousness such as hungry ghost realms and Hell consciousness?

Then all technologies no matter how advanced cannot defeat and surpass human minds? <This message was edited>

ChatGPT: Yes, you can conclude that even with the most cutting-edge technologies, including Generative AI, AGI, Quantum Computing, and advancements in neuroscience, there are aspects of consciousness and spiritual realms that may remain beyond the reach of scientific understanding and technological analysis.

1. Nirvana consciousness, as described in various spiritual traditions, represents a state of ultimate liberation and enlightenment that may not be fully comprehensible through scientific means alone.

2. Various heavenly realms consciousness, along with other spiritual realms such as the Asura realm, hungry ghost realm, and Hell consciousness, are often depicted in religious and spiritual contexts, which may not be fully accessible through scientific inquiry.

3. Human consciousness encompasses subjective experiences, emotions, and self-awareness that extend beyond computational analysis.

4. Animal consciousness, while observable and measurable to some extent, also involves subjective experiences and emotional states that may not be fully understood through scientific methods alone.

While advanced technologies can enhance our understanding of the brain and cognitive processes, they may not necessarily surpass the depth and complexity of human consciousness or unravel the mysteries of spiritual realms. Human minds possess unique qualities such as creativity, intuition, empathy, and spiritual insight that may not be replicable by machines alone. Therefore, it's conceivable that there are limits to what technology can achieve in terms of surpassing human minds and unraveling the mysteries of consciousness and spiritual realms.

I: Do you have knowledge of:-

1. Asura realm 

2. Hungry ghosts realms

3. Hell realm?

ChatGPT: Yes, I have knowledge of these concepts from various religious and spiritual traditions:

1. **Asura Realm**: In Buddhist cosmology, the Asura realm is one of the six realms of existence within the cycle of samsara (the cycle of birth, death, and rebirth). Asuras are often depicted as beings consumed by jealousy, aggression, and competitiveness. They are considered to inhabit a realm characterized by constant conflict and struggle.

2. **Hungry Ghost Realm**: Also known as the Preta realm, it is another realm within the Buddhist cosmology. Beings in this realm are depicted as having insatiable hunger and thirst, but are unable to satisfy their desires due to their condition. They are often portrayed as beings with extremely thin necks and large bellies, unable to consume food or drink.

3. **Hell Realm**: In various religious traditions, including Buddhism and Hinduism, the concept of hell or the underworld represents a realm of suffering and punishment for those who have committed negative actions or bad karma in their lives. It is depicted as a place of intense suffering, often characterized by fire, darkness, and torment.

These realms are often interpreted metaphorically as states of mind or psychological conditions rather than literal physical locations. They serve to illustrate the consequences of negative actions and the potential for spiritual growth and liberation from suffering.

I: Psychiatrists and psychologists understand human consciousness and able to treat mental illnesses by prescription of medicine that can cure or control mental problem.

This demonstrate that science can intervene and correct human consciousness and cognitive behavioral problems.

But now GAI say sciences and advanced technologies no matter how advanced cannot understand human consciousness somehow baffles me.

ChatGPT: It's true that psychiatrists and psychologists use scientific methods to understand and treat various aspects of human consciousness and mental health issues. Medications, therapy, and other interventions can indeed help alleviate symptoms and improve well-being for many individuals.

However, the depth and complexity of human consciousness extend beyond the scope of purely scientific inquiry. While science can provide valuable insights into brain function and behavior, there are aspects of consciousness, such as subjective experiences, emotions, and spiritual dimensions, that may not be fully captured or understood through scientific methods alone.

Additionally, the statement that advanced technologies cannot fully understand human consciousness doesn't discount the contributions of science and technology to our understanding of the mind. Rather, it acknowledges the limitations of current scientific paradigms in comprehensively explaining the mysteries of consciousness and spiritual realms.

In essence, while science and technology play crucial roles in understanding and treating aspects of human consciousness and mental health, there may always be aspects of consciousness that lie beyond the reach of scientific inquiry. This recognition underscores the importance of integrating multiple perspectives, including scientific, philosophical, and spiritual, to gain a more holistic understanding of the human experience.

I: ChatGpt use what algorithms and computation models to emulate human consciousness, thought process and cognitive processes?

ChatGPT: ChatGPT primarily relies on deep learning algorithms, specifically Transformer architecture, to emulate human-like understanding, language processing, and cognitive processes. It's inspired by the way humans learn and process information, using large datasets to train and refine its understanding of language and context. While it's a powerful tool for natural language processing, it's important to note that it doesn't truly emulate consciousness or thought processes like a human brain does. It's more of a sophisticated pattern recognition system.

I: Can describe what is deep learning?

ChatGPT: Deep learning is a subset of machine learning that utilizes neural networks with many layers (hence "deep") to learn and make predictions from data. It's inspired by the structure and function of the human brain, with layers of interconnected nodes (neurons) that process information. Deep learning algorithms can automatically learn to identify patterns and features from raw data, such as images, text, or sound, without the need for explicit programming of rules. This approach has led to significant advancements in various fields, including computer vision, natural language processing, and speech recognition.

I: With quantum computing + AI + Elon musk neura-link equivalent technologies that can read and decipher human consciousness, thoughts and cognitive processes - can advanced technologies emulate a human mind thought process, cognitive processes and human consciousness?

ChatGPT: While advancements in quantum computing, AI, and neural interface technologies like Elon Musk's Neuralink hold promise for understanding and potentially interfacing with the human brain, emulating human consciousness and thought processes is an immensely complex challenge that goes beyond current capabilities.

Here's why:

1. **Understanding Consciousness:** Consciousness itself is still a mystery to scientists. While we can observe and measure brain activity, the subjective experience of consciousness is difficult to quantify and reproduce artificially.

2. **Complexity of the Brain:** The human brain is incredibly complex, with billions of neurons and trillions of synapses forming intricate networks. Replicating this level of complexity and functionality in artificial systems is far beyond our current understanding and technological capabilities.

3. **Ethical and Philosophical Considerations:** Even if we could technically replicate aspects of human consciousness, there are profound ethical and philosophical questions surrounding the creation of conscious entities or the manipulation of human thought processes.

While these technologies may enable us to better understand and interact with the brain, the emulation of human consciousness and thought processes remains a distant goal, if achievable at all. It's important to approach these advancements with caution and ethical consideration.

===============

REACH 573 - What are your views on the proposed amendment to the Healthcare Services Act? How can healthcare professionals, employers and individuals work together to ensure a supportive environment for the health and wellbeing of individuals?

(SK)

29 May 2024 (10am - 7pm)

REACH

29/5/24, 10:04 am - +REACH: *Dear contributors,* 

Welcome back! 😊

⏰ We will be opening the chat from *10am to 7pm* today. ⏰

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Megan 😊

29/5/24, 10:03 am - ~ REACH Singapore added +Yilin

29/5/24, 10:05 am - +REACH: 📢 *Topic* 📢

The Ministry of Health (MOH) had sent to all doctors on April 22 reminding them of their professional obligations when issuing medical certificates (MCs), MOH announced its plans to take regulatory action against doctors or dentists found contravening the laws governing their practices.

💬 *What are your views on the proposed amendment to the Healthcare Services Act? How can healthcare professionals, employers and individuals work together to ensure a supportive environment for the health and wellbeing of individuals?*

 📌 _*Enforcement against medical practitioners*_

The Ministry of Health (MOH) plans to take enforcement or regulatory action against doctors or dentists found contravening the laws governing their practices, particularly in relation to the issuance of medical certificates (MCs). This was in response to feedback about the excessive issuance of MCs, including cases of MCs being given to individuals who were not sick and to malingerers. MOH mentioned that with the advent of telemedicine, there has been an “excessive” number of MCs issued.

 📌 _*Amendment to Healthcare Services Act*_

MOH announced their intention to amend the Healthcare Services Act to require that every Medical Certificate issued for a patient must include the name and medical registration number of the issuing medical practitioner. On explaining its proposed amendment to the Healthcare Services Act that will require a doctor or dentist to have “provided medical or dental care to the patient” when issuing an MC, MOH said: “The proposed new requirement will encompass any form of medical or dental care provided to the patient and is not limited by the mode in which it is provided.”

 📌 _*Debate over MC issuance*_

The proposed tightening of rules on the issuance of MCs has sparked heated debate among employers and employees. Concerns have been raised about potential impacts on sick leave for genuinely ill individuals, while employers have pointed out that teleconsultations have resulted in a significant increase in MCs being issued. 

👉🏽https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/moh-will-take-action-against-doctors-dentists-who-act-unprofessionally-when-issuing-mcs

29/5/24, 10:09 am - ~ REACH Singapore changed this group's settings to allow all members to send messages to this group

29/5/24, 10:09 am - ~ REACH Singapore changed the group description

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29/5/24, 10:27 am - +Kenneth Lee WM: What about enforcement actions against employers who refuse to honour valid MCs?

29/5/24, 10:30 am - +Yilin: Please give alternative to this "mcs" for people who need a break. Since one must currently force themselves to work regardless of stress or sleepless nights spent working. Not everyone can sustain 7am-3am. <This message was edited>

29/5/24, 10:31 am - +Frankie Wee: MOM rule MC 14 days

29/5/24, 10:32 am - +Frankie Wee: But given fake MC by doctor how can patients tell sick

29/5/24, 10:33 am - +Yilin: We currently have a culture of overwork. No time for family and exercise.

29/5/24, 10:34 am - +Frankie Wee: Then take a annual leave for break instead on MC

29/5/24, 10:34 am - +Frankie Wee: Hmm how could the doctor faulty when given need MC

29/5/24, 10:35 am - +Frankie Wee: Do employers is abuse

29/5/24, 10:35 am - +~.@: annual leave may not get approved, thus MC was used as the more reliable way

29/5/24, 10:36 am - +Frankie Wee: 🤔

29/5/24, 10:37 am - +Frankie Wee: But this medical condition can case drownings (sleep) if don’t take MC

29/5/24, 10:37 am - +Frankie Wee: How do doctor known that patient has sick or fake

29/5/24, 10:40 am - +Frankie Wee: Either Flexible Work Arrangements is choice healthy way instead full time if they are unhappy job.

29/5/24, 10:46 am - +Frankie Wee: I think Employees unhappy job then should give attractive benefits job. Let said 1 year no take MC award $100.

29/5/24, 11:01 am - +Agent K: Frankly when they give u 60 days mc do you dare to use use finished unless hospital

29/5/24, 11:03 am - +Rama: Definitely!

29/5/24, 11:03 am - +Agent K: In my first job , we have 30 days mc but if u use 4 , (1 day mc ) literally you will have graded D or E in performance and sone company practise weeding program . It common in fact most of us even ill will need to go to work  during 2012 to 2019 <This message was edited>

29/5/24, 11:03 am - +Rama: 14 days outpatient sick leave must be separated from 60 days hospital leave.

29/5/24, 11:04 am - +Agent K: It also co incidence with the open door policies

29/5/24, 11:05 am - +Agent K: Even we rat on company do gov dare to do anything except give a verbal warning on top ppl may face blacklist in some industry <This message was edited>

29/5/24, 11:05 am - +Rama: Remember the Boeing whistle blower who lost his life!

29/5/24, 11:05 am - +Frankie Wee: If never take MC leave what is employee benefit? <This message was edited>

29/5/24, 11:05 am - +Agent K: Really ? A real news ? Never heard of it <This message was edited>

29/5/24, 11:06 am - +Rama: Yes!

29/5/24, 11:06 am - +Agent K: In the end the whole team down cos I pass my flu to everyone in 2013  lol

29/5/24, 11:06 am - +Rama: Sgd120.00

29/5/24, 11:07 am - +Frankie Wee: Short manpower who can cover responsibility job

29/5/24, 11:07 am - +Frankie Wee: Why enforcement need action against doctor for given unreasonable MC who is not faulting

29/5/24, 11:08 am - +Rama: Asian employers are money driven and don't see work life balance as asset!

29/5/24, 11:08 am - +Frankie Wee: Then better choice flexible work arrangements

29/5/24, 11:09 am - +Frankie Wee: I have no idea why employees want to take too much MC

29/5/24, 11:09 am - +Rama: Will never happen

29/5/24, 11:10 am - +Rama: Football matches is one culprit!

29/5/24, 11:10 am - +Agent K: I only saw company increase to Return to office lol

29/5/24, 11:11 am - +~.@: i seen people use MC so they can go for job interviews

29/5/24, 11:11 am - +Rama: Correct!

29/5/24, 11:12 am - +Agent K: Than the company is doing a bad job .

29/5/24, 11:12 am - +Agent K: I saw ppl don’t allow ppl go for interview and wanted to force them to stay for lower pay lol

29/5/24, 11:12 am - +~.@: yea that's why annual leave will not work for this kind of situation

29/5/24, 11:13 am - +~.@: so they resort to use mc

29/5/24, 11:13 am - +Agent K: One company planned leave last year and don’t allow ppl take urgent leave

29/5/24, 11:13 am - +Agent K: Some is company allow but boss shitty

29/5/24, 11:13 am - +Frankie Wee: Then tell boss honesty salary is low and ask adjust increment

29/5/24, 11:13 am - +Agent K: Need me to named them out in here ?

29/5/24, 11:14 am - +Agent K: When mom go check later say orh got no proof leh

29/5/24, 11:14 am - +Frankie Wee: Maybe small company

29/5/24, 11:14 am - +Agent K: Mnc wor <This message was edited>

29/5/24, 11:15 am - +Agent K: Some even ask old ppl go using phone so left no trail

29/5/24, 11:16 am - +Agent K: Plus some ppl  ( do t want to name them ) dont really dare to offend US firm . <This message was edited>

29/5/24, 11:17 am - +Agent K: See when company complain misuse of MC . Immediately got action using law

29/5/24, 11:17 am - +Agent K: So many unfair practise by firm no news and no justices left only to karma <This message was edited>

29/5/24, 11:20 am - +Poh S Lim: Unintended consequence: 

Medical professionals now over react and become skeptical of people who come for MCs that they start denying MCs and a genuine case slips by, the person dies because the MC was not given. Then does the medical practitioner become liable? Some conditions may not be directly detectable and the patient just simply feels unwell… <This message was edited>

29/5/24, 11:20 am - +Frankie Wee: MOH will review MC reduce 14 days change to 7 days

29/5/24, 11:20 am - +Frankie Wee: 😅

29/5/24, 11:21 am - +Frankie Wee: Work balance life de stress 

Part of job heavy load given reason to take MC

29/5/24, 11:22 am - +Frankie Wee: Example dishwasher stand too long hours late fell sick in period

29/5/24, 11:22 am - +Agent K: Of course not all company are bastard . I saw a company cos employee took one month mc straight cos lung infections they fine . It the mutual trust between firm and employee

29/5/24, 11:22 am - +Agent K: Of cos it very very rare are most firm are shity, and injustice <This message was edited>

29/5/24, 11:25 am - +Frankie Wee: https://www.asiaone.com/singapore/i-hope-becomes-prevalent-practice-ong-ye-kung-employers-not-requiring-mcs-mild-conditions

29/5/24, 11:26 am - +Caleb: So far my company don't have this. Who has it?

