Monday, September 19, 2022

REACH 396 - What are your views on the relevance of ethnic-based self-help groups in supporting less-privileged communities? How else can society work together to uplift low income groups in Singapore? 

(SK)

19 Sep 2022 (10am - 7pm)


REACH

[9:56 am, 19/09/2022] +REACH: Dear Contributors,

Welcome back! 😊

⏰ We will be opening the chat from 10am to 7pm today. ⏰

House Rules (short version of our Terms of Use) to keep in mind: 

1. Be kind and respectful. We all want to be in a safe space to share our views. 

2. Any and all threatening, abusive, vulgar or racially, religiously and ethnically objectionable content is prohibited.

3. Consider the quiet ones among us and give them a chance to comment.

4. No need to repeat your comment or in different forms (including caps) - we heard you loud and clear the first time.

5. Let’s protect each other’s privacy and keep contact details in this group what it should always be - confidential. 

Full set of Terms of Use: https://go.gov.sg/reach-whatsapp-terms

We will strive to uphold these rules to ensure this is a safe space for all.

Please be assured that the points made by participants during the chat are aggregated and shared with relevant agencies.

The topic will be posted shortly.

Thank you

Megan 😊

[10:00 am, 19/09/2022] +REACH: 📢 Topic 📢

Speaking at the Chinese Development Assistance Council (CDAC) 30th Anniversary Open House yesterday, Prime Minister (PM) Lee said that as Singapore's economy develops and the external environment becomes more challenging, "economic growth will be harder to come by, and social mobility will be tougher to sustain".

In this way, Singapore's four ethnic-based self help groups -  the CDAC, Mendaki, SINDA and the Eurasian Association, are still an important source of aid for low income families as they are able to customise programmes most relevant to their beneficiaries. 

💬 What are your views on the relevance of ethnic-based self-help groups in supporting less-privileged communities? How else can society work together to uplift low income groups in Singapore? 

PM Lee explained that while the Government provides assistance to low-income families regardless of ethnicity, these self-help groups – which are funded by the Government and community donations of 50 cents to $3 per worker each month – are able to provide additional support and address issues without raising racial or religious sensitivities. These groups also provide a vehicle for more well-off Singaporeans to support members from their own communities. 

Ethnic-based self help groups offer a range of mentoring support, tuition programmes and financial aid for low income families in their respective communities. The groups also run joint programmes - like the Collaborative Tuition Programme and Big Heart Student Care Centres - which cater to students from all races. 

👉 https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/ethnic-self-help-groups-still-vital-as-they-customise-support-for-beneficiaries-pm-lee

👉 https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/ethnic-based-self-help-groups-relevant-singapore-raises-socio-economic-levels-pm-lee-2947021

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[10:24 am, 19/09/2022] +Smiley face: Mandarin and English spee ches

https://youtu.be/3AIvbbJFRrI

[10:32 am, 19/09/2022] +SL: Ethnic-based self-help groups are important in our society. This is something we should not re-engineer until the whole community thinks self-help groups are no longer necessary. Self-help groups may want to work with others to maximize using the community resources to target and help those in need to prevent duplication of help that results in the wastage of resources.

[10:35 am, 19/09/2022] +65 8796 9013: $0.50 to $3 collect whole employment with a year it’s worth  million dollars after 30th anniversary can be billion dollars

[10:38 am, 19/09/2022] +SL: Collaboration and better resource management from society as one for charity and self-help groups is crucial, especially during post covid high inflation period, to prevent those who require help from the overlook due to different areas of responsibility.

[10:44 am, 19/09/2022] +SL: The published audited account for 2021 cdac total assets of only 120,926,835 (comprised of operation fund and endowment fund)

[10:45 am, 19/09/2022] +SL: Audited reports are available for other self-help groups on their website too

[11:14 am, 19/09/2022] +Smiley face: "one helps others (in small ways) and other groups helping more others (in many ways), that's a chain reaction and a positive condition towards an inclusive and caring habits."

- - annoymous

[0:02 pm, 19/09/2022] +Smiley face: 19 September, 2022

To: Our Distinguished Leaders, Community Leaders and All Honorable Members

"Take and Give, Give and Take

(饮水思源)"

The Spirit of Givings:

Is there a possibility to increase the monthly contributions to the four community funds (Chinese, Malay, Indian and Eurasian) from $1 to $50?

By encouraging especially those who earns above $10,000.00 monthly to give $10/month and those earning $30,000.00 and above to give $30-50/mth or more? Better still, any amount above all mentioned?

