REACH 439 - What are your views on the impending enactment of Workplace Fairness Legislation (WFL)? What more can be done to protect workers against discrimination and uphold fairness at workplaces, while preserving workplace harmony?
(SK)
27 Mar 2023 (10am - 7pm)
REACH
[9:45 am, 27/03/2023] +REACH: Dear Contributors,
Welcome back! π
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Megan π
[9:59 am, 27/03/2023] +REACH: π’ Topic π’
On 23 Mar 2023, more than 200 employers, HR professionals and workers participated in a dialogue on Workplace Fairness. This dialogue is part of ongoing engagements by the Tripartite Committee on Workplace Fairness, which released an interim report on 13 Feb 2023, containing 20 recommendations for the proposed Bill to protect workers against biases on nationality, age and others, as well as new penalties on errant employers. A range of issues such as special arrangements, outsourcing, misunderstanding on discrimination and how to avoid them were discussed at the dialogue.
π¬ *What are your views on the impending enactment of Workplace Fairness Legislation (WFL)? What more can be done to protect workers against discrimination and uphold fairness at workplaces, while preserving workplace harmony? *
In the opening remarks, Senior Minister of State for Manpower, Zaqy Mohamad, mentioned the workplace fairness law will provide clearer rules, in addition to allowing more proportionate action to be taken against errant firms.
The summary of recommendations by the Tripartite Committee on Workplace Fairness include:
π Strengthen protections against workplace discrimination (E.g. Recommendation 1: Prohibit workplace discrimination in respect of the following characteristics: (i) age, (ii) nationality, (iii) sex, marital status, pregnancy status, caregiving responsibilities, (iv) race, religion, language, (v) disability and mental health conditions.)
*π Provisions to support business/organisational needs and national objectives *(E.g. Recommendation 11: Allow employers to favour persons with disabilities and seniors (55 years and above) over other groups in hiring decisions, even if another candidate may be equally or more qualified.)
π Processes for resolving grievances and disputes while preserving workplace harmony (E.g. Recommendation 12: Require employers to put in place grievance handling processes. Employers should also protect the confidentiality of the identity of persons who report workplace discrimination and harassment, where possible.)
π Ensuring fair outcomes through redress for victims of workplace discrimination and more appropriate penalties for breaches (E.g. Recommendation 16: Encourage parties to explore non-monetary remedies, such as reinstatement of an employment offer or providing an apology letter, where practicable.)
If accepted by the Government, the new law will be introduced on top of current guidelines against discrimination by the Tripartite Alliance for Fair & Progressive Employment Practices (TAFEP). The Committee’s final report is expected to be ready later this year.
π Special arrangements, outsourcing among issues raised at dialogue on proposed workplace fairness law
https://str.sg/iZAQ
π Work ‘still ongoing’ on how to define workplace discrimination in upcoming law: Zaqy
https://bt.sg/5z96
You may read up on the full Summary of Recommendations and the Interim Report:
π https://www.mom.gov.sg/newsroom/press-releases/2023/0213-tripartite-committee-releases-interim-report-on-recommendations-for-wfl
π go.gov.sg/wfl
-----
[10:09 am, 27/03/2023] +Umar M: A LOT more work is needed to recognise that workplace discrimination exists and is actually very rampant in many different sectors and industries.
[10:20 am, 27/03/2023] +TD: Chennai Business Park during lunch says someone at MOM is sleeping while approving employment permits.
[10:21 am, 27/03/2023] +Grace: How does one legislate graciousness?
Won't it make us more litigious?
I am a young mom and I have bosses tell me just put my child in infant care and come back to work ASAP n roll eyes when I need to take childcare leave.
Legislation doesn't help. They are stressed too. We just need less work, more life. Hard to achieve.
[10:34 am, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Agree
[10:37 am, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: The 5 Concerns?
Conflicts
Conversations
Considerations
Consensus
Coexisting
- - anonymity
[10:39 am, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Hi Grace, good morning! An excellent point that is GRACIOUSNESS!
This good virtue of graciousness must be taught starting from a young age...the sooner the better!
Thank you.
[10:41 am, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Hi Umar, good point!
Discrimination based on age and race, these two are commonalities of D!
Thank you
[10:42 am, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Hi TD, good morning!
Attitude towards work and at the workplace matters because of pride or more issues?
Thank you.
[10:43 am, 27/03/2023] +TD: If you have worked with them, you dont need to ask. If you didn't, then no amount of explaining will make you understand
[10:44 am, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: What is managing?
Many people including experts think that the essence of management is a combination of the arts and the sciences?
- - in progress - -
[10:46 am, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: "One rule of calibration is to objectively be a target of achievement. Collaboration is another subject that needs people's efforts in achieving a good outcome. How to calibrate using human as the 'object' to reach a higher order of tangibles? Is human a 'subject'? If so, what other innovative methods will do the job better?"
- - anonymity
[11:04 am, 27/03/2023] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
Workplace discrimination could be in the form of :-
1. Age - above 50 years old is a problem.
2. Women with pregnancy or child bearing.
3. Disabilities
4. Races
I think for organisations that have less discrimination based on my observation in workplace are :-
1. Government
2. GLCs
3. MNCs
How to safeguard against workplace discrimination?
1. Legislation is one way.
2. Bosses hiring staff must focus on competencies, chemistry - and must be able to look beyond the above discrimnatory factors.
It is all about human ethics - difficult to legislate.
[11:08 am, 27/03/2023] +TD: I have personal experience that would argue against GLC being nondiscriminatory.
They just hide it better. Worked for nearly a decade at one of the largest GLC/TLC.
