REACH 194 - Which part of Budget 2021 resonate with you (SK)
17 Feb 2021 (11am - 7pm)
REACH
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[11:00 am, 17/02/2021] +REACH: 📢 Topic 📢
💬 Which Budget 2021 measures resonate with you?
Deputy Prime Minister and Finance Minister Heng Swee Keat delivered the Budget 2021 statement in Parliament on Tuesday (Feb 16). This year's Budget, titled Emerging Stronger Together, combines measures to help families, workers and businesses weather the COVID-19 crisis in the immediate term, with measures to accelerate structural adaptations for the long term.
Some key highlights are:
▶️ S$900 million Household Support Package to help families with expenses
▶️ S$5.4 billion boost to SGUnited Jobs & Skills Package to support hiring of 200,000 locals and provide up to 35,000 training opportunities this year
▶️ Jobs Support Scheme extended for worst-hit sectors as part of S$11 billion COVID-19 Resilience Package
▶️ Support for low-wage workers, lower-income families, children with special needs and charities
▶️ More incentives to encourage early adoption of electric vehicles
👉 https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/budget-2021-heng-swee-keat-emerging-stronger-covid-19-singapore-14208888
👉 https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/budget-2021-singapore-jss-household-support-package-covid-19-14209224
[11:05 am, 17/02/2021] +Ben: All 5 listed are good measures, in the order you have listed.
[0:17 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
In the order of preference:-
1. Create jobs, keep jobs, provide training to help to secure jobs. (Government provide fishing rod so that people can fish on our own - is the best).
2. Support worst hit sectors so that when pandemic is over - the business and workers can stand on their feet.
3. Support for low income families and provide some financial assistance to household to help tying over the pandemic come next.
4. As for electric vehicles - not enough charging points. Also not sure whether electric vehicles are reliable - still a question mark.
[0:21 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
1. One happy thing to note, our Sovereign funds again has shine - as they earn a higher NIRC passive income in 2021 compare to last year.
2. 2021 - $19.56 billion.
2020 - $18.14 billion.
3. A 7.8% increase - very good performance.
[0:22 pm, 17/02/2021] +Caleb: 👍
[0:22 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
https://www.straitstimes.com/asia/se-asia/indonesia-makes-covid-19-vaccines-compulsory-allows-for-private-vaccination Indonesia is the 1st Country that make covid-vaccination compulsory.
[0:25 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
1. And notice something, Indonesia decides to make covid vaccination compulsory - I think the 1st Country to do so.
2. Should observe how they are doing vis-a-vis how Israel, UK, US are doing who adopt voluntary stunt (but are progressing well in their vaccination efforts).
[0:32 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
I can't see any charging points in HDB estate, private housing and condo.
Imagine buy an electric car, how to charge?
Or drive to somewhere, run out of battery, where to charge?
Got to call tow truck.
[0:45 pm, 17/02/2021] +Alvin: It’s good for all the budget measures but $11b for the JSS and Resilience Package a wee bit too much.
[0:45 pm, 17/02/2021] +Alvin: My 2.14 cents
[0:47 pm, 17/02/2021] +Berny: Hdb: I've seen some at jurong east area,
Condo: the place I work at already has them installed.
To install the charging station, it is not as easy as it seems, the upfront cost is high and not many is willing to spend that amount for the 1-2 individual, especially in mcst setting (private property)
[0:52 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
That's is why buying electric cars now is a risk.
Not enough charging points.
Reliability a question mark.
[0:53 pm, 17/02/2021] +Berny: Unless someone up there drop some heavy incentives
[0:56 pm, 17/02/2021] +YT: So, I am wondering whether electric cars are any cleaner than combustion engine ones. What generates the electricity to run these cars? In my opinion, it's shifting the emissions from cars to the power plants. Unless and until there are ways to generate clean energy (solar, or other means), electric vehicles will only be a cosmetic solution to the climate problem, at least in the context of Singapore. Incidentally, there were no clean energy mentions in the budget.
[0:57 pm, 17/02/2021] +Caleb: Buying clean energy from Malaysia or Australia right?
