REACH (Telegram) 83 - What are your views about the country’s upcoming plans for the transition towards autonomous vehicles in the near future?
(SK)
30 Jun 2025 (10am - 7pm)
REACH (Telegram)
REACH Singapore, [30/6/2025 9:46 am]
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REACH Singapore, [30/6/2025 10:01 am]
📢 Topic 📢
On 27 June (Friday), Acting Transport Minister Jeffrey Siow announced that Singapore will trial autonomous vehicles (AVs) in Punggol from the fourth quarter of this year.
Mr Siow and Senior Minister of State for Transport Sun Xueling were in Guangzhou from Thursday to Saturday to learn about the development and deployment of AVs in China.
💬 What are your views about the country’s upcoming plans for the transition towards autonomous vehicles in the near future?
📌 AVs to support the public transport network
Noting that AVs are a maturing technology, Mr Siow said that in the short term, the Ministry of Transport (MOT) is thinking about how AVs can be used to support the public transport network.
He added that the ministry is working with potential operators and AV companies to decide on the right type of vehicle to bring in. Other factors to consider include the frequency at which these services can be run and whether there is demand from commuters.
Some AVs will be deployed in Punggol to try out "fixed routes". On why Punggol was picked, Mr Siow said that it is an estate where travel patterns are “quite mature”. If the trial in Punggol is successful, the ministry can then look at other places at the turn of the year, he said, adding that Tengah could be the next location.
📌 Challenges
Infrastructure is one factor in deciding how AVs can be rolled out to more areas, said Mr Siow. "We have to look at whether the roads are wide enough (and) whether there are stopping points that are available," he added. Getting drivers, commuters, pedestrians and cyclists used to seeing AVs on the roads and as "part of the general landscape" would be key.
Another issue that has been talked about with AVs is safety, which is a priority, said the acting transport minister. These vehicles will be painted in a "bright colour", he added. To start, the AVs will have a safety officer on board and run at a "manageable" speed.
📌 Jobs
Over time, people will get used to travelling in autonomous vehicles and the role of the driver may change, said Mr Siow.
Drivers in the current ecosystem, including taxi drivers or private-hire car drivers, would transition to the new jobs that the new industry will create, he added. "Others - we have to see how to help them reskill, to retrain and to take up other jobs in the economy that will be generated because of economic change," said the acting transport minister.
In the initial stages, it will be a "mix of both" - jobs for drivers in the transport industry and new jobs emerging.
The government's job, together with the National Trades Union Congress (NTUC), is to help drivers make the best use of these opportunities, he said.
🔗 [ST] https://str.sg/vWGd
🔗 [ST] https://str.sg/Lg9t
🔗 [CNA] https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/autonomous-vehicles-public-transport-punggol-5209136
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Jun Ming, [30/6/2025 10:21 am]
It will never be 100% automonous
365, [30/6/2025 10:33 am]
Even not 100% autonomous, it opens up the pool of available operators and helps with driver fatigue.
I want to draw parallels to 2 instances
Autopilot - even though there are still pilots and copilot, autopilot helps a lot with regular flying fatigue as it opens up their time and attention to other operation matters, or even rest while on standby.
Elevators / lift - there used to be a lift operator in each lift, people who manually control the lift movements. Nowadays, it is considered autonomous already. Yes you still need someone to press buttons, but the ease of operations just opened up the pool of available users to essentially everyone and not just those trained to operate lifts.
Jun Ming, [30/6/2025 10:53 am]
Yes like trains although it autopilot but a staff is standing there doing nothing
365, [30/6/2025 10:57 am]
Public won't know the specifics of what they are doing, could be communication, checks, or other matters. Monitoring is work as well, even if it looks like doing nothing
REACH Singapore, [30/6/2025 11:00 am]
[ Poll : Do you support the use of autonomous vehicles in Singapore? Please elaborate on your answer in the chat below. ]
- Yes
- No
REACH Singapore, [30/6/2025 11:02 am]
Dear Contributors,
Please take a moment to participate in our polls and share your opinion. The poll questions are pinned for easy reference, and your vote is anonymous.
We look forward to hearing your thoughts on today’s topic!
