REACH 506 - What are your views on rewarding the reduction of electricity usage? How can we better manage electricity demand and supply in homes and businesses as part of managing our daily cost of living?
(SK)
25 Oct 2023 (10am - 7pm)
REACH
25/10/23, 9:45 am - +REACH: *Dear Contributors,*
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25/10/23, 10:00 am - +REACH: 📢 *Topic* 📢
In a first-of-its-kind initiative to get households to help manage the load on the electricity grid, residents in homes equipped with smart meters will be called upon to adjust their electricity usage during peak demand periods.
The initiative, called Residential Demand Response (R-DR), is targeted to start by the second half of 2024 and will tentatively involve about 1,000 households that have smart electricity meters provided by utilities firm SP Group, said the Energy Market Authority (EMA).
💬 *What are your views on rewarding the reduction of electricity usage? How can we better manage electricity demand and supply in homes and businesses as part of managing our daily cost of living?*
These households will receive alerts from the SP app to temporarily cut down or defer their electricity usage during demand peaks in the power system. Once alerted, residents can postpone usage of high energy-consuming appliances such as washing machines or dishwashers, or adjust the temperature of their air-conditioner, or turn it off.
This programme for residents follows a similar initiative for commercial firms and industries. Under the two-year Demand Side Management regulatory sandbox launched in late 2022, commercial consumers in the programme receive payment as an incentive for reducing their electricity usage at certain times of the day, or using their own generators to meet their electricity needs. The efforts of the commercial and industrial consumers led to a reduction in wholesale electricity prices in the first half of 2023.
Minister Tan See Leng spoke about the need for a resilient electricity grid amid the energy transition. “Today, the flow in the grid is primarily one-way. It brings electricity from our natural gas power plants to the rest of Singapore,” he noted. In the future, there will be a wider mix of energy sources – from power plants, solar panels, electricity imports and battery storage systems, for example – and Singapore’s grid will need to cope with multi-directional flows across the island, he explained.
Minister Tan added: “Some countries experience grid congestion and are unable to cope with the introduction of new renewable energy sources. Their grids cannot bring clean energy to cities and industries where it is needed most.”
👉 https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/residents-to-be-rewarded-for-cutting-electricity-usage-during-peak-periods-under-new-pilot
👉 https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/pub-joins-scheme-that-will-reward-businesses-for-lowering-electricity-usage
25/10/23, 10:00 am - ~ REACH Singapore changed this group's settings to allow all participants to send messages to this group
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25/10/23, 10:22 am - +~L: Great to see this. Why do the malls and shops blast their air-con so much. Maybe an incentive to better manage this would see a substantial benefit. It would be good to get Smart controllers that switch off air-con at home and work for just 6 minutes per hour. That would cut electricity usage by 10% and would barely be noticed.
25/10/23, 10:27 am - +Rama: Subsidies for energy saving appliances must go hand in hand with responsible purchases.
25/10/23, 10:35 am - +Frankie Wee: I heard Tengah area got system cooling is helping reduce hot heat
25/10/23, 10:35 am - +Kelvin Ang: As questioned...what incentives....
25/10/23, 10:35 am - +Frankie Wee: Why not all HDB should have it better
25/10/23, 10:37 am - +Coconut Tree: The tengah one is a massive failur
25/10/23, 10:37 am - +Coconut Tree: Failure
25/10/23, 10:38 am - +Coconut Tree: Looks ugly, underpowered.
This is what happens when you shoehorn in a system as an afterthought. All the trunking running in areas that were not planned for them
25/10/23, 10:41 am - +Frankie Wee: I think HDB design is basic first next project will new development
25/10/23, 10:42 am - +Frankie Wee: Too many compressor will temp over heat
25/10/23, 10:47 am - +Frankie Wee: https://youtu.be/UigOJcSRIpQ?si=cJSbEnO-42UCVkgb
25/10/23, 10:49 am - +Frankie Wee: https://youtu.be/kuy4d_xzDyg?si=AaZp0VBny35VTJFm
25/10/23, 10:50 am - +Frankie Wee: In future Singapore is going temp 40 degree. Because we have building too many flat and landscaping plants are less.