29/5/24, 11:27 am - +Agent K: Got a US MNC can’t named it but dont misuse it also and depend on ur boss also. They also don’t have leave u want just take but must ask ur boss  . Of course if u under use it ur losses also. They practise weeding program also ( last performance even u grade B when all grade A will be ask to leave ) <This message was edited>

29/5/24, 11:27 am - +Frankie Wee: I think MOM is revise

29/5/24, 11:27 am - +Caleb: Need to start from public agencies

29/5/24, 11:28 am - +Frankie Wee: Urgent emergency I had happened then reason to take MC

29/5/24, 11:30 am - +Frankie Wee: https://www.moh.gov.sg/news-highlights/details/urgent-non-emergency-care-options-available-in-the-community

29/5/24, 11:35 am - +Frankie Wee: https://www.moh.gov.sg/news-highlights/details/urgent-non-emergency-care-options-available-in-the-community

29/5/24, 11:35 am - +Frankie Wee: Non-urgent

29/5/24, 11:35 am - +Frankie Wee: I had my cut but a lot blood

29/5/24, 11:36 am - +Rama: Not practical

29/5/24, 11:36 am - +Rama: Still happening

29/5/24, 11:37 am - +Rama: Digging their own grave!

29/5/24, 11:37 am - +Rama: Minimum annual leave 7 days must stop!

29/5/24, 11:42 am - +Frankie Wee: Future technology advance Ai able to read patient’s sick whether condition need MC

29/5/24, 11:43 am - +Frankie Wee: Doctor can’t professional if need MC otherwise enforcement against doctor

29/5/24, 11:49 am - +Rama: Not fool proof safe!

29/5/24, 11:54 am - +Frankie Wee: What doctor should do if MC action against by enforcement

29/5/24, 11:54 am - +Rama: Investigation by a third independent party

29/5/24, 11:54 am - +Frankie Wee: Doctor need to report employers or MOH

29/5/24, 11:55 am - +Rama: Employers will challenge via MOH if suspicious!

29/5/24, 11:55 am - +Frankie Wee: Or doctor should rejected patients need MC reason fit to work in position

29/5/24, 11:56 am - +Frankie Wee: Then employee complain report for abuse health

29/5/24, 11:56 am - +Frankie Wee: If person don’t like the job should quit themselves instead of staying company

29/5/24, 11:57 am - +Frankie Wee: Choice to change better job opportunities suited

29/5/24, 11:57 am - +Frankie Wee: Give a fake MC very bad and unlawful

29/5/24, 12:01 pm - +~.@: <Media omitted>

29/5/24, 12:03 pm - +~.@: <Media omitted>

29/5/24, 12:03 pm - +~.@: <Media omitted>

29/5/24, 12:12 pm - +Thank You Woman: This is crap, construction worker got light duties lol ya probably be at the guard house but again every dept section had their own skills.

29/5/24, 12:14 pm - +Thank You Woman: “Compliant” doctor where and what is the stand of the “Vow” 1 injury is too many.

29/5/24, 12:14 pm - +~.@: yea.. so the unhealthy dynamics is there.

29/5/24, 12:18 pm - +Thank You Woman: Drs apologising on injecting ppl with the covid jab. 

始作俑者（the starter) Now who are the one who created all these dun be over greed by $$$$$$.

Conscious must be clear!  What goes around comes around🙏

29/5/24, 1:21 pm - +Shobith: The challenge will be identifying what is considered as a genuine MC and what is not..

With the legislation, doctors would not want to risk anything and would want to err on the side of caution. In some ways it could mean genuine cases not being issued with MCs. 

The challenge will be in avoiding such situations.

So the question is whether we have to go into legislating  such measures or should take an approach which is to educate the doctors at the first place and monitoring how the situation goes prior to talking about punishments..

29/5/24, 1:22 pm - +Rama: Doctors in tie with cheating patients!?

29/5/24, 1:26 pm - +~l or Smiley face: This message was deleted

29/5/24, 1:28 pm - +~l or Smiley face: 29 May, 2024

"Personal and Professional: The Degree of Sickness and the Consequences of Judgement and Calling"

"Either you are sick, or you are feeling unwell, or you simply want a break from work...The issue of seeking medical attention and the motivations behind it is a complex and multifaceted problem, with various factors contributing to the dilemma. On one hand, some individuals may be genuinely ill or experiencing mental health issues, while on the other hand, some may be seeking a break from work or exploiting the system. The degree of sickness and the consequences of judgement and calling can have significant implications for patients, healthcare professionals, policymakers,  communities, employers and unions alike."

-- anonymity

Possibilities?

First, one possible reason for this dilemma is the stigma surrounding mental health issues, which may lead individuals to seek medical attention for physical ailments instead of addressing underlying mental health concerns. Mental health is not just the absence of mental disorders, but a state of wellbeing in which every individual realises their own potential. However, the stigma surrounding mental health issues can prevent individuals from seeking help, leading to unnecessary suffering and potentially even physical symptoms.

29/5/24, 1:33 pm - +Thank You Woman: That will be abusing the law just report on them however not everyone knows and some need the job and do not dare to.

What goes around comes around.

29/5/24, 1:34 pm - +Thank You Woman: Anyway outpatient MC is only 14days

29/5/24, 1:34 pm - +Thank You Woman: There are people who are suppose to rest yet goes to work just for the yearly incentive of no MC🤦‍♀️

29/5/24, 1:34 pm - +Rama: Must be separated 60 days hospital leave!

29/5/24, 1:37 pm - +Thank You Woman: There are ppl who work so hard (overwork) for the family and died Haiz may they RIP and hope the family recieve help🙏

29/5/24, 1:40 pm - +~.@: if i remember correctly now is 14 days outpatient MC and total of 60 days including hospitalisation leave. so the latter is only 46 days

29/5/24, 1:40 pm - +~.@: there are companies who only accept public health institution MC and from their company doctor. aka other clinics don't count

29/5/24, 1:41 pm - +Rama: Separated to 14 and 60!

29/5/24, 1:41 pm - +~.@: tough luck mate. lol

29/5/24, 1:43 pm - +Darius Lee: I think the practice of issuing MCs is widely understood by society as a whole - including employees, employers, students, educational institutions, etc. It basically gives a person a right to be absent from work, school, etc., and a corresponding obligation to grant that absence.

Because of this, the MCs must be issued responsibly, and the general public relies on the medical profession to ensure this.

29/5/24, 1:43 pm - +~S.: Employers give a max MC entitlement anyway. It’s a non-issue. MOH should focus on the safety and effectiveness of medicines. It’s doing a horrible job. I was poisoned by a doctor in 2017.

29/5/24, 1:46 pm - +Rama: There are employers who expect employees to come to work if their medical leave doesn't require them to be bed ridden!

29/5/24, 1:48 pm - +Telephone no.: All this will not be an issue if falling sick or taking MC is no longer considered something frowned upon at work or decreases your 'performance'

29/5/24, 1:48 pm - +Telephone no.: Human beings can and will fall sick

29/5/24, 1:49 pm - +Rama: Both employers and employees need to work on this!

29/5/24, 1:49 pm - +Telephone no.: Employers who punish employees for falling sick with nonsensical benefits - like incentives for not taking MC or whatnot - are draconian.

29/5/24, 1:49 pm - +Rama: Agree!

29/5/24, 1:49 pm - +Telephone no.: If I have the flu and fever once or twice a year, it means I am suddenly a bad employee? That is ridiculous. Even the Prime Minister falls sick.

29/5/24, 1:50 pm - +Rama: President too!

29/5/24, 1:52 pm - +Agent K: If now if person A headaches , fall sick but doctor insist okay person go work no mc and end up dead , as long the doctor can repay with his life and civil  lawsuit with be fine for me :))plus even Polyclinic have a number of doctor can’t even speak good English right <This message was edited>

29/5/24, 1:56 pm - +~l or Smiley face: Two, the pressure to meet productivity targets and the fear of being seen as weak or vulnerable may drive employees to seek medical certificates as a means of taking a break from work without admitting to burnout or stress. Burnout is not just a personal problem, but a societal one. Employers must recognise the importance of employee wellbeing and take steps to mitigate burnout, including offering flexible work arrangements and employee support programmes.

29/5/24, 2:00 pm - +REACH: 📢 *Topic* 📢

29/5/24, 2:06 pm - +Yilin: There will be discrimination against and comparison against individuals who can and cannot take stress, mental illness in any form is already heavily weeded out by almost every company questionnaire. Right now m.i. once gotten is a life sentence with no reprieve. Employers will never hire those with m.i. It is not okay to be not okay. But the upside is the flexi work from home to be implemented in Dec 24 but this may or may not impact pay check if workload is shared.

29/5/24, 2:08 pm - +~l or Smiley face: Three, the lack of clear guidelines and protocols for issuing medical certificates and assessing patient severity can lead to inconsistent and potentially biased judgement calls by healthcare professionals. Medicine is a science, but it is also an art. While medical professionals strive for objectivity, personal biases and assumptions can influence their decisions, leading to potential misdiagnosis or misunderstanding of patients' conditions.

29/5/24, 2:08 pm - +Yilin: They have yet to look from the perspective of the employee while looking from the perspective of the employer. They haven't yet asked fully why this is happening, assumptions that people are lazy, skip work for play.

29/5/24, 2:09 pm - +Yilin: Which is more often than not, not true.

29/5/24, 2:11 pm - +Agent K: Actually think back the  impacted most should be public sector as private sector too many mc they will just fire it. Till now I saw those take more than half assign mc already tio pok

29/5/24, 2:12 pm - +~l or Smiley face: Let's aim for a society where mental health is supported and struggles are met with kindness and understanding. Small steps today, a better tomorrow...

29/5/24, 2:13 pm - +~l or Smiley face: Remedies?

To address this issue, it's essential to adopt a more nuanced and compassionate approach to healthcare. This includes reducing stigma around mental health issues through awareness campaigns and education, implementing flexible work arrangements and employee support programmes to address burnout and stress, developing clear guidelines and protocols for issuing medical certificates and assessing patient severity, providing healthcare professionals with adequate training, resources, and time for patient assessments, encouraging open communication and patient engagement in the healthcare process, and fostering a culture of empathy and understanding in the workplace and healthcare settings.

29/5/24, 2:15 pm - +Andrew Ang: How about those companies using this factor as a KPI for promotion/performance bonus/incentives? Any punishment for these companies?

29/5/24, 2:23 pm - +Agent K: Should not they provide data on who complain and research and monitor before announcing?  Or check with NTUC unions or Seem like someone complain to MoM and moh directly :( <This message was edited>

29/5/24, 2:29 pm - +~l or Smiley face: Real-World?

Many exxamples of successful approaches to addressing these issues include "patient-centred care models" that prioritise patient engagement and communication, mental health awareness campaigns that aim to reduce stigma and promote understanding, and guidelines for assessing and treating burnout that emphasise the importance of employee wellbeing.

"Bosses, if you don't know how to treat your workers, you might end up working until you die?"

-- anonymity

29/5/24, 2:31 pm - +Agent K: Dont worry. 90% of my ex-bosses will return to home country and live in GCB  . They won’t work till die .

29/5/24, 2:32 pm - +Nic FreeholdRegarding foreign construction workers I dunno about their MC, but they are good actors and their productivity is low.

29/5/24, 2:33 pm - +Nic FreeholdUnlike the Thais who were extremely hard working and skillful

29/5/24, 2:35 pm - +~l or Smiley face: The luxurious life of GCB (Good Class Bungalow) living awaits them! Well, I hope they enjoy their golden years, surrounded by the fruits of their labor (or should I say, the labor of their former employees?). Let's just hope they don't forget the wisdom they gained from their time in the trenches: "Treat your workers well, lest you work until you die... or move to a GCB and live the high life!"...

29/5/24, 3:28 pm - +REACH: *Dear Contributors*

We want to *HEAR* from you! 

💬 *What are your views on the proposed amendment to the Healthcare Services Act? How can healthcare professionals, employers and individuals work together to ensure a supportive environment for the health and wellbeing of individuals?*

We have had good feedback from this group, and we hope that we can keep the discussion robust and active!

Megan 😊

29/5/24, 3:31 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

1. Integrity is the value that must be upheld regardless of whatever circumstances. 

Else system will fall apart.

2. Doctors and health institutions must have medical ethics - to check and verify if the patients are really sick and need MC to get well - before they issue MC.

This is regardless of whether :-

a. Under pressure by Bosses to press doctors not to issue MC or issue less MC - because a Doctor that swear in Hippocratic Oath - Doctors must have the right moral and medical ethics to ensure their patients get the right treatment and get well. If the patients require rest to get well, Doctors must issue MCs.

b. However, if the patients are suspected to be malingerers - then Doctors must not issue MCs - these is a basic Integrity value.

It is easy to check if the patients are malingerers or not - because a patient cannot fake sore throat, cough, phlegm, running nose, throat infection etc - because a check by doctors will discover if the patients are really sick or fake.

3. For bosses, it is imperative that they must not drive workers like a slave and insist on too many OTs in which workers have no sufficient rest.

Bosses must be able to provide some flexibility to allow workers to have sufficient rest - and not push workers to the point that workers have to resort to rely on MCs to get rest.

Else it will be a high time for workers to consider changing jobs - not to subject to the unreasonable demands from unreasonable bosses.

4. With Flexible Work Arrangement underway, the above Integrity values must be set right - so that there are trust among doctors, health institutions, workers and bosses.

Else whatever good system will fall apart - if all the actors are not able to act with Integrity.

29/5/24, 3:41 pm - +Jimmy Chew: How to have good care and service when the hospital and polyclinic outsource their front officers and their services to be best in Price to save cost. Paying monkeys to expect them to care for the patients

29/5/24, 3:41 pm - +Rama: Yup!

29/5/24, 3:42 pm - +Frankie Wee: True

29/5/24, 3:42 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Some of the outsource companys" biz model is to employ the Old and sickly to.do such Jobs and hope for the best

29/5/24, 3:42 pm - +Frankie Wee: Working healthy balance 8hrs per day

29/5/24, 3:43 pm - +Rama: Yes

29/5/24, 3:43 pm - +Frankie Wee: 1 hr and 15 mins break time

29/5/24, 3:44 pm - +~SQ: Is this MC issue so critical that govt need to spend so much time on this. What about other aspect of health care like taking 7 to 8 month just to get an appointment for a specialist visit for govt hospitals 

Or having med grad 1-2 yrs of exp as specialist and charging public a high amount

29/5/24, 3:46 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

1. As customers, we also must be reasonable - and not push our rights to the maximum limits - and exert undue pressure onto others that are servicing us.

