REACH 397 - What are your views on the new beverage container return scheme?
(SK)
21 Sep 2022 (10am - 7pm)
REACH
[10:01 am, 21/09/2022] +REACH: Dear Contributors,
Welcome back! π
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Megan π
[10:12 am, 21/09/2022] +REACH: π’ Topic π’
By mid-2024, consumers seeking to quench their thirst from a canned or bottled drink will likely have to fork out 10 to 20 cents more.
However, this extra cost can be redeemed if consumers return their empty bottles and cans for recycling at any of the beverage container return points islandwide.
π¬ What are your views on the new beverage container return scheme?
The new beverage container return scheme proposed by the National Environment Agency (NEA) was announced on 20 Sep (Tues).
Under the proposed scheme, a small deposit of between 10 cents and 20 cents will be added to the price of all pre-packaged drinks in plastic bottles and metal cans between 150ml and 3 litres.
Drinks will be labelled with a deposit mark and consumers can claim a refund of the deposits when they return their empty beverage containers to a return point. This redemption will likely be in the form of cash or digital transfer.
Return points will be set up at all supermarkets that are larger than 200 sq m. Other possible return locations include convenience stores and community centres.
The proposed scheme comes after extensive public engagement and aims to increase the recycling rate of beverage containers in Singapore to 80 per cent.
Public feedback is sought on the deposit amount, where the refund points should be and how the deposit should be refunded, among other things. Feedback can be given on the REACH website:
https://go.gov.sg/nea-bcrs
π https://str.sg/wK98
π https://str.sg/wQUT
----
[10:14 am, 21/09/2022] +Caleb: Like that still need to wash the bottle first before can recycle?
[10:15 am, 21/09/2022] +L or BL or Locker: How does the 20c get returned? not by coins I hope. That would be terribly inefficient.
[10:19 am, 21/09/2022] +Timothy Low: Will there be automated machines installed around the island so that the returns can be done more efficiently?
Perhaps can tie up with local banks or Grab or Google Pay so that the deposit returned can be immediately credited into Paylah, Google Pay, Grabpay or Paynow into bank account directly?
For those deposits collected and not claimed, what is NEA going to do with the money?
[10:22 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: To ensure this initiative is successful and sustainable, 400 collection points with only 1 unit of collector might not be sufficient. There need more machine in a popular area (unless the vendor clear the stock in hours daily and during the weekend)
[10:23 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: The project team need to evaluate all possible scenario and address the limitation, risk and overcome these before launching for a guaranteed successful initial
[10:26 am, 21/09/2022] +L or BL or Locker: BTW - I'm happy to see this initiative, but hope it is set up for success and not a waste of money and effort.
[10:30 am, 21/09/2022] +Stella Yip: Buy, drink, cannot put in recycle bin immediately, need to go find a nearby toilet to wash first? Or will G provide a washing area at to the collection place?
[10:31 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: I am quoting an example:- there was a recycling initiative in the past with a collector machine installed and operating in a mall to collect plastic bottles. It was discontinued after a period of operation, and no detail about where is the nearby machine available.
At the time, The machine could not cope with high demand and failed to serve residents. Plastic bottles that the machine fails to accept are then thrown into general waste Dustin nearby.
[10:33 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: Spent 20-30 cents go a public toilet to wash and search for the machine @ nearby?
[10:33 am, 21/09/2022] +L or BL or Locker: not realistic to expect people to wash and not efficient either
[10:34 am, 21/09/2022] +L or BL or Locker: best to wash all bottles at once as part of recycling process
[10:34 am, 21/09/2022] +L or BL or Locker: problem is that soda drinks will attract bugs
[10:34 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: I don't remember it is a practice to wash it when in state or other countries except in Japan. Can someone please enlighten me on this topic?
[10:34 am, 21/09/2022] +Linda Seng: Not everybody is willing to wash the canned or bottled drink if the machines are far away to return. They will rather drink finish and drop away at the nearby dustbin
[10:35 am, 21/09/2022] +Linda Seng: good point here
[10:36 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: Attract bug inside the machine? How frequent will the vendor collect the recycle items? Once a month?
[10:37 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: If bottles are kept not really a issue… I would say min..
[10:39 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: In Taiwan you see they clean the straws and clean chop sticks.. lol it about education and mindset I guess
[10:39 am, 21/09/2022] +typing: No need to wash - they get melted down.