💬 What are your views about the country’s upcoming plans for the transition towards autonomous vehicles in the near future?
Thank you.
Megan 😊
Adam, [30/6/2025 11:23 am]
People think its fully ai. But we can have a staff watching a video feed in india for cheap.
Adam, [30/6/2025 11:27 am]
I wonder how they are gonna handle fares in auto bus. Will a bus stop if an auntie is fumbling in tapping card or finding money? Or what if the bus moves off and not enough cash?
Adam, [30/6/2025 11:37 am]
Roads wide enough? Does he think our roads here is too narrow? Or is there extra wide AV? Look at japan, they can manage with tight roads, yet we want to cut trees and squeeze out pedestrians.
Wider roads makes cars faster and more unsafe. We already making silver zones by narrowing and making bends so is our ministry contradicting itself? Make road narrower for safety of elders while wider for safety of AVs.
This very one statement make me doubt if our minister knows what he's doing. My expectation is for AVs to be computer precise, better than human at centimeter accuracy. If it cannot perform at current roads whether wide or narrow what hope do humans have?
Jun Ming, [30/6/2025 11:45 am]
I think there's the need of a staff to manage the bus either.
Jun Ming, [30/6/2025 11:46 am]
Like it cannot be totally driverless. It must be hybrid
Nicholas, [30/6/2025 11:58 am]
While I support the use of autonomous vehicles since there is a shortage of drivers, please ensure the safety aspect is thoroughly taken care of.
LCL (Danny 心), [30/6/2025 12:10 pm]
369. I post in REACH (Telegram) LCL (Danny 心), [18/6/2025 4:52 pm]:-
1. I realise a few merits of these driverless public buses initiatives which are :-
a. More bus services are rolled out to less accessible and ulu remote places. Commuters will find travelling more convenient going to work, study and play.
Not restrained by less bus services because unable to recruit more bus captains mainly foreigners to man the feeder services.
b. Also salaries of bus captains now pretty high $2,700 to $5,000 per month, with some even reaching $5,500 or more.
Can have more savings for bus companies translated into lesser needs to increase bus fares for commuters.
c. In longer run, can even extend the services of the bus after midnight - because only need to manage by a few central controllers at data centre working in 3 shifts (not constrained by lack of bus captains after midnight).
d. Theoretically need lesser bigger depots and interchanges because it can ply the roads continuously without the need to dock in depots and interchanges for bus captains to change shifts because they are remotely centrally controlled.
Only need charger stations to charge the driverless bus and then continue to ply the road.
Only need maintenance workshops.
LCL (Danny 心), [18/6/2025 4:55 pm]
I think driverless public buses can achieve these by plying these ulu routes.
LCL (Danny 心), [18/6/2025 5:34 pm]
That's why driverless public buses will have alot of merits if deployed.
Those are the roads that big public service bus cannot ply not enough drivers.
Private hire also don't want to go.
No profit.
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Straits Times UPDATED Jun 29, 2025, 07:28 PM
“There are residents who live in Punggol West who would like to be able to more conveniently have access to amenities in Punggol East, for instance, the wet market (and) the polyclinic,” said Ms Sun, who is MP for Punggol GRC.
“At the same time, we know there are residents who live in the eastern side of Punggol who want to have more convenient access to transport hubs like the bus interchange,” she added.
In the short term, the autonomous shuttles are expected to provide short, fixed-route services to various points within Housing Board estates, supplementing regular public bus services, taxis and private-hire vehicles.
In the medium term, this could be widened to include introducing services that are constrained by labour today, such as night buses, which can be run more frequently with driverless vehicles, Mr Siow said.
“It is a trip that maybe the taxi drivers or the private-hire car drivers may not really want to do, especially during the peak hour.
365, [30/6/2025 12:16 pm]
Maybe new bus model can have a gantry system at entrance and exit, should be just a switch, then see how engineers can work around the space. There's some models with automated platforms for wheelchair users now.
LCL (Danny 心), [30/6/2025 12:17 pm]
I saw the few news about AV buses and taxis in Guangdong.
Quite impressive.
Zero accidents.