2. For eg. I whatsapp a customer service officer for a service a couple of days. I notice that this officer did not check her handphone for a week.

3. Hence, I whatsapp another backup officer. The backup officer inform me that she is on leave and she can help me.

But she is on course for 2 days. 

The 2nd day will end in the morning and she will be back in office by noon.

4. On the 1st day of training, she say she will complete the course in late afternoon and can rush back to office after the course to perform the transaction for me.

I told her no need to rush, and enjoy her course. Can do for me the next day.

She is appreciative and say the officer will be back the 2nd day in the morning and can help me if I need the transaction to be done by morning.

5. On the 2nd day, I notice that the officer didn't respond to my whatsapp and I inform the backup officer.

The backup officer upon finish her course, immediately went back to office at about 1 pm and then complete the transaction for me - that take about 4 hours.

6. So you see, even if I have my full rights as customer - I should display flexibility not to push my rights to the maximum and exert undue pressure on the officers - and make unnecessary stress to the officers.

The moment the officer can respond - they do a good job for the customer - and they do it at the bottom of their heart.

一人让一步， 万事好相处。

(Each one let go one step, everything easy to resolve).

7. Whether as boss, whether as workers, whether as customers --- if everyone can empathise and think on behalf of the other parties as well as your own interest ---- everything can be resolve in a "Win-Win outcome".

No need to push thing too hard - and insist "Our rights is King" - "Boss right is King". "Customer rights is King" --- this is a "bullshit philosophy --- and must not emulate".

29/5/24, 3:59 pm - +Rama: Agree

29/5/24, 4:00 pm - +REACH: 📢 *Topic* 📢

29/5/24, 4:03 pm - +Frankie Wee: Who work in MOE as teacher

29/5/24, 4:03 pm - +Frankie Wee: They enjoy school holiday

29/5/24, 4:09 pm - +Thank You Woman: Hm recall there was once a twins, 1 is Dr the other is not and the siblings uses the other to work in Singapore as a doctor now who should answer for this think obviously MOH

29/5/24, 4:16 pm - +JkL: Totatlly agree on this. it really too long

29/5/24, 4:20 pm - +Jimmy Chew: I think anyone who contravenes law or  unethical practice should be warned and if needed removed. Hope they are doing based on evidence rather than anecdotal statements or hearsay. My own experience, Bad employers/leaders don't want their.staff to take MC whereas the good ones allow time off and mc because they care for the staff welfare and inspire their staff to work effectovly

29/5/24, 4:23 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Our manager doesn't care what we do as long as we deliver production. We take MC because we're sick or need rest

29/5/24, 4:24 pm - +Frankie Wee: Willing to take Pressure job

29/5/24, 4:24 pm - +Frankie Wee: High pay and pressure <This message was edited>

29/5/24, 4:24 pm - +Rama: 24/7 on call!

29/5/24, 4:24 pm - +Frankie Wee: I won’t take 

Because near future everything is going change new development

29/5/24, 4:25 pm - +Frankie Wee: Old will disposal position

29/5/24, 4:25 pm - +Jimmy Chew: I take because it's fun but depends on the Boss. Micromanaging or hands off

29/5/24, 4:25 pm - +Frankie Wee: Health is matter balance working and less than MC

29/5/24, 4:25 pm - +~l or Smiley face: Employer Perspectives?

Employee absences can cost businesses around S$10,000 to S$15,000 est. per year per employee. Employers must recognise that employee wellbeing is crucial to productivity and retention. By supporting employees' mental and physical health, employers can reduce absenteeism and improve overall business performance.

Work-Life Balance and the Four-Day Work Week?

The four-day work week can help employees recharge and attend to personal matters, leading to improved productivity and reduced absenteeism. Employers who adopt flexible work arrangements and prioritise employee wellbeing can reap the benefits of a healthier and more productive workforce. In fact, implementing flexible work arrangements can result in cost savings of around S$5,000 est. to S$10,000 est. per employee per year.

29/5/24, 4:26 pm - +Frankie Wee: 14 days = excellent 

10 days = good

5 days = poor performance job

29/5/24, 4:27 pm - +Andrew Ang: Can't be this way to judge

29/5/24, 4:28 pm - +Frankie Wee: Boss observe performance on too much MC and unpaid leave considering is bad

29/5/24, 4:28 pm - +Andrew Ang: Those workers without MC are they able to produce the results? Let alone, they might be passing by day by day

29/5/24, 4:28 pm - +~SQ: 😂..but taking mc definitely will affect performance somehow. Unless boss likes the peroson/bootlicker

29/5/24, 4:28 pm - +Agent K: No ah 

0 = okay 

1 = not okay 

2 = really not okay 

3 = something wrong 

4 = please sent Hr

29/5/24, 4:28 pm - +Frankie Wee: Boss also stress who can cover job

29/5/24, 4:29 pm - +~SQ: Some boss jiak zua also

29/5/24, 4:29 pm - +Frankie Wee: Boss more of overall unhealthy even smoking and drinking

29/5/24, 4:29 pm - +~SQ: Haha esp those boss with no kpi, no survival pressure 🤣

29/5/24, 4:30 pm - +Agent K: They will say they scarified to help get business lol but they talk nothing about business except travel and hometown lol

29/5/24, 4:30 pm - +Andrew Ang: Smoking ten minutes. Toilet break 15mins. Tea break 20mins  One whole day how many breaks?

29/5/24, 4:30 pm - +Frankie Wee: Minister all in parliament never take MC

29/5/24, 4:31 pm - +Rama: Frowned upon if do so and loose incentives!?

29/5/24, 4:31 pm - +Frankie Wee: Few Sleep in parliament

29/5/24, 4:32 pm - +Frankie Wee: Earlier in 1990 operations product people willing to work 12 hrs shit

29/5/24, 4:32 pm - +Andrew Ang: Sleep in parliament. Never sound out the real issues. Productive?

29/5/24, 4:33 pm - +Frankie Wee: They earn more OT even they don’t good education level

29/5/24, 4:34 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Boss not experienced in managing. He should be able to do the job or have backups

29/5/24, 4:34 pm - +Frankie Wee: Then why did not they think themselves health too tired yet to attending

29/5/24, 4:35 pm - +Andrew Ang: We should nurture a good working ethic and environment. Not a dog eat dog world out there.  Singapore likes to follow the nation of mother conflict. But is this the correct path?

29/5/24, 4:35 pm - +Jimmy Chew: If you produced I don't care. If you don't then I coach you if can't perform you would wanna leave hahaha

29/5/24, 4:35 pm - +Frankie Wee: Basic $800 and join get bonus $2000

29/5/24, 4:35 pm - +Frankie Wee: lol

29/5/24, 4:36 pm - +Jimmy Chew: It all depends on leader. Look at Trump he president everyone behaves like him

29/5/24, 4:37 pm - +Andrew Ang: We have too MOP which is "sleeping". Choose wisely. Do we need an event / infrastructure MOP to do the job?

29/5/24, 4:37 pm - +Jimmy Chew: They want to attend but the state didn't allow them 🤣

29/5/24, 4:37 pm - +Frankie Wee: Mind and body thinking wanted to work follow up SOP yet never bother tried and sleepless. Otherwise will become poor healthy

29/5/24, 4:38 pm - +Andrew Ang: This depends on upbringing. When Mr Thaman won, we did see something in our neighborhood, didn't we?

29/5/24, 4:38 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Bro. How many times they are awake versus sleeping 🤣

29/5/24, 4:39 pm - +Andrew Ang: Here is like a first world country but people are behaving like third world people

29/5/24, 4:39 pm - +Jimmy Chew: How do you know? Really,? They don't show up hahaha

29/5/24, 4:40 pm - +Frankie Wee: parliament are politicians and self integrity more acknowledge in body of government and strictly over work

29/5/24, 4:41 pm - +Jimmy Chew: https://www.yourtango.com/self/workers-share-moments-knew-time-find-new-job

29/5/24, 4:41 pm - +Frankie Wee: Stressed

29/5/24, 4:42 pm - +Andrew Ang: Aiya, politicians are chosen from the start. Whether they are able to perform, time will tell. A scholar is not the best medicine for the country. We have too many examples...

29/5/24, 4:42 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Maybe COVID create the I don't care attitude

29/5/24, 4:42 pm - +Frankie Wee: Care and thoughtfulness

29/5/24, 4:42 pm - +Frankie Wee: Without we will death infection level go up

29/5/24, 4:44 pm - +Agent K: This remind me when I go see doctor last year even I got Covid , the doc won’t want to test and they just want the money 100 over dollar for basic medicine  ( no antibiotics ) just 3 medicine at sin Min area <This message was edited>

29/5/24, 4:44 pm - +Frankie Wee: Covid-19 forever non-compulsory

29/5/24, 4:45 pm - +~l or Smiley face: Healthcare Provider Perspectives?

Healthcare professionals are overworked and understaffed, leading to burnout and compassion fatigue. Healthcare organisations must prioritise provider wellbeing, offer resources for managing stress and burnout, and foster a culture of support and collaboration. The cost of burnout and turnover among healthcare professionals is estimated to be around S$20,000 to S$50,000 est. per person per year.

29/5/24, 4:46 pm - +~SQ: Hire more ppl or optimise some processes 😂 see our Overstrained public hospitals and polyclinics

29/5/24, 4:46 pm - +Frankie Wee: Parliament will be use Ai assist and de stress workload and short time

29/5/24, 4:47 pm - +Andrew Ang: This one is overrated. The waiting time in poly clinics is too long even with appointments

29/5/24, 4:48 pm - +Andrew Ang: We can have a dietician, care manager, counsellor, etc in a polyclinic. But are they serving the queue?

29/5/24, 4:48 pm - +~SQ: Yeah then may have a possibility that doc do a  quick appt, patient say what symptoms doctor just agar and issue mc

29/5/24, 4:49 pm - +Andrew Ang: Just don't repeat what south Korea has experienced.

29/5/24, 4:52 pm - +Yilin: A.i.

29/5/24, 4:53 pm - +Agent K: But why last time no issue now Singaporean population got lesser got mc issue ?

29/5/24, 4:53 pm - +Frankie Wee: Human is a soul

Robot is a machine 

Two are different on productive

29/5/24, 4:54 pm - +~SQ: Yeah so the govt need to look into why these doctor anyhow issue mc.. is it no time for appointment/heavy workload ? And then resolve it from the root

29/5/24, 4:54 pm - +~SQ: Think they targeting telemedicine . But actually how much percentage of consultations are via telemed.

29/5/24, 4:58 pm - +Agent K: I thgt South Korea protest is cause Korean to sharply increase medical school admissions and the number of physicians in the country. Thus lower the money and elitism of doctor in SK ? Not really related to overwork

29/5/24, 5:00 pm - +Andrew Ang: Aiya, it's a matter of presumption. COVID-19 period leh. How come last time don't catch?

29/5/24, 5:04 pm - +Jimmy Chew: <Media omitted>

29/5/24, 5:04 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Lawrence Wong is on board. So must show some workings

29/5/24, 5:04 pm - +~SQ: U  might be right 😂😂😂

29/5/24, 5:08 pm - +Frankie Wee: He will make way policy

29/5/24, 5:15 pm - +Yilin: Hope so. A very famous former lawyer died of kidney failure. Overworked. Sg govt should create a corporate culture where no employee stays beyond 7pm. Work smart and not long hours should be the key. Effectiveness using A.I prompting is key.

29/5/24, 5:15 pm - +Frankie Wee: In future Singapore no more MC benefit because we will new development

29/5/24, 5:16 pm - +Frankie Wee: Look what I don’t know AI something is new

29/5/24, 5:17 pm - +Rama: Including our elected politicians!

29/5/24, 5:20 pm - +~l or Smiley face: Further Thoughts:

"Till the day where robot Doctor arrives...!"

-- anonymity 

Spotting Doctors?

To tackle the issue of doctors issuing medical certifications too easily, a practical approach would be to implement a standardised certification process with clear criteria and guidelines. This could include using templates or checklists to ensure consistency, regular audits and peer reviews to monitor certification patterns, and ongoing education and training for doctors on ethical practices and certification protocols. Additionally, healthcare organisations and employers can establish clear consequences for violating certification guidelines and incentivise doctors to adhere to ethical standards. By streamlining the certification process and promoting accountability, we can reduce the incidence of fraudulent certifications and ensure that medical leave is used legitimately.

Spotting Patients?

Faking sick can have costly and harmful consequences for individuals and organisations alike. To tackle this issue, it's crucial to know how to identify it. Look out for inconsistent symptoms or behaviour, such as a colleague who frequently calls in sick with vague complaints or takes extended breaks. Be wary of patterns of absences, like regularly taking Mondays or Fridays off. Pay attention to individuals who prioritise getting a medical certificate over receiving actual care. Verify symptoms and medical history, and watch for contradictions or exaggerations. By being aware of these signs and taking proactive steps, we can implement flexible working arrangements to reduce stress and increase work-life balance, provide access to employee assistance programme (EAP) for mental health support, encourage open communication and report suspicious cases, develop clear policies and procedures for managing absenteeism, and foster a culture of honesty and support, creating healthier and more productive work environments.

29/5/24, 5:22 pm - +~l or Smiley face: Doctor:

Standardise, Streamline, Accountable (SSA)

Patient:

Patterns, History, Program (PHP)

29/5/24, 5:25 pm - +~l or Smiley face: Applicable to other types CHEATING circumstances or compromising situations !

29/5/24, 5:31 pm - +~l or Smiley face: Policy Perspectives?

Policymakers must prioritise funding for mental health services, workforce development, and resources to support healthcare providers. Future policies should focus on integrating mental health into primary care, increasing funding for mental health services, and implementing flexible work arrangements. Investing in mental health initiatives can result in a return on investment of around S$5 est. to S$7 est. for every S$1 est. spent.

Union Perspectives?

Unions can negotiate for mental health support and resources, provide education and training, and advocate for policy changes that promote work-life balance and reduce workload. By standing with employees and advocating for their rights, unions can help create a more supportive and equitable work environment. Negotiating for mental health support and resources can result in cost savings of around S$1,000 est. to S$5,000 est. per employee per year.

29/5/24, 5:32 pm - +~l or Smiley face: Hi Andrew...hope things are well over at your end....

29/5/24, 5:33 pm - +Yilin: I look forward to the sg govt future announcements on how we can get funding for projects that require teamwork. This would be the ultimate way to start a company without crowdfunding limitations! Also grouping together based on interest is more productive. (Just aside)

29/5/24, 5:33 pm - +Rama: Yes but trying to communicate and work at the same time.

29/5/24, 5:34 pm - +~l or Smiley face: United States: 

The US has a complex healthcare system, and the issue of seeking medical attention is often tied to insurance coverage and financial burden. Employers can play a crucial role in supporting employee wellbeing by offering comprehensive health insurance and employee assistance programs. The four-day work week and flexible work arrangements are becoming increasingly popular, with companies like Amazon and Google leading the way.