[11:12 am, 27/03/2023] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
I used to work in a GLC at a later part of my career whereby I see staff of different races, pregnant women, mature workers.
Though I didn't see any disabilities.
[11:15 am, 27/03/2023] +TD: I saw deliberate targeting of senior Mature workers for retrenchment.
[11:16 am, 27/03/2023] +TD: I saw department heads prioritising promotion and hiring of their own nationalities
[11:17 am, 27/03/2023] +TD: No comment on disabled. From what I can see, maternity/Paternity benefits were taken care of.
[11:24 am, 27/03/2023] +Rama: I am not sure glc/mnc/government is discrimination free!
[11:24 am, 27/03/2023] +Rama: There is
[11:25 am, 27/03/2023] +TD: My previous workplace was shitty, and I will give them a lot of shite about a lot of things, but Paternity/Maternity wise it was okay, I feel.
Have to be fair.
[11:26 am, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Still long way to go
[11:39 am, 27/03/2023] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
I don't think is discrimination free.
But compare to outside - it is better.
But however targeting mature workers for retrenchment - I think they do try to reduce their salary.
If refuse, mature workers leave.
[11:40 am, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Agree on targeting older people for retrenchment by reducing salary
[11:42 am, 27/03/2023] +TD: I saw salary reduction, old senior managers being forced out and sidelined.
These were lifers with decades of experience and irreplaceable knowledge. Really didn't like the way they were treated.
[11:43 am, 27/03/2023] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
This is a common observation.
[11:43 am, 27/03/2023] +TD: agree on the better than outside though.
[11:43 am, 27/03/2023] +Rama: No respect for loyalty!
[11:45 am, 27/03/2023] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
Nowadays, seems like respect for loyalty is not the norm.
But for older firms - boss treat their loyal staff very well until they retire.
[11:47 am, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Government, GLC can no longer set the example!?
[11:47 am, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: 27 March, 2023
To: Our Distinguished Leaders, Human Capital Experts and All Honorable Members
In Search of the "fittings" just to survive through for as long as possible...?"
- - anonymity
Employable and Dispensable?
6 billions people are educated...Moving the barometer of unemployability to 45 years old and onwards will be the callings of the coming digitisations, streamlinings and orientations of the work process and at the workplace!
How organisations and managements reacting to these changing paradigms that is shifting the ways private or public businesses are dealing with it, one thing is mobility of people and the next is competencies of each worker from the bottoms up to the top. Either you contribute alot or you are out of it!
"The needs…
[11:47 am, 27/03/2023] +TD: didnt see it at the GLC I worked for. And it's one of the oldest firms in Singapore
[11:47 am, 27/03/2023] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
Not sure about government.
But GLC increasingly like that.
[11:48 am, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Statutory boards!?
[11:48 am, 27/03/2023] ☸️ Danny εΏ: Not sure.
[11:48 am, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Civil service!?
[11:49 am, 27/03/2023] ☸️ Danny εΏ: Probably better.
[11:49 am, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Hi Andrew, good morning!
Both private and public must come together to address these malpractices at the workplace!
Thank you
[11:51 am, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Negative hr practices must be corrected without fear but fairness!
[11:51 am, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: "talking happens to be the cheapest trades... and concrete actions and commitments are the true hero of the win win outcomes...!"
- - anonymity
[11:52 am, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Yes
[11:52 am, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Thank you!
[11:55 am, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Next ..what will you do if your workers are SLACKING and how will you act on it to turn things around or Simply sack these slackers at work?
Is it a science or is it an art in dealing with people aka human and their brains?
What are the conditions and motivations to act upon, the tools?
Do the HR or human capital experts know exactly what to do or the old ways of hiring and firing?
Thank you.
[11:56 am, 27/03/2023] +Rama: No, they don't!
[11:59 am, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: As a civic Society, we protect the innocent and the ignorant, from the young ones and the elderly...
Isn't it true, such a simple philosophy to comprehend yet Human chooses to do things otherwise to their benefits with no consciousness or wrongs?
Just to make more money and the pursuit of success!
What is compassionate meritocracy? Is it achievable or just a talking point?
Thank you.
[0:00 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Make money and the pursuit of success comes first! Compassion meritocracy is a myth!
[0:04 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: That's pragmatism!
True but avoidable!
Who is gonna take the leadership role, the ownership and champion the true course of these dysfunctional social behaviors, aka Kiasu and Kiaboh? How about boh kiasi?
Thank you, Andrew!
Thank you.
[0:06 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Probably those sit down, shake their legs and collect a fat pay check!?
[0:07 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: There will always be Free Riders around everywhere!
Thank you.
[0:11 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Saving the workers?
1st happiness, is to reskill and retool
2nd happiness, is to land a matched job
3rd happiness, is this new role sustainable or it starts all over again.
[0:11 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Good point
[0:21 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Thank you.
[0:24 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Human (workers) as the subject and Job (objects).
How can we craft a role and design a job out of existing and future needs, with it a growth needs or the unstoppable automations (AI) at the work floor?
One thing, you need human and bot, both at work!
Thank you
[0:25 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Big adjustment coming and needed with AI/Robotics and Drones against jobs human will do in time to come!
[0:26 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: "Till that day arrives,... crafted robots are able to smile or cry indifferently and perfectly like humans laughing or crying, that's the day, true and perpetual Intelligence!'
- - anonymity
[0:27 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Cultures, values, language are three keys that AI may not necessarily have the advantage over human abilities and knowledge. How can the craft hood (craftiness) of AI learning cultures and values across the continent and what about the loss in translation of language from any native language other than English, reference to the US or China? Cultures, values and languages have embedded history of the human emotions in it that AI may not fully comprehend and able to put it into perspectives when analyzing a situation or a set of requirements to a finite answer....