[0:58 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ken: Clean energy is not cheap 😅
[0:59 pm, 17/02/2021] +Caleb: I thought we very clean liao
[0:59 pm, 17/02/2021] +Caleb: With natural gas
[0:59 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ken: Lol a way to drive economy and prepare and understand then economy of EV overseas to see if we can have a role in it
[0:59 pm, 17/02/2021] +Caleb: And incineration
[0:59 pm, 17/02/2021] +Leonard Lau: Precisely .. that’s why the culprits are the petrol cars generating co2
[1:00 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ken: Incineration is more for waste treatment to reduce land fill only... by product is electricity
[1:00 pm, 17/02/2021] +Leonard Lau: Ev is a new industry where We can participate and grow with it
[1:00 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: I'll be standing by if anyone bothers about my opinion
[1:01 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ken: Will be the next big thing I guess.. hence we keep trying to woo big EV companies to setup here
[1:01 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ken: So we can have supply chain capacity
[1:01 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ken: ?
[1:02 pm, 17/02/2021] +Leonard Lau: Ifs the sophisticated components and technology that we want to be in
[1:02 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Electric car price still very high, some higher than petrol car.
[1:02 pm, 17/02/2021] +Caleb: I guess the key here is to reduce total vehicle population?
[1:02 pm, 17/02/2021] +Leonard Lau: It will just go cheaper when the cost of battery falls
[1:02 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ken: Not easy to move like pharma
[1:03 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ken: Hence we looking into bring them in
[1:03 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ken: Also can provide for the rest of the Ev that will eventually pop out
[1:03 pm, 17/02/2021] +Leonard Lau: Yes . Agree . Thus we got to initiate and hope to gain some first mover advantage
[1:03 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ken: automotive standard is similar to pharma super hard to replace once confirm
[1:04 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ken: Cause if the paper work involved
[1:04 pm, 17/02/2021] +Leonard Lau: Yes .. manufacturing as well as communication protocols .. it is the compliance part that we got our SG brand to uphold the standards
[1:06 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: Supply vs Demand, as always
[1:12 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: Electric cars are cleaner than ICEVs only on the street
What you said about shifting emissions is totally true, and some people will brand this as "big oil agenda" when it's not. It's simply us seeing the truth for what it is.
And what is the truth? E-mobility is just another excuse for people to get rich under the guise of "going green" 🤢🤮. Raw battery materials as we know it come from mines, meaning they're non-renewable (school term, anyone?)
Yes, some companies vow to avoid cobalt since it's also infamous as a conflict raw material (Congo, anyone?) but ultimately no matter if it's Lithium, Manganese or whatever, these are all limited. Plus, mining them are even more polluting. And when you manufacture batteries out of them, pollution adds on.
The transition is simply happening too quickly which is why we need to reduce the number of EVs through the advocacy of shared mobility (despite the pandemic).
[1:13 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: I remember there was this news clip from ABC Australia that "Singapore has not made any moves" or something like that even though yes, this was a high profile piece of news many months back
[1:13 pm, 17/02/2021] +Alvin: 👏🏻👍🏻
[1:13 pm, 17/02/2021] +Alvin: Very well articulated bro
[1:14 pm, 17/02/2021] +CQ: 👍🏻
[1:15 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: And that is true. But people never stop at "very clean liao".
As much as we know that natural gas burns cleaner than coal, people simply don't choose to stop at that and want even cleaner alternatives. So people talk about photovoltaic, wind, tidal, nuclear even.
As per my last rant, it's up to the NCCS to find the most viable solution out of all the evils out there. No energy source is truly clean.
Solar: Clean first, toxic later
Wind: Well land is an obvious issue
Tidal: Not strong enough
Nuclear: Is a no-brainer
[1:16 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: We have a role to play especially with Hyundai/KIA (they're actually part of the same group for those who don't know) investing here to build a smart factory to manufacture EVs
Too bad we have to play ketchup on the world stage, or we will lose out in many ways, while it may not be the best for our country, or the world at large
[1:17 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: And it's a good by-product
Waste-to-Energy is one of the good innovations out there
[1:18 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: The government will no doubt work on introducing more incentives to encourage the purchase of EVs (something already seen elsewhere in the world).
Reaching cost parity with ICEVs isn't too far-fetched as compared to a few years ago now
[1:20 pm, 17/02/2021] +Leonard Lau: The End game for SG is to compete with a advantageous Carbon footprint . Currently SG is at a huge disadvantage.
[1:35 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: Oh yes to add on,
ICEVs are obviously unclean
And to some out there, EVs are not clean, they're merely "cleaner" because of the particulates from braking
See, even when the traditional emissions isn't there from the tailpipe anymore, people still talk about other forms of emissions that were unheard of before EVs were a thing
And this is just talking about the tailpipe, without accounting for the shift as YT and I mentioned just now and before respectively
[1:37 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ben: Well, you're right. We need to use solar, tidal and wind to generate electricity with less enviornemntal damage. That us happening. With EV there is also no smoke blowing in the faces of children as they walk to school.