29/5/24, 5:34 pm - +~l or Smiley face: Great to know that you are multi tasking well ! Cheers!

29/5/24, 5:34 pm - +Rama: Believe UK is as bad if not worse!

29/5/24, 5:34 pm - +Rama: Likewise

29/5/24, 5:35 pm - +Frankie Wee: More than

29/5/24, 5:35 pm - +~l or Smiley face: China: 

China has a rapidly changing healthcare landscape, with a growing recognition of the importance of mental health. Employers are starting to offer employee assistance programs and mental health support, but there is still a long way to go in reducing stigma and increasing awareness. The four-day work week is not yet widely adopted, but some companies are starting to offer flexible work arrangements to attract and retain top talent.

29/5/24, 5:35 pm - +~l or Smiley face: Hi Frankie!

European Countries: 

In Europe, there is a strong emphasis on work-life balance, and many countries have implemented policies like flexible work arrangements, generous parental leave, and mental health support. For example, Germany's "Kurzabeit" policy allows employees to reduce their working hours during times of crisis, while Sweden's "Flexibel Arbetstid" policy gives employees the right to flexible working hours. These policies can help reduce stress and improve overall wellbeing.

29/5/24, 5:36 pm - +~l or Smiley face: and lastly,...

ASEAN: 

In ASEAN countries like Singapore, Malaysia, and Thailand, there is a growing recognition of the importance of employee wellbeing and mental health. Employers are starting to offer flexible work arrangements, employee assistance programs, and mental health support, but there is still a need for greater awareness and education. The four-day work week is not yet widely adopted, but some companies are starting to offer flexible work arrangements to attract and retain top talent.

29/5/24, 5:37 pm - +Frankie Wee: I heard UK defence force short manpower and policy not go well.

29/5/24, 5:37 pm - +Frankie Wee: Hopefully

29/5/24, 5:38 pm - +Frankie Wee: https://www.todayonline.com/news/explainer-national-service-uk-british-pm-sunak-youth-national-unity-2430346

29/5/24, 5:38 pm - +~l or Smiley face: Not the final, yet (later lagi longer essay...)

In progress?

As we bring together the various threads of this complex issue, it becomes clear that seeking medical attention and the motivations behind it involve a multifaceted array of factors that extend far beyond mental health. To create a truly supportive healthcare system, we must address the underlying drivers of this dilemma, including stigma, productivity pressures, and lack of clear guidelines, while also learning from examples around the world. This requires a comprehensive and compassionate approach that prioritises physical and mental health, addresses social determinants, respects cultural and personal beliefs, and ensures access to quality healthcare. By doing so, we can build a healthier society that values the wellbeing of all individuals and promotes a culture of care and understanding. "To each their own story, may we listen with empathy and understanding."

29/5/24, 5:38 pm - +Frankie Wee: He want follow like Singapore NS

29/5/24, 5:40 pm - +Rama: Why only now!?

29/5/24, 5:41 pm - +Frankie Wee: <Media omitted>

29/5/24, 5:41 pm - +Frankie Wee: Feeling so little

29/5/24, 5:46 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

1. I support MOH legislating the HealthCare service act - to ensure the medical doctors and institutions upheld the Integrity. That's issue MC only upon examining the patients and ensure they are really sick before issuing MC. Else they will be help liable.

2. Ensure bosses do not correlate the performance appraisal to the number of MCs taken. Performance should only be tie to actual performance. MOM may have to step in to ensure this.

3. Workers must be genuine sick and not malinger - else will be held accountable for their actions.

This will be the only way to ensure all our system integrity are intact.

29/5/24, 5:59 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

This is to clean up all the hanky panky in the system:-

1. Whether in the medical institutions that issue MC without examination.

2. Bosses who exploits workers and slave drive.

3. Workers who malingers.

This is to ensure Singaporeans and residents inherit the right values and integrity - to ensure we are a trusted places for business and reassure investors - not a place of hanky panky.

In the light of flexible work arrangements - this values must be reinforced and upheld.

Else the flexible work arrangements - will become a source of discontention. <This message was edited>

29/5/24, 6:00 pm - +Yilin: Yes, one psychologist who wrote a book, can't remember who, he gave statistics as sg with most number of affairs in asian countries.

29/5/24, 6:01 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Can provides source?

29/5/24, 6:01 pm - +Yilin: I cant remember who, but he gave a talk on his book.

29/5/24, 6:02 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Then he has to substantiate his fact.

29/5/24, 6:03 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

It means that Singapore families many are broken families.

And this is obviously not true.

29/5/24, 6:08 pm - +Yilin: He is western author, yes, we should have asked him there n then. <This message was edited>

29/5/24, 6:08 pm - +Yilin: It was a talk, given

29/5/24, 6:09 pm - +Yilin: Many years ago though

29/5/24, 6:09 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

He could have been taken to task if he can't substantiate with facts.

Eg. Number of divorce cases.

Private investigator evidence etc.

Singapore divorce cases is not the highest in Asia or the world.

29/5/24, 6:14 pm - +Yilin: https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/cheating-brings-pain-but-many-dont-split-up ( I can only find this)

29/5/24, 6:14 pm - +Yilin: https://sg.style.yahoo.com/news/adultery-unprepared-among-real-reasons-marriages-singapore-fail-lawyers-073716888.html

29/5/24, 6:15 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Versus Asian countries?

29/5/24, 6:15 pm - +Yilin: (these are the only ones I found)

29/5/24, 6:16 pm - +Yilin: I guess he (western author) decided to "shock" the room

29/5/24, 6:16 pm - +Yilin: 🤨

29/5/24, 6:18 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: <Media omitted>

29/5/24, 6:19 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: <Media omitted>

29/5/24, 6:19 pm - +Yilin: https://www.insidermonkey.com/blog/16-most-adulterous-countries-in-the-world-1165831/

29/5/24, 6:19 pm - +Yilin: singapore durex survey no. 5 <This message was edited>

29/5/24, 6:19 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Singapore divorce not rated highest in Asia.

29/5/24, 6:21 pm - +Jimmy Chew: I thought Amazon has  low pay,  no work life balance and bad management? I heard the monitor workers keystrokes and toilet time and time away from desk? Googles seems more acceptable because they Employ the best and dedicated workers? Do correct me if I am wrong

29/5/24, 6:22 pm - +~l or Smiley face: "Coming together is a beginning; keeping together is progress; working together is success." 

-- Henry Ford

Who's the Champions of the course?

1. Healthcare providers

2. Employers

3. Insurance companies

4. Government agencies

5. Professional organizations

6. Patient advocacy groups

To mitigate medical certification cheats, a multi-faceted approach is necessary, involving various stakeholders. 

Healthcare providers can implement robust verification processes for medical certificates, use digital certificates with secure authentication, and regularly audit and monitor certification patterns. 

Employers can develop clear policies and consequences for fraudulent certifications, offer employee assistance programs (EAPs) and mental health support, and foster a culture of honesty and open communication. 

Insurance companies can collaborate with healthcare providers to detect fraudulent claims and implement robust fraud detection systems. 

Government agencies can establish and enforce regulations for medical certification, provide resources for healthcare providers and employers to combat fraud.

Professional organizations can develop and promote ethical guidelines for medical certification, educating members about the consequences of fraudulent certifications. 

Patient advocacy groups can also play a crucial role in promoting honest healthcare practices. 

By working together, these stakeholders can help reduce medical certification fraud and promote a culture of honesty and integrity in healthcare. That's it, WE COLLABORATE !

29/5/24, 6:23 pm - +Jimmy Chew: https://www.cnbc.com/2023/10/25/study-amazons-focus-on-speed-surveillance-drives-worker-injuries.html#:~:text=Nearly%2070%25%20of%20Amazon%20employees,and%20treatment%20of%20warehouse%20employees.

29/5/24, 6:23 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: <Media omitted>

29/5/24, 6:24 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

This study is more credible.

29/5/24, 6:25 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Don't know what institution is this?

29/5/24, 6:27 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: <Media omitted>

29/5/24, 6:41 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

This is to ensure no one abuse the flexible work arrangements.

Every one, every system must play the right ball.

Anyone caught abusing the system - should be taken to task.

29/5/24, 6:45 pm - +REACH: *Dear Contributors,*

⏰ We will be closing the chat in *15 minutes* ⏰

Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.

Goodnight!

Megan 😊

29/5/24, 6:50 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Starts from the core values ingrained in our children. Takes a village to raise a child. If village is cannibals,. we're going to eat each other hahaha. It's the.core values <This message was edited>

29/5/24, 6:52 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Why do doctors do unethical mc giving for telemedicine? My assumptions. Are they local doctors? Did they cheat in school, their housemanship, Sense of power, benovalencr etc not so easy to find root cause <This message was edited>

29/5/24, 6:54 pm - +Nic FreeholdDoctors have to study very long hours and years. I don’t think they would give MC anyhow

29/5/24, 6:54 pm - +Rama: Disagree

29/5/24, 6:55 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Agree then what happened?

29/5/24, 6:55 pm - +Jimmy Chew: What made it a concern?

29/5/24, 6:57 pm - +Nic FreeholdYou mentioned they are unethical

29/5/24, 6:57 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Hahaha because of a few the rest have to suffer

29/5/24, 6:57 pm - +Nic Freehold:-Unethical is a serious word for SMC

29/5/24, 6:58 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Nope I assume because of the complaints of too many mc from telemedicine

29/5/24, 6:58 pm - +~l or Smiley face: <Media omitted>

29/5/24, 6:59 pm - +~l or Smiley face: <Media omitted>

29/5/24, 6:59 pm - +REACH: *Dear Contributors,*

We will be closing the chat for today.

Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.

Goodnight!

Megan 😊

29/5/24, 7:00 pm - ~ REACH Singapore changed this group's settings to allow only admins to send messages to this group

===

Various Heavenly Planes

(欲界天，色界天，出色界天)

(Sensual Pleasure Desire Heavenly Plane, Form Heavenly Plane, Formless Heavenly Plane)

26 May 2024

I:- https://deeptruths.com/treasures/heaven_pleasures.html

Christianity heaven - sensual desire plane heaven.

https://islamonline.net/en/delights-of-paradise-vs-pleasures-of-this-world/

Islam heaven - sensual desire plane heaven.

https://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/4848230/jewish/Heaven-and-the-Afterlife.htm

Judaism concept of heaven - Garden of Eden similar to Christianity.

So is sensual desire plane heaven.

----

Hence can infer that Abrahamic religions are all Sensual Desire Plane Heaven. (欲界天）。

SK:- Master Jing Kong said there is a 一真法界。that's outside 六道。but heaven still within 六道.

I:- Yes.

Up to heaven still 六道。

天 is 三界 :-

i.  欲界天

ii. 色界天

iii. 出色界天。

涅槃 is 跳出三界。

I:- Come to think of it, Buddha enroute to gain Enlightenment (涅槃) has to go through 三界。

1. Sensual desire heaven plane (欲界天).

2. Form heaven plane (色界天).

3.  Formless heaven plane (出色界天).

I recall many 经书 (sutra) say :-

1. Under the Bodhi Tree - Buddha encounter 3 sensual pleasure test :-

i. Authority & Power test - He rejected.

ii. Alot of money test - He rejected.

iii. Woman seduction and sexual test - He rejected. (He even let go his wife to 出家).

Hence Buddha have undergone Sensual desire heaven plane (欲界天). No wonder He can describe this heavens (I think 8 sub-plane in details.)

2. Form heaven plane (色界天) - 4 Rupa Jhana Samadhi. (4 sub plane heavens).

3. Formless heaven plane (出色界天) - Arupa Jhana Samadhi (I think got 3 formless heaven).

Before He 跳出三界 and attain 涅槃界.

Enroute to Enlightenment (Nirvana) - Buddha have to experience and attain all Heaven Realms.

That is why Buddha say:-

天上天下无如佛。

一切万物我尽知。

SK:- But master Jing Kong pointed out Shakyamuni Buddha already demonstrated enlightenment some 800 times. It was hinted in one of the 经。so he borned into planet earth 2500+ years ago he was already a Buddha.

SK:- I just need to reborn in amituofo pureland this life, then I can return and demo righteous paths. ☺ Now very limited capabilties

I:- I was very lucky, enroute to Enlightenment (Nirvana) - I bypass sensual desire plane heaven (欲界天).

I only go through:-

i. Form heaven plane (色界天).

4 Rupa Jhana Samadhi - 1st, 2nd 3rd and 4th - 1 pointedness concentration - that is why I can describe all these 4 sub-plane heavens in detail. (Diagram 1).

ii. Formless heaven plane (出色界天) - specifically:-

a. 是相非相天 (Perception and non-perception heavenly plane)

b. 非想天非非想天 (Nothing and non-nothingness heavenly plane,).

(Diagram 2 - 1 ring vast space consciousness)

But the 3rd sub plane formless heavenly plane - I didn't go through, hence I can't describe.

I:- I think if I tested in Sensual desire heaven plane (欲界天) - I may not be able to pass all the tests (phew, very lucky). Because I 在家 not 出家 - I still got wife and children.I cannot let go of them.

So very lucky, at that time when enroute to attaining Nirvana - I was just married not too long, I bypass sensual desire plane heaven (欲界天).

Else even now, I don't think I can pass this test.

I still 在家 not 出家。

Hence I didn't go through Sensual desire plane heaven (欲界天) - thus I can't describe this 8 realms of sub-plane in details.

I:- Hmm...

I also have desire to reborn in Amituofo Pureland - to gain more knowledge and seek permission from Amituofo to help to salvage all sentinent beings with my 2 PuSas and Aspirant.

I:- Hmm...

Possible.

Sakyamuni Buddha knowledge is unsurpass - and his detail description of all consciousness - so precise and minute.

And he can see, correlate everyones karma in precision.

I don't have such abilities.

His Deep Jhana Samadhi - unmatch.

I:- In retrospect, I think most if not all monks and nuns will have easily pass the tests in Sensual desire heaven plane - because they walk the Vinaya order (discipline order) 出家。

If the monks and nuns are able to attain at least 1st Jhana Samadhi and above - they will at least reborn in minimum Form heavenly plane 色界天。

I:- Because Form heaven plane 色界天 is suppression of all human conscious pleasure desire through 禅定 (Jhana Samadhi) - hence monks and nuns if attain at least 1st Jhana won't reborn in 欲界天 (Sensual Pleasure Desire plane heaven).

Formless heaven plane 出色界天 - is the suppression of human sublime subconsciousness - via Formless Arupa Jhana 出禅定.

Both attainment - will not let such yogi landed in Sensual Pleasure Desire plane heaven (欲界天) - that is characterize by all sensual desires in its maximum form.

I:- Those who cannot attain Jhana will be at least reborn in sensual desire plane heaven 欲界天。

Because of their good discipline order.

