REACH 479 - What are your views on Singapore's national security? What more can be done to strengthen Singapore's resilience to combat national threats?

(SK)

 26 Jul 2023 (10am - 7pm)

REACH

26/07/2023, 9:45 am - +REACH: *Dear contributors,* 

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26/07/2023, 9:59 am - +REACH: *📢 Topic 📢*

Singapore’s Internal Security Department (ISD) said that terror threats in the region have persisted over the past year, and extremist groups like the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria (ISIS) view Singapore as a prized target for attacks. In its annual terrorism report, ISD said that the central message of defending oppressed Muslims continues to have traction online.

*💬 What are your views on Singapore's national security? What more can be done to strengthen Singapore's resilience to combat national threats?*

A recent Ministry of Home Affairs (MHA) survey found that about 37% of Singapore citizens and permanent residents would contact the authorities if they believed their loved ones were displaying signs of radicalisation.

The findings from MHA’s survey, conducted from October to December 2022, come amid an assessment by the authorities here that while Singapore has no imminent terror threat, it continues to be a target of terrorist elements.

ISD said that youth radicalisation is a growing concern here, with social media and gaming platforms being used as channels for recruitment into terror groups.

Those getting radicalised by groups such as the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria (ISIS) in Singapore are also getting younger.

👉 https://str.sg/iifw

👉 https://str.sg/iixF

👉https://www.mha.gov.sg/mediaroom/press-releases/singapore-terrorism-threat-assessment-report-2023

26/07/2023, 10:01 am - ~ REACH Phone 2 changed the group description

26/07/2023, 10:01 am - ~ REACH Phone 2 changed this group's settings to allow all participants to send messages to this group

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26/07/2023, 10:23 am - +Smiley face: "Our enemies are not demons, but human beings like ourselves..."

- - Lao Tzu

26/07/2023, 10:24 am - +Smiley face: "Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed. This world in arms is not spending money alone. It is spending the sweat of its laborers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children. This is not a way of life at all in any true sense. Under the clouds of war, it is humanity hanging on a cross of iron."

- - President Dwight D. Eisenhower, Washington 16 April, 1953

26/07/2023, 10:25 am - +Smiley face: <Media omitted>

26/07/2023, 10:35 am - +Rama: The threats are ever evolving. Have to keep pace and stay on top

26/07/2023, 10:43 am - ☸️  Danny 心: 

1. Community alertness to sign of radicalisation is key to combating terrorism.

2. 37% of Singaporeans and PRs willingness to report to authority of sign of radicalisation from their loved ones is far too low.

3. Reporting to authority will not harm their loved ones, but in fact preventing their loved ones from committing harms to others and society as well as themselves.

4. If their loved ones are not stop, detained, counsel and rehabilitated by the authorities, their loved ones may gone into a path of no return if they commit any terrorist acts.

5. Hence community and families members reporting of any radicalisation is an important step to stop and combat terrorism.

26/07/2023, 10:46 am - ☸️  Danny 心: 

6. Else if terrorism is committed, not only will innocent people get harm, the perpetrators will also be injured or killed in the process by the security forces.

7. So reporting of radicalisation is the most sensible way to prevent and combat terrorism.

26/07/2023, 10:58 am - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Cyber vigilance and surveillance

1. As youth are self radicalise online through videos or gaming, surveillance and vigilance in the cyberspace become imperative.

2. With the help of AI and security software, constant surveillance by cyber security and blocking of terrorist sites, communication channels as well as gaming become critical - to prevent youth or people surfing the terrorists sites propagating terrorism propaganda.

3. Detection of youth and people surfing the radical sites become imperative - and proactive actions must be taken to reach out to such youth or persons who often visit such sites to prevent radicalisation.

4. Mainstream religious institutions and teachers must play a part imparting right and wholesome values to those youth and people influence by radical sites and teachings - to promote kindness, peace, harmony, tolerance, compassion, inclusiveness and able to coexist peacefully with people from other faiths.

5. Combating terrorism cannot be left to chance.

26/07/2023, 12:15 pm - +Smiley face: 26 July, 2023

" You Planned smartly and You Rehearses and They are Planning, Planting and Prospecting...?"

Remembering February of 2008, Mas Selamat and his window of escapement...?

A golden opportunity wide open!

Now, let's reimagine, one day in the midst of a National Celebration and a lone drone missile from outer space not only undetected by radars but at hypersonic speed, zeroing into this venue. One and is all done! 

So besides the usual security checks, pre-event intel info and all land, air and sea secured during this big event, what other areas of possible penetration? (loopholes)

     - - in progress - -

26/07/2023, 12:17 pm - +Smiley face: Next,...

" the business of finding the loopholes"...

26/07/2023, 12:57 pm - +Smiley face: "The Mechanics of Terror" 

You seen and you know and you think you got it all learned!

Parts?

All terrorists attacked, there are insiders who betray the security system for benefits of all sorts!

No matter how you prepares, there are loopholes and loopholes are the best forte of the terrorist organisation!

So how to find the loopholes? Is like finding a coin in the ocean? Or is it possible to haul these coins up?   

         - - in progress - -

Next: The Moving Parts?

26/07/2023, 1:12 pm - +Smiley face: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dzhokhar_Tsarnaev

Archetype: Terror Type #1 

" You think he must be crazy and in his world all folks are crazy!"

- - anonymity

26/07/2023, 1:17 pm - +Frankie Wee: Why they want threat terror? Maybe 🤔 because of they want freedom and own religion then follower believers. Or did he learned from super hero affected wrong behaviour.

26/07/2023, 1:19 pm - +Rose M K Ho: Er ... hm ....

I think after all 👆🏻is said & done, ther is still the need for 

_Human Communication & Education_

We hv to get to the _root cause_ of _why_ these youths seek self-affirmation thru such channels / medium.

Everyone of us plays a part.

Mostly, parents.

If parents r too busy, dun hv time, dun spend enuff time, dun care about .... their children, esp during their teen years when youths r most vulnerable,  that can gv rise to a host of problems later on, as such youths seek answers.

On the other hand, if such youths do not turn to their parents but seek solace elsewhere, tt is also a problem. 

We need to hv more ppl on the ground to educate, to counsel such youths, spot such problems and nip it in the bud before it gets worse. 

But as always, it takes 2 hands to clap, and is easier said than done. 

Perhaps, start w roadshows, talks in schools on a regular basis? Appoint a teacher in charge in each sch to spot such teens / counsel them ? 

Just some very basic thots ... 🤔

26/07/2023, 1:20 pm - +Frankie Wee: Parent also can teach bad kids they learned from them

26/07/2023, 1:20 pm - +Smiley face: Belief systems, most instances are internalised...

26/07/2023, 1:21 pm - +Rose M K Ho: Parents shd also monitor their kids' use of social media ...  

Unfortunately,  fr my observations, many parents in SG just dun hv the time, or dun bother or r themselves not even savvy w using the fone or familiar w the social media websites.

26/07/2023, 1:22 pm - +9richard: ask a secondary kids what is terrorism, 8 out of 10 would give you a blank look, secondary education should be taught current affairs, my view

26/07/2023, 1:22 pm - +Frankie Wee: Singapore more security cctv everywhere in public. But not perfect anytime terror threat will bomb hide

26/07/2023, 1:22 pm - +Rama: 😳🤦‍♂️😞

26/07/2023, 1:23 pm - +Smiley face: Hi Rose, well said and elaborating facts!

In this generation of digits and instant and quick information about the world (war)...

It's the connectivity of the mobile devices; the starting point to all things including Petty crimes to the crime of terrors!

Forget about Syria or Iraq! The possible terror haven can be in the Nordic countries, it is not appropriate to name these countries in these public discussions...

Thank you, Rose!

26/07/2023, 1:24 pm - +Frankie Wee: Ai network system terror threats

26/07/2023, 1:24 pm - +Rama: Nothing to shy about which country or where terrorism propagates!

26/07/2023, 1:26 pm - +Frankie Wee: Singapore is worrying they ppl don’t know how to handle when there is terror attacked they have not strong psychological skills and physical.

26/07/2023, 1:26 pm - +Smiley face: Hi Frankie! You are a smart investigator

HITECH terror organisations...they scam, they peddling drugs and they smuggle all sorts of things including human too ... highly vicious!

This is Archetype Terror type #5

Thanks.

26/07/2023, 1:26 pm - +Smiley face: Existential and practical observations!

Excellent, Frankie!

26/07/2023, 1:27 pm - +Rama: Absolutely True!

26/07/2023, 1:27 pm - +Smiley face: This message was deleted

26/07/2023, 1:27 pm - +Rama: Iran, Lebanon etc

26/07/2023, 1:33 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

1. Nowadays, CCTV is deployed quite widely throughout our country.

2. In HDB flats, in crowded areas, vital installation.

3. Video analytic driven by AI can do a real time analysis of suspicious behaviour on the video images collected online in the vast array of CCTV eg. People loitering in certain places doing reconnaissance, people carrying weapons such as knife, guns etc, or people behaving violently, running etc.

4. This will pre-empt and alert security forces of impending terrorism activities or incidence - and can take immediate actions to suppress and eradicate violence before it become worst.

26/07/2023, 1:36 pm - +Smiley face: This message was deleted

26/07/2023, 1:38 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

5. Collaboration with foreign intelligence notably with regional security forces and afar is very crucial to pre-empt any foreign activities that will trigger any events domestically.

6. Collaboration with social media platforms to screen and take down all terrorism messages, videos, and propaganda is necessary.

26/07/2023, 1:39 pm - +Smiley face: Like asking an "Asian" origin person to be trained in Iran or Lebanon or whatever?

Remember, language is one key to adapt and adopt before indoctrination  can begin... how about food?

26/07/2023, 1:41 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

7. All checkpoints must thoroughly screen visitors coming into Singapore - to ensure no infiltration of foreign terrorists to commit terrorism.

26/07/2023, 1:41 pm - +Rama: It has happened

26/07/2023, 1:45 pm - +Smiley face: Old ways

26/07/2023, 1:45 pm - +Smiley face: The archetype of a terrorist type?

26/07/2023, 1:47 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

8. Encrypted end to end communication media is often use by terrorists to coordinate terrorist activities.

Hence ability to work with the media developer to screen such communication channels become important - to stop and take preemptive actions before it materialise become necessary. <This message was edited>

26/07/2023, 1:47 pm - +Rose M K Ho: Agree.

26/07/2023, 1:48 pm - +Smiley face: They know and you know but they do know how to circumvent from the point of entry to the procurement of weapons....under the radar or above the radar or on the spot of things?

26/07/2023, 1:48 pm - +Frankie Wee: Hardly through the person that’s has acknowledged before enter Singapore. He can purchase hardware then make use any of the liquor to weapon himself and prepare for terror attack.

He sacrifice himself life and death threat.

26/07/2023, 1:49 pm - +Smiley face: Technical.... another archetype #2

26/07/2023, 1:54 pm - +Smiley face: How about Asian Chinese in Africa?

26/07/2023, 1:55 pm - +Frankie Wee: Have not heard in news

26/07/2023, 1:55 pm - +Smiley face: The highest archetype of terror is to destroy and escape...

26/07/2023, 1:56 pm - +Rama: Haven't heard

26/07/2023, 1:56 pm - +Smiley face: Loopholes.... Frankie....

"The safest place is the most dangerous... like our internal security and places...?"

Thanks Frankie for bringing it up.

26/07/2023, 1:57 pm - +Rose M K Ho: 👍🏻 Current Affairs ...

Good topic to be introduced to Sec schools ...

MOE shd think abt incorporating this in their text books. 

Teach kids the good & the bad abt current affairs & politics. 

Our next gen cannot remain _clueless_ abt such things ...

Current gen parents r not entirely tuned in to such topics either , fr wat I observe ard me ... or they dun discuss w the kids.

It seems to be like Sex Education was previously frowned upon in my gen.  But look, they hv now incorporated it in schools , so at least our kids know abt the birds and the bees.

Only now, we need to teach them abt the monsters and the ghouls .... 🤔

26/07/2023, 1:57 pm - +Smiley face: Then you start connecting a few dots...see if it fits in... the rest will be no history!

26/07/2023, 1:58 pm - +Rama: History there is but with some dots only

26/07/2023, 1:58 pm - +REACH: *📢 Topic 📢*

Singapore’s Internal Security Department (ISD) said that terror threats in the region have persisted over the past year, and extremist groups like the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria (ISIS) view Singapore as a prized target for attacks. In its annual terrorism report, ISD said that the central message of defending oppressed Muslims continues to have traction online.

*💬 What are your views on Singapore's national security? What more can be done to strengthen Singapore's resilience to combat national threats?*

A recent Ministry of Home Affairs (MHA) survey found that about 37% of Singapore citizens and permanent residents would contact the authorities if they believed their loved ones were displaying signs of radicalisation.

The findings from MHA’s survey, conducted from October to December 2022, come amid an assessment by the authorities here that while Singapore has no imminent terror threat, it continues to be a target of terrorist elements.

ISD said that youth radicalisation is a growing concern here, with social media and gaming platforms being used as channels for recruitment into terror groups.

Those getting radicalised by groups such as the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria (ISIS) in Singapore are also getting younger.

👉 https://str.sg/iifw

👉 https://str.sg/iixF

👉https://www.mha.gov.sg/mediaroom/press-releases/singapore-terrorism-threat-assessment-report-2023

26/07/2023, 2:00 pm - +Smiley face: On social media...

"When 1 million on-line viewed blackpink is great...when 10k viewed the killings of things is the start of connecting the dots and how about that 1k viewed online on how to dismantle or build a home weapon for self defense...that's near the dotted dots...?"

26/07/2023, 2:01 pm - +Smiley face: Think of ratio...

26/07/2023, 2:02 pm - +Smiley face: For terrorism, you avoid creating your history...

Thanks Andrew.

26/07/2023, 2:18 pm - +Rama: Inevitable

26/07/2023, 2:26 pm - +Smiley face: The big thing turned into small matter and matters solved.

How you solved it!

(大事变成小事，事情就解决了。)

26/07/2023, 2:28 pm - +Rama: Small things can become big too!

26/07/2023, 2:33 pm - +Smiley face: For foreigners entering into SG, regarding multiple entries or first timers...

The mobile phone numbers must be monitored into our ISD or SIB databases...

It's about surveillance of the unintended ones!

26/07/2023, 2:33 pm - +Rama: Agree

26/07/2023, 2:34 pm - +Smiley face: Our "secret servicemen" know it all...

26/07/2023, 2:34 pm - +Smiley face: However...