[10:40 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Cause cannot crush.. empty bottle take up space.
Waste energy to crush every bottle every time as well.. lol
First world problems for automation
[10:41 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: But where to wash it? Will consumer rush to rinse before recycling or throw it in the dustbin after being consumed in Singapore, realistically speaking, if there is no law mandating it?
[10:41 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Actually they will wash is after the cutting phase… the residue affects recycling quality
[10:42 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: Part of the process in recycling
[10:42 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Is the food scraps or random stuff people add into the bottle will be a recycling problem
[10:43 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Empty bottle not wash no big deal… but if full bottle will affect transportation of the recycling material.. unwanted weight to transport rubbish to the centre for recycling
[10:44 am, 21/09/2022] +Uncle Law: Currently there is recycling machine around the island that consumers can exchange for points and rewards. Have to see data if it is working well
[10:44 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Of course washing helps to reduce the need for more water to clean the bottles… in turns reduce the effort to wash with more water
[10:45 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Is more of getting the culture there before we go into the details
[10:45 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: This is another scenario the project team needs to consider
[10:45 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: This still exists? Wow
[10:46 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: When got money I remembered it being very successful π€£
[10:46 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: The example I quote is part of this I think
[10:46 am, 21/09/2022] +Linda Seng: yes still exists
[10:47 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: Marvelous. πππ
[10:47 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: The parkway outside the NTUC one always see people bring big bag over
[10:47 am, 21/09/2022] +Uncle Law: Yes
[10:48 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: The can ones makes more sense in terms of profit.. plastic a bit too low in recycle value
[10:48 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: Cultural change may take years to cultivate
[10:48 am, 21/09/2022] +Uncle Law: I used them regularly
[10:48 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Wah
[10:49 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: No more in my area. I didn't see it after it was removed
[10:51 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: Hence, it is bringing up a point for consideration, is 400 sufficient islandwide? Or will other vendors collect these bottles and send them to 400 machines for recycling?
[10:51 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: That was years ago.. didn’t visit there for awhile..
[10:52 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: To be frank not very profitable… if not you see companies queue to take it in…
[10:52 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: Yea, sad as recycling a good initiative
[10:52 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Till plastic price gets too high… or oil gets high enough for the business to make sense
[10:52 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: The gap now still a bit wide
[10:55 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: https://www.greenvinesustainable.com/blog/canned-water-vs-bottled-water
[10:55 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: alumnimum content.jpeg
[10:56 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: Recycling is for sustainability, but I am not sure the 10-20-30 cents per bottle can attract vendors to achieve a successful aim. Agencies need to do more to make this project successful and become the beacon of light along ASEAN countries on recycling
[10:58 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: To you is small… but you work out the maths it makes sense
[10:58 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: 80-91 per barrel of crude oil and advancement of tech in the petrol chemistry industry, I don't think the plastic material cost is high.
[10:58 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: One bottle is about 12 g.. so 1 kg get about 80 bottles. Which means 1 kg you get $8 roughly
[10:59 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: One ton without selling value you get $8000/ton
[10:59 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Plastic is about $1000/ton
[10:59 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: Great, the pull factor for vendors is there, hence their service level should be marked to market
[10:59 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Recycled value
[11:00 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: PE/PP range around $1600 to $2200/ton
[11:00 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Recycled is $1000/ton or less… or off grade material can go as low as $500/ton
[11:02 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: So 10cent makes perfect economy sense for vendors.. but the country still not ready.
So more effort on vendor side to make it doable… handling so much sorting and dealing with the waste generated from sorting
[11:02 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: So the cost include waste treatment after warehousing, sorting and logistic cost
[11:03 am, 21/09/2022] +Uncle Law: The after collection efforts need to consider
[11:03 am, 21/09/2022] +Uncle Law: Manpower and resources
[11:04 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: Recycle of cans, and bottles may need to start everywhere in the office, at home, in the food court, in the mall, in the convenience shop, in the bus station, in MRT etc to cultivate a cultural change
[11:04 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: There can be exclusive deals for incinerator power generators to get slightly higher rate payment from recycling companies for their waste send by them. Or even offer free service to incentivise the effort.