[0:28 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Second longer essay....
Perfection or Excellence?
There is no perfect knowledge from looking at one another of history, of social economics, of empathy, of feelings, of interests, of experiences. These are subjectivities that humans do better than artificial and augmented Intelligence. It is not an easy task for AI to calibrate accurately and derive an exceptional or a perfect ly correct answer! Will machine languages synthesize with humanity into a live language of translations and transforming itself into a robust platform of "no second guessing" and searching for answers?
[0:28 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Lagi longer essay...
Pit and Pitch?
AI is an objection (pit).
Recall, memory, repetitive, pattern recognition
Humans are subjective (pitch).
Compassion, creativity, context, reasoning, diversity of experiences/behaviours/team consist of left, centre and right.
Integration?
How does it matter to policymakers, together, AI and human cognitive abilities to recommend sound solutions especially in the area of sensitivity information from economics, sociald to politics or intelligence and of national and international interest?
[0:29 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Finally, finished....
Governance and Adaptability?
Will AI eventually replacing human for most of the tasks that once upon a time were humanly done?
How can we use AI together with Human touch to accelerate more objective and affirmative outcomes?
How can we teach AI to quantify feelings, moods, anger, ego, emotion Intelligence and not be presumptuous whether it is an entity or your enemy? Objective and subject, a clouding effect, there is a longer journey ahead to bridge these big gaps of human knowledge, machine learning and synthesize into one big thinking tank in which AI will be able to in a second guess all human behaviors and emotions to a perfect answer!
Meantime, don't trust that intelligent botchat that may not give you the full picture of the…
[0:30 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: - - anonymity
[0:30 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Agree
[0:32 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Thank you.
Hope that all of us including all experts and Policymakers will READ the above and use them to solve and resolve the COMING corrections of the human RACE!
Thank you,
Anonymity
[0:33 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: "Building that Exceptional Team!"
Genesis:
"Start by imagining or reimagining before you begins your mission, your previous failures and successes, your rules of engagement and lastly, what are your goals and that exceptional team you aspires"
- - anonymity
[0:34 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: If only those senior amongst us can see the results after we are s8x foot under!
[0:34 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Six
[0:35 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Just wait till 2030 arrives, that's 6 years away!
Thank you.
[0:36 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: πππππ€
[0:40 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: 27 March, 2023
"Shake up or Shape up?"
"Managing, this word is powerful, beautiful and glorious because it is like the invincible way of dealings with everything under the sun ..?"
- - anonymity
What is managing?
Many people including experts think that the essence of management is a combination of the arts and the sciences?
It is a common annual practice of "letting go" up to 5% of a multinational organisation's workforce, bottoms up!
So what is discrimination or favoritism?
It is a preference towards a person whether is based on race, age or skills or a combinations of more preexisting mindset of a manager and his/her peers and colleagues. It is human nature to prefer and/or compare tangibles to intangibles, it's true, it is innate in all human b…
[1:12 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: "A good government is expected not only to carry on and maintain standards, it is expected to raise them."
MM Lee Kuan Yew
"I'm very determined. If I decide that something is worth doing, then I'll put my heart and soul to it"
MM Lee Kuan Yew
[1:12 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: We need duplicate LKY!
[1:13 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Thank you.
A tribute and a gentle reminder of this exceptional man! Lee Kuan Yew, Sir!
Thank you.
[1:14 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: A moment of silence, thank you.
[1:14 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: ππ
[1:17 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: "Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed. This world in arms is not spending money alone. It is spending the sweat of its laborers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children. This is not a way of life at all in any true sense. Under the clouds of war, it is humanity hanging on a cross of iron."
- - President Dwight D. Eisenhower, Washington 16 April, 1953
[1:18 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Sad but true!
[1:22 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Is true....!
"The future is what we make of it. We owe it to ourselves to give of our best to build the foundations of a harmonious and integrated nation, peaceful, prosperous and vigilant, a haven of tolerance, harmony and progress in the stormy seas of Southeast Asia."
MM Lee Kuan Yew
[1:57 pm, 27/03/2023] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
Ideally, workers could work and then retire from official retirement age.
And then younger staff move upwards to replace the retired staff.
This will make working staff happy and feel organisation take care of them - and make staff feel secure in their jobs.
But increasingly, this is no longer the case.
Come 50 years old, mature staff are make to reduce their salary.
If refused, will be force to move out.
This is now a common trend.
[2:02 pm, 27/03/2023] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
Hence, working staff is better to save more and invest prudently and wisely in safe passive financial instruments such as insurance or other long term financial apparatus such as SSB, etc to grow their income to prepare for such eventuality.
Refrain from investing in high risk higher return investment - it is possible to even lose the capital.
Don't think high income, one can afford to spend lavishly such as going for tours, spend in lavish lifestyle such as buying expensive cars, dine in high class restaurant, splurge in luxurious goods thinking that job security is always there.
Job security is not guarantee and always wise to save for rainy day.
[2:03 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Agree
[2:04 pm, 27/03/2023] +REACH: π’ Topic π’
On 23 Mar 2023, more than 200 employers, HR professionals and workers participated in a dialogue on Workplace Fairness. This dialogue is part of ongoing engagements by the Tripartite Committee on Workplace Fairness, which released an interim report on 13 Feb 2023, containing 20 recommendations for the proposed Bill to protect workers against biases on nationality, age and others, as well as new penalties on errant employers. A range of issues such as special arrangements, outsourcing, misunderstanding on discrimination and how to avoid them were discussed at the dialogue.