25/10/23, 10:51 am - +Rama: 😳🤦♂️😞 Green buildings is must !
25/10/23, 10:52 am - +Frankie Wee: Weather 🌦️ change climate very fast when its raining turn sun suddenly over heat
25/10/23, 10:52 am - +Frankie Wee: Too fast too hot get sweat when on air con indoors while outdoor overheat 4-6 times
25/10/23, 10:54 am - +Frankie Wee: Garden by the bay we need east, west and north building plant to help reduce the climate
25/10/23, 10:55 am - +Rama: How can smart meters with responsible purchase help to decrease electricity usage when the weather is ridiculously hot!?
25/10/23, 10:56 am - +Frankie Wee: Even midnight still hot there is less winding because bto and EC building blocked
25/10/23, 10:57 am - +Frankie Wee: Pay and pay what we need cooling
25/10/23, 10:58 am - +Rama: So, should home appliances be discarded if less than five ticks after 10 years just like vehicle COE!?
25/10/23, 10:58 am - +Frankie Wee: By 2030 new carbon emissions in the world is changed
25/10/23, 10:58 am - +Frankie Wee: EV batteries and electric vehicles
25/10/23, 11:00 am - +Frankie Wee: I wonder how Singapore land hit 40 degree then all rivers will going dry and more mosquitoes 🦟
25/10/23, 11:00 am - +Rama: No more surface reservoirs!?
25/10/23, 11:02 am - +Frankie Wee: If Singapore hit 40 degree then people couldn’t going to work overheating warning healthy faint
25/10/23, 11:03 am - +Rama: Is the economy ready for below surface function!?
25/10/23, 11:04 am - +Frankie Wee: https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/singapore-weather-40-degrees-celsius-heatwave-global-warming-aircon-3597176
25/10/23, 11:06 am - +Frankie Wee: Our human normal temp is 35 below
25/10/23, 11:15 am - +KL: Frankly the poor suffer again :))
25/10/23, 11:15 am - +KL: When ppl install tower aircon at bungalow
25/10/23, 11:16 am - +KL: So let me guess , SG need to install new electricity generator or need to cut usage so can negotiate better gas price ? Thus start to ask ppl to cut electricity use during peak hours ? Last innovation of open market elecity I think is good but seem going down hill liao <This message was edited>
25/10/23, 11:16 am - +KL: Even Salvation Army install tower class aircon but they don’t use at night ( peak ) I guess <This message was edited>
25/10/23, 11:19 am - +KL: Well say , the articles say peak hours mean there maybe chance of blackout during peak right ? Cos normally to cut electricity during peak mean the electricity generate may not cover all peak usage . <This message was edited>
25/10/23, 12:08 pm - +Rama: Yes
25/10/23, 12:09 pm - +Rama: 😳🤦♂️😆
25/10/23, 12:18 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
1. Checking power metre every day to ensure prudent electricity spending is a norm for me.
But unfortunately, my power metre is an analogue metre not a smart IT metre.
I need to physically check it and photo the meter to check the reading.
Wonder when will smart metre be rolled out to all household?
2. Notice that without checking daily meter, there is tendency to overuse the electricity such as switching on the aircon for too long.
25/10/23, 12:30 pm - +Frankie Wee: Smart hub home
25/10/23, 12:30 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
1. I develop this habit during COVID-19 time, whereby everyone work at home, all switch on aircon throughout the day, and there is a change in electricity service provider due to end of electricity contract and when the open market electricity price per KW jump 100% from previous contract.
2. Indeed for 3 months, I almost fall off the chair when I received my electricity bill, when the bill reflect more than 100% increase in prices.
For a while, I thought someone tap my electricity.
3. On the advice of the service provider, I manually check the power meter and submit the meter reading monthly - then I managed to control the electricity usage and hence the price of my electricity bill come back to sanity.
25/10/23, 12:39 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
1. But, being smart hub means IP based, it is susceptible to being hacked by hackers from the internet - if it can be access by mobile apps or web based device.
2. I am not sure whether the smart meter come with firewall or at least ACL (access control list) capabilities to protect against internet hackers.
Else hackers could alter the smart meter reading - and consumers will have to pay through the nose.