[11:06 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Tax breaks for company or shopping more for having such effort. Reduce based on contributions to the effort
[11:07 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: When money comes in for incentives to reduce waste. Win win for both. No need out of pocket but effort on their end to reduce and get better tax break.
[11:08 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Lesser need for waste disposal on long run. When all have a home to go.
Organic for food recycling
Plastic for recycling
Etc
[11:09 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: The label of the drinks (can or bottle) maybe needs to be uniquely printed (aka a birth cert number of the drink). This unique number can be scanned in an app or matched from nea to track in the data pool and used for a refund. The custom authority also can use it for monitoring imports, and IRAS use the exact same data for GST tracking if required.
[11:10 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: That’s abit hard π unless we are FDA. Companies won’t want to be trace to that extent
[11:10 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: FMCG obviously are the biggest contributor of plastic waste
[11:10 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: Yea, FDA π
[11:11 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Plastic use is expect to double every 5 years…
[11:11 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Not within Singapore… but around the world.. as developing nations get more stuff and demand more imports
[11:12 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Plastic plant open every year… lol
[11:12 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: My company just announced 2 new plant within 3 months..
one in Singapore
[11:12 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: Collector machine in every 2 -3 block of hdb will ease the pain part of recycling bottle?
[11:13 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: Great, more jobs for Singaporean πππ
[11:13 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Err ok Lar… another 30 to 40 jobs? The rest will be foreign workers π€£ (60 to 80 more?)
[11:14 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Cause hard labour is tough to hire locals
[11:14 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: And don’t pay high enough
[11:15 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: Accumulated number of job created for singsporean will be quite significant πππ♂️
[11:16 am, 21/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Government plays a part in getting job… we expecting more from other sectors I guess…
Sanofi vaccine plant
Aramco rubber plant
And many others in the works to come in
[11:18 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: Yes, both govt and business are important in creating job πππ
[11:45 am, 21/09/2022] +SL: Appendix E mainly uses the example of Europe. Why Japan and USA are not in the list? π€
[11:50 am, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: 21 September, 2022
To: Our Distinguished Leaders, Renewables Experts (Including Karung Guni) and All Honorable Members
"The Karung Guni Approach Towards Recycling of Consumers' Waste (εζΆδΊΊ)"
Where are the Karung Guni (Rag-And-Bone Men)?
Besides aluminium cans, plastic bottles and papers to recycle, there are more things to consider to be included in this good initiative calls recycling. Haulding, may be one little unintended and accidental behavior to happen because there are 'values' in these recycleable items?
How about these Karungs?
All sauce bottles, milk and dairy cartons, all glass and plastic containers commonly found in groceries stores. Home furnitures seller like IKEA should be roped into this initiative too. IKEA could perhaps incentivise customers to bring in used or broken plastic or metal items that are HANDY to carry to the store for a 'token' as a offset to buy new items. How about furnitures? How about other stores similar to IKEA?
Next is home appliances seller like Gain City and many others, it should also incentivise their customers whom are buying a new TV, Computer, Fridge or Furniture to offset a small token (or free disposal) and carry away the old appliance and deliver the new one in one trip.
Finally, will the policymakers foot these big and bulky appliances back to back with the retailers for a small sum of say $2-$10 per item just to dispose off or better still to recycle and co-recover some money to be put into a 'GREEN piggy bank'?
Charlie Munger once said, "Show me the incentives and I will show you the outcomes!" Isn't it true and applicable to these two new habits of recycling and renewable
- - in progress - -
[0:27 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: https://sweden.se/climate/sustainability/swedish-recycling-and-beyond
[0:41 pm, 21/09/2022] +Guillermo Cabeza: I don’t think this scheme to charge a deposit will work very well because most people are not very sensitive to 10 cents compared to the inconvenience of taking (and maybe washing) the can or bottle to the drop off. For example: lunch - is every business going to have a collection box? HDB / condo / landed - how does this work with current recycling initiatives, or is the rubbish collection charge going to come down to account for items now having value? I’ve never seen overseas friends buy drinks from stores (where they are charged a bottle depo) and then take them back to get the deposit back.
[1:26 pm, 21/09/2022] +KSFoong: Soonest, our hawker centre and community will hv a group of drink cans collector willing to do this job for a living. Many consumers will not bother to keep their cans and bring them to the collection points for the refund.