π¬ *What are your views on the impending enactment of Workplace Fairness Legislation (WFL)? What more can be done to protect workers against discrimination and uphold fairne…
[2:09 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Frankly is NTUC useful ? I saw a lot of unfairness but ntuc was around for so long have it done it work ?
[2:09 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: I don't see any tangible positive results!
[2:10 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Ntuc really only good in gocery price control but as a union is not good.
[2:10 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Totally agree!
[2:10 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Maybe can tell me why there is a influx of foreigner in last 18 years and our birth still decrease ?
[2:11 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Than I think I can tell u my thoughts
[2:11 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Is there a real transfer of skill ?
[2:11 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Or just pull a wool over ppl ?
[2:12 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: NTUC is only good for pushing to ban plastic bags and nothing else.
And even plastic bags they got the wrong idea.
[2:12 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Thanks for adding point Back to topic lah if not they say I anyhow say lol . Uncle never study much :)
[2:13 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Definitely this only!
[2:18 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Hi KL, good afternoon!
The Lewis Turning point (LTP), an economics concept of replacements of labor or can be birth rates, just for discussion....
This LTP is especially applicable to the Chinese population starting from the 1950s and into 2016.
It showed the turning point in 2016 and China's population growth is on the downward trajectory!
Simply, no more cheap labor and no more cheaper goods, going forward!
Thank you.
[2:19 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Can u tell me the 300,000 daily cross into sg are not cheap labour ?
[2:20 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: That close to 10% of local population
[2:22 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Cheap labor means the average wage is in the last 25th percentile of a developing country...
China cost per daily labor was US$1 (prior to it's entering into the WTO) and today is in the multiples of tens, if not in hundred...
SG is a developed economy, cheap labor becoming blurry and Harder to determine...
Thank you.
[2:23 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: So I guess mean u also can’t tell
[2:23 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Btw we talking about local not sure why u keep pulling in China ?
[2:27 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: More than…
But factory bring in more Myanmar now
[2:28 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: They are even cheaper π₯
[2:28 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Wah. More cheaper
[2:28 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Thanks Ken if u don’t say we still in the dark
[2:28 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Err everywhere in the world is the same
[2:29 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Let's discuss SG...
To begin with, let's set the shape of things. That's the entire working population is a pyramid, the apex is the highest or among the higher income earners.
Second, the bottom is the baseline, aka the 10% of discussion and concern...
So through wage supplement and or skills upgrading, hopefully, this baseline will shrink and the bulk of it will be uplifted into the mid drift or towards the middle range of income earners.
How can we uplift our bottom 10% at the same momentum not infringing into competitiveness?
Let's have a healthy and heart to heart discussion.
Thank you.
[2:29 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: The issue of cheaper will shift possibly every decade to a different country.
[2:29 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Even in Japan they use china labour
[2:30 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Cheap labour is required in any country… very unlikely to have full local not possible…
There is always someone at the lower value chain
[2:30 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Ntuc is no more people supermarket
It is a business profit organization only
[2:30 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Cost centers or profit centres or both?
[2:31 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Even insurance seller I saw non local
[2:31 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Omg
[2:31 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: π³π π€¨π€¦♂️π
[2:32 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: If money is good… and they might not be foreigner… could be naturalised
[2:32 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Too bad
[2:32 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: The one pull people usually is non local.. lol face thicker π€£
[2:33 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: Even this reach WhatsApp group has foreigner issues also. I have a question. Why are PRs and foreigners invited to a group that are feeding back to Singaporean government policy?
Shouldn't this group be Singaporeans onlym
[2:34 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Oh there is in the group? π€£
[2:34 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: I thought all Sgp here π
[2:35 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: Got PR and Foreigner
[2:36 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Exactly!?
[2:36 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Lol… then they see true singaporean feedback π
[2:36 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Barriers to Entry?
An economics term...
Trades and professions have their barrier to enter through certification.
So long as a candidate suffices these governing boards, entry is gained!
How to lift the barrier higher and give easier access to our locals?
Thank you.
[2:36 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: Actually, I have always wondered why we need so much labour for an industry like construction.
[2:36 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: If u look at construction in places like Germany and japan
[2:36 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Haha cause local no one want to do
[2:37 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: They use automation and much les works
[2:37 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: Workers
[2:37 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Low paid and long hours
[2:37 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: In hope that they too will voice their concerns or valid/good pointers...
Thank you
[2:37 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Not everything can automate
[2:37 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Then your cost of HDB won’t be so cheap Liao
[2:37 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: I can answer this.
1) Little locals with the skills set and willingness.
2) can't replace everything with machinery. Still a lot of manual work required
[2:37 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Ntuc FairPrice groceries are not broadly compatible with other supermarkets!
[2:37 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: Have we have one bangla just to wave a flag to control traffic
[2:37 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: One lay pipe, one dig, 5 to eye power
[2:37 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: This one blame MOM. Their regulation
[2:38 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: They will side step the issue!
[2:38 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Ntuc buy most of their groceries prices are more expensive than other supermarkets
[2:38 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: Have a look at house construction in Germany and japan. Granted not exactly HDB but it's shocking to see how little labour their use
[2:38 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Which type of jobs will locals be more willing to do?
[2:38 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Local have the skill but don’t pay high enough and super long hours
[2:38 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: One Bangalah to Wave flag to direct traffic, One to wave flag to direct the machine, One to supervise the lifting, one to clear the path under the lfting.
[2:38 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: Willing or not all depends on the wage
[2:38 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: Livable wage?