26/07/2023, 2:34 pm - +Rama: Yes

26/07/2023, 2:49 pm - +Smiley face: Would you sport checks on business people on-board business class or would you spot check the diplomatic suitcases?

26/07/2023, 2:53 pm - +Smiley face: Andrew, something for you think it over.... Here it goes!

26/07/2023, 2:53 pm - +Smiley face: 5 May, 2022

The Economics of Refuge: The Good, The Bad and The Ugly!

"Is the World population getting older since post WW2...?"

The top four nations with the most refugees are Turkey (3.6m), Iran (3.4m), Columbia (2.5m) and Germany (2.1m). 

Looking back at Germany's refugees policy, perhaps it may be the correct calling and credit to the former Chancellor Angela Merkel.

With over 1.3 million Syria refugees, Germany has managed to turn around these extra human into the new contributors of its economy. Comparatively, to raise a naturally born German baby to an adult will cost E$60,000 and longer time to fruition. Whereas to place a refugee age 17 to 25 cost at most E$10,000 to train and educate and consequentially top up the labor shortage especially in the lower rank of skill jobs, plus, half of these refugees have landed jobs and they also raise Germany's retirement funds.

So when a country's population is ageing at an accelerated rate,  one way is to admit new people into its country to not only contribute but to sustain the necessities of living. It is now or never; it is a generational gap to fill and not letting this gap of ageing grow bigger that eventually becomes hopeless to salvage.

The Bad?

Crimes and clans are two existential threats of social disconnect between the two camps that is the refugees and the local population.

The ugly?

Terrorism...

    - - in progress - -

26/07/2023, 2:54 pm - +Rama: Shocking but true

26/07/2023, 2:55 pm - +Smiley face: More....

26/07/2023, 2:55 pm - +Rama: <Media omitted>

26/07/2023, 3:11 pm - +Smiley face: 26 July, 2023

Identity!

Is it true that for most international passports, the passport holder's origin place of birth is indicated in it? A Singapore passport holder can be born elsewhere as indicated in his or her passport? Is it true?

How about for the visa-free (visa) incoming visitors for short or long term can be asked to present a second ID to proof the authentication of identity. Are there dates of issue and  expiry date in these nation's ID card whether is a driver's license or medical card or citizen card or social security card or credit card? 

Are all the above thoroughly true? And can all of these IDs be excellently fabricated?

What next?

     - - in progress - -

26/07/2023, 3:15 pm - +Smiley face: Bank in the data!

26/07/2023, 3:20 pm - +Frankie Wee: This answar is true 

Some ppl happen place of born at taxi, hotel, flight, workplace or pre-arrive KKH. There will recorded certificate of birth in place.

26/07/2023, 3:23 pm - +Smiley face: Randomisation of checks and balances for discrepancy of crimes?

In structured or in stratified or in cluster format.

Perhaps, these are the various security protocols to try it out! What's Hitler Generals loved and called Blitzkrieg!

- in search of the loopholes -

26/07/2023, 3:44 pm - +Smiley face: How to quantity and qualify a check?

Whether it is a plane load of passengers, cargos and luggages; the order of importance. The criteria is in the population itself, this case is a plane full of various nationalities. The key is to identify transit passengers, the nationalities and the point of embarkation and the rest of the packing order. 

Transiting passengers (shortest staying time with connecting flights) is worth looking at as it can be an archetype #3 that is the "connector or messenger" of terror! In the worsening case, they may be the ultimate archetype which is "to execute and run off" !

-searching for the #1 -

26/07/2023, 3:53 pm - +Smiley face: What is a Specialised Super Intelligent System (SSIS)?

" The sniffing narcotic doggie versus the SSI..."

26/07/2023, 3:58 pm - +65 REACH: *📢 Topic 📢*

Singapore’s Internal Security Department (ISD) said that terror threats in the region have persisted over the past year, and extremist groups like the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria (ISIS) view Singapore as a prized target for attacks. In its annual terrorism report, ISD said that the central message of defending oppressed Muslims continues to have traction online.

*💬 What are your views on Singapore's national security? What more can be done to strengthen Singapore's resilience to combat national threats?*

A recent Ministry of Home Affairs (MHA) survey found that about 37% of Singapore citizens and permanent residents would contact the authorities if they believed their loved ones were displaying signs of radicalisation.

The findings from MHA’s survey, conducted from October to December 2022, come amid an assessment by the authorities here that while Singapore has no imminent terror threat, it continues to be a target of terrorist elements.

ISD said that youth radicalisation is a growing concern here, with social media and gaming platforms being used as channels for recruitment into terror groups.

Those getting radicalised by groups such as the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria (ISIS) in Singapore are also getting younger.

👉 https://str.sg/iifw

👉 https://str.sg/iixF

👉https://www.mha.gov.sg/mediaroom/press-releases/singapore-terrorism-threat-assessment-report-2023

26/07/2023, 4:00 pm - +~,@: Place of birth is an optional field. not all countries implement it. travel document standard is established by the ICAO. And some Singaporeans could be born in foreign place, perhaps parents relocated for work, diplomats, new citizens, etc.

26/07/2023, 4:03 pm - +Darius Lee: There is a need to look into the reasons why most people would not contact the authorities if they believed their loved ones were displaying signs of radicalisation. 

My sense is that people fear that their loved ones would be locked away in unknown (or bad) conditions, lose contact with them, or even blame them for being arrested. 

There is a need to assuage those concerns. Part of it is ensuring that the conditions of detained people are humane, and another part of it is showing the public that those conditions are indeed humane.

26/07/2023, 4:04 pm - +Smiley face: How young is the school of terror recruiting its students!

A quick scan says, teenagers from 14-16 yrs old?

Close or younger?

26/07/2023, 4:05 pm - +Smiley face: Section 55 of the IS acts?

26/07/2023, 4:10 pm - +Valli: Education of members of the public to equip them with skills on spotting signs of radicalisation and the SOP to alert others. 

Urging public service agencies to educate all staff on terror threats and accompanying action steps through staff development week. 

Run the counter terrorism/safety drills at malls/schools/hotels to check that places with high human footfall to check on their readiness. 

Promoting more intercultural exchange through official religious bodies to showcase holistic efforts of working together in promoting goodwill/peace/unity. 

Increase awareness of call hotlines to report individuals who may be radicalised

Publish facts/past trends on the radicalism data that ISD outreach team shares when invited to companies for SGSecure Talks.

26/07/2023, 4:12 pm - +Smiley face: Education, Empowerment and Enlargement

26/07/2023, 4:15 pm - +Smiley face: Just how many people in the public are aware of terrorism?

How many are well aware of the GST vouchers and cash?

26/07/2023, 4:19 pm - +Rama: <Media omitted>

26/07/2023, 4:28 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Who is this lady?

And what trouble has she got herself into?

26/07/2023, 4:29 pm - +Rama: 🤷‍♂️🤦‍♂️

26/07/2023, 4:30 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

And she ask the public to sign a petition without any background to her case while making serious allegations.

26/07/2023, 4:30 pm - +Rama: 😞

26/07/2023, 4:43 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: <Media omitted>

26/07/2023, 4:43 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: <Media omitted>

26/07/2023, 4:43 pm - +Rama: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-66308981.amp

26/07/2023, 4:44 pm - +Rama: The one and only!

26/07/2023, 4:45 pm - +lesli: It begins ..

https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/politics/tharman-officially-launches-campaign-for-presidency

26/07/2023, 4:46 pm - +REACH: Dear contributors, please be reminded to post content relevant to the topic that is being discussed. We have had good feedback from this group, and we hope that we can keep the discussion robust and active!

26/07/2023, 4:48 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Is this woman Iris Koh?

The founder of anti-vaccine group Healing the Divide Iris Koh has been arrested, along with a doctor and his assistant, for allegedly conspiring to cheat and submit falsified vaccination records to the Ministry of Health (MOH), The Straits Times understands.

This woman has broken the law - and she now trying to hijack the suicide case to elicit sympathy on her case - to put a bad light on the police institution.

I think AGC should take up this case as another aggravating factor and present this video to the court.

26/07/2023, 4:48 pm - +Rama: Agree

26/07/2023, 5:02 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

"Healing the Divide founder Iris Koh, doctor arrested for allegedly submitting fake Covid-19 vaccine records and inciting members of her group to disrupt public hotlines."

 https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/courts-crime/healing-the-divide-founder-iris-koh-and-two-men-arrested-for-allegedly-falsifying-covid-19-vaccine-records#:~:text=Healing%20the%20Divide%20founder%20Iris%20Koh%2C%20doctor%20arrested%20for%20allegedly%20submitting%20fake%20Covid%2D19%20vaccine%20records

26/07/2023, 5:06 pm - +Frankie Wee: 🤦

26/07/2023, 5:08 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

"Iris Koh Refused to Pay Lawyers & Husband Had an Argument With Lawyers".

A woman full of trouble.

 https://goodyfeed.com/iris-koh-husband-lawyer-troubles/#:~:text=Iris%20Koh%20Refused%20to%20Pay%20Lawyers%20%26%20Husband%20Had%20an%20Argument%20With%20Lawyers

26/07/2023, 5:31 pm - +Thomas: Can I says that she is a grifter in the likes of Donald Trump ? Excite the base for donation and spend minimum for the cause intended for the donation. Hope that the government punishment will martyr them and get even more donations…

26/07/2023, 5:31 pm - +Rama: Yeah

26/07/2023, 5:32 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

There are many gullible audience easily taken in by such sweet talker.

26/07/2023, 5:33 pm - +Rama: Yeah

26/07/2023, 5:34 pm - +Frankie Wee: She is take revenge and hates herself what has done is done

26/07/2023, 5:34 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

That's why never trust any videos or messages at face value.

Always investigate, dwell deep to find out the real motive of the videos or messages.

26/07/2023, 5:36 pm - +Frankie Wee: Fraud after arrested then become falsehood post video their own for not admitting or guilty.

26/07/2023, 5:36 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: <Media omitted>

26/07/2023, 5:38 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Even her photo images can be searched through Google lens.

So even though she don't mention her cases, appear in video, make inneundos - her image can be searched and all her history can be digged out.

26/07/2023, 5:39 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: <Media omitted>

26/07/2023, 5:39 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

All her information and past history dig out.

26/07/2023, 5:40 pm - +Thomas: This is test case to see and gather how many supporters

26/07/2023, 5:41 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

It backfire on her. <This message was edited>

26/07/2023, 5:49 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Break law means break law.

No one is above the laws.

26/07/2023, 5:56 pm - +Thomas: True but end of the day, she will have a large sum of donations to retire with

26/07/2023, 5:59 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

That's why crowdfunding are fooling people to support their "unwholesome" cause through misplaced compassion.

And many people buy in without critical thinking.

Thereafter found themselves"fool".

But too late.

People only can learn through lessons.

26/07/2023, 6:22 pm - +REACH: *📢 Topic 📢*

Singapore’s Internal Security Department (ISD) said that terror threats in the region have persisted over the past year, and extremist groups like the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria (ISIS) view Singapore as a prized target for attacks. In its annual terrorism report, ISD said that the central message of defending oppressed Muslims continues to have traction online.

*💬 What are your views on Singapore's national security? What more can be done to strengthen Singapore's resilience to combat national threats?*

A recent Ministry of Home Affairs (MHA) survey found that about 37% of Singapore citizens and permanent residents would contact the authorities if they believed their loved ones were displaying signs of radicalisation.

The findings from MHA’s survey, conducted from October to December 2022, come amid an assessment by the authorities here that while Singapore has no imminent terror threat, it continues to be a target of terrorist elements.

ISD said that youth radicalisation is a growing concern here, with social media and gaming platforms being used as channels for recruitment into terror groups.

Those getting radicalised by groups such as the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria (ISIS) in Singapore are also getting younger.

👉 https://str.sg/iifw

👉 https://str.sg/iixF

👉https://www.mha.gov.sg/mediaroom/press-releases/singapore-terrorism-threat-assessment-report-2023

26/07/2023, 6:24 pm - +Smiley face: 12 June, 2023

"Specialised Super Intelligence"  Systems (SSI)

For the future of law enforcement purposes?

"Envisioning: The future uses of bots and AI shall be divided into two; one genetic and the other specific. By means of genetic perhaps is a chatbot for smaller operations like office requirements to chunk data, text, video and voice. In the specific, we meant a higher order of requirement for precision outcomes as well as deepest knowledge base for the AI to be programmed into a specialisation of multi tasks all in a given highly complex and highly complicated services or highest precision manufacturings environment or even for law enforcements; the SSI realm above the generic bots in combination and outsmart all intelligents of the human cognition."

- - anonymity

26/07/2023, 6:49 pm - +REACH: Dear contributors, 

⏰ We will be closing the chat in 15 minutes ⏰ 

Thank you very much for being a part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively. 

Goodnight!

Megan

26/07/2023, 6:54 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Singapore is experiencing 4 transition:-

1. Our leadership transition to 4GL.

2. The political challenges we face recently.

3. Global transition exacerbate by geopolitical tension, global climate, global supply chain disruption and high inflation.

4. President election.

Opportunists will exploit the transition to create mistrust, havoc and exact their personal vendetta for their own personal agenda - at the expense of our national interest and national security.

And this is a type of soft terrorism that we must safeguard ourselves - not to be gullible and exploited by such elements.

If these elements have their way, they will tear our social fabric apart, sow distrust on our institution and political system that safeguard our interest.

This is the cyber exploitation that can be used effectively by undesirable elements.

Domestic terrorism need not be physical, it can be virtual by creating mistrust - "terrorism of the mind and heart". <This message was edited>

26/07/2023, 6:58 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

My close friend comments :

But I think she picked up a sore point "ownself check ownself" which will go down well with people who believe there should be opposition and third party intervention.

My comments : 

Yes.

That's why I checkmate her.

And backfire on her. <This message was edited>

26/07/2023, 6:58 pm - +Smiley face: 12 June, 2023

"Specialised Super Intelligence"  Systems (SSI)

For the future of law enforcement purposes?

"Envisioning: The future uses of bots and AI shall be divided into two; one genetic and the other specific. By means of genetic perhaps is a chatbot for smaller operations like office requirements to chunk data, text, video and voice. In the specific, we meant a higher order of requirement for precision outcomes as well as deepest knowledge base for the AI to be programmed into a specialisation of multi tasks all in a given highly complex and highly complicated services or highest precision manufacturings environment or even for law enforcements; the SSI realm above the generic bots in combination and outsmart all intelligents of the human cognition."

- - anonymity 

Super efficiency?