[1:40 pm, 21/09/2022] +SL: Foreigners who visit Singapore for business, leisure, and stopover may need to register for the refund system, I think, in the future.
[1:53 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: 21 September, 2022
"The Zen Way of Social Etiquettes"
What so Zen?
Japan is a neat and gleem country? The Japanese believe they should be considerate to others.”
What is social consideration? A typical Japanese daily life starts earlier, for instance, office workers and shop staffs area cleaning their place of work!People take their litter home like picking up one's own rubbish. Students and community cleaning initiatives, picking up rubbish near their school together in their neighbourhoods.
By the way of life, no ones blow their noses in public. When people are feeling unwell they either stay home or they wear surgical masks to avoid infecting other people.
All the above are simple acts of consideration for others. Isn't it worth learning a bit of Zen?
- - in progress - -
[2:03 pm, 21/09/2022] +REACH: π’ Topic π’
By mid-2024, consumers seeking to quench their thirst from a canned or bottled drink will likely have to fork out 10 to 20 cents more.
However, this extra cost can be redeemed if consumers return their empty bottles and cans for recycling at any of the beverage container return points islandwide.
π¬ What are your views on the new beverage container return scheme?
The new beverage container return scheme proposed by the National Environment Agency (NEA) was announced on 20 Sep (Tues).
Under the proposed scheme, a small deposit of between 10 cents and 20 cents will be added to the price of all pre-packaged drinks in plastic bottles and metal cans between 150ml and 3 litres.
Drinks will be labelled with a deposit mark and consumers can claim a refund of the deposits when they return their empty beverage containers to a return point. This redemption will likely be in the form of cash or digital transfer.
Return points will be set up at all supermarkets that are larger than 200 sq m. Other possible return locations include convenience stores and community centres.
The proposed scheme comes after extensive public engagement and aims to increase the recycling rate of beverage containers in Singapore to 80 per cent.
Public feedback is sought on the deposit amount, where the refund points should be and how the deposit should be refunded, among other things. Feedback can be given on the REACH website:
https://go.gov.sg/nea-bcrs
π https://str.sg/wK98
π https://str.sg/wQUT
[2:06 pm, 21/09/2022] +Guillermo Cabeza: agreed - what I meant though is that in my experience these schemes (certain states in the US, Australia, Canada) don’t work. People buy a drink from 7-11 or a vending machine, pay the 10c, and then toss the drink into the rubbish bin.
[2:07 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: The deposit machine should be able to refund in coins and dollars.
One place for such machine is groceries store.
[2:08 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: Hawker center?
[2:16 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: Orchard Road broadwalk, NAC and Paragon area? Is the machine weather proof?
Shopping mall Car park especially there is a big groceries store in that Mall.
[2:18 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: People's Park and Tekka vicinities?
[2:20 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: Geylang Serai area
[2:25 pm, 21/09/2022] +RH: Shd place the collection machine next to the dispensing one.
More convenient.
Or hv a 2-in-1 machine.
Buy, drink, dispose, collect refund.
All in one.
[2:30 pm, 21/09/2022] +RH: It wud be extremely inconvenient if ...
... I hv to lug more than 1kg of used bottles & cans to wherever the mc is in order to claim my 10 cents per can/bott.
... The cost of my taking it ther (not to mention my physical constraints due to back injury - cannot lift heavy objects nor carry for long distance) is not justifiable for me.
... I wud just dump it in the blue recycling bin downstairs of my block!
... Wat if the recycling bin /depo refund mc is over full or runs out of change?
... Who is gg to manage the frequency of collection of the used cans/bottles?
... Who is responsible for topping up the mc w change ?
[2:32 pm, 21/09/2022] +RH: Ther has to be better alternative ways to encourage us to recycle more.
This proposal is too cumbersome! π
And may not last.
[2:33 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: Hi,
Use technologies to scan the locations and the available machines (filled ones would be reflected and of cos real time..
These machines come with CCTV too!
[2:33 pm, 21/09/2022] +RH: Look at the Return Tray initiative launched one year ago.
Is ther any review ?
Wat is the result?
I see ppl revert to their old habits in some places, leaving their trays behind.
[2:36 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: Hi RH, good point raised.
There will always be forgetful folks and lazy (simply bochap) folks too.
How about situations whereby be seniors just could not return those used utensils?