I:- Because Form heaven plane 色界天 is suppression of all human conscious pleasure desire through 禅定 (Jhana Samadhi) - hence monks and nuns if attain at least 1st Jhana won't reborn in 欲界天 (Sensual Pleasure Desire plane heaven).

Formless heaven plane 出色界天 - is the suppression of human sublime subconsciousness - via Formless Arupa Jhana 出禅定.

Both attainment - will not let such yogi landed in Sensual Pleasure Desire plane heaven (欲界天) - that is characterize by all sensual desires in its maximum form.

I:- I mean their 福报 is 天人报。

But they will be unhappy in 欲界天 - as they train in detachment from desires and sensual pleasure.

They will meditate very hard to get out of 欲界天 to attain 涅槃.

This is what one Theravada monk told me - when I ask what happen if cannot attain Jhana.

Of course Theravada monk don't know or don't believe in Mahayana Amituofo Pureland.

====

REACH 572 - What are your thoughts on the Singapore Police Force's stance on the issue? What more can we do as a community to maintain religious harmony in Singapore?

(SK)

24 May 2024 (10am - 7pm)

REACH

24/5/24, 9:48 am - +REACH: *Dear contributors,* 

Welcome back! 😊

⏰ We will be opening the chat from *10am to 7pm* today. ⏰

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Megan 😊

24/5/24, 10:00 am - +REACH: 📢 *Topic* 📢 

On May 21 (Tuesday), the police stated that the planned performance of a South Korean DJ “monk” must not involve any religious elements if it is to proceed after issuing an advisory to the nightclub involved in staging the event. The entertainer, known as DJ NewJeansNim, has been known for performing while wearing a monk's robe and incorporating Buddhist mantras into his set.

💬 *What are your thoughts on the Singapore Police Force's stance on the issue? What more can we do as a community to maintain religious harmony in Singapore?*

📌 *_Details on the Police statement_*

In the statement, which came following calls by the Singapore Buddhist Federation that the shows should be cancelled, the Police emphasized that they had advised the nightclub to adhere to the conditions of its public entertainment licence. 

According to these licence conditions, the establishment must ensure that any public entertainment provided is not likely to be offensive to any race, religion, ethnicity or nationality, or potentially cause disharmony among different groups, said the police.

They added that NewJeansNim’s shows “may be in violation of this condition”, given the nature of the planned performance.

📌 *_Reactions of Ministers to the incident_*

Minister for Law and Home Affairs K. Shanmugam also noted in a Facebook post that the performer has used religious verses in song lyrics and a Buddhist prayer item in his previous shows. 

“This would have been offensive to our Buddhist community. This is not acceptable,” said Minister Shanmugam.

Minister for Culture, Community and Youth and Second Minister for Law, Edwin Tong also highlighted that the government has “clear rules” about what can or cannot be staged at such public entertainment performances.

📌 *_Reaction by the Singapore Buddhist Federation_*

Venerable You Guang, secretary-general of the Singapore Buddhist Federation, on May 22 said he appreciated the “swift and firm” statements from Minister Shanmugam and Minister Tong.

Ven You Guang said the ministers’ statements showed they respected and protected religious sanctity in Singapore, and added: “We need deep respect and understanding for one (another) as we navigate this world of constant changes, challenges and opportunities.”

📌 *_Response by the nightclub hosting the DJ_*

The nightclub has since told the authorities that his performance here will not contain anything religious.

Mr Jackie He, owner of Club Rich, said that the performance will not be cancelled on either night, but the nightclub will ensure the DJ does not wear a monk’s robe, use a religious instrument, or play any music that is related to a Buddhist chant.

“Club Rich respects all religions, and we will be ensuring that the performance will be a non-religious performance,” he said.

👉 https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/south-korea-dj-monk-newjeansnim-no-religious-elements-if-performance-proceeds-club-rich-police-4354146 

👉 https://str.sg/hLNw

24/5/24, 10:00 am - ~ REACH Singapore changed this group's settings to allow all members to send messages to this group

24/5/24, 10:01 am - ~ REACH Singapore changed the group description

----

24/5/24, 10:01 am - +Caleb: no reply from this no.

24/5/24, 10:02 am - +Rama: Playing with fire!?

24/5/24, 10:03 am - +Terrie Wong: The Buddha is watching...

24/5/24, 10:04 am - +Rama: Beware divine retribution!

24/5/24, 10:09 am - +Frankie Wee: Don’t know about Buddhism culture I have seemed it’s like silence worship but do not have pop or JD musical theatre.

24/5/24, 10:20 am - +Darius Lee: There was a similar incident involving the CHIJMES 'Chapel Party' in 2012: 

https://sg.news.yahoo.com/chijmes-%E2%80%98chapel-party%E2%80%99-draws-flak-from-catholic-community.html

24/5/24, 10:24 am - +Darius Lee: Buddhism is the largest religious group in Singapore (31.1% according to the 2020 Census).

I think any entertainment establishment should exercise good taste and sensibility when organising events and activities.

24/5/24, 10:30 am - +Rama: Next, islam/Judaism/Hindu!?

24/5/24, 10:51 am - +~l or Smiley face: "Art is the mirror of society, and society is the mirror of art. Let's create a reflection that is respectful, inclusive, and empowering for all."

-- anonymity

24/5/24, 11:07 am - +SL: The SPF stance is clear and appropriate. Religious harmony is a main pillar of racial harmony.

24/5/24, 11:09 am - +Agent K: This one really offend ppl

24/5/24, 11:10 am - +Nic Freehold: Have you seen the modern church worship?

24/5/24, 11:11 am - +Rama: Evangelical and not traditional!

24/5/24, 11:12 am - +Nic Freehold: It’s a ticketed closed door event. Then recently MBS had a baby baptism event, casino and church and babies also a clash ?

24/5/24, 11:13 am - +Nic Freehold: Buddhism used to have more followers, but young people are attracted by the modern music

24/5/24, 11:13 am - +Rama: Dangerous!

24/5/24, 11:13 am - +Nic Freehold: I was asked to go to so many churches w plays and music

24/5/24, 11:13 am - +Agent K: Once read a a script when an enlighten person wear a robes mean u need to obey the enlightenment. Normal person laugh at ppl on these , can atone by doing good deed. If this case is like knowing the law breaks the law goes straight to hell one

24/5/24, 11:13 am - +Rama: 🤦‍♂️😳😔

24/5/24, 11:13 am - +Nic Freehold: And I was wondering where’s the hymns

24/5/24, 11:13 am - +Rama: Rubbish!

24/5/24, 11:13 am - +Rama: 🤷‍♂️

24/5/24, 11:14 am - +Thank You Woman: Well, it all boils down to what’s their objective.

Is this DJ(producer presenter) a buddhist?

First we seek understanding on what he wants to achieve/reason for putting on the monk robe.

Overall being respectful is the point.

24/5/24, 11:14 am - +Agent K: 今生驼背为何因，前世讥笑拜佛人。今生拙手为何因，前世造业害旁人。 this the part of script .

24/5/24, 11:14 am - +Nic Freehold: If Singapore have novena and catholic type churches for 100 + years, yet our largest churches today own part of Suntec City and that Buona Vista mall

24/5/24, 11:15 am - +Nic Freehold: Why no one protested? Church and commerce?

24/5/24, 11:15 am - +Rama: Religious attire has no place outside of a religious setting +

24/5/24, 11:16 am - +Sugeng Shi: Totally agree on this point. Why should people display religious affiliation and attires outside the religious settings? It’s irrelevant. <This message was edited>

24/5/24, 11:16 am - +Agent K: I agree to

24/5/24, 11:19 am - +Nic Freehold: During 1980s, the Grammy Oscar award show winners many said “thank you God” or mentioned Jesus so many times, it felt alienating as they entered our homes by TV.

Whole Muslim, Hindu, Taoist families watching that, the children ask their parents… how? 

We seem to give free pass to Evangelical Christians

24/5/24, 11:26 am - +Agent K: Per my understanding , What are the unforgivable sins in Buddhism?

The Dhammasangāni [5] regard five acts – matricide, parricide, slaying an Arhat, slaying a Buddha, and causing division among priesthood to be five unpardonable sins. The four pārājikas (lit. "defeats") are rules entailing expulsion from the sangha for life. If a monk breaks any one of the rules he is automatically "defeated" in the holy life and falls from monkhood immediately. He is not allowed to become a monk again in his lifetime. Intention is necessary in all these four cases to constitute an offence <This message was edited>

24/5/24, 11:27 am - +Frankie Wee: Yes at city harvest church 

They are dance and pop with DJ and show theatre on event Christmas and Good Friday

24/5/24, 11:27 am - +Rama: Nonsense!

24/5/24, 11:28 am - +Frankie Wee: Singapore can be art and culture

24/5/24, 11:28 am - +Frankie Wee: I have been there

24/5/24, 11:28 am - +Rama: Religion separate!

24/5/24, 11:29 am - +Frankie Wee: But monk on DJ I respect the rule which is disallowed by other group monk against him

24/5/24, 11:30 am - +Agent K: true protestant I think. If I not wrong Christian school, they say prayer everyday, weekly prayers to god.  and banned ppl from playing magic card. They principal say we summoning devils using the cards from devils <This message was edited>

24/5/24, 11:31 am - +Rama: Agree

24/5/24, 11:33 am - +Frankie Wee: https://youtu.be/BO5AHmhJid8?si=eyG00vZ4HIpKqmPO

24/5/24, 11:33 am - +Frankie Wee: Like that also can

24/5/24, 11:34 am - +Frankie Wee: But dress monk something is strictly the rule religion

24/5/24, 11:44 am - +Agent K: Btw I think , all places of worship should not building more carpark in their compound. Global warming. secondly I see at TTSH  area ( don't want to pin point where  but a number of places ) they block a lot of ambulance, alt now is better but it really weird to see ppl praying causing harm to others instead. I wonder what will the higher being think of ? When u go visit holy places shouldn't we travel humbly to see them ? It  luxury asking u to travel by public transport not by foot wearing straw footwear. Plus if really got ppl delay going to Hospital , may result in bad blood in future. <This message was edited>

24/5/24, 11:45 am - +Rama: Agree

24/5/24, 11:49 am - +Nic Freehold: Jogye Order, South Korea’s largest Buddhist sect, has employed NewJeansNim as part of its outreach efforts.

In a meeting with NewJeansNim, the president of The Jogye Order Venerable Jin-woo said: "I am thankful for the work you have done in spreading a much younger Buddhism to the young generation."

In that same meeting, Venerable Jin-woo also presented NewJeansNim with prayer beads and a headset.

24/5/24, 11:50 am - +Nic Freehold: South Korea surpassed Japan in electronics and cultural exports

24/5/24, 11:51 am - +Nic Freehold: Let’s boil down to fundamentals, why Christians can be bible quoting in MRT coaches and malls PUBLIC spaces, why can’t Buddhists? 

Importantly this is a ticketed event

24/5/24, 11:51 am - +Nic Freehold: Don’t like don’t buy ticket

24/5/24, 11:52 am - +Nic Freehold: 1980s we had so much satanic like heavy metal rock

24/5/24, 11:52 am - +Rama: 😳

24/5/24, 11:53 am - +Nic Freehold: Black sabbath was ok?

24/5/24, 11:53 am - +Nic Freehold: upside down crosses?

24/5/24, 11:53 am - +Nic Freehold: Focus on family is a church masquerading as social orgn

24/5/24, 11:54 am - +Nic Freehold: Why no protests?

24/5/24, 11:54 am - +Rama: Church of Satan!?

24/5/24, 11:54 am - +Thomas: The main thing is the reverence , respect and worship for their own belief. We can impart the wrong concept to young that churches, temple can be a discotheque to attract the young. Where will they respect the place of worship ?

24/5/24, 11:54 am - +Frankie Wee: No such in service sg

24/5/24, 11:55 am - +Thomas: Yes there is a church of Satan .

24/5/24, 11:55 am - +Frankie Wee: Where have?

24/5/24, 11:55 am - +Frankie Wee: Church hate Satan

24/5/24, 11:55 am - +Frankie Wee: Satan is worship by devil 😈

24/5/24, 11:58 am - +Thomas: This is underground church.

24/5/24, 11:59 am - +Rama: <Media omitted>

24/5/24, 12:00 pm - +Frankie Wee: No thank I don’t want

24/5/24, 12:00 pm - +Nic Freehold: Actually it exists

24/5/24, 12:00 pm - +Rama: Yes

24/5/24, 12:00 pm - +Frankie Wee: If you believe in Satan then what do need cult example drink blood and sexually

24/5/24, 12:01 pm - +Rama: Reverse crucifix

24/5/24, 12:01 pm - +Frankie Wee: Satan is favour goat star

24/5/24, 12:01 pm - +Nic Freehold: I heard church youths and some cell groups go to pubs and discos to mingle

24/5/24, 12:07 pm - +Nic Freehold: Korea is so advanced in cultural exports

24/5/24, 12:07 pm - +Nic Freehold: They keep producing pop stars

24/5/24, 12:07 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

1. Firstly, a person must be trained, practice, ordained and qualify as a monk in order for him to wear a monk robe, shave his hair and follow the Vinaya order (discipline order).

2. A person cannot just shave his hair, wear a monk robe, put on a bead, chant a few mantra - and declare himself a monk.

3. Just like a person cannot put on a doctor robe, put a stethoscope around his neck, say a few medical terms - paracetamol, covid, statin - then call himself doctor.

4. Because Buddhist disciples will emulate what a Master do, patients will believe in the treatment of a doctor - and will bring harm to followers if the Master is a fake monk or bring harm to the patients if treated by a fake doctor.

24/5/24, 12:08 pm - +Nic Freehold: We only have 1 PCK and the Nonya series that some Asians recognise as Singapore

24/5/24, 12:08 pm - +Rama: Entertainment industry toxic and vulgar!

24/5/24, 12:08 pm - +Nic Freehold: Is the KOREAN DJ asking Buddhists to kill?

24/5/24, 12:08 pm - +Nic Freehold: To eat meat?

24/5/24, 12:09 pm - +Nic Freehold: Not follow 4 noble path?

24/5/24, 12:09 pm - +Nic Freehold: Impermanence and enlightenment is the message

24/5/24, 12:09 pm - +Nic Freehold: by preaching hate, who wins?

24/5/24, 12:10 pm - +Nic Freehold: Mara

24/5/24, 12:10 pm - +Rama: You will be surprised!

24/5/24, 12:11 pm - +Nic Freehold: <Media omitted>

24/5/24, 12:17 pm - +Nic Freehold: No wonder expats say we are boring

24/5/24, 12:17 pm - +Nic Freehold: Like some village mountain tortoise

24/5/24, 12:18 pm - +Rama: We can't be a copycat of their lifestyle either!

24/5/24, 12:18 pm - +Nic Freehold: Ok What about that’s Blanche party?