25/10/23, 12:42 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
3. Also the connection and meter reading should be encrypted - so that hackers can't see, alter and change the meter readings.
25/10/23, 12:49 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
1. Another thing, the Minister mention that with more energy mix due to introduction of varied renewable energy sources - energy grid could face congestion.
2. Does this mean that in future, electricity supply will be less reliable?
3. Our recent experience whereby the Equnix data center got shutdown, trigger a data center wide malfunction of IT services for the banks eg. DBS, Citibank etc.
Many bank services eg. mWallet, ATM, internet banking etc are down for at least 1 day.
4. Wonder whether Government will ensure the electricity power reliability as we move towards renewable energy?
Because our entire economy rely on reliable electricity source to function well.
Any hiccups in the electricity supplies will cripple our economy.
25/10/23, 12:52 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
1. Hence our various critical economic sectors IT services need to be resilient and fully redundant to prevent such service downtime.
2. Eg. Banks, manufacturing, security, vital infrastructure, services etc <This message was edited>
25/10/23, 12:53 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
'This is not supposed to happen': Experts on DBS, Citi outage caused by data centre failure.
Most banks have two or more data centres and redundancies at multiple levels if a primary data centre goes offline, industry experts say. https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/dbs-citibank-outage-data-centre-cooling-system-down-3861076
25/10/23, 12:53 pm - ☸️ Danny 心: <Media omitted>
25/10/23, 12:53 pm - ☸️ Danny 心: <Media omitted>
25/10/23, 12:53 pm - ☸️ Danny 心: <Media omitted>
25/10/23, 12:53 pm - ☸️ Danny 心: <Media omitted>
25/10/23, 12:53 pm - ☸️ Danny 心: <Media omitted>
25/10/23, 12:53 pm - ☸️ Danny 心: <Media omitted>
25/10/23, 12:53 pm - ☸️ Danny 心: <Media omitted>
25/10/23, 1:04 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
1. Note:- Electricity is a Critical Information Infrastructure that need to be carefully protected.
2. Smart infra which means IT enabled - is also a subject to Internet hacking by hackers (similar in vein to online scam).
3. It has become an easy, juicy target for Terrorists or State actors - to cripple the electricity infrastructure first (as seen in the Ukraine war and Gaza war).
4. Hence a very resilient and well protected energy grid infrastructure become imperative.
5. I am sure those who have seen the movie "Diehard 4" - will have seen the impact of terrorists attacking the State electricity infrastructure - and its devastating impact.
It is not just a movie, but can happen during tension.
The hacking is so multi facet and widespread - coming from internet, satellite, GPS spoofing, RF (radio frequency), wireless and wired. <This message was edited>
25/10/23, 1:10 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
To protect against such risk, minimally, electricity infrastructure should not be connected to Internet.
A close architecture, with no connection to internet will prevent such hacking.
(That's smart electricity infrastructure must sit within an intranet).
25/10/23, 1:16 pm - ☸️ Danny 心: <Media omitted>
25/10/23, 1:16 pm - ☸️ Danny 心: <Media omitted>
25/10/23, 1:16 pm - ☸️ Danny 心: <Media omitted>
25/10/23, 1:17 pm - +Rama: This message was deleted
25/10/23, 1:19 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
Taking the cue from Stuxnet cyber attack that cripple the nuclear plant infrastructure.
The nuclear plant infrastructure is not connected to the internet.
But the cyberworm was planted in a USB drive.
One engineer pick up the USB drive purposely drop in front of the nuclear plant, plug it into his computer in the plant, and trigger a massive cyberattack to the nuclear plant IT infrastructure.
Imagine if our electricity infrastructure is plug into the internet exposed to the world hackers at large?
25/10/23, 1:47 pm - +Rose M K Ho: As u hv illustrated, Danny,
Even without being connected to the Internet, terrorists / arsonists / attackers wl always find _another_ way in.
We hv to find _foolproof_ solutions.
Employees need to be trustworthy too & not decide to "take revenge" suddenly becos of some personal issue ...
🤔
25/10/23, 1:49 pm - +Rose M K Ho: That said, I agree tt an important infrastructure such as our electricity grid shd not be connected to the Internet.
This is the first & most important security consideration.
Thereafter, we add on other layers of security.