[2:41 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: How about our younger folks? Are they abiding this habit after finished eating in public?
Will fine suffice and erase such bad habit?
[2:42 pm, 21/09/2022] +SL: Yes, in the offices/restaurants/ mall, there got recycle bins. Observed that Ppl tend to throw away cans/bottles in general waste Dustbin if recycle bin is not nearby.
[2:43 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: How about those offenders, hawker center cleaner for a day?
[2:43 pm, 21/09/2022] +SL: Coins and dollars maybe run out fast in popular location
[2:45 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: Hi SL, good instinct.
Let the machine contains up to $500?
After all, there is a limit (capacity) to contain these cans and bottles, isn't it?
[2:51 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: Most importantly, this initiative (the process) must be FUN and rewarding (refundable) too.
"To change an old (any) habit, not only you need more than one new habit. You need to have a couple positive conditionings to achieve and erase prior bad habits."
- - annoymous
[2:52 pm, 21/09/2022] +RH: I actually witnessed able bodied cit , both young & old , walking away & leaving their trays behind.
All the rest u mentioned who r not able, r excepted .
[2:53 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: Fun is a positivity.
Refund is one condition.
Complex, Confusion and frustration are negativities!
[2:53 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: Bad social habit...
[2:54 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: Pls use Pavlov theory to amend tangibles and intangibles...
[2:54 pm, 21/09/2022] +RH: Lol.
[2:55 pm, 21/09/2022] +RH: Good idea.
Community service instead of monetary penalty.
Helps change mindset as one gains new perspective fr other side.
[2:55 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: Access to machine is another condition.
[2:57 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: "Only kena hawker centre cleaning",
one learns and appreciates a clean environment and the tough chores of a cleaner too!
[2:59 pm, 21/09/2022] +SL: Not sure will the Collector replenish the dollar and cents at the same time they empty the machine
[2:59 pm, 21/09/2022] +RH: How abt making clean up a national initiative once a month or qtr, sth like tt, to increase involvement & awareness?
CC, RC, PA, grassroots org can take the initiative.
Hv the clean up on a regular basis. Get residents to also bring their trash to recycle.
Make it a fun family recycling day ...
[3:00 pm, 21/09/2022] +RH: Good enuff for a start. ππ»
Esp for ppl who hardly get their hands "dirty" these days ....
[3:01 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: Is true!
Half of Singapore can afford paying fines but sure enough they would be very "pemalu" to be a cleaner for a day at the hawker center!
Isn't this true?
[3:02 pm, 21/09/2022] +RH: Yup yup!
Esp if u suddenly spot yr fren, nbr, colleague sitting ther, watching u.
Alamak! ☺️
[3:03 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: On the lighter tone, take this punishment as a community service and be considerate to many too!
Is it too much to enact such punishment for the "simply bochap" folks of any age?
[3:04 pm, 21/09/2022] +Caleb: Got to reg for paynow also. For cashless transaction payments
[3:11 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: Hi Caleb, good point!
Are these negative or positive attributes for our foreign guests?
Efficient?
[3:15 pm, 21/09/2022] +Caleb: Got to see the onboarding process. I know NETS is working with some countries to accept payment and we can use it on their country too.
[3:18 pm, 21/09/2022] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
Initial thoughts about recycling the beverage containers
1. When I hear the news yesterday about the container return scheme - 1st thought come to mind - won't it cause alot of inconvenience to the public?
a. Workers, students, shoppers who eat out in food court, hawker centre, fast food, restaurants etc need to carry their containers to a central place - queue up likely to be a long queue in crowded areas just to get a refund for their drink containers.
b. Housewives and elderly retirees at home need to accumulate the containers and then weekly, bi-weekly or monthly lug a big bag of containers to the supermarkets, cc or convenience store to join a long queue to get refund.
Wonder what if the refund machines run out of coins or notes or breakdown - and then they will have to lug their big bag home.
And all household now will have a secondary role of becoming a "garang guni" men or women - because if these containers accumulate - household become a hoaders - and if the containers are not wash - it will attract alot of ants, cockroaches and other pest.
Honestly, my initial feelings is quite unpleasant.
2. Then I happen to read a few articles about the dire consequences of global climate that have been affecting many Countries recently, from Asia, to Europe, to US, to Africa, to Middle East, to S America.