[1:38 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ben: Yes, we can be a world leader in this tech.
[1:39 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ken: Don’t think so... we are a bit slow in that field don’t even have car manufacturers here 😅
[1:40 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ben: Thumbs up to Shared Mobility!
[1:40 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: I have also mentioned something about maintaining diesel vehicles before. Back then when Euro 5 (or EEV) was the latest standards, you can already see black smoke coming out from some of the buses
The importance is maintaining your vehicles so even though they are diesel, they will still be "as clean as can be"
I won't be surprised if I see any Euro 6 buses emitting smoke cuz SBS Transit's maintenance is simply a joke
[1:43 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ben: No? https://www.todayonline.com/singapore/construction-hyundais-electric-car-manufacturing-plant-singapore-begins
[1:43 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ken: Lol so did dyson, only up and running then consider bah
[1:43 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: Also apart from full electric, we should also look into hydrogen fuel cells (that disappeared into oblivion many years ago when we had those YOG buses from Higer) and there's biogas to look at as well
Of course if we want to look at the TCO, we have to account for the total expense (as well as the pollution at the expense of the environment) when we import whatever we have to import
The nearest biofuel source we have is Malaysia as per a World Biogas Association report I read recently
[1:43 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ken: Many suppliers lose tons of money on dyson first round
[1:44 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: I doubt Hyundai/KIA will do a runner like Dyson dyd cuz they do have all the intention to look for talent and had this acceleration programme I mentioned before
[1:46 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ben: Fair point
[1:46 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: Furthermore, it's not just on the mobility front since the plant itself is touted as a "smart factory"
[1:46 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ben: Not sure these are well suited to SG roads?
[1:46 pm, 17/02/2021] +Leonard Lau: Yes we are playing catch-up .. SG is light years behind when come to EV.
[1:46 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ben: The TESLA now on sale in Singapore..
[1:46 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: You're concerned about the top speed and acceleration right? LTA confirm will limit one, they also not so stupid one lol
[1:47 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ken: Yup DBS have loan for Tesla also
[1:47 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ben: Yes, drivers here are not very proficient. Hope the Tesla can self park....
[1:47 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: Esp with the recent Tanjong Pagar incident, highlights the concern about speed all the more
[1:48 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ben: Education too, such a sad story.
[1:49 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ken: They are all youngster that are doing quite well in life 😔
[1:50 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: This can ultimately be better monitored with the advent of Intelligent Transport Systems (ITS). Perhaps someday a system can monitor overspeeding, over-revving, etc
I believe ITS can help us a lot in the near future
[1:54 pm, 17/02/2021] +Valli: 👍
[1:54 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ben: Satellite tracking, which I understand us coming, will spot this
[1:55 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: Satellite tracking of every vehicle might be a little too intensive, but perhaps matching a vehicle's top and average speed to the max and average speed band of a specific stretch of road of concern to LTA/TP could help in safety
[1:58 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: Leveraging on the ERP 2.0 interface, that itself can be a V2X (Vehicle to Everything) kind of technology
No more SAF 9th Core Value (for those who get it) once ITS solutions such as this are implemented
[1:59 pm, 17/02/2021] +Valli: All cars in Spore should come fixed with a speed limit where they cannot go above this limit.
Just sad that 5 young lives just gone with the wind. And leaving their parents & families really heartbroken.
[2:01 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: Rather than fixed limit, there's this geofencing technology in the ITS world which could be used so it can further improve safety and we could couple this with that rough idea of mine of detecting what stretch of road a vehicle is on and then applying the limits accordingly
So let's say instead of a uniform max of 90 or 100 km/h for all roads, every road (and stretch) has its different speed limits
[2:01 pm, 17/02/2021] +Rama: Commercial vehicles has a beeping device that is activated when going above the set limit but nothing more.
[2:03 pm, 17/02/2021] +Valli: Every night at Clementi Ave 6 , can hear cars revving and zooming pass at high speed .
I hope the authorities can look into this.
[2:03 pm, 17/02/2021] +YT: Five lives lost because of their own doing. If they were pedestrians walking and minding their own business but got mauled down by speeding driver, then it is an accident. In this case, it was self inflicted. Never mind how successful they were, how charitable and caring they were. This was preventable and avoidable.