Is it too much (money) to ask from the higher income individuals to 'chip-in' to uplift fellow citizens of all ages to a better life and expand their outreach to a meaningful and aspiring tomorrows?

Afterwords:

"one helps others (in small ways) and other groups helping more others (in many ways), that's a chain reaction and a positive condition towards an inclusive and caring habits."

- - annoymous 

In the middle of the nite, phone rang, your 'hospice care' person has passed on! The next moment you activated the funeral process and completed that person last rites and last wish. That itself is a selfless act, it is more than giving money or donate to good causes! 

Kudos to Mr Anson Ang true stories of many suffering people he attended and the truths are lying out there every day and in many ways!

https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/community/the-serial-do-gooder-who-pays-for-the-funerals-of-strangers

    - - in progress - -

[2:03 pm, 19/09/2022] +REACH: 📢 Topic 📢

Speaking at the Chinese Development Assistance Council (CDAC) 30th Anniversary Open House yesterday, Prime Minister (PM) Lee said that as Singapore's economy develops and the external environment becomes more challenging, "economic growth will be harder to come by, and social mobility will be tougher to sustain".

In this way, Singapore's four ethnic-based self help groups -  the CDAC, Mendaki, SINDA and the Eurasian Association, are still an important source of aid for low income families as they are able to customise programmes most relevant to their beneficiaries. 

💬 What are your views on the relevance of ethnic-based self-help groups in supporting less-privileged communities? How else can society work together to uplift low income groups …


[2:03 pm, 19/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

1. The CDAC ethnic self-help group just like other ethnic self-help group like Mendaki, SINDA and Eurasian Association - are meant to collect funds from the same ethnic groups to fund and help their fellow ethnic Singaporeans who are of lower income to tie through difficult period of their time and to level up to attain social mobility so as to be self-sustainable for the whole family.


2. Notably, the source of funds from these self-help groups are from monthly contribution by working people as donation (a very small amount), plus top-up by government - which in total not a big amount of money (unless the fund are also invested to growth the fund).


3. Hence the self-help group funds must be use wisely.


4. In times of badly needed money to buy food or necessities - providing a small amount of money to the lower income family to tie through - will be akin to "Giving fish to eat - to fill their stomach and sustain their lives".

But in the long run, this is not sustainable as the limited fund of the self-help group will get depleted.


5. Hence the need to level up the lower income family - to make them self-sustainable and attain social mobility to go upwards - akin to "Giving them fishing rods to help them to fish for their families" - which is more self-sustainable in the long run - and when they are able  to be self-sustained - they can in turn contribute to the self-help group fund.


a. To help lower income group to level up and attain social mobility - as correctly identified by the Government and the self-help groups --- is to provide education to the children of the lower income families ---- so that they can eventually graduate with a University or a polytechnic diploma - that can help them to gain good and high income jobs - so that they can finance their family's expenses and accumulate wealth --- and in so help the lower-income families to do an uplift - a social mobility upwards to crime the social ladder and income ladder - and pull their families out of poverty.


b. Hence help and assistance to make the children of the low-income families to be successful such as giving them free tuition to help them do well in their weak subjects, give them bursaries, scholarships, education funds etc - to help them succeed in their education will be the most effective approach to the low-income families to level up.


c. It is also important to impart the good and right values of work attitude and ethics to the children of these low-income families :-

i. Hardworking - willing to work hard to contribute to the job and the employer

ii. Hungry to succeed in education eg. Graduate with good Degrees, diplomas

iii. Hungry to get a good job, high-income jobs.

iv. Devoid of unrealistic expectations and wants from the employers (which I wish to elaborate later - continuation from the previous topic).


[2:07 pm, 19/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

[15/09, 7:42 am] Close friend: China workers working 9-9-6. Our people wants 4 day work week. So all contracts and SLA have to be re-written?


[15/09, 11:49 am] ☸️  Danny 心: Exactly.

Some people say, another staff cover his job on Friday.

Then it means the company will have 2 days degraded service.

If one staff work Mon to Thurs - Fri need one staff to cover.

Then that staff work Tues to Fri, the other staff cover him on Mon.

It means Mon and Fri are 2 degraded service days for the company.

Yet the 4 days week staff want equivalent salary of 5 days week staff. 

But company have 2 days degraded service.


[15/09, 11:53 am] ☸️  Danny 心: Also in an IT company, I cannot arrange database specialist to cover a network guy or a software developer or an AI specialist.

This means I need to employ 2 specialists each in my department - means higher business cost.