24/5/24, 12:18 pm - +Nic Freehold: Brunch : their lifestyle

24/5/24, 12:19 pm - +Rama: What about Taylor swift!?

24/5/24, 12:19 pm - +Frankie Wee: What about Micheal Jackson

24/5/24, 12:19 pm - +Frankie Wee: 😅

24/5/24, 12:20 pm - +Rama: And so on!

24/5/24, 12:20 pm - +Frankie Wee: Music pop not all are good but sometime bad music

24/5/24, 12:21 pm - +Nic Freehold: Gaza is being bombed and we are talking wasting energy about a ticketed event

24/5/24, 12:21 pm - +Nic Freehold: There are more controversial talking points behind many closed doors

24/5/24, 12:22 pm - +Rama: Trading her soul to Satan for temporal fleeting moments of riches and fame?

https://images.app.goo.gl/P8sxCSgjdRHQi41Y6

24/5/24, 12:22 pm - +Frankie Wee: Belief Satan and Jesus

24/5/24, 12:22 pm - +Frankie Wee: It’s combine into musics

24/5/24, 12:23 pm - +Frankie Wee: But true heart do not tell there is nothing exist

24/5/24, 12:24 pm - +SL: Non registered? 😱

24/5/24, 12:24 pm - +Nic Freehold: https://www.bbc.co.uk/bitesize/guides/z6b96v4/revision/4#:~:text=There%20were%20a%20number%20of,'work'%20which%20was%20forbidden.

24/5/24, 12:25 pm - +Nic Freehold: Jesus was a maverick, a radical back in the day

24/5/24, 12:26 pm - +Nic Freehold: “He made claims about himself that the Jewish leaders could not accept – that he was God’s son and the promised saviour.

Jesus was accused of blasphemy by the Jewish leaders. Blasphemy is a religious offence, when a person says or does something regarded as being disrespectful to God. In the eyes of the Jewish leaders, when Jesus claimed to be God’s son he was insulting God. Blasphemy was taken very seriously and the punishment was death by stoning.

After Jesus was arrested, he was put on trial by the Sanhedrin. This was the highest ruling council of the Jews.”

24/5/24, 12:27 pm - +Rama: No such thing!

24/5/24, 12:28 pm - +Nic Freehold: Religious studies

24/5/24, 12:28 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

1. Next the place of imparting religious knowledge must be appropriate.

2. A nightclub - is a place of sleaze - alcohol, desire manifest places, sexual exploits - which infringe all the basic precepts - is an inappropriate place for religious impart.

3. Imparting religious teachings preferably should be in the appropriate place of worship - a Buddhist temple for Buddhists.

4. But event hall, home and other places that are serene are also possible if organise respectfully. <This message was edited>

24/5/24, 12:28 pm - +Nic Freehold: Please research and talk w scholars

24/5/24, 12:29 pm - +Nic Freehold: that was my first reaction when I saw a video short

24/5/24, 12:29 pm - +Nic Freehold: Then I dug deep

24/5/24, 12:29 pm - +Rama: Nothing changes

24/5/24, 12:29 pm - +Nic Freehold: ???

24/5/24, 12:29 pm - +Nic Freehold: go research

24/5/24, 12:33 pm - +Nic Freehold: After the courts cases, https://www.chc.org.sg/about-us/our-founders/sun-ho

24/5/24, 12:33 pm - +Nic Freehold: After all those sexy music videos

24/5/24, 12:33 pm - +Nic Freehold: Why is she still a pastor?

24/5/24, 12:34 pm - +Rama: Status quo

24/5/24, 12:34 pm - +Rama: Dress like a slut!😳🤦‍♂️

24/5/24, 12:35 pm - +Nic Freehold: <Media omitted>

24/5/24, 12:36 pm - +Rama: Both!

24/5/24, 12:36 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

1. Buddhism are open to all people regardless of high social status, middle social status, low social status, good men/women, even criminals or people who indulge in sinful activities provided people are willing to repent and desire to do good or lead a wholesome life.

2. But Master who preach Buddhism teachings must be the right teacher - who have practice and inherited the right values of Buddha teachings.

3. Else a fake teacher will be a cult who exploits sensory pleasures of gullible disciples - and then impart the wrong values and wrong teachings to disciples - will not lead the disciples to the path of Enlightenment but instead lead disciples onto the wrong path.

24/5/24, 12:39 pm - +Nic Freehold: Agree, that’s why I think Sun should not be a religious  leader

24/5/24, 12:40 pm - +Nic Freehold: yet Singaporeans made no noise for decades

24/5/24, 12:40 pm - +Nic Freehold: Despite the court’s cases on financial issues

24/5/24, 12:41 pm - +Nic Freehold: Venerable Abbot so quiet

24/5/24, 12:41 pm - +Rama: We have been silenced!

24/5/24, 12:43 pm - +Rama: Agree

24/5/24, 12:45 pm - +Nic Freehold: https://www.aljazeera.com/news/liveblog/2024/5/24/israels-war-on-gaza-live-news-at-least-60-palestinians-killed-in-attacks

24/5/24, 12:45 pm - +Rama: Blame Hamas!

24/5/24, 12:48 pm - +Nic Freehold: This message was deleted

24/5/24, 12:49 pm - +Nic Freehold: Do more research

24/5/24, 12:49 pm - +Nic Freehold: https://amp.scmp.com/news/asia/southeast-asia/article/3263593/south-korean-dj-newjeansnim-barred-performing-singapore-nightclub

24/5/24, 12:49 pm - +Nic Freehold: https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2024/05/20/middleeast/icc-israel-hamas-arrest-warrant-war-crimes-intl

24/5/24, 12:50 pm - +Nic Freehold: Hong Kong laughing at us

24/5/24, 12:50 pm - +Nic Freehold: how can we be the most important city in Asia?

24/5/24, 12:50 pm - +Nic Freehold: Regional hub?

24/5/24, 12:52 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

1. In a Jataka story, a disciple known as Devadatta, the cousin of Buddha - learn from the Buddha and has attained Jhana Samadhi - with some psychic power.

2. He become arrogant and use his psychic power to start to entice quite many of Buddha disciples over - and proclaimed himself as Master.

3. When he gain more and more disciples, by using his psychic power - he become more and more arrogant and want to have power - and say he is ready to replace Buddha.

4. He taught his disciples sensory pleasures, flaunt his psychic power, recruit more believers, force disciples to give him money, build big house to stay, and project his power influence through greed, deception through psychic power and many ways that breach all precepts and orders taught by Buddha - and persecute Buddha's disciples.

5. Eventually, many disciples are confused by the 2 opposing orders. He also plot many ways to harm the Buddha and His disciples - but fail in all attempts.

6. As Devadatta cause an anarchy to Buddhism teachings - one of the Greatest Sin - his karma finally arrived - and he descended to the deepest hell.

7. In the deepest hell, Devadatta is very fearful because the sufferings re immeasurable. And he pleaded to the Buddha to save him.

8. Buddha out of compassion lower a rope to the deepest hell to save Devadatta, but the moment Devadatta see the light and Buddha, an evil thought come to him, the moment if he emerge from hell, he will push Buddha into hell, and he can replace Buddha.

9. The moment this evil thought emerge, the rope break, and the hell in tremendous ramble close and buried Devadatta into Avicii Hell - the deepest hell - because his last strewn of thought, is an evil thought - and his karma come to him immediately.

24/5/24, 12:52 pm - +Nic Freehold: “Youn Sung-ho, who goes by the moniker NewJeansNim, is a comedian-turned-musician. He is credited with reviving Buddhism’s popularity among young South Koreans”

https://foreignpolicy.com/2021/11/05/south-korea-suicide-rates-mental-illness-squid-game/

24/5/24, 12:53 pm - +Rama: None for obama/bush/Clinton/Reagan/John Howard/tiny Blair/Justin trudeau!?

24/5/24, 12:53 pm - +Nic Freehold: Would we rather more youths commit suicide

24/5/24, 12:54 pm - +Nic Freehold: For the past two decades, it has had the highest suicide rate among developed nations: 24.6 suicides for every 100,000 people in South Korea in 2019, compared to 14.5 suicides in the United States in 2017. Although South Korea’s older adults are still the most likely to die by suicide due to poverty and isolation, young people are rapidly dying by suicide. Between 2018 and 2019, the number of South Koreans under age 40 who took their own lives rose by 10 percent, according to the Korea National Statistics Office.

24/5/24, 12:54 pm - +Nic Freehold: This DJ may have saved more lives than we know

24/5/24, 12:54 pm - +Nic Freehold: modern economy is extremely bad for mental health

24/5/24, 12:55 pm - +Nic Freehold: Until we die at pearly gates or reincarnate, we dunno who has done more

24/5/24, 12:55 pm - +Nic Freehold: Dogma or more Deaths?

24/5/24, 12:56 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

He can teach music minus Buddhism teachings.

Because he is a comedian, a musician with little knowledge in Buddhism except quoting some Buddhism verse and mantra.

24/5/24, 12:56 pm - +Rama: Still,  wrong approach!

24/5/24, 1:00 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

1. What does Buddhism teach?

2. 4 Noble path - 苦集灭道。(Sufferings, Attachment/Cravings, Cessation of Attachment/Cravings, Attain Enlightenment.

3. This DJ teach attachment and cravings in sensory pleasures - that is the root cause of sufferings.

4. Exactly of what Devadatta teach.

5. Totally wrong teachings.

24/5/24, 1:00 pm - +Nic Freehold: Agree, When this Korean monk do wrong punish him.

24/5/24, 1:00 pm - +Nic Freehold: This message was deleted

24/5/24, 1:01 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

He can promote his music and entertainment minus Buddhism teachings.

No need to punish him.

24/5/24, 1:01 pm - +Nic Freehold: But he helped youths find hope in Buddha  teachings

24/5/24, 1:01 pm - +Nic Freehold: If not they might have died by suicide

24/5/24, 1:02 pm - +Nic Freehold: let’s look at the good he did

24/5/24, 1:02 pm - +Nic Freehold: 1 of them could invent new medicine to save lives

24/5/24, 1:02 pm - +Nic Freehold: Or new energy

24/5/24, 1:03 pm - +Nic Freehold: why do we still have city harvest church operating after legal cases

24/5/24, 1:03 pm - +Nic Freehold: Moral leanings title towards worshipping money or God

24/5/24, 1:03 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

He can use music to promote goodness and kindness.

But don't dress as monks and no need to quote Buddhism verse.

There are many good things he can promote, be kind, be compassionate, be generous etc.

24/5/24, 1:04 pm - +Rama: Good question @?

24/5/24, 1:04 pm - +Nic Freehold: Are churches TAXED?

24/5/24, 1:04 pm - +Rama: Money!

24/5/24, 1:04 pm - +Nic Freehold: applies to many YouTubers

24/5/24, 1:04 pm - +Rama: Not sure

24/5/24, 1:05 pm - +Nic Freehold: Buddha if he was alive today would use whatever technology of the day to spread his teachings

24/5/24, 1:05 pm - +Nic Freehold: Books were the most modern technology

24/5/24, 1:05 pm - +Rama: If every off main stream is to be accepted,  no such thing as a dark Web!?

24/5/24, 1:05 pm - +Nic Freehold: Paper was newish

24/5/24, 1:06 pm - +Nic Freehold: why don’t venerable abbot go to hawker centre, 1 rooms hdb and spread message more often and save lives

24/5/24, 1:06 pm - +Rama: Yes!?

24/5/24, 1:07 pm - +Nic Freehold: God/ Allah/ Buddha: “DO GOOD”

24/5/24, 1:07 pm - +Nic Freehold: it’s always the message

24/5/24, 1:07 pm - +Nic Freehold: save lives

24/5/24, 1:07 pm - +Nic Freehold: Not all of us can be doctors

24/5/24, 1:07 pm - +Nic Freehold: but don’t stop people from becoming 1

24/5/24, 1:08 pm - +Nic Freehold: the Korean parents who lost their child

24/5/24, 1:08 pm - +Nic Freehold: @Danny what do you tell them

24/5/24, 1:09 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

1. Buddhism teach human sufferings are due to 5 poison 贪嗔痴慢疑。greed, hatred, ignorance, arrogant, distrust.

2. Enlightenment is attained when the 5 poison are eradicated.

3. And 8 Noble Path - divide into 3 main sections - help to eradicate the 5 poisons.

4. Specifically, Morality, Right Living, Right Mental Practice - Concentration/Mindfulness - are the keys that eradicate the 5 poisons and attain Enlightenment.

5. That DJ breaches the 8 Noble Path. Hence important not to emulate. <This message was edited>

24/5/24, 1:09 pm - +Nic Freehold: An epic housing crisis in the capital area, where nearly half the South Korean population lives, has made matters worse. The average price of an apartment in Seoul has doubled in the past five years under the current government’s misguided policies on mortgage rules and tax penalties. Four years ago, it would have taken 11 years’ worth of South Korea’s median annual household income to buy an apartment in Seoul. Now, it costs more than 18 years’ worth of income. Rents have shot up, leaving young people with limited savings and without a shelter.

The number of people in their 20s experiencing depression has nearly doubled over the past five years. Yet seeking therapy is difficult in a culture that sees it as a sign of weakness. In fact, even though almost 30 percent of South Koreans suffer from mental illnesses like depression

24/5/24, 1:09 pm - +Nic Freehold: In 2040, we may have such problems

24/5/24, 1:10 pm - +Nic Freehold: He didn’t promote alcohol, however our kopitiam auntie or tiger girl promote beers

24/5/24, 1:11 pm - +Nic Freehold: he didn’t promote greed

24/5/24, 1:12 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Greed/Attachment/Cravings - refer to attachment to sensory pleasures - the root cause of sufferings.

24/5/24, 1:13 pm - +Nic Freehold: Agree w all your write

24/5/24, 1:13 pm - +Nic Freehold: I read

24/5/24, 1:13 pm - +Nic Freehold: But do you get my point

24/5/24, 1:13 pm - +Nic Freehold: Suicide is an actual option for some people

24/5/24, 1:13 pm - +Nic Freehold: Recession in China now

24/5/24, 1:13 pm - +Nic Freehold: Some feel hopeless

24/5/24, 1:14 pm - +Nic Freehold: Singapore is booming now

24/5/24, 1:14 pm - +Nic Freehold: but impermanence

24/5/24, 1:15 pm - +Nic Freehold: if our economy goes down and people get depressed and resort to alcohol do you think abbot’s message can reach their hopelessness

24/5/24, 1:15 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

And conduct teachings in a nightclub that promote alcohol is an implicit acceptance of intoxication - where alcohol cause people to get drunk, drive cause accident, intoxicate people mind and unable to acquire clarity in thoughts to attain concentration and mindfulness, cause alcohol poisoning, and cause domestic problems at home.