[2:03 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ken: Lol CTE every night also have lor
[2:06 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: Here's a slide from some ITS4Climate webinar I attended - while the focus of this webinar was climate, we can also see some safety aspects included in this
[2:08 pm, 17/02/2021] +richard Wong: When driving EV to malaysia, where to charge when battery running Low ?
[2:09 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: Another point everyone should also worry about is even when they have the charging facilities, will they match the standards of whatever the cars have? I know some organisations like CharIN are trying to standardise the same standard across the ASEAN region but I haven't heard much from them afterwards
[2:12 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/tanjong-pagar-crash-video-shows-girlfriend-of-driver-running-straight-into-burning-car
Very graphic video of how the car lose control, spun around, bang into a shophouse, burst into flame and how the girlfriend run straight into the fire.
[2:16 pm, 17/02/2021] +Thomas: Another point is the time to charge a car can be an hour to a few for full charge. Unless you can attain 10 or 15 minutes charge time, then is feasible for a charge at petrol kiosk
[2:18 pm, 17/02/2021] +Thomas: Our electricity grid may not be able to support sudden up swing of electrical load if high ev cars on the road
[2:25 pm, 17/02/2021] +Berny: can support, but need LEW to do some works
[2:26 pm, 17/02/2021] +Berny: it's about 5.5k per lot, excluding the LEW fee, change of lot size fee, application to relevant authorities etc
[2:27 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: I think his point is about the time
Ultimately if everyone drives an EV to charge at one same place, that place will become congested, and that's already a known problem in the e-mobility community long ago so some came up with solutions to divert EVs to other charging points and to work on software to optimise charging time based on traffic waiting for a charging lot
[2:27 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ben: Yea, maybe just track the driver's phone, we can do that for 5 million people, can maybe do it for 200,000 cars....
[2:28 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: Why track the driver's phone? It will cause another privacy uproar.
[2:29 pm, 17/02/2021] +Berny: next stop: government ask us go ev so they can track us
[2:29 pm, 17/02/2021] +Berny: confirm happen
[2:30 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: Not necessarily. It's not going electric that allows them to track us, it's the implementation and introduction of the ERP 2.0 system which is the telematic system that will track you.
[2:30 pm, 17/02/2021] +Poh S. Lim: According to ST News report, the driver had already driven down that stretch of road thrice earlier but at a lower speed, and the accident occurred on the fourth time at the higher speed. That fact plus the fact that the driver’s fiancée was nearby indicates intent to speed, with reckless driving. It is like tempting fate. That four others were in the same car is tragic as five lives were lost immediately. The driver had obviously lost control sine the car was spinning 180 deg. It is sad and tragic has all were young men who had so much potential and so much to live and look forward to.
[2:30 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ben: Lol I was joking when you said it would be hard to track the car.
[2:30 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: I didn't say it was hard, I said it would be intensive
Two different meanings altogether
[2:31 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ben: Ok, when you said it would be intensive to track the car :)
[2:31 pm, 17/02/2021] +Leonard Lau: Watch the video closely .. the driver was avoiding a vehicle before it went out of control . There could be a change of road condition that he didn’t anticipate
[2:32 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: Basically if you come up with a joke without thinking it through, expect logical rebuttal so yeah 🤷♂️
[2:36 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ben: Ok, I can play too. You said it would be intensive to track all the cars in Singapore. I joked that we already track 5 million mobile phones, so maybe just track the driver's phone instead of the car. It's not a very funny joke, so I get why you questioned it. 😆
[2:37 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: I don't get your point of raising this anyway, seems like you're just trying to pick a fight when I have no hostile intentions and am merely stating my opinions based on what I know about the ITS industry sector
[2:37 pm, 17/02/2021] +REACH: First shipment of Moderna's Covid-19 vaccine arrives in Singapore
The first shipment of Moderna's Covid-19 vaccine arrived in Singapore on Wednesday afternoon (Feb 17).
It is another step forward in the Republic's bid to control the Covid-19 outbreak.
More: https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/transport/first-shipment-of-modernas-covid-19-vaccine-arrives-in-singapore-on-feb-17
[2:39 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ben: Way over my head, I must have missed a few messages. I too have no hostile intentions.