Likewise in a hospital, can I cover a brain specialist with a heart specialist or a lung specialist?

One people say 4 days week is non-linear.

I say it is linear - because jobs cannot be covered unless I employ 2 similar skillsets for a 4 days week - else I will have 2 degraded service for my company.

Thus if I am recruiting staff, I will put a clause:-

"5 days week candidate required.

4 days week candidate no need to apply."

What if the 4 days week staff work from 9am to 8pm Mon to Thurs just to make up the working hours?

It will cause me to have degraded service on Mon and Fri - unless I employ double staff to plug the 2 days degraded service.


Thus 4 days week staff is a gimmick to me - not providing the required service on 2 days or I will have to incur higher staff costs to higher double the staff to plug the degraded service.


1. As for the example of durians, no use for 4 days week workers to work from 9 am to 8 pm on Mon to Thurs - because from 9 am to 6 pm all ripen durians will have been picked - the 2 extra 2 hours are not required even if a 4 days week want to work to make up for the working hours on Friday.


2. On Friday, no workers work to pick up the ripen durians. Come back on Monday, all the Fri ripen durians rotten.


3. So how does a 4 days work week worker useful to me compare to a 5 days weeks workers?

Also if the office hours is from 9am to 6pm.


Why do I need the 4 days week to work from 9am to 8pm from Mon to Thurs?


So the 2 extra hours 7 to 8 pm for them to waste around just to make up for the Fri working hours - when the company don't need them to be around?


And expect the company to pay them equivalent salary to 5 days week?

Also those staff who works 5 days week will they be happy to receive equivalent salary to 4 days week - and yet need to cover 1 day for the 4 days week workers?


Definitely not - they will get upset for unfair treatment.


Either they resign, demand for higher salary or all want to work 4 days week - which cause tremendous operational problem and higher business cost to the company.


Thus if I am the boss I will have 3 choices:-

a. Refrain from hiring 4 days week staff.

b. Cut the salaries of 4 days week staff.

c. Retrench 4 days week staff - who are causing operational and HR problems to the company.


[2:09 pm, 19/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

https://mustsharenews.com/boss-cancels-interview/


[2:09 pm, 19/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Youngster think they are kings? 🤔


[2:20 pm, 19/09/2022] +Smiley face: 19 September, 2022

"Educating Leaders of Tomorrows"

Leaders creating more Leaders:

All along, decades, Prefect (Counsellor) and CCA leadership roles have been part of our education system from Primary to JC. These are existing leadership roles by selected pupils.

It is timely to introduce a New category that is 'Community Leader' (CL). Each class will have up to 10 CL and each CL will serve any two school years for Primary to Secondary and JC shall be one year. Overall, all students would have their turns to become a CL at each institution from Primary to ITE, Poly or JC. It is almost a compulsory role for all students as a CL?

These young leaders will spearhead each school outreach program (4 events per school year) to it's Community social needs like food bank and other meaningful social activities jointly organised by that particular area community organisations and the school, these are commonly known as Service to Community.

These CL efforts would be recognized by the next school he or she applies to be considered for early admission under leadership and even the enlarged society as CV.

What do we think, this CL?


[2:48 pm, 19/09/2022] +Smiley face: Are these three virtues enough as KPI of one's lifetime? Or is it success, material achievements and money are above these 3 virtues?


[2:54 pm, 19/09/2022] +Umar M: https://str.sg/wKKP


[3:16 pm, 19/09/2022] +KL: Anyone go to cdac tuition before ?

[3:17 pm, 19/09/2022] +KL: I think a lot of ppl comments but who really go before in this group ?

[3:18 pm, 19/09/2022] +KL: Why ppl go cdac must be facing a mountain pressure .


[3:27 pm, 19/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

My son provide free tution to such student.

He passed his exam with a few straight As.

He will be going to the University.


[3:27 pm, 19/09/2022] +KL: A lot of ppl comment without going through the stress kids and their parents have to endure . Which in turn  I do have to full respect for those school teacher who volunteering their weekend precious time for the kids in the last decade for 4 cdac, mendaki etc, This show one question in mind . Ppl sent children for 18 years of schooling to be ? I don’t pity myself but the parents.

[3:28 pm, 19/09/2022] +KL: A poor family kids have different thoughts than u .


[3:28 pm, 19/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

That student is from the low income family.


[3:29 pm, 19/09/2022] +KL: He lucky lor

[3:30 pm, 19/09/2022] +KL: Meet ur son


[3:31 pm, 19/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

I am please with my son volunteer efforts despite his challenging time who need to juggle his previous university exam and his work after his graduate and the time he give free service to the student.