If generative AI means highly intelligent machine mind but in general and not specific or a predefined scopes of high efficiency to generate the daily requirements at the workplace or at the shop floor.

How about a specific intelligence superimposed with a higher generative AI coupled in a span of metaverse to package into a super AI for specific roles in multi-tasking environments in one act?

"Coming to a theatre near you...!"

In an example of a Cardiac surgeon using a specialised SSI to perform an actual heart transplant which is a high risk operation. Prior to the actual ops, the team of surgeons and doctors will simulate the ops process in a metaverse with reality of up to 99% similarity to the actual Ops. The patient's biometrics are stored into the SSI and the highest chance of success given the Shortest time to complete this Ops shall be the key role, the hands-on and highest intelligent "chief surgeon" of this SSI to plan, to simulate, to allow multiple access across border or timezone and connecting the entire medical experts into one, to execute, and to implement with all planned sequel executed in the highest precision and no step would be missed and/or no mistake during this actual and highly intensive situation of life and death! This is an aspired SSI package of the future for the medical community and hopes for millions of patients too.

So what will be the future roles of this Cardiac surgeon?

Doctor and patient relationships, AI technologist/highly skilled Digital & Medical technicians in this set-up, clinical nurses shall return to hospital grounds and fully automated from the door steps of the surgeon office to the Ops theatre. 

Envisioned this: the surgeon will become the co-pilot of the actual Ops (just in case) and the rest shall be all under ONE SSI !

How much a company is willing to fork out to play this game of changing and how far it aspires to come out of this deep tunnelling of transformation ?

These transformative efforts will mean costs than the targeted benefits. For starting a process of transforming an existing effective way of productivity and planning to transit into a higher order of AI or automation; one cannot avoid and can expect a variety of risks and costs that will reduce the existing capacity thus resulting in a loss of revenue especially in the first half of the planning and executing phase. The final process of fully implemented change will need a further timeline of one year or more depending on the newly commissioned complexity and complicated process. This will also add towards the interim downtime, loss of productivity and revenue downed.

Applications?

Applying this SSI into other bigger area of activities such as supermarkets, public transportations, educations and trainings or public administrative services and law enforcements. All of these individual transformation projects will need more than 2-4 years from the starting plan and papers to the final products and the costs along these big changes don't come cheap too. 

Where are the carefully defined parameters of operation and the team of talents; an all hands on deck approach together with the chief pilot aka Chief Transformation Officer to lead, to check and to chart ahead in phases: plan, replan, execute, re-execute and into implementing and corrections and the final landing of this transformation plane on site!

In summary, there are costs and risks involved in any transformation moves from the human aspects, downtimes and correcting the process and so on, a common saying, "no pain, no gain", how about the greater the pain doesn't necessarily derive a greater gain too!

The Rocket man and his ambitions?

Be forewarned, the route to transformation will not be a smooth and straight road (and at times can be exploded) but rather it will be a winding and challenging one for the team that defined, planned, executed and implemented in hope of achieving a super efficient workplace or shop floor. And how about the excess human of yesterdays going to do and where to replace all these excess human capital into other meaningful uses? 

At the end of the day, Patience Pays big rather than the ways of the rocketman attitudes and his extinguished projectiles and followed by the smoked trajectory!

Imperatively speaking, the biggest challenge of tomorrow transforming and thereafter a transformed economies shall be HUMAN!

Afterwords:

"The Transformative Climate Challenges of the Commercial Aviation"

" For shorter flight under 7 hours, SSI the captain and human the co-pilot...?"

- - anonymity

Let the SSI be the Captain?

When weather becoming hotter, the ground especially for airport's runway tarmac will expell hot terma so much so it will affect the calculus of an airline flight planning, mid air turbulence and flight time. The hotter the ground temperature is, the lesser the fuel load, the shorter the range, lesser pax and lesser cargo just to lessen the overall load for take-off with the existing length of the runway! (Or under this hot condition, the only way out is to extend the runway to 30% longer for a fully loaded flight to take-off safely)

How to mitigate the hot weather for an airline flight Ops and the implications and significances towards it capacity load from passengers onto the air cargo compartments in a less optimum operations criteria? How to strike a balance and achieving a ratio of profitability?

Perhaps, if the average yearly sunrise to the mid day hit sun will raise a solution to frontrun the most lucrative flight routes starting from 10pm till 10am, the aircraft will carry full load and hitting the KPI for each flight; these golden hours of aviation perhaps will override the possibilities of loss in revenue perse this airline competing with the budget airlines schedules and pricings!

Another tell sign of the extreme weather will determine the lives and livelihoods of everything that is S/M/L in size!

How about working under extreme weather conditions from hot to cold or wet to dry?

It is profoundly important to equip and train the workforce of tomorrow to just in case the weather of that day or that week happens to disrupt the means to travel into the physical locale that is the office space.

How to set up these tiny-winnie ops suffs? First thing first, employer and employees trust must be on-going.

Two, up to 80% of the office workload can be transformed into the individual homes just like many hybrid offices all in sync as one unit or one department.

Three, the measurements of performance of  these hybrid situations and the Code of Conduct coupled with the altered KPI that is fair and justify to all employees.

Four, all of the above shall be a carefully crafted operations and the broader strategies must fit into these smallest hybrids of human & AI workforce. 

    - - in progress - -

26/07/2023, 7:00 pm - +REACH: *Dear Contributors,*

We will be closing the chat for today.

Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.

Goodnight!

Megan 😊

26/07/2023, 7:00 pm - ~ REACH Singapore changed this group's settings to allow only admins to send messages to this group

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REACH 478 - What are your views on these schemes? How can Singaporeans better prepare themselves financially for retirement?

(SK)

 24 Jul 2023 (10am - 7pm)

REACH

24/07/2023, 10:30 am - +REACH: ⏰ We will be opening the chat from *10:30am to 7pm* today. ⏰

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*Full set of Terms of Use: https://go.gov.sg/reach-whatsapp-terms* 

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The topic will be posted shortly. 

Thank you. 

Megan 😊

24/07/2023, 10:31 am - +REACH: 📢*Topic*📢

More seniors have started monetising their Housing Board flats to supplement their retirement income and beef up their Central Provident Fund (CPF) balances. In 2022 alone, about 2,860 seniors tapped the Lease Buyback Scheme and Silver Housing Bonus Scheme, up from 2,790 in 2021.

According to the CPF Board’s latest home financing report charting data from 2020 to 2022, this enabled them to bring in around $429 million in total.  Of this, the seniors got about $202 million as a cash bonus and take-home cash from net sales proceeds. The remaining $227 million or so went towards topping up their CPF Retirement Accounts.

💬*What are your views on these schemes? How can Singaporeans better prepare themselves financially for retirement?*

📌_Lease Buyback Scheme_

Launched in 2009, this scheme allows seniors aged 65 and older to sell part of their flat’s lease back to HDB in five-year increments, while retaining lease lengths from 15 to 35 years.

The scheme, which requires retained leases to cover the flat’s youngest owner until the age of 95, provides an option for seniors to convert part of their remaining leases into retirement income while living in the same home until the end of their life.

📌_The Silver Housing Bonus Scheme_

Launched in 2013, this scheme gives those aged 55 and above a bonus of up to $30,000 for “right-sizing” to a three-room or smaller flat from an HDB flat or private property with an annual value not exceeding $13,000.

They will receive the maximum cash bonus of $30,000 if they top up their CPF Retirement Accounts with $60,000 of the proceeds from selling their property and join CPF Life.

Professor Sing Tien Foo, provost’s chair professor in the Department of Real Estate at the National University of Singapore Business School, said the two schemes have helped to ease the “asset rich and cash poor” dilemma that seniors face and address worries about decaying leases.

However he noted that the take-up rate of both schemes has remained low over the years, as there are “uncertainties in life” that may affect seniors’ decisions to monetise their homes.

👉https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/housing/increase-in-seniors-monetising-their-hdb-flats-to-supplement-retirement-income

24/07/2023, 10:32 am - ~ REACH Singapore changed this group's settings to allow all participants to send messages to this group

24/07/2023, 10:40 am - ~ REACH Singapore changed the group description

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24/07/2023, 11:01 am - +Smiley face: "Luckily, there is still something to monetise or otherwise what are the existing and available helps to tie through this moment and into tomorrow and the days after tomorrow; so was it luck or was it pre-determined,...?

- - anonymity

24/07/2023, 11:02 am - +~L: Set a monthly budget that allows for 20% saving of income. Put a % of savings in CPF and a % in private investment. HDB needs to think about how people are protected when leases run out. Perhaps CPF/HDB can join forces and set up a Lease Extensions plan. Sell back some of the property for a lease extension. I'd like my lease to stay active until my youngest is 95 :)

24/07/2023, 11:03 am - +~L: "Professor Sing Tien Foo, provost’s chair professor in the Department of Real Estate at the National University of Singapore Business School, said the two schemes have helped to ease the “asset rich and cash poor” dilemma that seniors face and address worries about decaying leases." - this would be a good problem to solve, and seems really simple/obvious.

24/07/2023, 11:23 am - +Jimmy Chew: Haha. I met a resident who is 75 years old and his wife 73. Both are moving to Bali because their lease buyback has expired. They activated it when the PM shared about it. It was a wrong decision. Because they had a 5 room point block which can be rented but the HDB took back the flat. Please don't encourage the buy back scheme. Owners may out life the tenure.The next national day rally PM recommends renting rooms to supplement ones income.

24/07/2023, 11:24 am - +Jimmy Chew: I am very upset of the scheme because both of them is hunch back and seeing the old man pushing his wife to the taxi and going to Batam to live is shocking to me. What is the government doing?

24/07/2023, 11:26 am - +Frankie Wee: They can use BRS CPF

24/07/2023, 11:26 am - +Frankie Wee: FRS very tough and hard to goal full retirement

24/07/2023, 11:26 am - +Frankie Wee: Every year keep on increase few thousand dollars

24/07/2023, 11:33 am - +Jimmy Chew: Rent one's home is the best. Because can leave for next generation. Sometimes I feel that HDB is like a bank giving wrong investment advice hahahaha the business of any company is to make money. need to pay for all workers. The social implications will be no home and need to pay for sustainability, like my old neighbor ,whoever advises the buy back scheme must be a banker hahaha

24/07/2023, 11:34 am - +Frankie Wee: <Media omitted>

24/07/2023, 11:34 am - +Frankie Wee: Near $100k in RA can get money CPF no issue

24/07/2023, 11:35 am - +Jimmy Chew: Thanks. when HDB takes your home where do you stay?

24/07/2023, 11:36 am - +Frankie Wee: If couple has less saving in RA then downsides room or lease buy back scheme they can enjoy silver bonus support $30k

24/07/2023, 11:36 am - +Jimmy Chew: Yeah but when the buy back lease is over?

24/07/2023, 11:36 am - +Frankie Wee: Life is short I won’t able live 165 years 😅

24/07/2023, 11:37 am - +Jimmy Chew: How come they were evicted?

24/07/2023, 11:37 am - +KL: Ask u a question if u never top up medi save and is zero will ur medishield be deactivated ? <This message was edited>

24/07/2023, 11:37 am - +Frankie Wee: 99 years + 35 age total 134

24/07/2023, 11:37 am - +Jimmy Chew: ?

24/07/2023, 11:37 am - +Jimmy Chew: It's lease buy back not lease extension

24/07/2023, 11:38 am - +KL: Cos I don’t trust nowadays . A lot of policy have trap <This message was edited>

24/07/2023, 11:38 am - +KL: It trap every where

24/07/2023, 11:40 am - +Frankie Wee: Leave it the CPF alone and u can apply insurance for retirement saving unit 55 or 65 full payout to your bank account

24/07/2023, 11:40 am - +KL: Like I saw elderly go hospital they keep asking old ppl to use medisave for medical bill despite they want to pay cash . They still purposely go deduct the medisave and it risk the medisave no money for yearly medishield  and  than charge Gao Gao for medical bill <This message was edited>

24/07/2023, 11:42 am - +KL: Once you do too much nonsense even u do good things ppl will think negative about u .

24/07/2023, 11:42 am - +Frankie Wee: Sad nowadays elder some lost because of scam, child abandoned and have no work yearly

24/07/2023, 11:43 am - +KL: I saw ppl top up ntuc gift card for elderly and elderly did not use and all money was eat up .

24/07/2023, 11:43 am - +Singapore Maid Agency: think in their point of view instead of owner selling it away to public it sold to HDB at a cheaper rate and etc

24/07/2023, 11:43 am - +Jimmy Chew: Where to get Money. my friend out in 1.5mill and get 3k a month. If no flat stay where?

24/07/2023, 11:43 am - +KL: Ntuc alt is private should be caring a bit the interest in ntuc prepaid card is enough for u don’t be too greedy

24/07/2023, 11:44 am - +KL: Yes , sound like a trap

24/07/2023, 11:45 am - +Frankie Wee: Seek for help social worker and try get rent flat and help them find a job

24/07/2023, 11:47 am - +Jimmy Chew: Bro at 79?

24/07/2023, 11:48 am - +Jimmy Chew: Hunch back?

24/07/2023, 11:48 am - +Frankie Wee: 79 very touch life

24/07/2023, 11:48 am - +Jimmy Chew: ?

24/07/2023, 11:49 am - +Frankie Wee: What mean 79 sorry miscommunication

24/07/2023, 11:51 am - +Jimmy Chew: 0h I meant at 79 years old.

24/07/2023, 11:52 am - +Frankie Wee: By the time I will be retire at 71 

Some ppl said pap crazy increase RA they will work till reach age 90 saving $200k

24/07/2023, 11:52 am - +Frankie Wee: But inflation is rising

24/07/2023, 11:53 am - +Jimmy Chew: So keeping ones flat and renting one's room is better. I hope the HDB sellers will exercise due care in selling these options

24/07/2023, 11:55 am - +Jimmy Chew: I remembered a story when I met a old couple who sold their Kampong land in Tampines and ran out of money. The reply from the social worker was, who ask them to accept the sale. Hahaha so we going to meet folks who will reply why did you do the buy back. Never think properly hahahaha

24/07/2023, 11:56 am - +Jimmy Chew: Buyers beware

24/07/2023, 11:58 am - +Jimmy Chew: Now you know why you need brilliant and caring MPs.

24/07/2023, 12:09 pm - +~L: Need to pay bonuses haha

24/07/2023, 12:15 pm - +Bhavani: There are also dangers to renting out. What if the tenant's careless habits lead to a fire or the tenant damages the owner's home

24/07/2023, 12:18 pm - +Smiley face: Policies of yesterdays may not work in today's context and likewise today's plans may have to be changed or entirely a new policy just to cater to tomorrow's uncertainties of ageing, of society and lastly the politics of taking care of all people. Isn't life an uncertainty to begin with?...