25/10/23, 1:50 pm - +Frankie Wee: I think Singapore technically is too complex and need more advanced infrastructure. It’s going to study the case how to develop and cybersecurity
25/10/23, 1:50 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
Now there are protection against such USB drive attack.
Many companies disable USB drive plugin.
Only registered USB drive can plugin.
Such attack currently is neutralised - based on the Stuxnet scenario.
Cll infrastructure not connecting to public internet is an important safeguard.
25/10/23, 1:51 pm - +Frankie Wee: IT system project will work on case innovation
25/10/23, 1:54 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
Eg. The current pilot 1,000 home smart metre reading are accessible through internet via mobile apps or web based device.
That's it could be read only but probably no write access.
Means introducing cyberworms will be difficult.
But still, it is an internet access.
Well cybersecurity experts will have to study it carefully - is it safe in the long run.
Based on current usage, it doesn't look dangerous.
But in future, how AI evolved, I don't know.
25/10/23, 1:56 pm - +Frankie Wee: The world trying make Ai basic it’s going to change experiences from wasted bad habits.
25/10/23, 1:58 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
Worst come to worst, the electricity infrastructure can be subjected to:-
1. DDOS attack (distributed denial of service attack) - as IP addresses, DNS (IP address to URL) are exposed to the internet.
2. IP scan, TCP scan, SNMP...
3. IP reconnaissance
Etc.
Read spoofing...
But no risk of more malicious write access.
Eg. SQL injection, cyberworms/malware injection etc. <This message was edited>
25/10/23, 2:01 pm - +Frankie Wee: I have ever seemed in Toa Payoh Hub interchange in basement foods courts they use Ai robot to service collect cup/plate 🍽️ self and also Vivo city in Starbucks coffee
25/10/23, 2:04 pm - +REACH: 📢 *Topic* 📢
25/10/23, 2:27 pm - +Rose M K Ho: 👍🏻good to know.
Reach shd take this into consideration .
25/10/23, 2:31 pm - +Rose M K Ho: Exactly!
With the use of AI now available, having an Internet connection to anything out ther is dangerous !
If AI were to be used in any way w controlling or monitoring our electricity, tt is _not_ a viable option!
25/10/23, 2:31 pm - +~L: <Media omitted>
25/10/23, 2:31 pm - +~L: I don't usually forward things like this, but with all the talk of scams out there, I thought it appropriate!
25/10/23, 2:34 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
But having say so, even if read access but no write access is allowed, having public internet connection still pose some risk.
Eg. 1. State hackers can compromise internet routers (by compromising the firmware of the routers) even though extremely safe router configuration are implemented.
Then hackers can access the internal electricity infrastructure network creating havoc.
Eg. 2. Break server password and hack into a vulnerable server and assign itself privilege root access.
25/10/23, 2:34 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
So as long as connected into a public internet, the security risk is there.
25/10/23, 2:35 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
https://www.securityweek.com/chinese-gov-hackers-caught-hiding-in-cisco-router-firmware/
25/10/23, 2:35 pm - ☸️ Danny 心: Yes.
This news I see before.
Very jialat.
The whole network can be hacked.
25/10/23, 2:35 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
The moment the router is compromised, it can go anywhere inside the network.
25/10/23, 2:35 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
Unless defense in depth is deployed within the internal network - such as firewalls, proxy, IPS, etc.
25/10/23, 2:35 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
This APT attack - even CCIE (experts) cannot stop and protect because CCIE experts can only protect at the configuration level.
This APT hackers attack at the firmware level - whereby only Cisco factory developers can protect and secure.
It needs Cisco factory expert developer that develop the firmware, secure boots to secure the iOS of the Cisco routers.
Else all Cisco routers will get hacked and can jump from routers to routers within the network undetected - because the APT hackers can remove all entries in the syslog configure in the routers - and leave no trace of hacking.
This is a State hackers attack not any traditional hackers out there - very highly skilled.
Only Cisco factory developers can match.
25/10/23, 2:40 pm - +Vivian: It is related to some insurance one... don't bother... please don't send in this group.. thanks
25/10/23, 3:24 pm - +Kenneth Lee WM: Bravo! Being *rewarded* for using less is a great move for changing consumer behaviour.