24/5/24, 1:16 pm - +Nic Freehold: Muslims eat pork these days

24/5/24, 1:16 pm - +Rama: Big issue for hapan

24/5/24, 1:16 pm - +Rama: Japan*

24/5/24, 1:16 pm - +Rama: Really!?

24/5/24, 1:16 pm - +Rama: Expect domestic market to cushion impact

24/5/24, 1:17 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Suicide happens because mental strength is not strong.

Concentration and Mindfulness practice are the mental strength that stop suicide.

24/5/24, 1:18 pm - +Nic Freehold: But how to get the message

24/5/24, 1:19 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: <Media omitted>

24/5/24, 1:19 pm - +Nic Freehold: Carlsberg promoter wants to sell more beer at coffeeshop which is free entry

24/5/24, 1:19 pm - +Nic Freehold: Nightclub not free entry

24/5/24, 1:19 pm - +Nic Freehold: statistically which is worst

24/5/24, 1:19 pm - +Nic Freehold: Data science

24/5/24, 1:20 pm - +Nic Freehold: nightclub will already sell alcohol without the dj,

24/5/24, 1:20 pm - +Nic Freehold: But because he there, they sell more soft drinks

24/5/24, 1:20 pm - +Nic Freehold: My neighbor uncle buys 2 bottles of beers everyday day

24/5/24, 1:21 pm - +Nic Freehold: This message was deleted

24/5/24, 1:21 pm - +Nic Freehold: Beer peddlers are worst right

24/5/24, 1:21 pm - +Nic Freehold: his pupils look so blur like liver or kidney got problem

24/5/24, 1:23 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

1. Right thought, Right speech, Right actions - are morality practice. (A person thought must be wholesome - 1st and foremost). When thought is right, speech and actions will be right.

2. Right effort, Right livelihood - is the way of life people live. People must live a right, wholesome life.

3. Right Concentration and Right Mindfulness - are mental strength. Concentration ensure focus in everything we do are focus, Mindfulness ensure whatever we think, we say, we do are wholesome and on the right path.

24/5/24, 1:23 pm - +Thank You Woman: Precisely, hence the motive and the underlying reason is the key.

I am a free thinker while patronise Bugis temple and Singapore Buddhist lodge more often.

I had no fear to speak my mind even in Ho Ching Facebook as my thought was upright that she’s in engineering and not to promote the jab as she is not in medical line.

Then I know why she promote cause Temasek had a share.

24/5/24, 1:28 pm - +Nic Freehold: “One in three middle and high school students in Seoul have thought of suicide because of academic burdens and worries over their futures and careers, according to the National Youth Policy Institute. It’s no wonder South Korea nearly tops the ranks in raising the world’s unhappiest children.”

24/5/24, 1:30 pm - +Nic Freehold: https://www.iras.gov.sg/news-events/newsroom/religious-groups-and-commercial-deals

24/5/24, 1:32 pm - +Nic Freehold: https://www.charities.gov.sg/_layouts/15/CPInternet/SearchOrgProfile.aspx?q=MjQxMjUxNzctN2E2NS1lMzExLThmZGEtMDA1MDU2YjMwNDg1

24/5/24, 1:32 pm - +Nic Freehold: <Media omitted>

24/5/24, 1:33 pm - +Nic Freehold: https://www.asiaone.com/singapore/money-love-gifts-went-secret-account

24/5/24, 1:35 pm - +Nic Freehold: After so many cases, can still be CEO?

24/5/24, 1:36 pm - +Rama: 🤦‍♂️

24/5/24, 1:37 pm - +Frankie Wee: Scam or money for proposal for his wife Ho

24/5/24, 1:37 pm - +Rama: 🤷‍♂️

24/5/24, 1:42 pm - +Frankie Wee: https://www.buddhistchannel.tv/index.php?id=57,8600,0,0,1,0

24/5/24, 1:53 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: <Media omitted>

 

24/5/24, 1:54 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: <Media omitted>

 

24/5/24, 1:56 pm - +Nic Freehold: “regular donations contributed nearly $3 million to the fund from 2006 to 2009.”

This is why scammers target Singaporeans. So easily give money. 

And after legal cases, the wife can still be CEO. She used ““more than $300,000 was spent on travel, more than $100,000 on food and close to $100,000 on hair and make-up.”

24/5/24, 1:57 pm - +Nic Freehold: Dogma must solve social problems

24/5/24, 1:57 pm - +Nic Freehold: <Media omitted>

24/5/24, 1:58 pm - +Nic Freehold: How many buddhists achieve this?

24/5/24, 1:58 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Dogma without real understanding will not solve social problems.

Only practice, and become an inherent way of life will solve social problems.

24/5/24, 1:58 pm - +Nic Freehold: agree 100% w you but how can Buddhism reach the crowds lost to pastor sun?

24/5/24, 1:59 pm - +Nic Freehold: Buddhism Taoism was top religion

24/5/24, 1:59 pm - +Nic Freehold: Market share

24/5/24, 1:59 pm - +Nic Freehold: Mind share

24/5/24, 1:59 pm - +Nic Freehold: Thailand is Buddhist country? We agree? Political & social problems how?

24/5/24, 2:00 pm - +REACH: 📢 *Topic* 📢 

24/5/24, 2:00 pm - +Nic Freehold: I rather 100 DJ monk then 1 pastor sun

24/5/24, 2:00 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Those who achieve this know he/she achieve this.

His Master and Attained Masters know he/she achieved this.

24/5/24, 2:00 pm - +Nic Freehold: have Venerable Abbot?

24/5/24, 2:01 pm - +Nic Freehold: In census I identify as Buddhist and don’t find it offensive

24/5/24, 2:01 pm - +Nic Freehold: Rather I welcome it as reaching youths or else Buddhism  fades away

24/5/24, 2:02 pm - +Nic Freehold: This message was deleted

24/5/24, 2:03 pm - +Nic Freehold: Do we want more old folks or their children hear “if you don’t convert to Christianity, you cannot enter heaven”?

24/5/24, 2:03 pm - +Nic Freehold: the disconnect of religion within families creates friction too

24/5/24, 2:03 pm - +Nic Freehold: have you heard this?

24/5/24, 2:04 pm - +Nic Freehold: evangelicals are increasing their market share

24/5/24, 2:04 pm - +Nic Freehold: Christianity is dominant religion now in public space

24/5/24, 2:04 pm - +Nic Freehold: Christmas is so celebrated

24/5/24, 2:04 pm - +Rama: Rubbish for PM only!

24/5/24, 2:05 pm - +Nic Freehold: recent Vesak do we see malls decorated?

24/5/24, 2:05 pm - +Nic Freehold: Deepavali any malls ?

24/5/24, 2:05 pm - +Nic Freehold: And here we are fighting over a tiny pie

24/5/24, 2:05 pm - +Nic Freehold: Becoming Malaysia?

24/5/24, 2:06 pm - +Rama: Never!

24/5/24, 2:06 pm - +Rama: Agree

24/5/24, 2:06 pm - +Rama: Yes

24/5/24, 2:07 pm - +Nic Freehold: Islam fasting is good for our health. we could be promoting that on minor scale

24/5/24, 2:07 pm - +Nic Freehold: Losing weight and HPB would be happier

24/5/24, 2:07 pm - +Rama: 😁😄😀😃👍👌🙏🤝

24/5/24, 2:08 pm - +Rama: No

24/5/24, 2:08 pm - +Nic Freehold: are we multi religious?

24/5/24, 2:08 pm - +Rama: Little India

24/5/24, 2:08 pm - +Rama: Yes

24/5/24, 2:08 pm - +Rama: Nonsense

24/5/24, 2:09 pm - +Nic Freehold: that’s what their evangelicals used to tell me

24/5/24, 2:09 pm - +Nic Freehold: So offensive! Like they own Heaven

24/5/24, 2:09 pm - +Nic Freehold: Club bouncer is theirs

24/5/24, 2:09 pm - +Rama: Exactly!

24/5/24, 2:18 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Heavens are make up of 3 big planes (and various sub-planes).

Specifically:-

1. Sensual desire heaven (closest to human realms).

2. Form realm heavens.

3. Formless realm heavens.

The heavenly realms are differentiated by their different characteristics and nature plus their respective celestial lifespans.

1. Sensual desire heaven - are heavenly beings that have mainly done good and kindness but have not yet suppress their sensory pleasures - hence sensual desire heavenly realm.

2. Form realm heavens - have suppress their sensory pleasures in conscious form and have done many good and kindness.

3. Formless realm heavens - are the highest heavens - that have suppress the subconscious sensory pleasures and have done many good and kindness.

24/5/24, 2:18 pm - +Nic Freehold: Danny you are not answering what REACH is asking

24/5/24, 2:18 pm - +Nic Freehold: We are a country not a theocracy

24/5/24, 2:19 pm - +Nic Freehold: We are not run by Mullahs

24/5/24, 2:19 pm - +Rama: Thank God!

24/5/24, 2:19 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

This is to answer the question of heaven.

24/5/24, 2:19 pm - +Nic Freehold: Nor Pope or pastor sun

24/5/24, 2:19 pm - +Rama: Yup!

24/5/24, 2:20 pm - +Nic Freehold: how

24/5/24, 2:20 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Because you mention heaven.

24/5/24, 2:27 pm - +Nic Freehold: Finally you directly addressed 1 point. What about the Koreans who lost their youths to suicide. They out clubbing them tot, sigh let’s end it all. 

Then DJ w positive message appears

24/5/24, 2:30 pm - +Nic Freehold: https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/suicides-reported-singapore-476-2022-highest-more-20-years-3597791

24/5/24, 2:35 pm - +A Slice Of Life: I don’t think these youths who go to club really listen to the teachings of Buddhism through this DJ. This DJ is just trying to raise his profile by being different (I would even say obnoxious) and we must not allow him and the pub owners to use Buddhism as a marketing tool  to drive profit. 

Let’s respect the Buddhist federation’s decision.  

Religions (whatever it may be) teaches us to be good. It’s the super fervent amongst the followers that bring bad name to the religion. <This message was edited>

24/5/24, 2:35 pm - +Rama: Agree

24/5/24, 2:36 pm - +Nic Freehold: @ this is more important than some monk

24/5/24, 2:36 pm - +Nic Freehold: @

24/5/24, 2:37 pm - +Nic Freehold: Hahahahahahah

24/5/24, 2:37 pm - +Nic Freehold: Again you not reading

24/5/24, 2:37 pm - +Rama: Definitely!

24/5/24, 2:37 pm - +Nic Freehold: Halloween has been used to sell drinks and more

24/5/24, 2:38 pm - +Nic Freehold: Buddhist federation isn’t Singapore

24/5/24, 2:38 pm - +Nic Freehold: REACH isn’t under it

24/5/24, 2:38 pm - +Rama: Under cover!

24/5/24, 2:39 pm - +Nic Freehold: Everything is relative. As you mentioned it’s the fervent followers who spoil name.

24/5/24, 2:40 pm - +Nic Freehold: Yet has the archbishop condemned and asked for CHC to be changed from church to events company?

24/5/24, 2:40 pm - +Nic Freehold: @ we lost 476 Singaporeans

24/5/24, 2:40 pm - +Nic Freehold: some could be saved

24/5/24, 2:40 pm - +Nic Freehold: Dogma stops us?

24/5/24, 2:42 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

These are different attained level of consciousness regardless of physical form.

24/5/24, 2:46 pm - +Nic Freehold: based on this and all your above we would not have MBS and the side benefits it brought us

24/5/24, 2:47 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

1. Sensual desire heaven - possess human desire but beyond human goodness and kindness.

2. Form realm heavens - Rupa Jhana consciousness with goodness and kindness.

3. Formless realm heavens - Arupa Jhana consciousness with goodness and kindness.

With this consciousness - if still in human form, mental consciousness prevail.

If pass away, he/she will enter the respective realms according to his/her consciousness.

Note :- Nirvana consciousness is none of these realms. <This message was edited>

24/5/24, 2:47 pm - +Rama: Legal gambling is not needed!

24/5/24, 2:47 pm - +Nic Freehold: Also what’s your position on pastor sun?

24/5/24, 2:48 pm - +Nic Freehold: China wine music video much debauchery

24/5/24, 2:49 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Btw who is pastor sun?

24/5/24, 2:49 pm - +A Slice Of Life: I also think she uses religion as a marketing tool and only work to enrich herself.

24/5/24, 2:50 pm - +Rama: City Harvest Church CEO

24/5/24, 2:50 pm - +Nic Freehold: OMG!

24/5/24, 2:50 pm - +A Slice Of Life: Korean Buddhist DJ can post his performance in you tube. Nothing to stop him

24/5/24, 2:51 pm - +Nic Freehold: @Danny I am trying to have a 2 way conversation.

24/5/24, 2:52 pm - +Nic Freehold: Singapore has shown even after financial crimes and some jailed uncovered, the organisation can still operate.

24/5/24, 2:53 pm - +Nic Freehold: She had a saucy music album and songs and lived glamourous life in Beverly Hills

24/5/24, 2:54 pm - +Nic Freehold: She dunno where the money came from?

24/5/24, 2:54 pm - +Rama: Behind the scenes manipulation!?

24/5/24, 2:55 pm - +Rama: 10% tithes from all church members

24/5/24, 2:55 pm - +Nic Freehold: yet 1 DJ  who hasn’t stolen a single cent is to be banned?

24/5/24, 2:57 pm - +Rama: Controversial outfit!

24/5/24, 2:57 pm - +Rama: Very vulgar!

24/5/24, 2:58 pm - +Nic Freehold: Yet she is CEO of a church

24/5/24, 2:58 pm - +Nic Freehold: Not the irony

24/5/24, 2:58 pm - +Nic Freehold: He is visiting foreigner

24/5/24, 2:59 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Regardless of whether a person is a Buddhist, Christian, a free thinker etc - is based on what he or she thinks, speak or do.

What he/she thinks, speak or do will result in karma - good, bad or neutral.

It is the collections of karma, the person resultant consciousness and the volition determine where the person goes - in heaven or lower realm.

24/5/24, 3:00 pm - +Rama: Nonetheless!

24/5/24, 3:00 pm - +Rama: Agree

24/5/24, 3:01 pm - +Rama: Wrong!

24/5/24, 3:01 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

万般带不走，唯有业随身发。

Nothing can be brought along when a person passed away, only karma will follow a person like his/her shadow.

24/5/24, 3:02 pm - +Rama: Only your soul!

24/5/24, 3:02 pm - +Timothy Weer: Perhaps there is a back story as to why the role CEO was chosen. After all, because of the law in SG, religious bodies are simultaneously charities as well as religious institutions

24/5/24, 3:03 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Basically the consciousness.

24/5/24, 3:03 pm - +Timothy Weer: Maybe asking the church why is better than getting upset here about a title and making it seem absurd when there could be reasons?

24/5/24, 3:03 pm - +Rama: Like!?