24/07/2023, 12:19 pm - +65 9852 1750: This is probably not the same buyback scheme you are talking about? The one in discussion here is a lease buyback scheme where they can only sell in increments of 5 years while preserving the lease such that the youngest owner is covered till age 95.

24/07/2023, 12:19 pm - +~L: Yes indeed! We need to be adaptable

24/07/2023, 12:22 pm - +Frankie Wee: Why did we vote PAP and they have voice out

24/07/2023, 12:37 pm - +Smiley face: "Home, Job, Food: An universal phenomena either one or two or three of these items changed; thereafter all things will shift and change to a new way of living...!"

- - anonymity

24/07/2023, 12:40 pm - +Smiley face: Do these 3 big items so well....

Anywhere and anytime; "you shall win big regardless of your opponents and their areas of political savviness!"

Simply, You Win ALL!

24/07/2023, 12:44 pm - +Kenneth Lee WM: Regarding lease buy back, it's an excellent scheme!   To improve it further, it needs better publicity/education.  Most oldies think that they are selling their flat and will have no home to live; especially the illiterate ones.  Also instead of selling the lease back in one lot, it could be broken down into blocks of 5 years and each block is sold off at the current market rate.  Singapore land prices increase much faster than CPF rates and tracks real inflation, the lease prices increase as well.  By delaying the sale of lease, the sellers can get better prices in the future.  The restrictions can also be relaxed, eg: allow person to be able to continue to rent out flat, able to participate even though have another property etc.  ie: enable oldies to monetise their HDB property, treat it as a stored value and make it a proper asset that can be utilised whilst alive.

The silver housing bonus scheme is great!  Again more education needed; most people not aware of it.

24/07/2023, 12:45 pm - +Frankie Wee: New polices:

.Pension allowance monthly with job support 

.Housing stay affordable with more help granted and less sale or limit price transaction 

.Stay employed and healthy till 70 years old or choice to retire.

CPF unchanged contribution employment will continue growth rate.

24/07/2023, 12:46 pm - +Frankie Wee: Workfare not enough money 😅

24/07/2023, 12:47 pm - +Frankie Wee: That’s why minster have self integrity standards level they can afford while poor or mid can’t afford 

Example 5room sold $1m break records transaction.

24/07/2023, 12:49 pm - +Smiley face: ...into the high days of the charismatic Clinton's presidency; what were the achievements out of the Clinton administration,  economies, socials and geopolitics; all amounted to three budget surpluses (70% patriotism in the 1990s)...

24/07/2023, 12:54 pm - +Frankie Wee: I though my age is not issue as long as I can able to live and working. But I realise when it’s come health issue and my body changed. Maybe 90 years walking will be very slow. 

I feel it’s not matter let it go life is short (I can’t live 200 years old 😅)

24/07/2023, 12:57 pm - +Frankie Wee: And i though Singapore will have a future AI and technology everything is changed lifestyle (work short hours and flexible healthcare) when there will be uncertainty in time and crisis economy.

24/07/2023, 1:00 pm - +Frankie Wee: What is the political for all of us needed especially for government new change a better way. 

There is no point working long (12 or 8 hours a day)

24/07/2023, 1:06 pm - +Singapore Maid Agency: Ask a property agent they will tell you not to do it

24/07/2023, 1:19 pm - +Smiley face: Conflation and Configuration of the Home, the Job and the food?

Home?

What is a Home of now and the future? A place that fits a person or a group of humans to stay for a fixed period of time.

The configurations of each home matters most from a one room flat to a larger four rooms flat. (smart & practical)

How about the amenities and facilities that suit the four broad based demography that is the (1) very young ones, (2) the young adults, (3) the adults and (4) the elderly. The designs of the township or the cluster of blocks will have to include these 4 demographic identities otherwise, it will not conflate nor it will meet the consequences and the basic needs of the residences. That itself is  called livable spaces and liveable urban city! (best practices - form & structure)

All of these happened to be of value and valuable to the HDB flats; if it is well envisioned and thoroughly planned, the future values of our flats will hold well aboveground and see us through our lifetime! Possible?...

    - - in progress - -

24/07/2023, 1:32 pm - +Vali: The lease Buyback scheme and Silver Housing Bonus scheme is good for seniors who wish to age in place, do not need to bequeath their property to the next generation and would like to liquidate a portion of their assets.

However, if there is an avenue within the policy to allow a reversal of the decision made previously, it would be good. The one-way path may be the reason why take up rates are not high..

24/07/2023, 1:46 pm - +Kenneth Lee WM: >The one-way path may be the reason why take up rates are not high..

If hdb can relax this as well, it would be great!!!

24/07/2023, 1:46 pm - +Kenneth Lee WM: Of course they won’t support. No commission for them!

24/07/2023, 1:49 pm - +Kenneth Lee WM: If oldie really no more money in cpf, bank, family members all no money, they only hv hdb, only 10yrs to live, what other choices they hv? They hv stored value in their hdb and can live on it.

24/07/2023, 1:52 pm - +Kenneth Lee WM: Am very certain that the increase in their hdb value far exceeds their ability to save as well as their cpf.

24/07/2023, 1:56 pm - +Kenneth Lee WM: As long as economy is good, singapore attracts good talent to come stay here, population increase, land price will keep on going up.

24/07/2023, 1:56 pm - +Kenneth Lee WM: Hdb prices will go up in tandem.

24/07/2023, 1:57 pm - +Kenneth Lee WM: Of course must hv clean gov, else all the increases will be makan by corruption.

24/07/2023, 2:04 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

1. In Singapore, more than 90% of the people own home - HDB flats or private houses.

2. As houses are big ticket item, hence many belong to the "Asset rich, but cash poor" group.

3. Many of the people wealth are lock up in their properties - hence ability to monetise the property to finance their retirement if they are not be able to set aside cash or cash generating income during their retirement - will be the last viable option.

4. 2 options are presented to the people to monetise their HDB flats - whereby majority of the the people possess.

a. Lease Buyback scheme - upon 65 years old, people can sell a portion of the lease to HDB in exchange for money - but continue to stay in the flat until 95 years old for the last youngest owner.

b. Silver Housing Bonus scheme - upon 55 years old, people can right size their HDB flat to a smaller 3 room flat or smaller in exchange for $30,000 if top up their CPF Retirement account to $60,000.

5. Both schemes are design to allow house owners to have a house to stay until their last day - while allowing them to monetise some money from their flats to help the people to finance their retirement.

6. I think these are 2 good schemes as they achieve 2 objectives :-

a. All owners of the HDB flats have a house to stay until their last day.

b. Able to monetise their assets to help to finance their retirement.

Provided that they are not designed to pass down to their next generation as inheritance (as their children are applying their own HDB flats or buy private properties - for their own homes).

These 2 objectives are what LKY promise - and the Government has delivered.

7. However, as rightly pointed out by a couple of participants in REACH, option a - has a risk if occupants outlive 95 years old.

What happen then, as their lease expired and they will be chase out by HDB.

Should there be an option for HDB to sell e.g. 3 years to 5 years back to the owners of the flat - to ensure they have a place to stay until their last day?

----

24/07/2023, 2:11 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Got example?

24/07/2023, 2:12 pm - +Jimmy Chew: When it sounds too good to be true it's a scam hahaha 🤣

24/07/2023, 2:13 pm - +~L: What happens if the lease is 20 year when they hit 65? Do they get an extension to 30 years if they participate in the lease buy back?

24/07/2023, 2:14 pm - +Jimmy Chew: No need to pay interest?

24/07/2023, 2:14 pm - +Kenneth Lee WM: > Most oldies think that they are selling their flat and will have no home to live; especially the illiterate ones. 

I personally know of 1.

24/07/2023, 2:15 pm - +Kenneth Lee WM: Only few years left to live but now living like a pauper.

24/07/2023, 2:16 pm - +Jimmy Chew: I am 66 years old. I take a 20 year lease buy back. How long can I stay in flat. I have a remaining lease of 60 yrs <This message was edited>

24/07/2023, 2:18 pm - +Kenneth Lee WM: 60-20 = 40 yrs.  U can stay until u are 66+40= 106 yrs old.

24/07/2023, 2:19 pm - +Jimmy Chew: How come my neighbor has to leave his flat?

24/07/2023, 2:20 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Interest payment?

24/07/2023, 2:20 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Interest free?

24/07/2023, 2:21 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

How can Singaporeans better prepare themselves financially for retirement?

1. Government extending the retirement age to 67 years old will help people to work and accumulate income and savings to finance their retirement.

2. But Government must ensure that age discrimination must not take root in GLCs, MNCs, SME in Singapore.

Quite a couple of feedback that mature workers once reached 55 years old are subject to yearly review - to cut their salaries, demotion in lieu of their high pay, or demeaning remarks that younger workers can take their jobs etc despite the fact that mature workers' work performance did not degrade.

3. Hence one way Government can help Singaporeans to prepare themselves financially for retirement - is to ensure mature workers are able to work and retire at the official retirement age of 67 years old without age discrimination or coercion.

4. Singaporean workers must be educated to save early in their work lives once they start working in safe financial instruments to grow their passive income so that they will have sufficient savings for their retirement.

On top of compulsory CPF savings, they also should be exposed to safe financial apparatus such as Singapore Saving Bonds (SSB), T-bills, SGS, fixed deposit in banks, saving plan in insurance companies etc that will help them to accumulate their wealth as they work.

These will help to prevent young workers to spend lavishly and frivolously - instead of saving for their retirement.

24/07/2023, 2:21 pm - +Kenneth Lee WM: can't tell. need more details.  Max lease buy back is: 

let x = 95 - your age

max lease buy back length = remaining lease - x

24/07/2023, 2:24 pm - +Jimmy Chew: No interest payment?

24/07/2023, 2:24 pm - +Kenneth Lee WM: >How can Singaporeans better prepare themselves financially for retirement?

Allow us to put money with in GIC/Temasek.  What gov earns from GIC/Temasek, citizens get proportion of what they invested with them.

24/07/2023, 2:24 pm - +~L: This message was deleted

24/07/2023, 2:25 pm - +Kenneth Lee WM: Sorry don't understand.  Interest payment from what pls?

24/07/2023, 2:26 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Buy back scheme

24/07/2023, 2:27 pm - +REACH: 📢*Topic*📢

More seniors have started monetising their Housing Board flats to supplement their retirement income and beef up their Central Provident Fund (CPF) balances. In 2022 alone, about 2,860 seniors tapped the Lease Buyback Scheme and Silver Housing Bonus Scheme, up from 2,790 in 2021.

According to the CPF Board’s latest home financing report charting data from 2020 to 2022, this enabled them to bring in around $429 million in total.  Of this, the seniors got about $202 million as a cash bonus and take-home cash from net sales proceeds. The remaining $227 million or so went towards topping up their CPF Retirement Accounts.

💬*What are your views on these schemes? How can Singaporeans better prepare themselves financially for retirement?*

📌_Lease Buyback Scheme_

Launched in 2009, this scheme allows seniors aged 65 and older to sell part of their flat’s lease back to HDB in five-year increments, while retaining lease lengths from 15 to 35 years.

The scheme, which requires retained leases to cover the flat’s youngest owner until the age of 95, provides an option for seniors to convert part of their remaining leases into retirement income while living in the same home until the end of their life.

📌_The Silver Housing Bonus Scheme_

Launched in 2013, this scheme gives those aged 55 and above a bonus of up to $30,000 for “right-sizing” to a three-room or smaller flat from an HDB flat or private property with an annual value not exceeding $13,000.

They will receive the maximum cash bonus of $30,000 if they top up their CPF Retirement Accounts with $60,000 of the proceeds from selling their property and join CPF Life.

Professor Sing Tien Foo, provost’s chair professor in the Department of Real Estate at the National University of Singapore Business School, said the two schemes have helped to ease the “asset rich and cash poor” dilemma that seniors face and address worries about decaying leases.

However he noted that the take-up rate of both schemes has remained low over the years, as there are “uncertainties in life” that may affect seniors’ decisions to monetise their homes.

👉https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/housing/increase-in-seniors-monetising-their-hdb-flats-to-supplement-retirement-income

24/07/2023, 2:27 pm - +Kenneth Lee WM: Once LBS is activated, u choose duration of lease to sell back to gov, a lump sum is provided.  Part of it goes into CPF etc, remaining amt, u get as cash.

24/07/2023, 2:27 pm - +~L: OK, so the lease needs to be > (95 - age), makes sense. What happens for people who have a lease less than 95- age, they cannot participate and will lose their home... ok

24/07/2023, 2:29 pm - +Kenneth Lee WM: No, then they can't participate.  Best is to rent out whole flat, go johor and rent a place there with the rental income.  U'll spend 1/3 of the rental income and can live/save on the 2/3.

24/07/2023, 2:29 pm - +Jimmy Chew: I find it strange when it indicated to sell back to government but it's indicated that I can stay 66+40 = 106

24/07/2023, 2:30 pm - +Kenneth Lee WM: this is the thing that confuses a lot of oldies.

it is "sell back a portion of the lease".  not the whole place.

24/07/2023, 2:30 pm - +~L: I see- as long as they is a option I guess :)

24/07/2023, 2:31 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Sell back to governance at what price?

24/07/2023, 2:32 pm - +Anselm: i think it is good to have this "way out" or people whom hit difficulty in their financial planning. Low take-up rate should be looked at as a good thing, as LBS should be an exception and not the norm.

24/07/2023, 2:32 pm - +Kenneth Lee WM: The current market price is, set by HDB valuers.  It's quite close to bank valuation.

24/07/2023, 2:35 pm - +Jimmy Chew: How come my neighbor told me he has to sell because his buy back scheme is due

24/07/2023, 2:35 pm - +~L: There needs to be a safety net for people who survive past 95.

24/07/2023, 2:36 pm - +~L: Maybe a small insurance policy (must be able to get a good rate!), like a reverse life insurance- you get money if you survive.

24/07/2023, 2:37 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Hahahaha one of my lawyer friends says never give your assets away. Once given you can't control it

24/07/2023, 2:37 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Wiser for the owners to rent their rooms or flats.

24/07/2023, 2:37 pm - +Kenneth Lee WM: He's probably not telling u the whole story or got his terms mixed up.