[2:42 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: There are many other tech out there which we can rely on that doesn't use satellites, potentially making it easier and faster
V2G (Grid), V2I (Infra) and V2X (Everything) tech are such examples
There also technologies like MQTT for communication so I thought leveraging all these rather than just falling back to satellite-based options would be worth thinking about
[2:46 pm, 17/02/2021] +Valli: Going forward, likewise for mobile phones & computer cables & probably electronics,
there should be a global understanding & implement a common charger, cable.
This will cut down on electronic waste.
[2:47 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: Totally understand your point about standardisation but call me a preacher if you will, I talked about how people come up with tons of standardisations in the name of standardisation to standardise other standardisations but in the end, there are more and more standards, how to standardise? Lol
[2:48 pm, 17/02/2021] +Murphy Choy: Standards are just like guidelines. The companies exploit this to create customised solutions to make more money.
[2:49 pm, 17/02/2021] +Murphy Choy: Well that happens when the standards are not integrated.
[2:49 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: https://www.charinev.org/about-us/vision-mission/
For EVs, here's CharIN which I mentioned, who are behind the CCS charging plug standard
[2:55 pm, 17/02/2021] +Valli: We should have a global controlling body similar to WHO for health, one controlling voice for Global Waste to make this reality.
For a better future Smart Techno World .
[2:58 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: I must say today's discussion was really fruitful even though it's not directly related to the actual topic of Budget 2021, but I hope there will be an ESC on environmental and sustainability issues soon and find the best solutions and alternatives
[3:10 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Question to ask - why a car accident can trigger such a big fire?
Is it a poor car design that trigger this?
BMW seems to have a higher chance of triggering a fire.
[3:18 pm, 17/02/2021] +Leonard Lau: It was reported widely in US and Europe of BMW caught fire after collisions . Also there were questions why the rear wheels were locked up which led the car to skid .
This one is multi-facet since the driver could be down to inexperience , vehicle mods which may led to the tragedy.
Obviously , TP may not be a good place for test drive and they were instantly punished when a mishap occurred .
[3:20 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
The crash may injured the occupants.
The fire kill them.
[3:21 pm, 17/02/2021] +Leonard Lau: Most likely especially at least one may not be belted up .
[3:31 pm, 17/02/2021] +Rama: Believe it was a two door car so rear passenger less chance of escape even if not belted up.
[3:31 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
The next question to ask is the car manufacturer liable - as car in a crash should not trigger a fire.
[3:33 pm, 17/02/2021] +Rama: New vehicle should be under warranty so manufacturer has to commend on probable cause.
[3:34 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
If a car in a crash trigger a fire - then it is design fault and car manufacturer will have breach car safety.
[3:35 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
That's it is design not fit for purpose and safety.
[3:36 pm, 17/02/2021] +Leonard Lau: Someone has to start the ball rolling .
The convenient way is for the car company to push the responsibility to the driver and expert opinions may swing to BMW favour in this case .
Hence it is always good objective to suspect the car mechanisms first before investigating the driver .
[3:38 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
The driver is responsible for speeding, but if the car is known to crash and can trigger a fire at a high speed crash - then I think car manufacturer is equally liable to design a car that breach safety.
Else they will have to limit the maximum speed.
[3:38 pm, 17/02/2021] +Leonard Lau: Yes .. in US and Europe , people always question the car first not the human especially fires etc . Eg. Honda and Toyota was found guilty covering up mechanical and safety issues in the 90s. People has to question the machine
[3:39 pm, 17/02/2021] +Leonard Lau: Yes . M4 is a gentleman’s toy . It supposed to keep the driver safe after collision .
[3:39 pm, 17/02/2021] +YT: What a mess. So much resources expended just because some people didn't use their brains and decided to do a street race. Fire fihhters, police, paramedics, doctors, insurance, etc., so, why are people still saying this is a tragic event? It was preventable and avoidable. Hope people will get this straight.
[3:40 pm, 17/02/2021] +Rama: Social media picked up that the driver might not have a driving licence. If so, is it a perquisite to buy a car in Singapore at the show room?
[3:40 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
LTA may need to consider studying the safety of imported cars that can trigger fire upon impact.
This will make car manufacturer accountable in car safety.
[3:46 pm, 17/02/2021] +Leonard Lau: Yes . LTA got to get behind this fault and understand it . If this car caught fire at TP, it may just blew up on any expressway too.
[3:47 pm, 17/02/2021] +Leonard Lau: The driver has a license and he has been driving overseas too.