That student also study very hard and got very good results.


[3:32 pm, 19/09/2022] +KL: Poor family kids got time to study not bad

[3:32 pm, 19/09/2022] +KL: The worst is the kids still need to take care of ppl

[3:33 pm, 19/09/2022] +KL: So poor also have different grade

[3:33 pm, 19/09/2022] +KL: In case u not aware

[3:33 pm, 19/09/2022] +KL: Poor 

Very poor

Jin chaim

No cure liao

[3:35 pm, 19/09/2022] +KL: I do think school teachers play a important role than tuition teacher :)


[3:36 pm, 19/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

So it depends on individual attitude and aptitude.

Some no matter how poor are determined to succeed, hungry but hardworking.

Others with poor attitude and aptitude - no matter what help also no use.


[3:37 pm, 19/09/2022] +KL: I don’t think so luck play a part


[3:37 pm, 19/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Of course teachers play and important role.

But his parents come down personally to thanks my son for helping his kid to score well.


[3:54 pm, 19/09/2022] +KL: I can only say ur experience Is not a good example . Do U know cdac is a classroom in the past it a few lesson a few. It really eat into those teacher time.

[3:54 pm, 19/09/2022] +KL: I can only say ur experience Is not a good example . Do U know cdac is a classroom in the past it a few lesson a week. It really eat into those teacher time.


[3:56 pm, 19/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

My son example is organised by cdac and community centre that tie up one to one with my son and that kid.


[3:57 pm, 19/09/2022] +KL: Got cca / volunteer point ?


[3:58 pm, 19/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Nope.

My son is in final year at that time and also have secured a job.

He don't do this for benefits.


[3:58 pm, 19/09/2022] +KL: I see

[3:58 pm, 19/09/2022] +KL: He been doing before final year ?


[3:59 pm, 19/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

He did it for 3 years.


[3:59 pm, 19/09/2022] +KL: I see

[4:15 pm, 19/09/2022] +REACH: 📢 Topic 📢

Speaking at the Chinese Development Assistance Council (CDAC) 30th Anniversary Open House yesterday, Prime Minister (PM) Lee said that as Singapore's economy develops and the external environment becomes more challenging, "economic growth will be harder to come by, and social mobility will be tougher to sustain".

In this way, Singapore's four ethnic-based self help groups -  the CDAC, Mendaki, SINDA and the Eurasian Association, are still an important source of aid for low income families as they are able to customise programmes most relevant to their beneficiaries. 

💬 What are your views on the relevance of ethnic-based self-help groups in supporting less-privileged communities? How else can society work together to uplift low income groups …


[4:23 pm, 19/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

My close friend comments (which is also my agreed comments):-

We need to target the different forms of assistance to low income groups. Are we able to segmentise them into different categories?

Eg

(1) elderly who have no dependents or their dependents are also financially deprived

(2) elderly who have dependents who are financially well off but not getting from them

(3) long illness or handicap who makes finding long term employment difficult or unable to earn enough

(4) persons who are saddled with care giving responsibilities such as looking after elderly, ill and handicapped person's

(5) low education and low skilled person's

(6) those unwilling to work


[4:26 pm, 19/09/2022] +KL: Question > I got known ex colleagues withdrawn from donating to cdac ( they live in well to do places ) . So if they request help why should cdac help them ? ? A bit not fair hor :(


[4:27 pm, 19/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

My close friend comments (which is also my agreed comments):-

Our principle for assistance should aim at helping them to help themselves. Interim, short term financial assistance can be put in place while they adapt to changes. This to me is more wholesome assistance. 

While ethnic self help groups are good, but what if problems are perennial to certain ethnic group. Then do we have the heart to see them being left behind? We teach kids about one Singapore, one people, one nation. Is it better to pick one or two segments and  widen our efforts? To avoid being miscontrued as welfarism, we can formulate policies for monetary contributions from people and non monetary support from gov agencies.


[5:23 pm, 19/09/2022] +REACH: Dear Contributors, 

We’d love to HEAR MORE from you on today’s topic! 

💬 What are your views on the relevance of ethnic-based self-help groups in supporting less-privileged communities? How else can society work together to uplift low income groups in Singapore?

We have had good feedback from this group, and we hope that we can keep the discussion robust and active!

Megan 😊

[5:53 pm, 19/09/2022] +Smiley face: 19 September, 2022

To: Our Distinguished Leaders, Community Leaders and All Honorable Members

"Battles of the Equals"

How to battle equality?