24/07/2023, 2:39 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Do you have a real case example

24/07/2023, 2:40 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Told me he can't stay in his flat. Have to sell

24/07/2023, 2:40 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Maybe

24/07/2023, 2:41 pm - +Kenneth Lee WM: at least for singaporeans, we're fortunate to have the "live in johor" as a back up plan. but we need to vote good clean gov in who can grow our economy and attract foreign investments and talent to come to singapore.  If Malaysia overtakes us, the back up plan will cease to exist.

24/07/2023, 2:41 pm - +Jimmy Chew: So instead of selling to the open market we sell back to HDB

24/07/2023, 2:44 pm - +Smiley face: "To each their own...?" (家家有本难读的经?)

Renting a room to others? ( Susah lah, lagi Susah? 困难，更困难?)

Renting out a room is perhaps a simple and short term solution for the need to have extra income.

To monetise the entirety that is to downgrade to a smaller flats is to cash out a lump sum for whatsoever uses at that moment in time of this individual or this family or upon death of the owner.

Some used this lump sum to help their children to buy an EC or Condo or bigger flats so that the parents agreed to stay with them or sacrificing to move into a studio flats just to pass some money to their child or children (for parents: the more children the harder the decision and division of assets to the next generation?)

There are several cases of unintended consequences of children forcing their parents to cough out their old flats just to convey the wishes of upgrading to a better home.

Is it rite or not rite?

Each household has its own issues from relationships into money matters. Can authorities step-in to intervene or watch by the sidelines? Professionally, are housing agents able to explain clearly to the flats owners on their decision to sell, what are the consequences and thereafter the sales and what are the owner options or intentions to find the next dwell?

How to intervene in the event of "not rite" cases? What are the available mitigation processes rather than leaving all to the family court or worse of all, to the high court to settle it?

    - - in progress - -

24/07/2023, 2:44 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Haha hopefully they don't change policy like what CPF does

24/07/2023, 2:44 pm - +Kenneth Lee WM: Big difference in selling in the open market is that one sells the entire lease all at once to open market.  one can no longer live in the flat.

For LBS, one is selling part of the lease back to HDB.  One can continue to live in the flat until 95 or whatever date one decides.

Best is to rent out rooms in flat if really need the cash to live.

24/07/2023, 3:00 pm - +Smiley face: So where are the areas to thrift, monetising assets and how about to travel a longer road ahead? All of these variables which are highly possible situations and more likely for this current generation of our PG to live into theirs mid 80s to the 90s of ageing followed by our MG. What a big challenge now and ahead, inclusively the entire society because humans' aged !

24/07/2023, 3:13 pm - +Smiley face: The risen costs of living not only redefined the value of money from our PG but also to our MG. The totality of these changes in the ways of living their daily lives have profoundly altered the dynamics of retirements and the uncertainties of an ageing nation....

24/07/2023, 3:35 pm - +KL: They often change policies like open market electricity etc

24/07/2023, 4:00 pm - +REACH: 📢*Topic*📢

More seniors have started monetising their Housing Board flats to supplement their retirement income and beef up their Central Provident Fund (CPF) balances. In 2022 alone, about 2,860 seniors tapped the Lease Buyback Scheme and Silver Housing Bonus Scheme, up from 2,790 in 2021.

According to the CPF Board’s latest home financing report charting data from 2020 to 2022, this enabled them to bring in around $429 million in total.  Of this, the seniors got about $202 million as a cash bonus and take-home cash from net sales proceeds. The remaining $227 million or so went towards topping up their CPF Retirement Accounts.

💬*What are your views on these schemes? How can Singaporeans better prepare themselves financially for retirement?*

📌_Lease Buyback Scheme_

Launched in 2009, this scheme allows seniors aged 65 and older to sell part of their flat’s lease back to HDB in five-year increments, while retaining lease lengths from 15 to 35 years.

The scheme, which requires retained leases to cover the flat’s youngest owner until the age of 95, provides an option for seniors to convert part of their remaining leases into retirement income while living in the same home until the end of their life.

📌_The Silver Housing Bonus Scheme_

Launched in 2013, this scheme gives those aged 55 and above a bonus of up to $30,000 for “right-sizing” to a three-room or smaller flat from an HDB flat or private property with an annual value not exceeding $13,000.

They will receive the maximum cash bonus of $30,000 if they top up their CPF Retirement Accounts with $60,000 of the proceeds from selling their property and join CPF Life.

Professor Sing Tien Foo, provost’s chair professor in the Department of Real Estate at the National University of Singapore Business School, said the two schemes have helped to ease the “asset rich and cash poor” dilemma that seniors face and address worries about decaying leases.

However he noted that the take-up rate of both schemes has remained low over the years, as there are “uncertainties in life” that may affect seniors’ decisions to monetise their homes.

👉https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/housing/increase-in-seniors-monetising-their-hdb-flats-to-supplement-retirement-income

24/07/2023, 4:00 pm - +Singapore Maid Agency: They dun support reason being it is not worth it.

24/07/2023, 4:26 pm - +Frankie Wee: I heard they said original price not an open market 

I not sure sure

24/07/2023, 5:14 pm - +lesli: Sad case ...should not happen again

https://str.sg/iifJ

24/07/2023, 5:17 pm - +Eunice Lim: things must have been really bad for his own mother to call the police on him....that's just a few days before he jumped.

24/07/2023, 5:17 pm - +Singapore Maid Agency: We really have to be kind and also share with people around us

24/07/2023, 5:27 pm - +Smiley face: https://mustsharenews.com/former-spf-officer-bullied/?utm_source=telegram

24/07/2023, 5:36 pm - +Smiley face: "Is not just a number; is a human!"

Yet another tragic suicide that could have been detected early enough; its too late...

Perhaps, from now on, Counsellors should be more vigilant in spotting any early signs of possible depression or visible cues of suicidal or worse case of a total silence;  putting these vulnerable populations on higher alert, whether to inform and interact with patients and families about how to monitor at home, at work, or at school. (early warnings & closer monitoring)

It's all about early detection and closer intervention...to save precious lives!

What causes Anxiety and how does Stress arise? (anxiety & stress)

Does a person's life, health, job, education and future matter? (existentials)

What are some ways to cope and reduce stress or anxiety? Don't want to compare with others? or some other way? (self & others)

How to live a carefree life? Would thinking less about tomorrow reduce all this pain? (over thinking & over worrying)

    - - in progress - -

24/07/2023, 5:39 pm - +Singapore Maid Agency: <Media omitted>

24/07/2023, 5:39 pm - +Smiley face: "Accelerating Performances & Pitfalls: Jung & Maslow ways?"

"What is human and what is a group of human with divest backgrounds from literacy to livelihoods?"

- - anonymity

The Tiny-Winnie of things?

The freedom to work independently, a predetermined guidelines befalls on an intra-day or intra month (tactical) to a longer timeline of intra year (strategic). Arguably, the longer a timeline is, the lesser the scope of responsibilities and empowerment to individuals regardless of the size of an organisation...

24/07/2023, 5:39 pm - +Frankie Wee: Police team members treat bullied one another who want to get rank with salary

24/07/2023, 5:41 pm - +Smiley face: Isn't this description like a "dog eating dogs"...

Thanks Frankie for this valuable pointer...

24/07/2023, 5:42 pm - +Smiley face: Why Jung and why Maslow both matters?

Building the Archetypes and managing the Self esteem...

Next topic to come... sooner!

24/07/2023, 5:56 pm - +Singapore Maid Agency: Read the key word as it’s a “culture” well, MOE schools have tinkle

Friend and recent COVID the medical staff was taken care of and now it’s SPF who others have we miss out 🙏

Key word be kind 🙏 share and spread among each of our individual group well this also happens in family/siblings 生不带来 死不带去🙏 (we’re born with nothing and when we die we also cannot bring along the material stuff except of “deeds” be it Good or bad)

24/07/2023, 5:58 pm - +Smiley face: 24 July, 2023

"On the Schedules of Examinations"

One way to destress our students of all ages?

Wouldn't it be wiser to spread crucial exams like PSLE, O levels and A levels over two to three weeks? 

An example of a candidate  attempting up to 6-8 subjects; will MOE  planned for each subject to be examined on Mon, Wed and Fri ? 

Are there other operational reasons to SPEED through each exams day just to complete this cycle of the matriculation (madness) exercise? 

After all, the meaning of testing students is to assess the Proficiency of each subject taught over a long period of the school years. Or are we sieving gungho warriors just to demonstrate our resilience, our abilities and our mental stamina,  just to enable a place to the next higher order of education?

Let's think carefully, what is quality and what is quantity?

24/07/2023, 6:04 pm - +REACH: 📢*Topic*📢

More seniors have started monetising their Housing Board flats to supplement their retirement income and beef up their Central Provident Fund (CPF) balances. In 2022 alone, about 2,860 seniors tapped the Lease Buyback Scheme and Silver Housing Bonus Scheme, up from 2,790 in 2021.

According to the CPF Board’s latest home financing report charting data from 2020 to 2022, this enabled them to bring in around $429 million in total.  Of this, the seniors got about $202 million as a cash bonus and take-home cash from net sales proceeds. The remaining $227 million or so went towards topping up their CPF Retirement Accounts.

💬*What are your views on these schemes? How can Singaporeans better prepare themselves financially for retirement?*

📌_Lease Buyback Scheme_

Launched in 2009, this scheme allows seniors aged 65 and older to sell part of their flat’s lease back to HDB in five-year increments, while retaining lease lengths from 15 to 35 years.

The scheme, which requires retained leases to cover the flat’s youngest owner until the age of 95, provides an option for seniors to convert part of their remaining leases into retirement income while living in the same home until the end of their life.

📌_The Silver Housing Bonus Scheme_

Launched in 2013, this scheme gives those aged 55 and above a bonus of up to $30,000 for “right-sizing” to a three-room or smaller flat from an HDB flat or private property with an annual value not exceeding $13,000.

They will receive the maximum cash bonus of $30,000 if they top up their CPF Retirement Accounts with $60,000 of the proceeds from selling their property and join CPF Life.

Professor Sing Tien Foo, provost’s chair professor in the Department of Real Estate at the National University of Singapore Business School, said the two schemes have helped to ease the “asset rich and cash poor” dilemma that seniors face and address worries about decaying leases.

However he noted that the take-up rate of both schemes has remained low over the years, as there are “uncertainties in life” that may affect seniors’ decisions to monetise their homes.

👉https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/housing/increase-in-seniors-monetising-their-hdb-flats-to-supplement-retirement-income

24/07/2023, 6:45 pm - +REACH: *Dear Contributors,*

⏰ We will be closing the chat in *15 minutes* ⏰

Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.

Goodnight!

Megan 😊

24/07/2023, 6:54 pm - +Singapore Maid Agency: Recall there was the young man serving NS and was to ORD the culture was to go or thrown down the well/water deep pipe line and was announced dead. SCDF & SPF both are HOMETEAM

24/07/2023, 6:56 pm - +Smiley face: 24 July, 2023

" Sell and Rent or Sell Sell Sell ?"

"Luckily, there is still something to monetise or otherwise what are the existing and available helps to tie through this moment and into tomorrow and the days after tomorrow; so was it luck or was it pre-determined,...?

- - anonymity 

The risen costs of living not only redefined the value of money from our PG but also to our MG. The totality of these changes in the ways of living their daily lives have profoundly altered the dynamics of retirements and the uncertainties of an ageing nation.

"Home, Job, Food: An universal phenomena either one or two or three of these items changed; thereafter all things will shift and change to a new way of living...!"

- - anonymity

So where are the areas to thrift, monetising assets and how about to travel a longer road ahead? All of these variables which are highly possible situations and more likely for this current generation of our PG to live into theirs mid 80s to the 90s of ageing followed by our MG. What a big challenge now and ahead, inclusively the entire society because humans' aged !

Policies of yesterdays may not work in today's context and likewise today's plans may have to be changed or entirely a new policy just to cater to tomorrow's uncertainties of ageing, of society and lastly the politics of taking care of all people. Isn't life an uncertainty to begin with?

Conflation and Configuration of the Home, the Job and the Food?

The Home? (First place)

What is a Home of now and the future? A place that fits a person or a group of humans to stay for a fixed period of time.

The configurations of each home matters most from a one room flat to a larger four rooms flat. (smart & practical)

How about the amenities and facilities that suit the four broad based demography that is the (1) very young ones, (2) the young adults, (3) the adults and (4) the elderly. The designs of the township or the cluster of blocks will have to include these 4 demographic identities otherwise, it will not conflate nor it will meet the consequences and the basic needs of the residences. That itself is  called livable spaces and liveable urban city! (best practices - form & structure)

All of these happened to be of value and valuable to the HDB flats; if it is well envisioned and thoroughly planned, the future values of our flats will hold well aboveground and see us through our lifetime! Yes, is possible!

The Job? (Susah? 困难? )

To create many well paying jobs and abundant of job opportunities in the waiting, are these existentials just not good enough? Is it reasonable to say so?

What matters most perhaps at this junction in time or all time, it is imperative to find ways to not only secure jobs but to be able to sustain these jobs for as long as this nasty economics situation lasted. And how about securing a stable employment for people to work till 70 years old? That is if the worker is still able and both physically and mentally healthy to carry on this route of employment. 

Willingly, all employers from the public service to the private sector support their staff through employment from the age of 50 and onwards? Or just "release" the oldest first followed by the older workers? After all, it's about the rite time to say good job and good bye to them?

The Food? ( Lagi Susah? 更困难?)

It is a fact now that all things from foods to goods to services like medications or in-hospital treatments; all up !

This risen costs of living are unavoidable to all people. The groups that very much affected are the low wage family and the elderly who no longer have a stable income to depend upon.

Unless these elderly people have sufficient passive savings coupled with a robust CPF to kick start their retirements journey; should any one of the two missing, it will not be a free and easy life for these elderly citizens. It is true!

Afterwords:

"To each their own...?" (家家有本难读的经?)

Renting a room to others? ( Susah lah, lagi Susah? 困难，更困难?)

Renting out a room is perhaps a simple and short term solution for the need to have extra income.

To monetise the entirety that is to downgrade to a smaller flats is to cash out a lump sum for whatsoever uses at that moment in time of this individual or this family or upon death of the owner.

Some used this lump sum to help their children to buy an EC or Condo or bigger flats so that the parents agreed to stay with them or sacrificing to move into a studio flats just to pass some money to their child or children (for parents: the more children the harder the decision and division of assets to the next generation?)

There are several cases of unintended consequences of children forcing their parents to cough out their old flats just to convey the wishes of upgrading to a better home.

Is it rite or not rite?

Each household has its own issues from relationships into money matters. Can authorities step-in to intervene or watch by the sidelines? 