So right technologies employed are the sure bet to ensure a good safety record that should include and not limited to:-
1. AI machine learning
2. Lidar
3. Radar
4. Camera based system
5. Sensors
6. Remote control from Data center.
7. 5G network must be always on.
8. Satellite GPS.
Note:- onboard computer is important - but not sufficient due to lack of processor power, storage space and limited access to external data.
LCL (Danny 心), [30/6/2025 12:21 pm]
Don't use Tesla AV technologies.
Accident prone - as he forgo lidar and radar - rely only on camera based system that is not safe and unable to respond in real time to road conditions.
LCL (Danny 心), [30/6/2025 12:24 pm]
Sorry should also include computer graphics - to reconstruct all the historical figures - like real people in historical setting.
Yesterday channel 5 - Jurassic dinosaur uses computer graphics as well to reconstruct.
It looks so real.
LCL (Danny 心), [30/6/2025 12:28 pm]
[28/06, 9:11 pm] ☸️ Danny 心: What information are transmitted between AV vehicles and data center?
[28/06, 9:11 pm] Meta AI: Autonomous Vehicles (AVs) transmit a vast amount of data to data centers for processing, analysis, and decision-making. Here are some types of information that are typically transmitted [1][2]:
- *Sensor data*: AVs are equipped with various sensors, such as cameras, lidar, radar, GPS, and ultrasonic sensors. These sensors generate a massive amount of data, including:
- *Images and video*: Camera data is used for object detection, pedestrian detection, and traffic light recognition.
- *Point cloud data*: Lidar data is used to create 3D maps of the environment and detect objects.
- *Radar data*: Radar data is used to detect speed and distance of surrounding objects.
- *Vehicle data*: AVs transmit data about their own status, including:
- *Location and speed*: GPS data provides location and speed information.
- *Acceleration and braking*: Data on acceleration, braking, and steering wheel angle.
- *System health*: Data on the vehicle's systems, such as battery level, tire pressure, and engine performance.
- *Environmental data*: AVs transmit data about the environment, including:
- *Weather conditions*: Data on weather conditions, such as rain, fog, or snow.
- *Road conditions*: Data on road surface, traffic signals, and road signs.
- *Control commands*: Data centers transmit control commands to AVs, including:
- *Route planning*: Data centers can send updated route plans to AVs based on traffic conditions.
- *Control inputs*: Data centers can send control inputs, such as steering wheel angle or acceleration commands.
This data is used for various purposes, including [3]:
- *Real-time decision-making*: Data centers process data from AVs to make decisions about navigation, obstacle avoidance, and other critical functions.
- *Machine learning*: Data collected from AVs is used to train machine learning models, improving the accuracy and reliability of AV systems.
- *Predictive maintenance*: Data centers can analyze data from AVs to predict potential technical issues and schedule maintenance.
The transmission of data between AVs and data centers enables the development of more sophisticated and reliable autonomous driving systems.
LCL (Danny 心), [30/6/2025 12:32 pm]
Another aspect, ensure cyber security must be robust.
Because hackers can potentially hack into AV buses on the road.
Fail safe switch maybe necessary to disconnect remote control if hacking is detected - and rely on onboard computer to navigate the AV buses until the threat of remote hacking is removed.
Jun Ming, [30/6/2025 12:38 pm]
As bus management is more complicated and people want job a staff need to station in every bus
Jun Ming, [30/6/2025 12:40 pm]
This is to allow passengers pay the correct fare and allow wheelchairs to board on
LCL (Danny 心), [30/6/2025 12:56 pm]
In a steady state, I can foresee that driverless AV is not a mass replacement of all driver vehicles because driverless technologies are still very constrained and need to operate in a tight controlled conditions.
Not a free flow, dynamic, crowded or ever changing road conditions that driverless technologies still cannot handle.
Hence for another few decades, I still envisaged the following hybrid public and private services transport mix :-
1. Driverless MRT
2. Public buses with drivers
3. Taxis
4. Private hire
5. People owning cars
6. PMA, PMD, bicycle
7. Driverless AV buses and taxis.
LCL (Danny 心), [30/6/2025 12:59 pm]
But new jobs for driverless AV buses and taxis could changed and NTUC, e2i must be ready to reskill, retrain and upskill existing drivers and depot workers.