If efficiency is one of the drivers of an economy, there will be tradeoffs in terms of equity. Likewise, if we forgo some efficiency, more equity will arise. 

Can we see there is an inverse relationship between efficiency and equity? There is an old saying, "it just cannot be equal, all human, it's just so difficult!"

One thing for sure, a highly growing country like Singapore, more than half of its population demands for all sorts of goods and services over the basic necessities of life. In simple words, more than half of us are living comfortably without any worry over food shortages. 

Now the reality is we …

[6:14 pm, 19/09/2022] +Smiley face: "The struggle is great, the task divine ” to gain mastery, freedom, happiness, and tranquility."

- - Epictetus

[6:18 pm, 19/09/2022] +REACH: 📢 Topic 📢

Speaking at the Chinese Development Assistance Council (CDAC) 30th Anniversary Open House yesterday, Prime Minister (PM) Lee said that as Singapore's economy develops and the external environment becomes more challenging, "economic growth will be harder to come by, and social mobility will be tougher to sustain".

In this way, Singapore's four ethnic-based self help groups -  the CDAC, Mendaki, SINDA and the Eurasian Association, are still an important source of aid for low income families as they are able to customise programmes most relevant to their beneficiaries. 

💬 What are your views on the relevance of ethnic-based self-help groups in supporting less-privileged communities? How else can society work together to uplift low income groups …

[6:45 pm, 19/09/2022] +REACH: Dear Contributors,

⏰ We will be closing the chat in 15 minutes ⏰

Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.

Goodnight!

Megan

[7:00 pm, 19/09/2022] +REACH: Dear Contributors,

We will be closing the chat for today.

Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.

Goodnight!

Megan 😊

=====


Posted by at No comments:

Wednesday, September 14, 2022

REACH 395 - What are your views on flexible work arrangements, including four-day work weeks?

(SK)

14 Sep 2022 (10am - 7pm)


REACH

[9:55 am, 14/09/2022] +REACH: Dear Contributors,

Welcome back! 😊

⏰ We will be opening the chat from 10am to 7pm today. ⏰

House Rules (short version of our Terms of Use) to keep in mind: 

1. Be kind and respectful. We all want to be in a safe space to share our views. 

2. Any and all threatening, abusive, vulgar or racially, religiously and ethnically objectionable content is prohibited.

3. Consider the quiet ones among us and give them a chance to comment.

4. No need to repeat your comment or in different forms (including caps) - we heard you loud and clear the first time.

5. Let’s protect each other’s privacy and keep contact details in this group what it should always be - confidential. 

Full set of Terms of Use: https://go.gov.sg/reach-whatsapp-terms

We will strive to uphold these rules to ensure this is a safe space for all.

Please be assured that the points made by participants during the chat are aggregated and shared with relevant agencies.

The topic will be posted shortly.

Thank you

Megan 😊

[10:00 am, 14/09/2022] +REACH: 📢 Topic 📢 

Employers and employees in Singapore are strongly encouraged to be open to flexible work arrangements, including four-day work weeks, said Minister of State for Manpower Gan Siow Huang in Parliament on Tuesday.

She added: "As with any work arrangement, a four-day work week may work well for some employers and employees, but not others.

💬 What are your views on flexible work arrangements, including four-day work weeks?

"So far, results appear to be mixed. Some of the key concerns that stakeholders have include the impact on productivity, business costs, and employee well-being," said Ms Gan.

She added that while productivity improvements have been reported in some cases, this depends on the sector and job type.

"In some instances, reduced work hours have had to be compensated by hiring more labour," said Ms Gan.

👉🏻https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/jobs/employers-staff-urged-be-open-to-flexible-work-arrangements-including-4-day-work-week

👉🏻https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/4-day-work-week-flexible-work-arrangements-employers-mindset-2934531

👉🏻https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/restaurants-4-day-work-week-challenge-staff-shortage-benefits-2888946

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[10:02 am, 14/09/2022] +Uncle Law: If no need to answer calls or reply email on off day, I think is gd

[10:03 am, 14/09/2022] +Caleb: Public Service got to take the lead, and offer this for suitable positions

[10:03 am, 14/09/2022] +Uncle Law: Employer expects you to answer and reply email or calls during off days

[10:29 am, 14/09/2022] +Ah Heng: already working from home is a problem for company and employee now 4 day week -> very much expected compensation package will be much affected cos govt can only advise cannot enforce

[10:39 am, 14/09/2022] +~N: I'm extremely concerned about ONEP. Can there be a conversation on this topic?