Professionally, are housing agents able to explain clearly to the flats owners on their decision to sell, what are the consequences and thereafter the sales and what are the owner options or intentions to find the next dwell?

How to intervene in the event of "not rite" cases? What are the available mitigation processes rather than leaving all to the family court or worse of all, to the high court to settle it?

    - - in progress - -

24/07/2023, 7:01 pm - +REACH: *Dear Contributors,*

We will be closing the chat for today.

Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.

Goodnight!

Megan 😊

24/07/2023, 7:02 pm - ~ REACH Singapore changed this group's settings to allow only admins to send messages to this group

=====

REACH 477 - What are your views on the application of AI within Government services? What are some other ways of AI application that could help boost productivity of Government services and better benefit the public?

(SK)

 19 Jul 2023 (10am - 7pm)

REACH

19/07/2023, 9:44 am - +REACH: *Dear contributors,* 

Welcome back! 😊

⏰ We will be opening the chat from *10am to 7pm* today. ⏰

*House Rules (short version of our Terms of Use) to keep in mind:* 

1. Be kind and respectful. We all want to be in a safe space to share our views. 

2. Any and all threatening, abusive, vulgar or racially, religiously and ethnically objectionable content is prohibited. 

3. Consider the quiet ones among us and give them a chance to comment. 

4. No need to repeat your comment or in differnet forms (including caps) - we heard you loud and clear the first time. 

5. Let's protect each other's privacy and keep contact details in this group what it should always be - confidential. 

*Full set of Terms of Use: https://go.gov.sg/reach-whatsapp-terms* 

We will strive to uphold these rules to ensure this is a safe space for all. 

Please be assured that the points made by participants during the chat are aggregated and shared with relevant agencies. 

The topic will be posted shortly. 

Thank you. 

Megan 😊

19/07/2023, 9:58 am - +REACH: 📢 *Topic* 📢

Some 4,000 civil servants are using a Government chatbot based on ChatGPT called Pair to assist them with writing, research, and coding, in a trial of artificial intelligence (AI) bots to boost productivity within the Government and better benefit the public.

A security arrangement between the Government and Azure OpenAI – an arm of Microsoft that offers coding and language AI models – also ensures that confidential information is kept private within ministries and unavailable to Microsoft.

💬 *What are your views on the application of AI within Government services? What are some other ways of AI application that could help boost productivity of Government services and better benefit the public?*

Pair and an upgraded SupportGoWhere are part of the first tranche of AI use cases in the government. Pair will allow the secure and efficient use of large language models as a writing assistant within the government space, and also provides “a sparring partner for ideas”, he said.

The agency is also in the nascent stages of testing large language models to upgrade SupportGoWhere, a portal for locals to search and apply for government aid. Incorporating AI into SupportGoWhere will allow users to describe their problem in their own words and get a response on what assistance they can apply for and where to get it.

“If we get this approach right,” said Dr Janil, “citizens will be able to express their personal story without necessarily knowing how the schemes and support of the government are structured, which is something you still have to know today.”

Members of the public can take advantage of certain ePrimer modules on the Singapore Government Developer Portal to pick up these general concepts. (Link below  - the last link)

👉🏻 *4,000 civil servants using Government Pair chatbot for writing, coding*

https://str.sg/iwvS

👉🏻 *How Singapore intends to harness AI for the public good*

https://str.sg/i3Ms

👉🏻 *Public officers can use ChatGPT and similar AI, but must take responsibility for their work: MCI*

https://str.sg/iJ8c

👉🏻 *Link to the Singapore Government Developer Portal*

https://www.developer.tech.gov.sg/

19/07/2023, 10:00 am - ~ REACH Phone 2 changed the group description

19/07/2023, 10:01 am - ~ REACH Phone 2 changed this group's settings to allow all participants to send messages to this group

----

19/07/2023, 10:02 am - +Brandon Lin: I’m glad to see that AI is being used and develop to harness the power of AI for the good of citizens to get necessarily help and support from the government especially a lot of the people are unaware of the helpful schemes they are entitled to

19/07/2023, 10:03 am - +Brandon Lin: It will be good if this development can be done in multiply languages so that people of different races can use their native language to input their scenarios

19/07/2023, 10:04 am - +Rama: It still has its risk but with adequate safeguards and due diligence can be regulated

19/07/2023, 10:04 am - +Brandon Lin: It will be also good to publish and promote awareness of such help to the public so more people are aware of it and uses it

19/07/2023, 10:19 am - +Frankie Wee: https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/autonomous-buses-trial-jurong-island-science-park-430831

19/07/2023, 10:19 am - +Frankie Wee: SG future will have a School bus will be auto AI driver near their home kids pick point to drop point

19/07/2023, 10:22 am - +Frankie Wee: <Media omitted>

19/07/2023, 10:23 am - +Frankie Wee: But it can’t exceeded speed 60km/h

19/07/2023, 10:32 am - +Anselm: Good the government is investing into AI, autonomous vehicles, etc.

The challenge of doing more with less will increase into the future, for the government, especially when we see it from the prospect of a dwindling population

19/07/2023, 10:35 am - +Ken: It was trial very long finally ready after 5 to 6 years

19/07/2023, 10:35 am - +Ken: Oops 7 years ago already trial lol

19/07/2023, 11:29 am - +Rose M K Ho: This message was deleted

19/07/2023, 11:30 am - +Rose M K Ho: Questions are :

1. Who is regulating this (AI & its uses ) against abuse?

2. How will the public be protected against any potential abuse ie. misuse/loss of personal data, _mis-information_ , wrong advice/ medication ... and so on.

3. Will ther be a panel of staff to oversee this & monitor the system constantly to ensure smooth operations?

4. Is there any backup plan in case this system fails us , like a sudden glitch or 'power blackout' ?

5. If ther is, then has it (the backup) bn tested ?  

I see this backup as _critical_ since government services r using it. Case in point - Immigration system breakdown at Woodlands not so long ago.

6. Wat if AI were applied to our defence system ?  In a worst case scenario,  no defence capability can be enabled due to power failure or the AI screw up everything! 🤦🏼‍♀️

Dun get me wrong.  I m all for tech advancements. But becoz I believe in it, all the more I fear for it - humans r getting too reliant on tech to get things done, not thinking of the consequences if these things fail one day. 

Ther is a high tendency to take things for granted.

Hence, while I applaud the use of such high tech in our society, I m also sceptical of its applications -- _*ther must be proper policing procedures in place*_, overseen by someone in authority and proper monitoring , _*with backup in case of emergencies*_. 

🤔

19/07/2023, 11:31 am - +Frankie Wee: AI power backup 100% will work normal and abuse or violence law will take action against humanity.

19/07/2023, 11:32 am - +Frankie Wee: Human command to AI system biggest database into memory than human brain 🧠

19/07/2023, 11:35 am - +Rose M K Ho: Not good enuff, in my eyes.

Wat I mean is -- wat if AI messes up everything ... ie. Things dun work the way they r supposed to & people die as a result of these errors.

Can we go back to , say, _manual_ way of doing things, to put things right? --  tt is the kind of backup I m talking abt, not just power failure (again, human take for granted).

If got no power,  then backup is to use candles,  right? 

So, if no AI, then how ? Ppl forget how to use their brains, is it ? 🤪

19/07/2023, 11:35 am - +Frankie Wee: Cybersecurity more power safeguard when AI will follow up law

19/07/2023, 11:40 am - +~L: Great to see the innovation and opportunity. There are different types of AI - Machine Leaning and Large Language Model are 2 examples commonly in use. I assume this initiative is Machine Learning. The computer can run many simulations and a human can then make the decision. This saves considerable time and resources.

19/07/2023, 11:41 am - +Rose M K Ho: Er .... 

U still dun get wat I m saying. 

Before we went so High Tech, we had No Computers !

Human intervention is necessary when everything else fails ... how long wl it take for things to get bk to normal if humans take back control ? -- tt is the back up.

Cyber ... still talking in tech terms , relying on computers.... not wat I'm thinking. 

Hv u not seen enuff sci-fi movies like War of the Worlds (starring Tom Cruise), recently aired on Ch 5 .... ? 

The way things r going, oyr world may become like tt one day. 

Dun need aliens to invade our planet! 

😱

19/07/2023, 11:41 am - +~L: We are not talking about Skynet and Terminators on the street (yet).

19/07/2023, 11:41 am - +Rose M K Ho: *yet* 

... is the operative word

19/07/2023, 11:41 am - +~L: When we had no computers many more people died.

19/07/2023, 11:42 am - +Rose M K Ho: **  our world

19/07/2023, 11:42 am - +Rose M K Ho: Lol. 

We dun nd computers for tt.

Covid did its job ... sorry for the pun.

19/07/2023, 11:42 am - +~L: lol yes. When that is being proposed we might need to be more careful. Right now, traffic simulations to decide new routes for roads, or population simulations to decide on new malls seems pretty harmless.

19/07/2023, 11:43 am - +Frankie Wee: It’s the same like ATM when you withdraw or deposit into machine cash is a computer is useful mean to the future AI support to work on human

19/07/2023, 11:44 am - +Frankie Wee: Either you use PayNow money sent within a mins they received

19/07/2023, 11:44 am - +Rose M K Ho: They always start out like this ... _harmless_ ....

Then, after we get comfortable & reliant on the system ....  ??? 😳

19/07/2023, 11:44 am - +~L: I'm sure people didn't want Photocopiers invented because it put typists out of work and could potential change text and create chaos in our documents..?

19/07/2023, 11:45 am - +Frankie Wee: Do I believe AI can safeguard against scam or fraud blocked them away.

19/07/2023, 11:46 am - +~L: It already does. This is how Spam filters work.

19/07/2023, 11:46 am - +Frankie Wee: Developing project will successfully

19/07/2023, 11:46 am - +~L: "AI" has been in use for years.... behind the scenes.

19/07/2023, 11:46 am - +Rose M K Ho: Agree .

But AI = Artificial Intelligence 

... in case anyone doesn't know wat it stands for.

AI is much much much more powerful than all these other inventions. 

It is potentially dangerous if not _controlled_ properly.

19/07/2023, 11:46 am - +~L: Now it's being made accessible to the general public

19/07/2023, 11:47 am - +Rose M K Ho: Ther wl be a Dark Web somewhere tt wl harness its power for unethical uses.

19/07/2023, 11:47 am - +Rose M K Ho: R we ready for it ?

19/07/2023, 11:48 am - +Frankie Wee: Cisco Systems will protect away dark web

19/07/2023, 11:48 am - +~L: Casio Calculator in 1978 used AI... It appeared to use intelligence to do maths, but it's just ones and zeros.

19/07/2023, 11:48 am - +Rose M K Ho: Those r primitive now, in comparison. 

Lol.

19/07/2023, 11:50 am - +Frankie Wee: Without AI what will happen in Singapore? Other country developed AI fast maybe one day our CPF lose without support AI system.

19/07/2023, 11:51 am - +~L: We cannot stop the use of modern AI. It cannot be regulated. AI will keep going and will infiltrate every part of our lives. We are best positioned to take advantage of it, and ensure Singapore remains at the forefront of advanced technology for the good of the population.

19/07/2023, 11:53 am - +Rose M K Ho: Nah!

We r moving too fast !

Other countries in SE Asia ...? Dun think they r even close to this yet, as far as general public r concerned.

As for countries outside of us, tech is not readily adopted by _everyone_, esp if the country is very big and spread over many islands / hv many remote areas tt still hv ppl struggling with their daily living.  

Tech is not for everyone.

19/07/2023, 11:54 am - +~L: It will be imposed on everyone. It will be impossible to avoid, unless people want to opt out and live in a hut growing vegetables.

19/07/2023, 11:54 am - +Rose M K Ho: 🤣🤣  hahaha!

19/07/2023, 11:55 am - +~L: I don't think we are comparing ourselves to other countries in SE Asia.

19/07/2023, 11:55 am - +Rose M K Ho: So, if we can't beat them, we join them !!

Right ? 

🤪🤪

19/07/2023, 11:55 am - +~L: Yes - and we can lead the way in the development of Ethical AI.

19/07/2023, 11:56 am - +~L: Protect jobs by upskilling our people. Protect economy by remaining competitive. Protect our future by educating kids in the use of AI and lateral thinking.

19/07/2023, 11:56 am - +Rose M K Ho: "Ethical" .... 

Back to my point on putting controls & policing policies in place ....

😉

19/07/2023, 11:57 am - +~L: The days of remembering facts and creating engineering diagrams are gone, or will be in 10 years.

19/07/2023, 11:57 am - +~L: Those you cannot do, effectively. I mean Ethical as in protecting people from the consequences of AI.

19/07/2023, 11:58 am - +Rose M K Ho: Same thing... 😁

U need rules (policies) in order to know wher the line has bn crossed.

19/07/2023, 12:00 pm - +~L: Consequences as in job losses, inadequate compensation for training the model, new industries etc

19/07/2023, 12:15 pm - +Jimmy Chew: It's good to embrace new technology and they need to double check the outputs become I heard chatgpt us 60 percent accurate and like the earlier terms in computing.. garbage in garbage out. They should use it as a supplement not as actual like PowerPoint. Haha it also allows them to earn good pay without working or thinking hahahaha

19/07/2023, 12:16 pm - +Jimmy Chew: This message was deleted

19/07/2023, 12:18 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Not sure whether it will weaken their analogical, logical, deep thinking skills to create unique insights and ideas to bring us to the next frontier because it's a gatherer of information and consolidators

19/07/2023, 12:18 pm - +Jimmy Chew: It's extremely good at it

19/07/2023, 12:19 pm - +Jimmy Chew: I used chatGPT after awhile I dropped thinking and trying to master the prompts that give the best reply hahaha..make my life easier but my brain lazier

19/07/2023, 12:25 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Haha it's like in the old days pre-printed replies to letters from customers hahahaha hope that not the case in the civil service

19/07/2023, 12:26 pm - +Jimmy Chew: They would use it like R2D2 to add value

19/07/2023, 12:26 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Or C3PO

19/07/2023, 12:28 pm - +~L: it's just a different way of thinking - requires structure, lateral approach, communication skills. Like having an assistant on hand :)

19/07/2023, 12:36 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Yeap. Only challenge is we will find the easy way. Like if you have a maid. You would leave the shopping and menu planning for meals and then you can go play hahaha

19/07/2023, 12:38 pm - +Jimmy Chew: <Media omitted>

19/07/2023, 12:38 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Like this guy

19/07/2023, 12:42 pm - +lesli: For your lunchtime entertainment ..