Droughts, dry up rivers, seas, flood, tornado, earthquake, extreme high temperatures exceeding 40 to 50 degree celsius etc that have been hitting many Countries - trouble my thoughts.
a. However, I start to rationalise, what effects that Singapore do will make the Global Climate improve --- being a little red dot and being a population of less than 6 million?
Is it worth our effort of recycling the containers?
3. Then supramundane thoughts arise :-
a. Even though what we do in our little red dot - by the definition of and computation from science and math - will have not much effect on improving the Global Climate - we need to do the right thing, conform to the right values --- so that we will reap good outcomes and act as catalyst for other Countries to follow the good examples.
If every Countries do the same, then waste can be cut down and containers can be recycle for reuse - and these will have a positive impact on the Global Climate.
b. When this happens, the World will improve on the carbon emission, less pollution to the sea, envrionment, landfill to hold the waste etc - and the World will face less extreme climate, less drought and flood - and crops can grow to feed the World population.
4. The vicious cycle of karma - will rectify by itself if every Countries and population do the right things.
5. An overnight thoughts plus my close friend comments :-
"Personally, I'm ok with the proposal. I practised re- cycling for several years. Just not sure if the general population are willing to do it."
"Question is will you do it? I'm always the one in the family collecting and consolidating recyclables and another household member bring them to recycle bin. It's a habit to cultivate."
My comments :- "I need to change my habit. Later I will pen down my thoughts."
====
[3:23 pm, 21/09/2022] +L or BL or Locker: Please be careful of the gender bias:
[3:24 pm, 21/09/2022] ☸️ Danny εΏ: Housewife and Househusband.
[3:24 pm, 21/09/2022] +L or BL or Locker: π
[3:49 pm, 21/09/2022] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
Pitfalls and ways to make recycling containers convenience and successful
1. Working people, students, travellers, shoppers etc eating in food courts, hawkers centre, f&b, restaurants, school canteen etc --- will be unproductive for them to go to a central location and join a long queue to get their refund from a vending machine.
Some may fidget on the machine trying to learn how to use the machine or the machine run out of coins or notes or breakdown unable to refund.
Do we expect these people to carry one or a few reused containers on their hands back to office, classrooms, shoppers, travellers carry them around doing shopping or bring it home or to hotels ---- like "garang guni" men or women?
Soln :- Upon completed drinking, they will just need to return to the drink stall to exchange their containers with the stall owners and get a refund.
The stall owners upon collection - at the end of the days - a recycle company will collect from the drink stalls for recycling at no cost (as the recycling company can earn by recycling the containers and resell the containers).
In these way, drink stall owners no need to queue at the refund machine - to refund hundreds of used containers on behalf of their customers.
[4:11 pm, 21/09/2022] +REACH: π’ Topic π’
By mid-2024, consumers seeking to quench their thirst from a canned or bottled drink will likely have to fork out 10 to 20 cents more.
However, this extra cost can be redeemed if consumers return their empty bottles and cans for recycling at any of the beverage container return points islandwide.
π¬ What are your views on the new beverage container return scheme?
The new beverage container return scheme proposed by the National Environment Agency (NEA) was announced on 20 Sep (Tues).
Under the proposed scheme, a small deposit of between 10 cents and 20 cents will be added to the price of all pre-packaged drinks in plastic bottles and metal cans between 150ml and 3 litres.
Drinks will be labelled with a deposit mark and consumers can claim a…
[4:12 pm, 21/09/2022] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
2. Housewives, Househusbands, Elderly retirees (men or women) - will have to play an additional role of :-
a. Making sufficient spaces at home to collect reusable containers for recycling.
At the same time, ensure that the recycled containers will not accumulate to a point that it take up too much spaces at home, become a hoarder of waste and worst result in a fire hazard.
b. Wash and rinse the resued containers at home to ensure it will not pose a hygiene risk - attracting ants, cockroaches, lizard, mosquitoes, houseflies ro other pests.
c. Household will need to ensure they buy a large bag to bring the reused containers to a central location such as supermarket, CC, or convenience store to put in the reused container one-by-one to get the refund - hopefully the refund machine got sufficient coins, notes or will not breakdown.
My nearest supermarket is 1 km away. Once this supermarket is doing a renovation for 1 month - I got to lug my trolley 5 km away for the next nearest supermarket.