[10:50 am, 14/09/2022] +Caleb: What's onep

[10:51 am, 14/09/2022] +~N: Overseas Network & Expertise Pass

[10:52 am, 14/09/2022] +Frankie Wee: ONEP salary $30k monthly

[10:52 am, 14/09/2022] +Frankie Wee: What is good performance job for?

[10:53 am, 14/09/2022] +Frankie Wee: Is he or she can bring in Singapore upbeat economic growth?

[10:54 am, 14/09/2022] +Frankie Wee: What about our contribution’s nation people of Singaporean?

[10:58 am, 14/09/2022] +Ah Heng: this 30k includes allowances blah blah

[10:58 am, 14/09/2022] +Ah Heng: many expats can easily hit 30k with all in

[10:59 am, 14/09/2022] +Ah Heng: put if just based on base pay well 30k is quite alot and can be a middle stake holder of an organisation not just some small fly mamager

[10:59 am, 14/09/2022] +Frankie Wee: $30k man make in Singapore

[11:06 am, 14/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Basic… without allowance

[11:17 am, 14/09/2022] +65 9661 0607: Very selective sectors of the economy can implement this. Need to assess the pros and costs.  Work life balance!?

[11:17 am, 14/09/2022] +65 9661 0607: Agree

[11:57 am, 14/09/2022] +SL: Suppose the weekly working hour maintains as 40 hrs. Each day is 10 hrs. Let's assume the work hour is 8.30 am to 6.30- 7.30 pm. Will other services going to support seniors or children's daycare by changing their operating hours? How about eatery and mall operating hours? Are they going to adjust accordingly?

[11:59 am, 14/09/2022] +SL: It would be nice if the weekly working hour reduced to 32 hours in conjunction with four days' work for the current level of salary (inflation-adjusted).

[0:02 pm, 14/09/2022] +SL: What is the ultimate target outcome anticipated or to achieve for four days of work? An alternative consideration is 2-3 days of work from the office and the remaining days working from home instead.

[0:04 pm, 14/09/2022] +KSFoong: Would u agree to Cut 25% pay ? 😜

[0:05 pm, 14/09/2022] +SL: 🤣 cut pay affect all future financial transaction with banks.

[0:11 pm, 14/09/2022] +RH: +1

Esp abt allowing their spouses and family members to work without restrictions !!

What r we paying the main income earner Big Bucks for?

With the 30k per mth, he/she can comfortably afford to support more than 4 mouths in a family.

Some of our local SG families are currently struggling to even earn 3k (10% of 30k) a mth and hv to support family. (example comparison)

Why must such privilege be given to the spouse of the ONEP holder?

Straightaway, I can spot the abuse of this privilege tt ppl wl take advantage of , as I m sure many of us here in this forum can see.

Why can't the MOM / GSH (Minister) see this?

Another qn:  

Wher / How is the transfer of skill / knowledge gg to happen ?

[0:12 pm, 14/09/2022] +RH: We had alredi objected to the addl privilege of allowing the ONEP spouse to work ' freely' in our last discussion on this.

I m very disappointed tt our feedback was not taken into consideration.

[0:19 pm, 14/09/2022] +RH: Which sectors r we looking at wher such bigshot talent is so critically needed?

Suggest tt the ONEP be limited to specific sectors ? 

In this way, other sectors wl not be so greatly impacted by the cost nor be allowed to abuse this privilege, etc., bearing in mind u r encouraging them to bring their whole family, whole jing gang along to compete w our local workforce?

[0:20 pm, 14/09/2022] +typing: It's a minimum fixed monthly salary of $30,000 per month. Allowances (if any) are no lt relevant.

[0:21 pm, 14/09/2022] +RH: Allowing their whole jing gang to work freely  is a threat to our own labour force, thereby creating new problems.

😠

[0:23 pm, 14/09/2022] +RH: Valid observation.

So far, no one has mentioned ...

4-day work week = pay cut too? 

Or 4-day work week but same salary? 

🤔

[0:24 pm, 14/09/2022] +typing: This is a common misconception - that expats are rolling around in cash - and it's simply not true. The "expat packages" which you regularly hear about don't exist any more. 

Private sector housing has increased 50-100% in price since Covid started. Most schools charge $25-30k per child per year.

I know many "well paid" expats who are struggling to cover their costs here and are planning to leave.