[3:48 pm, 17/02/2021] +Bobby Tan: Just made it compulsory to test drive car before buy. Test drive needs to produce driving licence.
[3:49 pm, 17/02/2021] +Leonard Lau: Isn’t this a existing rule ? We have to produce license when test driving ?
[3:49 pm, 17/02/2021] +Bobby Tan: All two doors cars that got back seats need a equipment behind to break the glass to get out in emergency.
[3:50 pm, 17/02/2021] +Bobby Tan: Many ppl buy without test drive as sometimes queue too long.
[3:50 pm, 17/02/2021] +CQ: It was a second hand car if I recall correctly from another report...
[3:50 pm, 17/02/2021] +Bobby Tan: Yes and we not sure how many modifications were done to the car.
[3:52 pm, 17/02/2021] +Leonard Lau: Yes . What was the quality of the car ? How come it was sold to the driver lower than expected sum ? Many questions still unanswered .
[3:53 pm, 17/02/2021] +Leonard Lau: I think in this case , the driver has not trial the car detailed enuf before it put on a test .
[3:54 pm, 17/02/2021] +Bobby Tan: Yes I believed so
[3:56 pm, 17/02/2021] +CQ: that's a question for the inquiry, the information isn't publicly available. but i don't think the pricing is that far off.
[4:03 pm, 17/02/2021] +Leonard Lau: Yup .. let’s await the report .
[4:17 pm, 17/02/2021] +REACH: 11 new Covid-19 cases in Singapore, including 1 in community
There were 11 new coronavirus cases confirmed as at Wednesday noon (Feb 17), taking Singapore's total to 59,821.
They included one community case, said the Ministry of Health (MOH). There were none from migrant workers' dormitories.
More: https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/11-new-covid-19-cases-in-singapore-10-imported-1-in-the-community
[4:55 pm, 17/02/2021] +REACH: COE prices end lower at latest tender
Certificate of entitlement (COE) prices fell across the board at the end of the latest bidding exercise on Wednesday (Feb 17), continuing a mostly downward trend from the previous tender.
The premium for commercial vehicles fell by the largest margin, about 10 per cent, after hitting a three-year peak two weeks ago.
More: https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/transport/coe-prices-end-lower-at-latest-tender*
[5:04 pm, 17/02/2021] +Bobby Tan: Link not working
[5:05 pm, 17/02/2021] +Linda: https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/transport/coe-prices-end-lower-at-latest-tender
[5:06 pm, 17/02/2021] +Bobby Tan: Thanks
[5:07 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: Didn't work cuz of the asterisk which they wanted to use to bold the text
[5:47 pm, 17/02/2021] +XaniceAfcai: Did u report to oneservice app and call neighbourhood police?
I did when I encounter this at wee hrs. These not only create noise pollution, endanger life and public nuisance.
[5:48 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: The root cause is the workshop target them
[5:49 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: Heavy fine force closure
[5:49 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: Is a open secret which are some of these so call workshop that dealt with these rice boi mordifications
[6:15 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
https://abcnews.go.com/US/mysterious-bmw-fires-continue-calls-investigation-grow/story?id=60843215
[6:16 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心: https://www.thesun.co.uk/motors/8544496/bmw-fire-coolant-warning-letter/
[6:17 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5049045/BMW-recalls-one-million-luxury-cars-fire-fears.html
[6:19 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
I think the tanjong pagar BMW - fire on impact deserves a review on car safety especially if it could trigger a fire upon impact.
[6:27 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ken: Quite a lot recently 😅
[6:28 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: have to see where the fire started if engine is usually short circuit
[6:28 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: if fuel tank there are proven science that it does not explode easily on impact
[6:29 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: anyway lets not take the focus away where the cause is speeding not the fire
[6:29 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: so what shoudl be done to better curb speeding on rd by all forms of vehicals
[6:31 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: in fact TP and regulators should do more to show to the society that THEY DO NOT GIVE IN TO expensive cars (urban legend is tp dare not find fault with luxury cars continental espically
[6:31 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: thus we see more rice boys in VW / Beemers / merc dress as amg class
[6:33 pm, 17/02/2021] +CQ: Since when does TP give face to luxury cars?? In fact it's the contrary, they pay closer attention to these cars which can run!
[6:34 pm, 17/02/2021] +Berny: This is my personal and humble opinion ah
[6:35 pm, 17/02/2021] +Berny: Most people, staff, residents, workers, most of them like to wait till something happen before somebody starts investigation and rectifying that fault
[6:35 pm, 17/02/2021] +Berny: I heard that area is particularly famous (heard ah, could be fake news) for having cars zooming down the street
[6:36 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: go see the mod compare to normal cars den u know ...