So if the refund machine breakdown --- and cannot refund, it means they will have to lug it back home --- follow by "don't know how many letter words"....
Soln :-
a. The best is for refund machine to be place in every HDB block -- if too costly, can be every 2 or 3 blocks per HDB, private condos, or landed houses per one refund machine.
These will make it convenient for household to refund their reused containers as household will only need to walk down to the nearest block with refund machine.
Also it will cut down the long queues unlike needing to go to a central location - km away.
If one break down in the block, household only need to walk to the nearest few block away to refund their containers.
Unlike if refund machine breakdown in a supermarket, CC or convenience store --- got to walk 5 km away to the next nearest supermarket, CC or convenience store.
Even if the supermarket, CC or convenience store are nearby, the whole precint household congregate over the weekend to refund their reused containers --- long queues will form.
Also how many refund machines are expected in one vicinity to cut short the queues?
[4:25 pm, 21/09/2022] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
1. In addition, spaces is limited and very compact in a supermarket or convenience store, even the CC.
- There are many queues to pay the cashier and self check out counters, got toto/4D queues - that encroach into shopping shelves space.
Now with queues for reused containers - carrying big and bulky bag --- how much spaces left for shoppers?
- This will be worst for convenience stores - whose space are even more limited. People carrying big bag to refund reused containers - will choke up the convenience store (outside and inside) --- and shoppers will have little space.
- CCs have people queueing up to sign up for activities, previously long queues for vaccination, queues for collecting cash vouchers etc
Now another long queues congregate with people with big bags to refund reused containers.
I am talking about a precint all congregating towards the CC in weekend or weekdays - one CC per town.
*Also one important consideration, what is the capacity of the refund machine?
Can it hold one hundred containers?
What happen if few hundred or thousand containers need to be refund?
If full, will people need to lug their big bag around searching another places for refund?*
2. So unless the refund machines is distributed conveniently - few blocks HDB, condo or private houses --- recycling of beverage containers will be more successful and more convenient for the public.
But it come with cost - because I believe the refund machine is not cheap.
Wonder who foot the bill?
[4:26 pm, 21/09/2022] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
1. In addition, spaces is limited and very compact in a supermarket or convenience store, even the CC.
- There are many queues to pay the cashier and self check out counters, got toto/4D queues - that encroach into shopping shelves space.
Now with queues for reused containers - carrying big and bulky bag --- how much spaces left for shoppers?
- This will be worst for convenience stores - whose space are even more limited. People carrying big bag to refund reused containers - will choke up the convenience stors (outside and inside) --- and shoppers will have little space.
- CCs have people queueing up to sign up for activities, previously long queues for vaccination, queues for collecting cash vouchers etc
Now another long queues congregate with people with big bags to refund reused containers.
I am talking about a precint all congregating towards the CC in weekend or weekdays - one CC per town.
Also one important consideration, what is the capacity of the refund machine?
Can it hold one hundred containers?
What happen if few hundred or thousand containers need to be refund?
If full, will people need to lug their big bag around searching another places for refund?
2. So unless the refund machines is distributed conveniently - few blocks HDB, condo or private houses --- recycling of beverage containers will be more successful and more convenient for the public.
But it come with cost - because I believe the refund machine is not cheap.
Wonder who foot the bill?
[4:29 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: 21 September, 2022
"Everyone becoming One (ζηδ½ θΏζ ·ε，ζδΉθ·ηδΉδΈδΉ)"
What If?
Should a society turning towards a healthy 'Karung Guni'
behavior, what's wrong and what's going to happen next?
Perhaps and hopefully all will learn the concepts of usefulness, wastefulness and reusing things for a longer time before disposing them?
So how?
As for those recycling 'vending' machines, it work simply by throwing cans or bottles into a big inlet hole, after machine counts, out comes the refunded money in dollars or cents.
So what?
When many of these receiving machines malfunctioning for whatsoever reasons (full, no power, no money, breakdown-mechanical and/or electronics) so what should civic minded people do?
Definitely don't kick or shake the machine! Simply go bac…
[4:29 pm, 21/09/2022] +RH: Qn: I m very concerned as flw..