WATCH LIVE: WP media conference at 1pm on Leon Perera and Nicole Seah’s ‘inappropriate exchange’

July 19, 2023 12:15 PM

SINGAPORE - Workers’ Party (WP) secretary-general Pritam Singh will be speaking to members of the press at 1pm on Wednesday to address a video circulating online of Aljunied GRC MP Leon Perera and senior member Nicole Seah touching hands.

Read more: https://bit.ly/3pYk3EY

19/07/2023, 12:44 pm - +lesli: https://www.youtube.com/live/v1Omcc7OQA8?feature=share

19/07/2023, 1:17 pm - +Jimmy Chew: <Media omitted>

19/07/2023, 1:17 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Rec'd from a friend

19/07/2023, 1:19 pm - +Rama: Double standards as usual!

19/07/2023, 1:27 pm - +Rose M K Ho: Also my point abt using AI & leaving it to the machines...

Our brains become useless... 🤪

19/07/2023, 1:32 pm - +Rama: https://www.asiaone.com/singapore/leon-perera-resigns-mp-and-workers-party-nicole-seah-also-quits-party-pritam-singh

19/07/2023, 1:47 pm - +Frankie Wee: Both of them are unpolitical

19/07/2023, 1:48 pm - +Rama: Agree

19/07/2023, 1:59 pm - +REACH: 📢 *Topic* 📢

Some 4,000 civil servants are using a Government chatbot based on ChatGPT called Pair to assist them with writing, research, and coding, in a trial of artificial intelligence (AI) bots to boost productivity within the Government and better benefit the public.

A security arrangement between the Government and Azure OpenAI – an arm of Microsoft that offers coding and language AI models – also ensures that confidential information is kept private within ministries and unavailable to Microsoft.

💬 *What are your views on the application of AI within Government services? What are some other ways of AI application that could help boost productivity of Government services and better benefit the public?*

Pair and an upgraded SupportGoWhere are part of the first tranche of AI use cases in the government. Pair will allow the secure and efficient use of large language models as a writing assistant within the government space, and also provides “a sparring partner for ideas”, he said.

The agency is also in the nascent stages of testing large language models to upgrade SupportGoWhere, a portal for locals to search and apply for government aid. Incorporating AI into SupportGoWhere will allow users to describe their problem in their own words and get a response on what assistance they can apply for and where to get it.

“If we get this approach right,” said Dr Janil, “citizens will be able to express their personal story without necessarily knowing how the schemes and support of the government are structured, which is something you still have to know today.”

Members of the public can take advantage of certain ePrimer modules on the Singapore Government Developer Portal to pick up these general concepts. (Link below  - the last link)

👉🏻 *4,000 civil servants using Government Pair chatbot for writing, coding*

https://str.sg/iwvS

👉🏻 *How Singapore intends to harness AI for the public good*

https://str.sg/i3Ms

👉🏻 *Public officers can use ChatGPT and similar AI, but must take responsibility for their work: MCI*

https://str.sg/iJ8c

👉🏻 *Link to the Singapore Government Developer Portal*

https://www.developer.tech.gov.sg/

19/07/2023, 2:03 pm - +~L: Having used ChatGPT extensively, I concluded that you cannot trust it for factual information. It's a language model only. It can perform analysis of text. You cannot use it verbatim. It's a very useful tool, like an auto spell checker.... It cannot do the work for you, even though it appears it can.

19/07/2023, 2:04 pm - +~L: It can break down information quickly into simple terms and constraints. It can create graphs, write code, suggest options for you.

19/07/2023, 2:05 pm - +~L: It can write text explaining ideas and adjust the tone for different audiences to make it easier to understand.

19/07/2023, 2:06 pm - +~L: It's truly brilliant tech and very easy to use. However, it doesn't replace human experience. The people at risk are interns and junior data analysts for example.

19/07/2023, 2:07 pm - +~L: There are countless examples of where AI has been extremely productive and efficient doing the work of many people in a fraction of the time and at zero cost.

19/07/2023, 2:07 pm - +~L: We cannot afford not to adopt it.

19/07/2023, 2:09 pm - +Jimmy Chew: Maybe they can tap the top civil service thinking algorithms and program it. All the thinking process into a super thinkers

19/07/2023, 2:10 pm - +Rose M K Ho: Ya.... 🤪  Then we dun need Super thinkers anymore ... ya?!  

Cos super thinker dun need to use brain anymore, become lazy ... 😴

19/07/2023, 2:12 pm - +~L: https://chat.openai.com/share/1b16fd23-cfd7-4ef4-a253-4832c5f964b3

19/07/2023, 2:12 pm - +~L: Reach can start to use OpenAI ChatGPT to ask the same questions they are asking us each day :)

19/07/2023, 2:13 pm - +Rama: Using AI rather humans¡?

19/07/2023, 2:13 pm - +~L: The above example shows how generic the ChatBot is. However, it does provide structure that you can then drill down into and get more specific.

19/07/2023, 2:14 pm - +~L: Use AI to create specific structure and questions and suggestions - then ask the humans. AI does 80% of the work, which the humans then validate.

19/07/2023, 2:17 pm - +Rose M K Ho: Thanks!

It's gg to take a lot more than this list to convince me !

Btw, let's also see how 'sustainable' this is.

In the 1st place, they'll hv to deal w those who aren't even tech savvy ... using mobile phone is alredi a hassle for some - altho I doubt if this grp is the target audience.

"Eh" (A)? "ai / ei 爱" (I) ?

Wat? 

🤣🤣🤣🤣

19/07/2023, 2:17 pm - +Ah Heng: dun forget whatever AI is doing it still needs a man there to mgt it

19/07/2023, 2:18 pm - +Ah Heng: but many brainies from the west have came out also to condem the going to over reliance on AI where we humans allow it to be smarter than us leading to a very dark world if not well control

19/07/2023, 2:18 pm - +Ah Heng: some call it skynet for short

19/07/2023, 2:21 pm - +~L: Yes, of course. But it took 5 seconds to create that list. Doing it properly would take about an hour. Doing it without the use of AI would take at least a day.

19/07/2023, 2:23 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Prompt: Write a 600-word essay for a university scholarship application into a machine learning university course in a perspective of a researcher.

19/07/2023, 2:23 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

As a researcher with a passion for machine learning, I am eager to apply for the machine learning scholarship at your esteemed university. I am confident that this scholarship will provide me with the opportunity to gain the technical skills and knowledge necessary to advance my research in the field.

My research interests lie in the application of machine learning to solve complex problems in various industries, such as healthcare and finance. While I have gained a solid foundation in machine learning through my previous academic and research experiences, I recognize that there is still much to learn. I am particularly interested in gaining deeper knowledge of advanced techniques such as deep learning and natural language processing, as well as the practical skills required to implement these techniques effectively.

I believe that the machine learning program at your university offers an exceptional opportunity to learn these skills. The program's curriculum is designed to provide students with a strong foundation in the fundamental concepts of machine learning while also providing hands-on experience with real-world datasets and problems. Additionally, the program offers courses on advanced techniques such as deep learning, natural language processing, and computer vision, which I believe will be invaluable in advancing my research.

In addition to the technical skills I hope to gain from this program, I am excited about the opportunity to collaborate with fellow researchers and learn from leading experts in the field. I believe that collaboration is essential in the field of machine learning, as it can lead to innovative solutions to complex problems. I am eager to work with other researchers on projects that apply machine learning to solve real-world problems.

Furthermore, I am excited about the possibility of participating in research projects conducted at your university. I believe that working on research projects will provide me with practical experience in implementing machine learning techniques and working with real-world datasets. Additionally, I am eager to contribute to ongoing research projects and learn from experienced researchers who have already made significant contributions to the field.

Lastly, I would like to mention that I am committed to using my technical skills and knowledge to make a positive impact on society. I believe that technology has the power to solve many of the world's most pressing problems, and I am passionate about contributing to this cause. After completing my studies, I plan to work on projects that use machine learning to address social problems such as healthcare disparities, financial inequality, and climate change.

In conclusion, I am confident that the machine learning program at your university will provide me with the technical skills and knowledge necessary to advance my research in the field. I am excited about the opportunity to collaborate with fellow researchers and learn from leading experts in the field. Additionally, I am committed to using my skills and knowledge to make a positive impact on society, and I believe that the skills I will gain from this program will enable me to do so effectively. Thank you for considering my application for this scholarship, and I look forward to the opportunity to contribute to the machine learning community at your university.

19/07/2023, 2:31 pm - +Frankie Wee: NASA will use AI to sent mission in mars planet than human

19/07/2023, 2:31 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

1. To discuss the use of Generative AI, eg. ChatGPT, using a real life example will be the best to convince people who have not used it.

2. The above is an example of a prompt in ChatGPT and the response from ChatGPT.

3. The response look impressive.

4. But if submitted, the person will probably not successful in winning the scholarship.

5. It only provides a good report structure - but have no meat, specific ingredients that interviewers are looking for - how the applicant will benefit the organisation if scholarship is awarded to him.

6. So actually, there is no fear this generative AI will take over the job of the people.

It provides a good guide, a good structure to report writing, but it can't replace a human input.

7. To be honest, the final report is more than 80% different from this ChatGPT generated report when submitted.

8. And he was awarded the scholarship.

19/07/2023, 2:31 pm - +Frankie Wee: AI will building project in mars once completed mission we can live in mars

19/07/2023, 2:31 pm - +~L: Don't forget the prompt to write in the style of an enthusiastic student and not a GPT LLM.

19/07/2023, 2:32 pm - +Rose M K Ho: 👆🏻er ...

U mean this is Example generated by AI, right?

Yup. I'm fully aware of its capabilities.

19/07/2023, 2:32 pm - +Rose M K Ho: But I Dun Trust AI.... 🤪

19/07/2023, 2:33 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Yes it is generated by ChatGPT.

19/07/2023, 2:34 pm - +Frankie Wee: Wow you use ChatHPT?

19/07/2023, 2:34 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

But it didn't provide insights how it benefit the organisation specifically.

See the report - it will give you a feel that the report is a "motherhood statement".

19/07/2023, 2:35 pm - +Rose M K Ho: I beg to differ.

'Lazy' people, Not so English-versed people wl _actually_ use this sample as it is without gg thru it!

That's _my_ point!

Not everyone wud look thru such verbose stuff w a fine tooth comb .... 😁

19/07/2023, 2:35 pm - +Frankie Wee: ChatGPT write within 5-10 seconds fast than human brain

19/07/2023, 2:35 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

I too old to apply for a scholarship.

19/07/2023, 2:36 pm - +lesli: Perera's & Nicole's letters about their resignation & Pritam Singh's replies. From the horse's mouth.

Perera's letter  https://bit.ly/3XWf2JA

Seah's letter  https://bit.ly/3K6ny33

19/07/2023, 2:36 pm - +~L: Yes, exactly. It's a suggestion and a guide rather than to be used literally.

19/07/2023, 2:44 pm - +#.@: lacking in anecdotal evidence, didn't provide examples of ML project the candidate attempted on or libraries that was used, or interest in the university specific experiment, this will be brush aside if its a real application

19/07/2023, 2:45 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Yes.

Hence ChatGPT is not a real threat.

Just like computer, it is a tool not a replacement of human input. <This message was edited>

19/07/2023, 2:46 pm - +#.@: the real current threat is when your competitors are responding faster and cheaper by using AI

19/07/2023, 2:46 pm - +Rama: More understanding and legislation needed.

19/07/2023, 2:47 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Yes.

We need AI to hasten output by helping us.

Just like the invention of computer versus typewriter.

19/07/2023, 2:49 pm - +Frankie Wee: Time is changed

19/07/2023, 2:50 pm - +Frankie Wee: Like you use English dictionary book in old day searching

19/07/2023, 2:52 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Eg.

1. Computer versus typewriter.

2. Calculator versus abacus.

3. Machine versus handmade products.

19/07/2023, 2:53 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

4. Aircon, fans versus hand fan.

19/07/2023, 2:53 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

5. Car versus horse, ox cart.

19/07/2023, 2:54 pm - +Frankie Wee: Auto Machine wash versus hand wash

19/07/2023, 2:55 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Hahaha...

Yes.

AI is of similar vein.

19/07/2023, 2:57 pm - +Smiley face: 19 July, 2023

"Seeing is believing...?"

" Imagining the future of prepping for examinations; parents using chatbots to sieve the top probable maths questions for the PSLE or your tutor preparing a host of questions for your coming "A" levels exams or SEAB commanding the chatbots to derive, to repeat and to refine a sets of papers for the next national exams whether is a language, science, maths or theory of knowledge papers and no more tears, no more fears and less complaints; that's efficiency and how effective will all these faster setups becoming to be ACED by many people; after all, it is a game of ratio?"

- - anonymity

19/07/2023, 3:03 pm - +~L: I spoke with a legal firm and they said ChatGPT did a better job than their Juniors, so they will be hiring less Juniors.

19/07/2023, 3:03 pm - +~L: Does anyone here not use GPS via their Maps App on their Phone?

19/07/2023, 3:04 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

US lawyer sorry after ChatGPT creates 'bogus' cases.                                                                     Cannot fully trust ChatGPT while exploiting it.                                                                                      Must verify all the facts produced.                                                        https://www.channelnewsasia.com/world/us-lawyer-sorry-after-chatgpt-creates-bogus-cases-3549261

19/07/2023, 3:04 pm - +Rose M K Ho: Personally, I think everyone is _under_ estimating the potential of AI here.

U're not seeing wat I see.

Ther r always 2 sides to a coin.

Here, I see the Bad side of AI -- being misused for whatever (wl not mention since no one here understands wat I'm trying to say). 

That wud be in the future,  which I hope , will never happen.

But until tt day comes, it's good to see u guys here think so naively of the situation. 

I'm looking way, way beyond all the "goodie" things tt everyone is "wowing" over. 

It's no big deal, as it is , for now.

But its potential has yet to be reached & until someone 'sees' tt , or some super event blows up in our faces, I guess it's ok to just stick to the menial, trivial tasks tt everyone thinks AI can only do at the moment.

19/07/2023, 3:06 pm - +Caleb: fake URL?

19/07/2023, 3:06 pm - +Rose M K Ho: And yes, I see the potential Threat in AI, not the 'nice, wonderful' things everyone is wowing over.

19/07/2023, 3:06 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Hence though ChatGPT is a good tool, facts, checks, human inputs are imperative.

We cannot submit a ChatGPT generated output and submit it log stock and barrel.

The outcome could be exactly the opposite.

19/07/2023, 3:06 pm - +Caleb: Page Not Found

19/07/2023, 3:07 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Oh CNA remove the news already.