[0:25 pm, 14/09/2022] +L or BL or Locker: Very good to see Singapore Gov raising this as a topic. I like the recognition that it can work for some and not others ie.- not a fixed rule. Companies should advertise if they offer flexible working, inc 4 day week when they recruit and also promote conversation inside the company for existing employees. Company should be transparent with people about the impact to their careers, eg - management cannot expect to work 4 day week, if that is what fits for that company. There should be fines for companies that penalise the workers for reduced or flexible working if it is not stated in their company policy handbook.

[0:26 pm, 14/09/2022] +L or BL or Locker: Yes, and I know many who have already left. 2 kids in international school can cost 4-5k a month++

[0:28 pm, 14/09/2022] +L or BL or Locker: Good idea

[0:28 pm, 14/09/2022] +Caleb: Or 4 day work week, with longer working hours per day.

[0:28 pm, 14/09/2022] +L or BL or Locker: Hiring more labour is good. Maybe some people prefer 1 job 2 days a week and another job 3 days a week. The variety might be good for mental health.

[0:29 pm, 14/09/2022] +L or BL or Locker: That's true too - more flexibility.

[0:30 pm, 14/09/2022] +typing: Yup, this compares to $300 per month in local school but practically expats cannot send their kids to local schools. 

Many will say "so what" but in the UK or Oz that schooling would be free.  So expats get the benefit of lower tax than their home country but have significantly higher costs which balance against that.

A 30 year old single person will be infinitely better financially in SG than UK or OZ but a 40 year old married person with three years will probably be worse off.

[0:33 pm, 14/09/2022] +L or BL or Locker: $300? I'm sure I don't pay that... and Expats can send their kids to local schools, but they are bottom of the list and may not get the choice/location they want.

[0:33 pm, 14/09/2022] +L or BL or Locker: Expats can also rent HDB, but most choose not to.

[0:34 pm, 14/09/2022] +L or BL or Locker: Yes, hard to say about the comparison between 30 year old and 40 year old, depends on salary I guess

[0:37 pm, 14/09/2022] +SL: Process reengineering (replacing lost manhours in the productivity and number of the workforce) for each function in a business (especially those in high demand and fast turnaround industry)is deemed an important pre-existing condition for a shorter working hour to be successful.

[0:40 pm, 14/09/2022] +SL: Alternate source of the workforce in neighboring regions and deployment of AI is always an option for business owners.

[0:40 pm, 14/09/2022] +typing: If you take the first school on the list (Admiralty Secondary) a Singaporean pays $5 per month, a PR pays $440 per month and an expat pays $1600 per month, so at almost $20k per year its definitely cheaper but not much.

[0:42 pm, 14/09/2022] +L or BL or Locker: oh, wasn't aware, thanks!

[0:43 pm, 14/09/2022] +typing: The ages is maybe irrelevant, the point I'm making is that educating kids in singapore is very expensive.

As said above, there is a common myth that white collar expats are rolling around in money.  

I know lots of expats that would love to stay in Singapore but are leaving because they can't afford the recent rent increases and high school costs.

[0:56 pm, 14/09/2022] +L or BL or Locker: Yes, I understand.

[1:01 pm, 14/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Oops didn’t read the context 🤣

[1:03 pm, 14/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Yes cause teachers are not cheap. We need them paid well in order to educate our future generation.

I do see the difference is quality between us and Malaysia. Don’t pick too far away. Just a bridge difference quality student are at totally different level,

[1:04 pm, 14/09/2022] +typing: The MOM requires that any foreigner issued a work pass must have a role that a Singaporean is not available to do.  Pretty much all white collar expats that I know work for international conglomerates and work for the regional business (i.e. doing work regionally rather than specifically for the SG business).  Those people could be located in HK, KL, BKK etc but they are located in Singapore because we have a nice environment for them to live in.

They generate direct revenue to Singapore through tax and indirect through spending.

It's worth also bearing in mind that at a fixed monthly salary of $30,000 (which I still think is a crazy amount) this new work pass holder would generate approximately $53,000 in tax revenue.  Because of our regressive tax system, a person earning the average Singapore salary which is around $4,680 would generate approximately $2,000 in tax revenue.

Whilst some people might think it's unfair that these people earn what they do, it's better for Singapore and Singaporeans to have them here than in our neighbouring countries.  On direct taxation alone, we would require 25 people earning the average annual salary to generate the same tax revenue for the government (or would need to increase everyone's tax to fill the shortfall).

[1:04 pm, 14/09/2022] +Ken Loh: They expat study here… they don’t convert to be part of us, of course we charge them to study here. 

Incentive to convert to singaporean. We have lots of resources for education here. Just that singaporean don’t feel that we do, as it becomes a norm here.