** Is having more machines being environmentally friendly?
** wat happpens to these machines if they r no longer in use or upgraded in future?
[5:09 pm, 21/09/2022] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
1. Basically if people need to lug big bags to a far location to refund their beverage containers.
2. Stuck in long queues for hour(s) to get their refund - over weekend or weekdays.
People can better spend their time in better things then stuck in the queue or travel far distance to refund the containers.
It will be a failed project and inconvenience the public.
It has to be convenient, nearby, easy to refund and not stuck in queues.
[5:11 pm, 21/09/2022] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
Just a note.
My nearest supermarket is at least 1 km away.
The nearest cc is even further away.
[5:12 pm, 21/09/2022] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
My relatives supermarket and CC are few km away.
[5:13 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: “NOT ALL OF US CAN DO GREAT THINGS. BUT WE CAN DO SMALL THINGS WITH GREAT LOVE.”
- - MOTHER TERESA
[5:21 pm, 21/09/2022] +Rama: Agree
[5:39 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: Hello Andrew, how are you?
[5:44 pm, 21/09/2022] +Rama: Surviving
[5:44 pm, 21/09/2022] +Rama: You?
[5:48 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: Wait and see how Mr Putin next steps go, otherwise Great too!
[5:54 pm, 21/09/2022] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
Now recycling bin is downstairs in every HDB block.
People who want to recycle just bring their containers down and dump it in after sorted out at home.
But this refund machine is a totally different dimensions.
Also it is found only in central areas far away from home.
[5:54 pm, 21/09/2022] +Rama: Good poker game he is playing!
[5:57 pm, 21/09/2022] +SL: Russia just announced the mobilization of 300k personnel to contain nuclear blackmail.
[5:58 pm, 21/09/2022] +Rama: Γx convict!
[5:58 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: Hi Danni,
Perhaps, one could also see the urgency to faster this Recycling mindset to more locations and accessible too.
Remember we have a 2030 Green plan that is counting down...
[5:59 pm, 21/09/2022] ☸️ Danny εΏ:
Well NEA will have to consider all the feedback before implementation.
[6:00 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: Multi ministries approach and perhaps MSW heading it?
[6:03 pm, 21/09/2022] +REACH: π’ Topic π’
By mid-2024, consumers seeking to quench their thirst from a canned or bottled drink will likely have to fork out 10 to 20 cents more.
However, this extra cost can be redeemed if consumers return their empty bottles and cans for recycling at any of the beverage container return points islandwide.
π¬ What are your views on the new beverage container return scheme?
The new beverage container return scheme proposed by the National Environment Agency (NEA) was announced on 20 Sep (Tues).
Under the proposed scheme, a small deposit of between 10 cents and 20 cents will be added to the price of all pre-packaged drinks in plastic bottles and metal cans between 150ml and 3 litres.
Drinks will be labelled with a deposit mark and consumers can claim a…
[6:05 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: More than 3 decades, in the US, there are machines taking in beer and soda cans for Quarters (25¢). One big black disposal bag will yield closed to US$5.
So where to find so many drank cans?
University dorms especially on Sunday mornings(those uni kids are drunk and hangovers)!
That's one trick of this Recycling game for underfunded/self funded students to tap into..... those FUN days!
[6:26 pm, 21/09/2022] +L or BL or Locker: https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2022/sep/21/children-as-young-as-nine-say-they-are-ill-from-work-recycling-plastic-in-turkey?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other
[6:26 pm, 21/09/2022] +L or BL or Locker: Need to be careful where we send our plastic for recycling
[6:45 pm, 21/09/2022] +REACH: Dear Contributors,
⏰ We will be closing the chat in 15 minutes ⏰
Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.
Goodnight!
Megan π
[6:59 pm, 21/09/2022] +Smiley face: 21 September, 2022
To: Our Distinguished Leaders, Green Experts and All Honorable Members
"Leaders do make mistakes"
Mistakes & Breakthroughs:
Recalling decades ago, Morris Chang, founder of TSMC,"the learning curve cost perhaps is one big success and breakthroughs for us..."
Likewise Nicholas Negroponte, the founder of MIT Media Lab once said in 1990s that "the valuation of a bit is determined in large part by it's ability to be used over and over again..."
By applying two proven methods, can we also think the same for the future of recyclings and Green ways?
- - in progress - -
[7:01 pm, 21/09/2022] +REACH: Dear Contributors,
We will be closing the chat for today.
Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.
Goodnight!
Megan π
=====
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