In the past it has always been punitive means. Ie always pay more!
I would be interested to find out more details of how consumers are going to be rewarded. <This message was edited>
25/10/23, 3:50 pm - +~L: Good point - it really frustrates me that we are encouraged to consume more and often waste more, by lower prices, 2 for 1 etc....
25/10/23, 4:00 pm - +REACH: 📢 *Topic* 📢
25/10/23, 4:08 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
https://innovd.stengg.com/data-diode?gclid=CjwKCAjws9ipBhB1EiwAccEi1DkQWE6SNOLbQccYWsQTXu6T-Yt0N5r2XLADDAmhyqmNkR9Z47zFKxoCaDAQAvD_BwE
ST Engineering
Data Diode.
One Way Flow,
Zero Data Loss
ST Engineering Data Diode is a unidirectional data transfer gateway that enables organisations to transfer data securely from highly secured networks to external network systems without any file loss.
25/10/23, 4:08 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
Maybe this can help
25/10/23, 4:11 pm - +Rama: Copy right for government use only!?
25/10/23, 4:13 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
I think this could be a very secured way to connect to CII electricity infrastructure.
Because data diode operate in the physical layer hard wire.
Lower layer than the firmware - and it push uni-directional data eg. Internal network to external network (public internet).
And will not allow reverse direction into the CII electricity infrastructure network. <This message was edited>
25/10/23, 4:17 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
Don't know whether our electricity infrastructure network use this solution or not.
If not worth exploring.
25/10/23, 4:23 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
Because this look like a military grade cybersecurity IT device - anti-hacking proof.
25/10/23, 4:43 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
That's even APT State hackers cannot hack.
25/10/23, 4:51 pm - +Rama: The phrase anti-hacking proof is a challenge for hackers
25/10/23, 4:56 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
Because it operates in bits and bytes - wired at 0 and 1.
Transmit at 0 and 1 - electrical pulse and receive as 0 and 1.
There are no higher layer padding of for example:-
1. Mac address - source and destination layer 2 address.
2. Or IP address, source and destination IP address.
3. Or URL.
All the above can be hacked.
0 and 1 are raw electrical pulses - what you transmit, what you get.
No way any hackers can intercept or inject any malware in layer 2, layer 3 or higher layer.
So it is anti-hacking proof.
25/10/23, 4:57 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
Any attempt to inject or remove even one additional electrical pulses - will raise an alert and fail the checksum test. <This message was edited>
25/10/23, 4:58 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
Because this is physics.
25/10/23, 5:01 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
Using electrical engineering to plug the vulnerabilities of IT (IP protocols).
25/10/23, 5:06 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
So now understand why STEM education so important for Singapore?
STEM - Science, Technology, Engineering, Math.
Science cannot solve, technology solve.
Technology cannot solve, engineering solve.
Engineering cannot solve, math solve.
25/10/23, 5:13 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
"Negligent banks, telcos may be held responsible for scam victims’ losses as part of proposed measures.
The shared responsibility framework will focus on “a defined scope” of phishing scams as a start."
If banks and telcos have carried out their duties, consumers will have to bear the full loss.
https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/financial-institutions-telcos-share-liability-consumers-scam-losses-mas-framework-3871356#:~:text=Negligent%20banks%2C%20telcos,as%20a%20start. <This message was edited>
25/10/23, 5:53 pm - ☸️ Danny 心: <Media omitted>
25/10/23, 5:55 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
"Air gap" - betwen physically separated source and destination network - used for data transfer.
This is physics.
Anti-hacking proof.
25/10/23, 5:57 pm - +Frankie Wee: Not for public sale only offer by ST engineering under cybersecurity
25/10/23, 6:00 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
Sell to corporate I think.
Public won't buy it because it is use to secure large network.
Also for specific functions, not for open internet surfing I think. <This message was edited>
25/10/23, 6:01 pm - +REACH: 📢 *Topic* 📢
25/10/23, 6:12 pm - ☸️ Danny 心:
This solution seems to appropriately present the smart IT power metre readings to consumers and at the same time protect hacking from internet.
The function of pushing information and not pulling information - seems to be the right secure solution for this product.
I not ST engineering salesman selling "koyoh" here.