[2:38 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: I have buddy that work there… 5am work till 6 pm lol
[2:38 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: 3 to 4K only
[2:38 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: And 6 days work week
[2:38 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: Erm. Not true. I'm from the industry. Its about the same
[2:39 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: What is the minimum livable wage? For the individual or sole breadwinner of a household?
Thank you
[2:39 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Rebates too low!
[2:39 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: Slightly less due to better machines, but not a lot less. Letsay we use 100 Bangalah. The Japs will use 80.
[2:39 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Err you should see how many foreign labour they have lol… china that can speak Japanese
[2:39 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: ππ
[2:40 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Or those homeless guy
[2:40 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: I go to big factories in Japan top MNC… trust me they are from china the hard labourers π
[2:40 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Frankly labour intensive ( construction etc ) okay but not even ops or insurance etc . Ai ya say do much nothing done for past 18 years
[2:41 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Waste Singaporean time
[2:41 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Construction not attractive for singaporean that’s for sure.. on-site operation is tough..
[2:42 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Certain jobs or industry must be protected or more exclusively to locals?
Is that so?
[2:42 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Hi Ken, you got it!
Thanks for bringing up!
[2:42 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Yes… example oil and gas, Pharma production mainly singaporean
[2:42 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: With PWM, who knows!?
[2:43 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: π³ππππ
[2:43 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: This one MOM requirement hor =P
[2:43 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Sub contractor mainly foreignerπ€£
[2:43 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Higher value jobs.
Thanks again, you got it!
So where are the cheap jobs aka cheaper laborous jobs?
Thank you, Ken!
[2:43 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: O&G/Shipyards definitely local minority
[2:43 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: No skill or low skill lor…
[2:44 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Plug and play kind of job
[2:44 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: This is an area of concern for all of us...
How to uplift our locals?
Thank you
[2:44 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Logistic, gardening, construction just some
[2:45 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Automation how successful lol.. you go ask those in PSA lor.. π
[2:45 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Will these jobs DIE OFF over time and in come foreigners to these jobs?
[2:46 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Can we agree that...
Our locals tend to prefer higher wage jobs and jobs that have potential for future promotions, relevant and job security?
Thank you.
[2:48 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: The G keeps spouting this uplift local line.
I'd rather they protect our jobs more instead of asking us to do the fighting all the time.
Shouldnt the government look after it's citizens jobs instead of pushing us to fight and upgrade constantly?
I mean not that upgrading is not important, but the messaging is getting irritating.
[2:48 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Should follow gst 9% currently.
[2:51 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Upgrading skills can be a double edge sword...
One to justify pay increase and two, is to stay relevant to the changing requirements of the ecosystems of changes in the work and skillsets.
Three, is either you find your footing or you will foot the consequences!
Thank you, Andrew for bringing it up.
[2:52 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Agree
[2:53 pm, 27/03/2023] +Frankie Wee: Low salary with pension (workfare)
Local said not enough cover cost.
[2:53 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Does it grow with inflation and cost of living!?
[2:55 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: 100% agree
[2:55 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: No wor 2014 I think aircraft chief engineer was non local ?
[2:55 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: No wor 2014 I think aircraft main engine , chief engineer was non local ?
[2:55 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Not surprising!
[2:56 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: If now still non local . Understand it a restricted tech
[2:56 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: :))
[2:56 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: One successful story...
A security guard, our seniors, after upgrading his skills was promoted to supervisor.
One happiness to him!
Thank you.
[2:56 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Yes
[2:56 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Lol how to fight in cost?
[2:56 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Thank you.
A true story!
[2:56 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Need to grow local talent!
[2:56 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: You want local then you need to pay local price
[2:56 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Most heartening to know
[2:57 pm, 27/03/2023] +Frankie Wee: But MOM require local first placement employment then WP/SP
[2:57 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Yes, let's identify where and which sectors to target and nuture our younger ones.
[2:58 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Yes, but limited due to demand for jobs.
Thank you.
[2:58 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Then, they should not complain about foreign talent!
[2:58 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Thank you.
There is HOPE! FIND IT!
[2:58 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Cos I think aircraft engine not transferable so I give the benefit of doubt . But it a well pay job
[2:58 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Yes
[2:59 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Complaint is another cheap trade!
[2:59 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Yup
[2:59 pm, 27/03/2023] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
REACH only for citizens only.
[3:00 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: yah exactly - so how come got PR and Foreigner in this group?
[3:00 pm, 27/03/2023] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
Not that I am aware of.
[3:00 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: "If you want it badly, you strive for it and earn it...where is the will, there is hope!"
- - anonymity
[3:00 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: They're keeping queit now but they voiced out before
[3:00 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: during the arguement on GST
[3:00 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: and housing
[3:00 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: No PR!
[3:00 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: someone was defending PR's right to buy resale HDB
[3:01 pm, 27/03/2023] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
Is it?
I thought they are citizens or new citizens?
[3:01 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: one outright said foireigner. CECA i think
[3:01 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: one is malaysian PR
[3:02 pm, 27/03/2023] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
Ex foreigners or ex pr I guess.
[3:03 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: "The best person for the job or otherwise anyone can try any jobs?"
- - anonymity
What is progressive and how about regression?
One is a positive signal and the other is full of regrets?
Thank you.
[3:03 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: nah - quite sure I didn't remember wrongly. =)
[3:05 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Best person. Progressive has its limits.
[3:08 pm, 27/03/2023] +Frankie Wee: PR is like dual country
can make money earn and buy resale apartments. One from HK have pension allowance every monthly while staying in Singapore.