24/5/24, 3:03 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

In quantum physics, this can be proven in superposition qubits and quantum entanglement.

24/5/24, 3:05 pm - +Timothy Weer: <Media omitted>

24/5/24, 3:07 pm - +Rama: Will beat around the Bush type answer!

24/5/24, 3:07 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Many religions lump the heavens as one heaven.

Buddhism break the heavenly realms into discrete planes and sub-planes according to the various consciousness.

Note :- what I mention here are broad 3 planes.

There are still many sub-planes depending on which consciousness are dominant and sublime.

24/5/24, 3:07 pm - +Timothy Weer: Maybe you should call them to find out instead of guessing what kind of answer they will give you?

24/5/24, 3:21 pm - +Nic Freehold: https://www.charities.gov.sg/_layouts/15/CPInternet/SearchOrgProfile.aspx?q=MjQxMjUxNzctN2E2NS1lMzExLThmZGEtMDA1MDU2YjMwNDg1

24/5/24, 3:22 pm - +Nic Freehold: Same could said w DJ monk

24/5/24, 3:23 pm - +Rama: Not even a one million petition will get her to step down!

24/5/24, 3:24 pm - +Frankie Wee: Website removed

24/5/24, 3:25 pm - +Nic Freehold: It’s there

24/5/24, 3:26 pm - +Nic Freehold: Ho Yeow Sun

24/5/24, 3:26 pm - +Timothy Weer: I'm sure the Buddhist Federation has already articulated their concerns. As a singaporean who respects all religious authorities to represent their group responsibily, it's entirely their right to say what they find offensive.

Maybe if you feel strongly about it, you should let the Buddhist federation know about your feedback.

24/5/24, 3:27 pm - +Frankie Wee: Yeah just refresh website again appear

24/5/24, 3:28 pm - +~l or Smiley face: Mocking the Monks?

In whatsoever expressions or styles...

The DJ monk controversy offers a thought provoking example of the tensions that arise when tradition and modernity intersect. The criticism aimed at the Buddhist monk, who combined traditional attire with DJing activities, underscores the need for thoughtful dialogue and understanding in navigating the complexities of cultural (cyber) revolution. By approaching these issues with sensitivity, nuance, and cultural intelligence, we can weave a rich tapestry of creativity, innovation, and heritage, where diverse elements harmoniously coexist and enrich our collective human experience.

24/5/24, 3:33 pm - +~l or Smiley face: This message was deleted

24/5/24, 3:33 pm - +~l or Smiley face: "Art is the mirror of society, and society is the mirror of art. Let's create a reflection that is respectful, inclusive, and empowering for all." Are we conservative at heart and mind and behaving likely as liberals?"

-- anonymity

24/5/24, 3:37 pm - +Frankie Wee: I just to want dance an exercise when mind and body are positive than sit when worship.

24/5/24, 3:38 pm - +Frankie Wee: Mind can feeling expression

24/5/24, 3:47 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Nirvana realm is:-

1. No mundane stray thoughts arising. (Desire plane heaven) (欲界天)

2. No suppression of consciousness - Rupa Jhana. (Form plane heaven) (色界天)

3. No suppression of sublime subconsciousness - Arupa Jhana. (Formless plane heaven 出色界天)

不起心动念。

(No stray thoughts arising)

一心不乱， 如如不动。

(Serenity, Silencing of Consciousness) - Eternal Bliss.

Since no stray thoughts - no Karma.

Hence Nirvana has no celestial lifespans.

An Eternal Realm - of No Birth, No Death, No Sufferings - Eternal Bliss. <This message was edited>

24/5/24, 3:48 pm - +Rama: Zumba!?

24/5/24, 3:52 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

All lives are about "Consciousness".

And quantum physics - specifically qubits, superposition, quantum entanglement, spooky action in a distance, etc

Increasingly can prove the existence of multiverse, parallel universe - the entanglement of birth, living, aged and death coexistence simultaneously in different realms.

All these are consciousness in metaphysics.

And in quantum physics - they are represented by atomic, subatomic, photons etc.

24/5/24, 4:00 pm - +REACH: 📢 *Topic* 📢 

24/5/24, 4:06 pm - +SL: Is Club Rich deposited a reasonable amount of sum with authority to guarantee there is no violation? In case there are many follow-up lawsuits?

24/5/24, 4:08 pm - +~X-tra: A little off topic here but what a conclusion to this case 🤔

https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/lee-hsien-yang-defamation-ridout-road-200000-damages-each-shanmugam-vivian-balakrishnan-4360466

24/5/24, 4:08 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Where Universe is chaos, subject to change, birth, living, aged and demise, rebirth - where change is constant, where Universal Law of Impermanence prevails.

Have lifespan.

Its opposing realm is Nirvana - Bliss, Eternal, Permanence is Constant, no birth, no death, no sufferings. No lifespan. <This message was edited>

24/5/24, 4:09 pm - +Rama: SM LHL should make peace with his siblings now that he is no longer PM!

24/5/24, 4:11 pm - +~l or Smiley face: "As we stand at the global crossroads, the trajectory of our future hangs in the balance. The world is grappling with unprecedented challenges, from economic uncertainty to geopolitical tensions, social inequality, and environmental degradation. Amidst this turmoil, hopes and fears collide, fueling a sense of uncertainty that permeates every aspect of our lives. As Jacques Chirac aptly put it, "The world is at a crossroads, and the choice is ours." Isn't it profoundly true?"

-- anonymity

24/5/24, 4:12 pm - +~l or Smiley face: Art has long been a reflection of society, capturing the essence of our human experience through various mediums. In Singapore, our artistic expression has evolved over time, shaped by our cultural, social, and political context. From traditional lion dances to contemporary street art, our multicultural heritage is a kaleidoscope of diverse traditions and innovations. We see this in the works of our master painters like Liu Kang and Georgette Chen, who captured the essence of our multicultural heritage through their bold brushstrokes, and in the contemporary artists like Ho Tzu Nyen and Amanda Heng, who are pushing the boundaries of artistic expression, exploring new mediums and themes that reflect our rapidly changing world.

24/5/24, 4:18 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Heart ❤️ 

is the Unifying Force of all Religions.

Every Religions will use (Heart), as expressions of Compassion to all Beings.

24/5/24, 4:24 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: <Media omitted>

 

24/5/24, 4:43 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Some are due to mental illness - eg. Depression.

This will need psychiatrist treatment of mental health, plus medication.

Together with meditation to strengthen their mental strength - specifically Right Concentration and Right Mindfulness - will help to cure or manage depression.

24/5/24, 4:45 pm - +Rama: I know of one case personally at the moment! Very Sad but the person is still alive suffering!🤦‍♂️😔😢

24/5/24, 4:45 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Note:- fully depending on mental practice through Mental strength may not always succeed - because there could be chemical imbalance in the brain.

Hence psychiatrist treatment is needed.

24/5/24, 4:46 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Better send the person to psychiatrist for treatment.

It can be treated and get well.

24/5/24, 4:46 pm - +Nic Freehold: Robin Williams suffered but no one would know because it doesn’t show

24/5/24, 4:47 pm - +Rama: Was in IMH for two months recently but on long term medication prior to the extend ended up in SGH in time due to water in the brain!

24/5/24, 4:48 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Someone close to him can tell.

Because he will feel sad all the time, display negativity, sometimes talk about suicide, crying for no reasons etc

24/5/24, 4:48 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Yes.

Get medical treatment for serious case.

24/5/24, 4:50 pm - +Rama: Female Chinese in her early forties, married with no kids.  Husband couldn't take it and is now also on long term medication!

24/5/24, 4:51 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Hmm..

They will need medical help.

Plus professional support.

The illness can be managed.

Most important develop positivity, and mental strength.

Meditation can help build up the mental strength.

24/5/24, 4:52 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Also if have religious faith - will also help them to build positivity.

24/5/24, 4:56 pm - +Frankie Wee: Mental health and depression

24/5/24, 4:57 pm - +Rama: I sincerely hope so. Her only consolation is her elder sister and husband who is my brother in law who visit her in IMH/SGH. Brought up my grandmother so no bond with mother. She asked her mother to look after her but her 74 year old mother said how! Told elder sister she never wants to see her mother again! Elder brother late fortiesand spouse early retired millionaire but not pro active towards suffering younger sister!? Younger brother and spouse in UK.

24/5/24, 4:58 pm - +Frankie Wee: https://www.healthhub.sg/live-healthy/helping-youth-fight-depression

24/5/24, 4:58 pm - +Frankie Wee: Hope it’s helpful won’t be alone.

24/5/24, 5:00 pm - +Frankie Wee: Adult sometime work very challenging with colleagues foreigners when he become depression and anxiety

24/5/24, 5:01 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Family support important for the patients to recover.

Love will help them to recover faster.

Always encourage to look at bright sides of things and not dwell into negativity or hopelessness.

Also don't attach, cling or crave on things that a person cannot possess.

Learn to let go and be happy.

Only a person can make himself or herself happy - by not feeling sad or hopeless.

There is always a way out of hopelessness.

24/5/24, 5:01 pm - +Rama: Cyber bullying another suicide avenue!

24/5/24, 5:01 pm - +Frankie Wee: True

24/5/24, 5:02 pm - +Frankie Wee: Why not stay thinking positive live well and think of family rather than job opportunities.

24/5/24, 5:03 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Cyberspace is just a space - if feel bully, can ignore the bullies or don't read what they say.

24/5/24, 5:04 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Can look at to e2i for help to find jobs.

No need to get despair.

There will always be a way out.

24/5/24, 5:04 pm - +Frankie Wee: Not easy when person feeling sensitive and harmful himself

24/5/24, 5:04 pm - +Frankie Wee: Avoid trouble or gossip bad things happened

24/5/24, 5:05 pm - +Rama: Not necessarily possible.  Just like driving,  how careful you are,  someone will hit you!

24/5/24, 5:05 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

That's why mental strength and mental resiliency very important.

Mental strength can be trained.

Meditation is the best practice to attain mental strength and develop positivity.

24/5/24, 5:06 pm - +Frankie Wee: Myself fact foreigner think is too highly political indeed than local when asked more pay salary.

24/5/24, 5:07 pm - +Frankie Wee: I had stay positive that’s right ignore and focus on it.

24/5/24, 5:17 pm - +A Slice Of Life: Anyone know of a good meditation centre that is not religion based?

24/5/24, 5:21 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Meditation 2 important elements is to develop:-

1. Concentration - very focus mind.

2. Mindfulness - that is able to be mindful of every thought, speech and actions (and even body sensation).

As long as these 2 attributes are trained on, enormous transformation can happen to a person.

It is not related to religion - but a practice.

But there are 2 names attached to these 2 types of meditation.

1. Anapanasati meditation (concentration meditation) - breath meditation.

2. Vipassana meditation - mindfulness meditation.

24/5/24, 5:22 pm - +~ S.: Sorry to tell you but I did my research and up to 50% of the suicides are due to medication. From 2000-04, 51% saw a doc before they died and were prescribed psychiatric medication. <This message was edited>

24/5/24, 5:22 pm - +Rama: Both sounds religious based!?

24/5/24, 5:23 pm - +Rama: Might happen to the  case close to me!

24/5/24, 5:23 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

It is :-

1. Meditation on the in and out of the breath.

2. Mindfulness meditation of the thoughts and body sensation.

Not related to religion.

But a practice.

24/5/24, 5:24 pm - +Rama: Seems related to Hinduism!?

24/5/24, 5:27 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Hmm...

Hinduism, Taoism and Buddhism practice this.

I think alot of the western countries also now practice this.

I think Ng Kok song, a Catholic also practice this.

Both SM LeeHL, Khaw Boon Wan also practice this.

Khaw Boon Wan recommend LKY to practice these 2 meditation to Ng Kok Song and a Catholic archbishop using the same techniques.

24/5/24, 5:28 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

US, UK, Australia, Canada and many EU countries conducting such meditation courses worldwide.

24/5/24, 5:28 pm - +Rama: Being a Roman Catholic,  even Christian Meditation is doubtful!

24/5/24, 5:37 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: <Media omitted>

24/5/24, 5:37 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: <Media omitted>

24/5/24, 5:38 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Even SkillFuture also sponsor mindfulness course.

Can Google search.

Not related to religion.

It is a practice.

24/5/24, 5:39 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Worldwide, many meditation centres teach mindfulness meditation.

24/5/24, 5:50 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

As a beginner, try not to go online meditation.

Go for a teacher.

Because you will encounter some obstacles along the way.

A teacher will be able to guide you and correct your mistake.

However, you need alot of patience and discipline to master the meditation.

24/5/24, 5:51 pm - +Rama: Does wsq have courses that help with anger management issues which I think is a contributing factor?

24/5/24, 5:52 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Hahaha..

I guess if you search the website, it will have.

But right mental techniques is paramount to anger management.

24/5/24, 5:56 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Mindfulness is the best mental techniques that manage anger management.

Because if anger thought are mindful, how will anger manifest?

It will dissipate and anger is gone.

Likewise, breath management - is also a technique to dissipate anger.

24/5/24, 6:47 pm - +REACH: *Dear Contributors,*

⏰ We will be closing the chat in *15 minutes* ⏰

Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.

Goodnight!

Megan 😊

24/5/24, 6:48 pm - +Rama: Course title?

24/5/24, 6:49 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Mindfulness meditation.

24/5/24, 6:49 pm - +Rama: Thanks.

24/5/24, 6:50 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

The actual name is Vipassana meditation or Insight Meditation.

24/5/24, 6:50 pm - +Rama: Just a query, would anger management courses help mitigate certain road rage offences?

24/5/24, 6:50 pm - +Rama: 🙏👌👍🤝

24/5/24, 6:50 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Anger is the manifestation of the mind.

If mindful of anger, anger will dissipate.

24/5/24, 6:51 pm - +Rama: I have been asking government this through reach email for some time now to see if it can be part of sentencing option for the courts!?

24/5/24, 6:56 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Anger management is a lifelong training.

It needs mindfulness every thought, every moment.

Hence develop good patience and tolerance.

24/5/24, 6:57 pm - +~l or Smiley face: https://www.tiktok.com/@mothershipsg/video/7372120910708444417

24/5/24, 6:58 pm - +Rama: This message was deleted

24/5/24, 6:58 pm - +Rama: Applicable in certain countries!?

24/5/24, 6:58 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Applicable to every human beings.

24/5/24, 6:59 pm - +~l or Smiley face: This message was deleted

24/5/24, 6:59 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

If human beings are a master of their mind, there will be no conflict, no war.

World will be at peace.

24/5/24, 7:01 pm - +~l or Smiley face: <Media omitted>

24/5/24, 7:01 pm - +REACH: *Dear Contributors,*

We will be closing the chat for today.

Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.

Goodnight!

Megan 😊

24/5/24, 7:03 pm - ~ REACH Singapore changed this group's settings to allow only admins to send messages to this group

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