I purely come from cybersecurity angle whereby during peace time or tension period, it will be among the 1st infrastructure to hit by any bad actors. <This message was edited>
25/10/23, 6:13 pm - +Smiley face: 25 October, 2023
"How to build a Super Computer; Apple or Android?"
"End-users wise: Android based devices are quicker in graphic processing whereas Apple is much stable algorithm from security to processing both graphics and alphameric/codes/strings, fastest!"
- - anonymity
What are the past experiences from millions of dollars scammed out of individual bank accounts and how about our CPF accounts (hope not)? What's the common path of break-ins for these highly smart hackers? We are not referring to those "love" crimes nor "shopping" scams, these are small timers. More sophisticated hackers will go for bigger and valuable tangibles in exchange for other interests. It is a global horse tradings of data for money or for access to other domains that are economically accountable and of national strategic interests. An example of a defence domain is a submarine unit or a drone unit.
Where are the cyber loopholes?
Your historical activities & frequency from WhatsApp chats, your internet banking accounts, your previous vacations, your emails, your utilities payments, your engagements with the public offices and more, all of these are gateways for hackers to reach out and swam to bookmark in digital format and can be resold to other groups for their intended uses!
Simply to say, the entire cyber and cloud is the BIG hole, unless otherwise, our digital protocols may include facial and/or thumb recognitions coupled with security tags/layerings as gateways of checking activities and unique transactions. Is it good enough?
Perhaps, these hackers are unstoppable because there will always be one loophole to enter, simulates and to transact! How to resecure?
So how to begin the beguine?
Key areas are banking, shopping and public services. These three big providers of services and goods must DESIGN a uncommon layered security platform so deep to the extend of DE-STANDARDIZING critical information policing through AI without third party especially not to "outsource" in parts or "friend source" in small leak these highly strategic data assets! What is standard?
All security measures are temporary fences because it will be hacked in just a matter of time and/or the ripe timing (embedded)! High flow of data and low volume both have vulnerable spots in the digital highways. What is patterns recognition?
Another exception to prevent hacking is a super computer using the fastest micro processors which the Chinese, the Russians, the Israelis and the Americans are currently driving their national securities from tradings to sensitive documents are all secured in these deep "freezers" not in the clouds! Cloud computing can be simulated/tracked/traced as well as easier to breach and compromised with copied key attributes aka codes!
- - in progress - -
25/10/23, 6:45 pm - +REACH: *Dear Contributors,*
⏰ We will be closing the chat in *15 minutes* ⏰
Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.
Goodnight!
Megan 😊
25/10/23, 6:53 pm - +Smiley face: 25 October, 2023
"Peak Hoursv& Off-Peak Hours"
What is the Peak hours for most households; weekdays and weekends?
What is the Off-peak hours/days for Primary and Secondary schools and Public Offices? Any plans to reduce electricity consumption on all Public offices/places?
How to save electric Consumptions?
Common sense will say, "the rising cost of electricity will alert consumers to start looking for ways to save cost."
Businesses like F&B, hospitality, hospitals and manufacturings; it is harder to optimise and manage the usage of electricity.
Reward and Surcharge?
The benchmark of average usage varies from household to household and types of housing. Likewise for all businesses and public places.
The reward system should be clearly defined to each of these users based on average taken within the vicinity or cluster, related industries. How much is the reward in terms of direct discount on the utilities bill?
The Surcharge will be applicable if the user surpass the range or percentage above the average consumption. If there is an intention to surcharge for over using, what is the calculation and additional money payable?
The future?
Are there plans to reward the savings of water usage and also a surcharge for over using water? Both private and public. It might as well be a work-in-progress and the next item to save for all goodness.
- - in progress - -
25/10/23, 6:54 pm - +Rama: Shift work is another consideration
25/10/23, 7:00 pm - +Smiley face: Optimus both electric and water!
25/10/23, 7:00 pm - +Smiley face: Double reward system!
25/10/23, 7:01 pm - +REACH: *Dear Contributors,*
We will be closing the chat for today.
Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.
Goodnight!
Megan 😊
25/10/23, 7:02 pm - ~ REACH Singapore changed this group's settings to allow only admins to send messages to this group
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