[3:08 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: I think got lah . Normally they don’t put name one . I remeber got one saying about school want free school for PR . When I help sg ppl they 4 person attack me no one help me .
[3:09 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: π³π π€¨π€¦♂️
[3:09 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: There's one what I always skirmish with
[3:09 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: I remeber is valentine day
[3:10 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Cos of sg policies me still single no money and become uncle . So was shock when they speak for EP as well
[3:10 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: π³
[3:11 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: U can see the conversation
[3:12 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Cos me don’t screen shot any conversation as it not right :)
[3:13 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: So yah - confirm not SG only here. =)
[3:15 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Lol
[3:15 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: How they even register…
[3:15 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Reach fail then
[3:16 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Is it true...
Younger managers have less tolerance towards older workers?
Some older workers are less willing to go for upgrading skills?
Older workers find it harder to land the next job especially losing one, now?
Thank you
[3:16 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Why we need to updgrade and mangers don’t ?
[3:16 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Lol you try migrate lor… not easy… I try also hard to get…
To drop everything be 2nd class citizen till they get the benefit…
To me it is fair.
[3:17 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: And still can get in? ππ
[3:17 pm, 27/03/2023] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
Only Singapore NRIC can register.
Pr or foreigners IC cannot register.
[3:17 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Just excel copy and paste
[3:17 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Managers need to update too...or bye bye too!
Thank you.
Simply, the world has over 6 billions that are better educated since the 1980s....
Thank you, KL.
[3:17 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Likely didn’t do background check?
[3:18 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: can tell PR NIRC and SG NIRC apart?
[3:18 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Agree
[3:18 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: my malaysian PR colleagues IC number looks like a normal one
[3:18 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Can
[3:19 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: But I can’t share as I knew it by accident
[3:19 pm, 27/03/2023] +Frankie Wee: I am local singaporean.
I got to know a friend who married his wife is from HK. His wife likely to stay PR instead pink IC. Because she get pension every monthly.
[3:19 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: But since they are interested let them see how general public here feel lol
[3:19 pm, 27/03/2023] +Frankie Wee: I say wow so easy dual citizenship and PR
[3:19 pm, 27/03/2023] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
NRIC number is unique.
Only Singaporean can have one.
[3:20 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Danny I think you need to see the chat on 14 feb
[3:20 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: PR's NRIC same same leh.
[3:20 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Btw pr will issue nric numbers
[3:20 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: I've colleagues who's number NRIC no looks like SG ones
[3:21 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: their pr number will turn to red
[3:23 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Older one is similar to ours
[3:23 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Only new ones are different.
[3:23 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: If not wrong
[3:23 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: I'm more curious how did the Foreigner get in though
[3:24 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: there's one that outright said he's not Citizen, not PR
[3:24 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Good question!?π€¨π π³
[3:24 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: That day never help me , I thgt I become yue fei
[3:24 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: Tag me next time =)
[3:26 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Or they key anyhow NIRC and still get in lol
[3:27 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Did gov think because of these open door create more single ?
[3:27 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: ?
[3:27 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Actually I have a essay but really lazy to write it cause the singles in sg
[3:28 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Related to foreigner meh?
[3:28 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Open door cause wages depress for guys and girls wage more etc causing imbalance
[3:28 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: In fact singles occur in well educated females and middle families boys
[3:29 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Err
[3:30 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Earn well or not really depends on your capabilities bah
[3:31 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: When u are fighting with few millions non local it do depress wages
[3:32 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Imagine if u put 1.4 billions workers into China economic do u think will explode ?
[3:32 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Is it true that...
Older workers/managers hanging on their usual ways when dealing with the younger and aspiring ones?
Respect, dignity and pride are important to older people?
Basics are crucial in everything knowns from the past to the present days, for without these basics there will be no breakthroughs and inventions - non existence?
Experience and exposure are two attributes to pass onto the next generation or all the above are not relevant, things have changed and many things are moving faster and further (that human forgetten the basics and the roots)?
Thank you.
[3:35 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Lol they will tell you they did their best.. not everyone can go up… that’s the fact
[3:35 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Even your Hr will shoot you why promote you… unless you can give value higher than your pay…
[3:35 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Loyalty don’t count lol
[3:35 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: How is the intensity and magnitude like working in China?
People to people competing to survive and or in hope to succeed?
Which pit do you choose to compete and or choose to be born into?
Finally, each 20 years will bring about the unique opportunities and challenges!
When and where, two keys determinants of so called successful life?
Thank you.
[3:36 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: "Be a big fish in an ocean or A big fish in an enlarged pond...?"
- - anonymity
[3:36 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Are u saying puting 4-5 millions non local won’t cause a wage depress on local ?
[3:37 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: I think I need to go back study economics to see which rule say so .
[3:37 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Intensed competitions in a big economy like China...
Thank you.
[3:37 pm, 27/03/2023] +Frankie Wee: China local wage very cheap
[3:38 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: I thgt some one say China not cheap labour anymore ?
[3:39 pm, 27/03/2023] +Frankie Wee: But China government give local pension
[3:39 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Depress wage model happens when an economy is at the decline and or it's key industries are non competitive to the nearest three competing nations.
Three is enough for comparison.
Thank you.
[3:39 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: Then now do they do it there ? I don't see huge amounts of foreign workers in Japan and Germany
[3:39 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Then and not so today.
Thank you.
[3:40 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: How much a crane driver earn in guangxi? I think ard cny 6000 same as office worker . Cheap or not I not sure
[3:40 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Generation gap not closing!?