[6:37 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: maybe the work on the concept innocent till guilty ?
[6:38 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: hahahaha
[6:38 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: proven guilty ?
[6:38 pm, 17/02/2021] +Berny: This mindset is wrong to begin with
[6:38 pm, 17/02/2021] +Berny: Thats why police and mrt always announce, see anything or anyone suspicious, call 999
[6:38 pm, 17/02/2021] +CQ: So should be guilty until proven innocent?
[6:39 pm, 17/02/2021] +Berny: Dont wait till bomb explode then say: oh ya, this weird guy always loiter there, oh ya, i saw the bag with wire sticking out, etc
[6:40 pm, 17/02/2021] +Berny: My choice of words might be wrong ah, but theres no foresight
[6:42 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: please lah read what the ground says is not as if these comments are based on hear says
[6:42 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: that area how many feedback had been put in
[6:42 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: if action is take will such happen ?
[6:42 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: there is no smoke without fire
[6:42 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: sometimes certan things in society have to give some attention else it will spread like cancer den something major will happen
[6:42 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: is a good reminder to those in public services why must be so defensive
[6:43 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
1. LTA may want to consider 2 classification of speeding.
- speed exceed 20 kmph above speed limit - consider speeding and should be impose with current penalties and fine.
- 2nd category - any speed limit exceeding 50kmph or involve in car racing with other cars or with modified cars - should be categorised as "car racing".
Penalties should include "mandatory jail sentence" plus hefty fines and banned from driving for at least 5 years.
This will provide sufficient deterrence.
[6:44 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: should not it be innocent till proven guilty? i thought is always that case?
[6:44 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: Penalties should include "mandatory jail sentence" plus hefty fines and banned from driving for at least 5 years. ->>> thsi one good plus canning if possible
[6:45 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: but i think there was a case involving 2 cars before i forget the sentence is at lim chu kang
[6:45 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Caning too serious - only for violent criminals.
[6:46 pm, 17/02/2021] +CQ: Yes it is. It's always innocent until proven guilty. But to say that this mindset is wrong to begin with..... I don't know, maybe I misunderstood the message
[6:46 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: workshop that do illegal mod should be fine also
[6:46 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: that will deter the source to mod
[6:47 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
How does the car pass the inspection test if car modified.
[6:47 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: and those wanna be workshop who thing they know what they are doing but endangering the lives of others
[6:47 pm, 17/02/2021] +CQ: Speeding above a certain limit already attracts mandatory DQ. Can't remember for how long
[6:47 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: open secret ->
[6:47 pm, 17/02/2021] +Berny: Remove mod, put stock parts, go test, pass, put back mod
[6:47 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
LTA let it pass?
Cannot be.
[6:47 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: before inspection go back same workshop tear out all mod make it as original as possible
[6:48 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: inspection pass put all back
[6:49 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: and the workshop sometimes provide a package
[6:49 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: including SURE pass situation ..
[6:51 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Time for LTA to raid all these workshops that do illegal modification.
[6:51 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: it had been there for years
[6:52 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: raid den will go under sea den after x period will surface again
[6:53 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: bottom line which i hope we all dun forget
[6:53 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: speeding is wrong espically in Singapore our road are so congest and small
[6:54 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: drink driving shoudl be maid a canning crime
[6:54 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: made sorry hahaha
[6:55 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: by doing this are we limiting the passion of motor sports
[6:55 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: no .. u wanna speed and have fun go sepang or gudang up north and do up the car properly
[6:56 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: those are control environment where damaged can be controlled
[6:59 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ben: Maybe swap a Golf Course for a Race Track, takes up less space and can charge the same amount!
[7:00 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: hahahahah wait long long
[7:01 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: wait they tell u have mah road safety park hahahah
[7:09 pm, 17/02/2021] +Rama: 2nd category attractive
[7:10 pm, 17/02/2021] +Rama: Definitely
[7:11 pm, 17/02/2021] +Rama: Add retake highway code and driving lessons.
[7:12 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Car racing is a menace and a nuisance in our road.
It serve no purpose except cheap thrill - but threaten the safety of the population on the road.
Law must catch up to stamp the disapproval.
If people like car racing - join formula one.
If not don't do it on our road.