But new high tech jobs will be created especially AI, engineers, programmers, IT jobs, IT operators in data center.
Demand for computer science, computer engineering, electronic and electrical engineering and mechanical engineering will ramp up.
Adam, [30/6/2025 1:53 pm]
I think the gov needs to think long and hard long term what our infrastructure should look like
Adam, [30/6/2025 1:53 pm]
Look at how cycling and pcn is implemented
Adam, [30/6/2025 1:54 pm]
The intention might be good but the implementation is horrendous
Adam, [30/6/2025 1:54 pm]
How can we be 'car lite'
Adam, [30/6/2025 1:55 pm]
Well take it as a learning experience. What went wrong, and how can we avoid half baked measures when moving to AV
LCL (Danny 心), [30/6/2025 1:58 pm]
New jobs will emerge with transition to autonomous vehicles: Acting Transport Minister | The Straits Times
https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/transport/new-jobs-will-emerge-with-transition-to-autonomous-vehicles-acting-transport-minister
REACH Singapore, [30/6/2025 2:00 pm]
📢 Topic 📢
LCL (Danny 心), [30/6/2025 2:01 pm]
That means, if drivers jobs feel unsafe or chances of being taken over by driverless AV vehicles, drivers must keep an open mind to get themselves retrained and reskill to take up new but higher paying jobs offered by the driverless AV vehicles.
LCL (Danny 心), [30/6/2025 2:01 pm]
Change is constant.
Adaptable to change is resiliency.
Adam, [30/6/2025 2:02 pm]
But you cant expect the 100k phv+taxi drivers to simply find a new job at a snap of a finger
LCL (Danny 心), [30/6/2025 2:03 pm]
The transition is at least a decade.
Adam, [30/6/2025 2:03 pm]
Yeah
Adam, [30/6/2025 2:03 pm]
Maybe the gov starts by stopping handing out license for phv and taxi
Adam, [30/6/2025 2:04 pm]
Perhaps there is an industry of more atas human taxi service, or taxi service to malaysia still need human
Adam, [30/6/2025 2:05 pm]
But for reskilling, the gov needs to think through this carefully. Lots of people find skillsfuture a waste of time and money
Adam, [30/6/2025 2:06 pm]
We need a program that somewhat guarentees a job if the ex driver gets a credential.
Adam, [30/6/2025 2:06 pm]
If they reskill but cert is useless then what?
Adam, [30/6/2025 2:07 pm]
Credential already prove they can do job but why cannot get?
LCL (Danny 心), [30/6/2025 2:07 pm]
There will still be a need to access to personalized service such as driver private hire or taxi:-
1. Eg. People going to airport with luggages.
2. Elderly going to hospital.
3. A family going out with barang barang.
4. Buying groceries.
5. Fetching babies.
6. Going out with elderly that need personalized service
Etc.
Adam, [30/6/2025 2:09 pm]
Sounds like some can possibly be replaced by AI driver with human helper passenger
Adam, [30/6/2025 2:09 pm]
Literally a AV with maid
Adam, [30/6/2025 2:09 pm]
Get maid salary
Adam, [30/6/2025 2:10 pm]
But for ambulance i dont trust AV yet
Adam, [30/6/2025 2:10 pm]
I wonder if scdf is considering it since the shortage of manpower
LCL (Danny 心), [30/6/2025 2:14 pm]
There's less and less incentive to own a car.
As now driverless vehicles are virtual and available on demand - even after midnight not constrained by availability of human drivers.
Coe as a result will fall to a sane-able level.
Adam, [30/6/2025 2:19 pm]
Or maybe the gov will make even more rent seekers out of us
Adam, [30/6/2025 2:19 pm]
People who buy coe with car will rent out the AV to AV ride hailing companies
Adam, [30/6/2025 2:20 pm]
Coe skyrocket and roads jammed with AV that never need to park
Nicholas, [30/6/2025 2:37 pm]
Would prefer auto vehicles to current arrangement. Costs to get a Grab / GoJek have gone up significantly, and there is a strange practice where driver makes you wait for minutes, then cancels when near your location, making you wait for another driver, hence unreliable especially when tight for time.
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