[3:40 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: Local and imported. No idea about Germany but there's Chinese workforce in Japan.
[3:40 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: Actually , I think if these wages pay a livable wage
[3:40 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: Locals will do
[3:40 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Japan is a unique culture of exclusivity!
From the era of Meiji onward... however Japan of tomorrow needs foreign workers though they decline PR or citizenship!
Thank you.
[3:41 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: If u have no choice
[3:41 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: Not to scale as us mah
[3:41 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: So how they plug the gap
[3:41 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: 80%. Roughly.
[3:41 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: That's why I say the efficiency of automation part
[3:41 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: Might be the diff
[3:41 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: Their requirements are somewhat different
[3:41 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: We build in concrete. They build in wood
[3:41 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: Mostly
[3:42 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: Less urban renewal for high-rise
[3:42 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: Automation - somewhat. More of small scale machinery.
[3:43 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: Still very manual. A lot of smaller machines though. But mostly not compatible with SGs workplace needs.
[3:44 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: China no longer consider low cost centre
[3:44 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: They are consider as labour hub… if you need large number of engineers or professionals… you can source within the country
[3:45 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Which not many countries have the supply chain and the scaling
[3:45 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Singapore need so many talent overseas cause it is hard to find… for every industry… you can’t have talent overnight.. it takes time to build
[3:46 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: I have German friends who actually build their house themselves . Just 5 pple but they do get in certain specialist to do the electrical and piping
[3:46 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: But then again, it's a landed house and not hdb
[3:46 pm, 27/03/2023] +Frankie Wee: They stay long hour work.
Japan and Korean most worker stay long hours.
[3:46 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: Was amazed how he could do it themselvds
[3:46 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Can the government entice them to return!?
[3:47 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Plus after hours for office workers lol
[3:47 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: I would like to do that!
[3:47 pm, 27/03/2023] +Frankie Wee: Japan rush hour traffics
[3:47 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: As long as our pay is high enough.. plus strong currency
[3:47 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: If ringgit drop to same as SGD you think Malaysian will come meh
[3:47 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Same pay
[3:48 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Hope they are working on this!?
[3:48 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Nope
[3:48 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: I shot this perviously and some malaysian PR here said that this was racist. lol
[3:49 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: like if not for the money why else are they here
[3:50 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: This is just fact mah… if not for the strong currency who will travel so far to work?
[3:50 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: If given a choice you work at your home country
[3:50 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: No-one
[3:51 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Yes
[3:51 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: If Malaysia pay 3 times.. I also will travel there to work
[3:51 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: No questions ask
[3:52 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Travel 2 hours to Jurong island Liao
[3:52 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Definitely
[3:52 pm, 27/03/2023] +Frankie Wee: Malaysia is high crime
[3:52 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: This one is fact. All my Malaysian friends say this . Plus lack of opportunity in Malaysia so it's still a ricebowl issue
[3:52 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Buah tahan!
[3:52 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Pro and con
[3:52 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Yup
[3:52 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: I join you across the pond in a few months π€ͺ
[3:53 pm, 27/03/2023] +KL: Frankly they enjoying free national defence when earning 3 times
[3:53 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: 3 times income… still nearby… give and take
[3:53 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Lol PSA?
[3:53 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: Not as bad lah. I think Singapore is exception. If u compare with other places, maallaysia actually quite ok
[3:54 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Yup… of course Singapore a bit better if not they won’t have come here..
[3:54 pm, 27/03/2023] +Frankie Wee: All you need a own a car travel to Malaysia
[3:54 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: π€£ other direction. The lagi ulu direction.
[3:54 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Bukom arh?
[3:54 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: I won't say it's bad till it's a push factor
[3:55 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: I go Malaysia quite a lot
[3:55 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: Safer than last time
[3:55 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: Imo
[3:55 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: If the HSR is done.. is good that more talent can move around…
[3:55 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Haha but the delay is really haiz
[3:56 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: The issue of quality law enforcement, judiciary and civil service leaves much to be desired including action customs and immigration officers!
[3:58 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: Of course room for improvement lah
[3:59 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: I was stuck in the epic jam during school holiday π€£
[4:00 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Wait long long!
[4:01 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: Lol
[4:01 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: U ex Malaysian ah
[4:01 pm, 27/03/2023] +Fulgrim: π€£
[4:15 pm, 27/03/2023] +Jimmy Chew: And connections too
[4:15 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: That is a must for higher level..
I still very noob at that haiz
[4:17 pm, 27/03/2023] +Jimmy Chew: To get a job at basic level haha
[4:18 pm, 27/03/2023] +Jimmy Chew: Also
[4:31 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Luck?
[4:34 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Giving special preferential treatments to our local workers regardless of skills, from 50 years and onwards?
To protect their rice bowls?
Thank you.
[4:34 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Private to Public.
[4:36 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: basic survival law?
εΊζ¬ηεζ³?
[4:48 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: I believe something is in the works for this.
[4:50 pm, 27/03/2023] +REACH: π’ Topic π’
On 23 Mar 2023, more than 200 employers, HR professionals and workers participated in a dialogue on Workplace Fairness. This dialogue is part of ongoing engagements by the Tripartite Committee on Workplace Fairness, which released an interim report on 13 Feb 2023, containing 20 recommendations for the proposed Bill to protect workers against biases on nationality, age and others, as well as new penalties on errant employers. A range of issues such as special arrangements, outsourcing, misunderstanding on discrimination and how to avoid them were discussed at the dialogue.