[7:12 pm, 17/02/2021] +Alvin: I rarely agree with you but this I totally doubly second your idea
[7:17 pm, 17/02/2021] +Caleb: 👍
[7:19 pm, 17/02/2021] +Rama: Totally agree
[7:24 pm, 17/02/2021] +REACH: $870m aviation support package to pay up to 50% of wages from April to September: MOT https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/870m-aviation-support-package-to-pay-up-to-50-of-wages-from-april-to-september-mot?&utm_source=whatsapp&utm_medium=social-media&utm_campaign=addtoany
[7:48 pm, 17/02/2021] +Desmond Koh: more than 40 km/h, offenders will already be prosecuted in court and subject to a jail term of up to 10 years.
[7:48 pm, 17/02/2021] +Desmond Koh: https://sso.agc.gov.sg/Act/RTA1961?ProvIds=P1IV
[7:49 pm, 17/02/2021] +Desmond Koh: LTA is a very messed up statuary board... our govt should looks at how other first world countries manage their land transport
[7:50 pm, 17/02/2021] +Desmond Koh: I’m saying they are messed up due to the previous bike sharing and MRT issues....
[7:50 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: Hahaha you and I need to have a cuppa and rant face to face
[7:51 pm, 17/02/2021] +Desmond Koh: LTA still have hardworking officers la
[7:51 pm, 17/02/2021] +Desmond Koh: But IMO they are the worst SB in SG
[7:52 pm, 17/02/2021] +Desmond Koh: looks at so many POH that took over transport portfolio and left the politics 😂
[7:53 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: Simi is POH ah?
[7:54 pm, 17/02/2021] +Desmond Koh: Political Office Holder
[7:55 pm, 17/02/2021] +Nat: Hahaha not say they no substance or what lah but have to press on if they kena arrow to be Tpt Minister
[8:00 pm, 17/02/2021] +Rama: On par with!?
[8:09 pm, 17/02/2021] +Desmond Koh: Hong Kong, Taipei and Tokyo 😬
[8:19 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
For car racing, propose "1 strike you are out".
2 strike is not a deterrence.
[8:31 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Classifying a separate category call "car racing" as an offence - denotes disapproval of car racing on our road.
[8:32 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
Which should be separated from "speeding".
[8:32 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: speeding or racing is just a thin line
[8:33 pm, 17/02/2021] +Kevinn Wang: if i need to race i need to step on the gas usually
[8:34 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
1. Speeding could be due to rushing for time.
2. Car racing is a deliberate car race for cheap thrill.
[8:34 pm, 17/02/2021] +CQ: whether it's "racing" or "speeding" is about the objective in flooring the accelerator. you can be a speedster without racing because there's no "competitor", likewise you can be racing but when you're in a chui car, you might max out at 120.
[8:34 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
1. Speeding don't modify engine.
2. Car racers do.
[8:35 pm, 17/02/2021] +CQ: unless the message to be sent is "i don't care what's the reason. if you cross into a certain speed, you hit this penalty."
[8:37 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
1. Speeding - agree with current penalties - where repeat offenders can be jailed.
2. Car racing - is for cheap thrills and car competition.
[8:38 pm, 17/02/2021] ☸️ Danny 心:
1. Speeding - 2 chances.
2. Car racing - 1 strike you are out.
[8:45 pm, 17/02/2021] +REACH: Dear Contributors!
⏰ We will be closing the chat in 15 minutes ⏰
Megan
[8:46 pm, 17/02/2021] +Alvin: I somewhat agree with Danny. Need to split category. If the person caught racing says he’s just speeding then check his car for mods immediately. If got mods you will get penalized simple as that.
[8:46 pm, 17/02/2021] +Alvin: Gdnite Megan
[8:48 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ben: In the UK there is careless driving, fine and points; then there is reckless driving which is a ban, and jail if there is accident.
[8:49 pm, 17/02/2021] +Bobby Tan: Good night Megan
[8:49 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ben: Anyone dies and manslaughter charges will be added.
[8:49 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ben: I think we need time to pause and reflect in light of this human tragedy, but clearly a change is needed to stop it again.
[8:50 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ben: As much for the protection of young people who get drawn into this behaviour, as well as bystanders who are at risk too.
[8:51 pm, 17/02/2021] +Ben: Good night!
[9:01 pm, 17/02/2021] +REACH: Dear Contributors,
We will be closing the chat for today.
Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.
Goodnight!
Megan
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