19/07/2023, 3:08 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

"Lies, damn lies and ChatGPT"

 https://www.businesstimes.com.sg/opinion-features/lies-damn-lies-and-chatgpt#:~:text=Lies%2C%20damn%20lies%20and%20ChatGPT

19/07/2023, 3:11 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

This lawyer was sanction by the judge and law society - because ChatGPT generated fake case precedents .

The lawyer did not check the facts.

When the judge search his database for all the case precedents quoted, none was found.

ChatGPT fabricated all the case precedents.

If the case precedents are true, the lawyer could have win the case.

But now the lawyer got sanction and lose his case.

19/07/2023, 3:13 pm - +Rose M K Ho: Tks! Another good example ... this time of how AI can be misused ...

..  which brings me bk to the point of checks & policies ...

Had the judge not checked,  .... wat wud hv happened.... ? 

🤔

19/07/2023, 3:16 pm - +#.@: For me the questions here are, did ChatGPT generate fake precedents, or did the lawyer wanted chatGPT to generate fake precedents. Did ChatGPT return fake results without the prompt by the lawyer?

19/07/2023, 3:17 pm - +#.@: but what would I know, i'm just naïve 🥲

19/07/2023, 3:18 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

No specific on how the lawyer use the prompt.

The judge discovered that the lawyer use it honestly.

19/07/2023, 3:19 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

But ChatGPT is trained on data provided by humans.

Garbage in garbage out.

ChatGPT could have pick up the fake case precedents provided in the internet, being trained on it and Garbage out.

19/07/2023, 3:20 pm - +Smiley face: Hi Rose, great analogy of AI...

The US-UK-EU are currently working towards a consensus of regulations for the use and future uses of AI, that's work in progress!

Second, you are correct! The good, the Bad and the Ugly of the coming of the AI world!

Third, only human as the creator of these powerful tools are responsible to not overly tune it till there may be no point of returning to the norm!

As Thomas Friedman once said, " the world is flat" and today it seems more flattering...

Thank you!

19/07/2023, 3:20 pm - +Rose M K Ho: <Media omitted>

19/07/2023, 3:20 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

Also there is a possibility that AI do experience "hallucinations" - whereby algorithm go out of loop and produce gibberish output.

19/07/2023, 3:21 pm - +Rose M K Ho: There you go !

Machine gets the better of man ! .... 

I rest my case!

😅

19/07/2023, 3:23 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: <Media omitted>

 

19/07/2023, 3:24 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: <Media omitted>

 

19/07/2023, 3:25 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hallucination_(artificial_intelligence)#:~:text=For%20example%2C%20a%20hallucinating%20chatbot,plucked%20from%20thin%20air%22).

19/07/2023, 3:28 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: <Media omitted>

 

19/07/2023, 3:30 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

But highlighting the problems of ChatGPT - doesn't mean that I discourage using it.

We should use it.

But always check, verify, use critical analysis, and most important, human inputs and brainwork are very important.

Don't fully rely on ChatGPT to do the work for you.

Just use it as a tool for reference.

19/07/2023, 3:32 pm - +Rose M K Ho: Well said.  Agreed.

19/07/2023, 3:47 pm - +~L: We agree. Exactly what I said in my earlier post too.

19/07/2023, 3:52 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

1. Looking at the narrative of today's topic, the Government seems to adopt a "closed architecture" in exploiting an equivalent ChatGPT with Microsoft.

2. Look like data set being trained are not lifted from the open Internet - but within the civil service.

3. This will minimise the risk of fake data being inputted and trained on by Generative AI.

4. However, check, verification, human inputs and critical thinking will still be critical - as we cannot fully rely on Generative AI log-stock-and-barrel without fact checking and critical human thinking and input.

5. The mindset of using Generative AI - should be one like "using computer to help us" and not let "computer to replace us".

In similar vein, let "Generative AI to help us" and not let "Generative AI to replace us".

19/07/2023, 3:55 pm - +Smiley face: Code of Conduct?

19/07/2023, 3:56 pm - +Smiley face: Scale: The ratio of efficiency between the multiple points of services and the Servers.

19/07/2023, 3:56 pm - +Smiley face: Definitions and scopes of services?

19/07/2023, 3:57 pm - +Smiley face: Local, regional and global?

19/07/2023, 3:57 pm - +Smiley face: Securitize and Transactional?

19/07/2023, 3:58 pm - +Smiley face: How AI and chatbots will command the faculty of disinformation; if an entity pre-planned to use these digitised tools just to win?

19/07/2023, 3:58 pm - +Frankie Wee: Lawyer can use ChatGPT or ChatBox for battle win to win in case their clients

19/07/2023, 4:00 pm - +Smiley face: Created multiple precedents or new ways in the interpretations of the law, aka rewriting the law, once and repeatedly!

19/07/2023, 4:00 pm - +REACH: 📢 *Topic* 📢

Some 4,000 civil servants are using a Government chatbot based on ChatGPT called Pair to assist them with writing, research, and coding, in a trial of artificial intelligence (AI) bots to boost productivity within the Government and better benefit the public.

A security arrangement between the Government and Azure OpenAI – an arm of Microsoft that offers coding and language AI models – also ensures that confidential information is kept private within ministries and unavailable to Microsoft.

💬 *What are your views on the application of AI within Government services? What are some other ways of AI application that could help boost productivity of Government services and better benefit the public?*

Pair and an upgraded SupportGoWhere are part of the first tranche of AI use cases in the government. Pair will allow the secure and efficient use of large language models as a writing assistant within the government space, and also provides “a sparring partner for ideas”, he said.

The agency is also in the nascent stages of testing large language models to upgrade SupportGoWhere, a portal for locals to search and apply for government aid. Incorporating AI into SupportGoWhere will allow users to describe their problem in their own words and get a response on what assistance they can apply for and where to get it.

“If we get this approach right,” said Dr Janil, “citizens will be able to express their personal story without necessarily knowing how the schemes and support of the government are structured, which is something you still have to know today.”

Members of the public can take advantage of certain ePrimer modules on the Singapore Government Developer Portal to pick up these general concepts. (Link below  - the last link)

👉🏻 *4,000 civil servants using Government Pair chatbot for writing, coding*

https://str.sg/iwvS

👉🏻 *How Singapore intends to harness AI for the public good*

https://str.sg/i3Ms

👉🏻 *Public officers can use ChatGPT and similar AI, but must take responsibility for their work: MCI*

https://str.sg/iJ8c

👉🏻 *Link to the Singapore Government Developer Portal*

https://www.developer.tech.gov.sg/

19/07/2023, 4:04 pm - +Smiley face: Streamline and efficiency of the civil service to cater to thousands of users within minutes of delivering the specific service or enquiry with minimal Q-time wasted...

19/07/2023, 4:07 pm - +Rama: I heard la but don't know true anot that in 2025 GE, There will be a new party..Party members  are Nicole Seah, Leon, TCJ and CLH, Palmer and David.

Party name have been decided ..Is call The Third Party. 😂🤣🤣🤣

19/07/2023, 4:11 pm - +Ah Heng: wahhhhhh

19/07/2023, 4:32 pm - +Smiley face: https://youtu.be/j0rxzgoG7nU

19/07/2023, 4:33 pm - +Smiley face: https://youtu.be/Kmi7pDIk5N4

19/07/2023, 4:34 pm - +Rama: Only good contender against Tharman

19/07/2023, 4:36 pm - +Frankie Wee: He is former GIC

19/07/2023, 4:45 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: 

1. To understand Generative AI, specifically, we have to understand what ChatGPT is made up of.

2. Generative AI, speficically use a combination of :-

a. ML - Machine Learning

b. NLP - Natural Language Processing

c. Deep Learning

d. LLM - Large Language Model.

e. Neural network

f. Reinforcement Learning 

3. ML - Machine Learning

- is about creating a model that can recognise patterns in data and used them to make predictions or take actions.

4. NLP - Natural Language Processing

- enable machine to understand and process human language

5. Deep Learning

- It is based on deep learning architecture called the transformer.

6. LLM - Large Language Model.

- It mimic human intelligence.

- It uses statistical models to analyse vast amount of data, learning the patterns and connections between words and phrase.

7. Neural Network

- it uses neural network architecture comprising mathematical equations - linear and non-linear equations.

- A neural network comprise of multiple layers, where each layer performs a linear or non-linear transformation of the input from the previous layer.

8. Reinforcement Learning

- Reinforcement learning is a semi-supervised learning - learn based on "reward" (positive and negative reinforcement) - just like human.

- It is iterative in nature with the best solution gradually improving over time until an optimal strategy is discovered or the training process is ended.

- Because AI got "punished" with point deduction, it move away from bad solution and move into good solution as good solution accumulate points.

19/07/2023, 4:47 pm - ☸️  Danny 心: https://www.independent.co.uk/tech/harvard-chatbot-teacher-computer-science-b2363114.html

Harvard’s new computer science teacher is a chatbot

Students enrolled in the university’s flagship CS50 course will be presented with the AI teacher in September

19/07/2023, 4:48 pm - +Smiley face: https://youtu.be/sBWSszyI-GU

19/07/2023, 4:55 pm - +Smiley face: https://youtu.be/AaLQzXVL8oE

19/07/2023, 5:33 pm - +Smiley face: https://youtu.be/bSdUfnwQA8k

19/07/2023, 5:58 pm - +Rama: And PAP has changed its name to Problem After Problem party 🤣

19/07/2023, 6:00 pm - +Frankie Wee: He is power political

19/07/2023, 6:00 pm - +REACH: 📢 *Topic* 📢

Some 4,000 civil servants are using a Government chatbot based on ChatGPT called Pair to assist them with writing, research, and coding, in a trial of artificial intelligence (AI) bots to boost productivity within the Government and better benefit the public.

A security arrangement between the Government and Azure OpenAI – an arm of Microsoft that offers coding and language AI models – also ensures that confidential information is kept private within ministries and unavailable to Microsoft.

💬 *What are your views on the application of AI within Government services? What are some other ways of AI application that could help boost productivity of Government services and better benefit the public?*

Pair and an upgraded SupportGoWhere are part of the first tranche of AI use cases in the government. Pair will allow the secure and efficient use of large language models as a writing assistant within the government space, and also provides “a sparring partner for ideas”, he said.

The agency is also in the nascent stages of testing large language models to upgrade SupportGoWhere, a portal for locals to search and apply for government aid. Incorporating AI into SupportGoWhere will allow users to describe their problem in their own words and get a response on what assistance they can apply for and where to get it.

“If we get this approach right,” said Dr Janil, “citizens will be able to express their personal story without necessarily knowing how the schemes and support of the government are structured, which is something you still have to know today.”

Members of the public can take advantage of certain ePrimer modules on the Singapore Government Developer Portal to pick up these general concepts. (Link below  - the last link)

👉🏻 *4,000 civil servants using Government Pair chatbot for writing, coding*

https://str.sg/iwvS

👉🏻 *How Singapore intends to harness AI for the public good*

https://str.sg/i3Ms

👉🏻 *Public officers can use ChatGPT and similar AI, but must take responsibility for their work: MCI*

https://str.sg/iJ8c

👉🏻 *Link to the Singapore Government Developer Portal*

https://www.developer.tech.gov.sg/

19/07/2023, 6:25 pm - Your security code with ~ M@ni changed. Tap to learn more.

19/07/2023, 6:45 pm - +REACH: *Dear Contributors,*

⏰ We will be closing the chat in *15 minutes* ⏰

Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.

Goodnight!

Megan 😊 <This message was edited>

19/07/2023, 6:52 pm - +Rama: <Media omitted>

19/07/2023, 6:59 pm - +Smiley face: 19 July, 2023

"Seeing is believing...?"

" Imagining the future of prepping for examinations; parents using chatbots to sieve the top probable maths questions for the PSLE or your tutor preparing a host of questions for your coming "A" levels exams or SEAB commanding the chatbots to derive, to repeat and to refine a sets of papers for the next national exams whether is a language, science, maths or theory of knowledge papers and no more tears, no more fears and less complaints; that's efficiency and how effective will all these faster setups becoming to be ACED by many people; after all, it is a game of ratio?"

- - anonymity 

Usefulness?

Streamline and efficiency of the civil service to cater to thousands of users within minutes of delivering the specific service or enquiry with minimal Queueing time via Internet, on phone or in person.

How AI and chatbots will command the faculty of disinformation; if an entity pre-planned to use these digitised tools just to win? How?

Seeing is believing?

Today what you see in the Internet can be not real ! How about public opinions, propagandas or even sentiments during a period of heated elections? How to define and detect what is true?

Scale?

The ratio of efficiency between the multiple points of services and the Servers.

It is an achievable and powerful tool even to scale a business model upwards into millions of options and outcomes, that's the power of AI vs human abilities - the absolute competitions for repetitive and refinement of tangibles and intangibles.

Definitions and scopes of services?

From the physical counters to the remote access and the paperworks to the digital platforms of information.

Securitize and Transactional? How to internalise and externalise risks of misused or leaked data?

Local, regional and global? Are these systems of apps come with several cloud banks (modular) in chains (obital) and are these apps accessible only by location from local or to regional or global. These are scaling and security issues to be addressed.

Let us expand this exams and chatbots model into many areas of possibility, impossibility and utilities; that's what Thomas Friedman once said, "the world is flat" and now is flattering - One World!

Afterwords:

Generative AI has broad applications that will impact a wide range of workers, occupations, and activities. Unlike most advances in automation of the past, it is a machine of the mind affecting cognitive work. (deep learning)

From WW2 until the early 1970s, labor productivity grew at over 3% a year, more than doubling over the period, ushering in an era of prosperity for most Americans. In the early 1970s productivity growth slowed dramatically, rebounding in the 1990s and only to slow again since the early 2000s. (growth & productivity)

The recent advances in generative AI have been driven by progress in software, hardware, data collection, and growing amounts of investment in cutting-edge models. 

Cutting-edge AI systems has been doubling every six months over the past decade. The capabilities of generative AI systems have grown in multiples, allowing to perform many tasks that used to be reserved for the thinking workers, such as writing "well-crafted" sentences, creating computer code, summarising articles, brainstorming ideas, organising plans, translating multiple languages, writing complex emails, and more...(multiplier effects)

    - - in progress - -

19/07/2023, 7:03 pm - +REACH: *Dear Contributors,*

We will be closing the chat for today.

Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.

Goodnight!

Megan 😊

19/07/2023, 7:03 pm - ~ REACH Singapore changed this group's settings to allow only admins to send messages to this group

=====