π¬ *What are your views on the impending enactment of Workplace Fairness Legislation (WFL)? What more can be done to protect workers against discrimination and uphold fairne…
[5:15 pm, 27/03/2023] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
"Rising rents hit European businesses in Singapore, cause anxiety among employees"
https://www.straitstimes.com/business/rising-rents-hit-european-businesses-in-singapore-cause-anxiety-among-employees#:~:text=Rising%20rents%20hit%20European%20businesses%20in%20Singapore%2C%20cause%20anxiety%20among%20employees
[5:17 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Ripple effects
[5:18 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Three Concerns:
Lives, Livelihoods, Inflations
Thank you.
[5:19 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Yes
[5:20 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Work this equation backwards, you will see the dynamics!
Thank you.
[5:20 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Not just European.. in general the higher rent are making hard for them expat to stay in Singapore
[5:22 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Going back to the equation....
Building capacity from public goods, if one country is readying itself for headcount growth?
Not enough infrastructure will further add to the existing structures!
Thank you, Ken!
[5:24 pm, 27/03/2023] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
Rising rental cost, higher operational costs were found to be rising salaries and increased costs of renting business spaces - business contemplating moving operations out of Singapore.
Local workers may lose their jobs.
[5:25 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Thank you, Danny!
[5:27 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Just to ride over this "perfect storm" in the making....?
Accepting lower wages across all sectors? Doable or not?
Let's remember the 3 concerns...
[5:29 pm, 27/03/2023] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
Maybe it is time for government to convert some old HDB flats as dorm for these foreigners at rent them at cheaper rental - to dissuade foreign business from moving out and persuade foreign workers to rent such government flats at a cheaper rate.
This will help to save local jobs.
[5:34 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: Town council as the intermediary and agent for these rental flats?
$800/room for 2 pax and no more than 6 persons per three rooms flat? Including utilities?
Any hickups/unhappy from the public?
Thank you.
[5:43 pm, 27/03/2023] +Ken: Yah… that’s the worry
[5:48 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Illegal sub letting still a major issue.
[5:50 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: That's a Policy issue, easy to address and straighten.
Thank you, Andrew!
[5:53 pm, 27/03/2023] +TD: This is already being done?
there was a cluster of these Rentals along bedok south.
Not sure if the rentals along North Bridge road are catered for FT as well
[5:55 pm, 27/03/2023] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
I believe these are pmets.
They could have higher expectations.
[5:55 pm, 27/03/2023] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
Thus govt need to reach out to them to find out a workable solutions.
[5:59 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: https://stats.mom.gov.sg/Pages/Labour-Force-In-Singapore-2022.aspx
[5:59 pm, 27/03/2023] +Jimmy Chew: Good dialogue. All depends company CEO
[6:03 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: https://www.mom.gov.sg/newsroom/press-releases/2023/0327-launch-of-comprehensive-labour-force-survey-2023
[6:26 pm, 27/03/2023] +REACH: π’ Topic π’
On 23 Mar 2023, more than 200 employers, HR professionals and workers participated in a dialogue on Workplace Fairness. This dialogue is part of ongoing engagements by the Tripartite Committee on Workplace Fairness, which released an interim report on 13 Feb 2023, containing 20 recommendations for the proposed Bill to protect workers against biases on nationality, age and others, as well as new penalties on errant employers. A range of issues such as special arrangements, outsourcing, misunderstanding on discrimination and how to avoid them were discussed at the dialogue.
π¬ *What are your views on the impending enactment of Workplace Fairness Legislation (WFL)? What more can be done to protect workers against discrimination and uphold fairne…
[6:37 pm, 27/03/2023] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
My close friend comments:-
High rental not sustainable.
Many condos and flats will be completed this year.
It will douse the rise. I randomly checked on to-be completed new condo early this year.
1000+ units, but more than 500 put up on sale or rental.
It may be a sample point but it does say people are not short of space.
Plus WFH is over for most people.
[6:38 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Landlords only have a small window of opportunity before the curtains fall on their exorbitant rents!
[6:38 pm, 27/03/2023] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
Exactly.
[6:43 pm, 27/03/2023] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
My close friend comments:-
Also checked the rental listings on property site around Oct last year.
Pick on a heartland mrt 1km radius, rental listings hover around 20-40.
Now same 1 km radius mrt, 100 rental listings.
Landlords have to blink first or leave their property empty
[6:44 pm, 27/03/2023] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
My close friend comments:-
Don't think we need knee jerk reaction, just need property agencies to give their fair judgement to calm the market.
[6:45 pm, 27/03/2023] +REACH: Dear Contributors,
⏰ We will be closing the chat in 15 minutes ⏰
Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.
Goodnight!
Megan π
[6:50 pm, 27/03/2023] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
My close friend comments:-
To be fair, landlords who need to rely on rental will have to increase rents to fight rise in interest rates. So the rental market will find it's equilibrium.
[6:50 pm, 27/03/2023] +Rama: Understand
[6:55 pm, 27/03/2023] +Smiley face: 27 March, 2023
"Hope is like an aim, a target and a vision of success and positivity,...Finite is a game of loser and winner?"
- - anonymity
Infinity or Finity?
Do you loves your country, loves your family and loved ones, loves your job and do you like what you are and what you are currently doing? Human are emotional beings; love and like, out of love and dislike others are mental choices that were formed from past experiences and exposures.
Most often mankind think they are finite specie so much so that the psychology of the minds tend to circulate under the assumption of a fixed timeline of happenings and limitations of a person's abilities. It is true that each human abilities with the least nurturing/interventions are defined right from birth to d…
[7:00 pm, 27/03/2023] +REACH: Dear Contributors,
We will be closing the chat for today.
Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.
Goodnight!
Megan π
=====
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