[1:06 pm, 14/09/2022] +Ken Loh: To be fair most singaporean don’t pay income tax. 

Those that pay earn relatively decent.

[1:07 pm, 14/09/2022] +typing: Better for us that someone else pays!!

[1:07 pm, 14/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Someone that earn about 70k and have kid. Don’t have to pay income tax at all.

[1:07 pm, 14/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Annual”

[1:09 pm, 14/09/2022] +Ken Loh: The important part is if the company willing to keep such talent in Singapore relatively the team that work under that person won’t be too bad either.

[1:10 pm, 14/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Revenue and Capex… how much need to be earn to hire such a person?

[1:13 pm, 14/09/2022] +typing: Sorry autocorrect!  PROgressive tax system.


[1:43 pm, 14/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Impact on Economic competitiveness


1. Economically, Singapore need to be competitive and productive vis-a-vis economic competition with overseas Countries.


2. If Singapore many businesses adopt 4 days work week versus overseas Countries who are adopting 5 days work week - then we will lose our business to overseas competitors and our GDP will fall as we don't work on Fri to produce economic output (goods and services).


3. Eg. If our business work from Mon to Thu, whereas overseas Countries work from Mon to Fri - we lose 1 day (Fri) of work  for the whole Economy ---- how many billion of dollars we have lost per year?


[1:51 pm, 14/09/2022] +SL: taxable income of 30k need to pay 200.

[1:52 pm, 14/09/2022] +SL: To IRAS

[1:52 pm, 14/09/2022] +Frankie Wee: So cheap $200

[1:53 pm, 14/09/2022] +SL: Not possible for salary worker

[1:53 pm, 14/09/2022] +SL: 2%

[1:55 pm, 14/09/2022] +Frankie Wee: AI = annual income right $30k

If ONEP $30k monthly is AI = $360k

[1:55 pm, 14/09/2022] +SL: The deductible on - own + cpf + donation (250%) + others not possible to have 50k deductible from 70k and resulted in 20k taxable income. Below 20k is zero tax.

[1:56 pm, 14/09/2022] +SL: Annual taxable income

[1:56 pm, 14/09/2022] +L or BL or Locker: I think the idea is to have flexibility, not the whole country to stop working on Friday.


[1:58 pm, 14/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Operational impact

Public Service


1. Assume Government work 4 day weeks - and let us assess the impact on public service :-

a. If Public Service work from Mon-Thu, then public will have no access to public service from Fri, Sat and Sun.

Imagine public need services for their CPF, road tax, court service, police work, nurses and doctors in public hospitals, maintenance facilities, etc that can't be done online.

Will it be acceptable for public to wait out on Fri, Sat and Sun - before getting service from public service?

Can sick people wait out from Fri, Sat, Sun and see doctors on Mon to Thu?


b. Public Service has been increasing the salaries of civil servants - which must commensurate with output produce. Can a shorter work days and the associate economic output demand the higher salaries?


c. So it is a relief that the Government will not experiment or pilot 4 days work week.


[1:59 pm, 14/09/2022] +KSFoong: Let’s also be fair to the employer! What consideration do we have for employers’ part? At the end of it is who need who more!

[2:00 pm, 14/09/2022] +KSFoong: 4 days work week does not come without costs! Who will foot the bill?

[2:02 pm, 14/09/2022] +RH: Omg ... 🤦🏼‍♀️

Imagine Polyclinics, Healthcare , vital public services affected.

Sick on Fri-Sun. No professional help.

Die liao !  (pun intended)

😱

[2:03 pm, 14/09/2022] +SL: Assume the 360k (annual) is taxable without deductable as not tax resident (60 days and abv), the person need to pay 15% or 22% tax (which ever is higher)


[2:03 pm, 14/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

d. Assuming Government want to keep public service open from Mon-Sat to service the public - but with a 4 days work week.

This means Government will need to employ double the staff to keep public service open for 6 days in a 4 days work week.


e. So should a salary increase to civil servants justified?


f. This mean taxpayers will have to foot higher salaries for the staff - for a 2-shift public service - double the salaries --- meaning public will have to pay more taxes - eg. higher GST, income tax etc.


g. How is the 4 days work week make Singapore competitive?


[2:03 pm, 14/09/2022] +SL: Otherwise, 360k (without deductable) will be tax accordingly to tax resident status

[2:04 pm, 14/09/2022] +RH: Alredi hv manpower shortage.

A 4-day work week wl need MORE, not less workers, esp if the biz runs on shift work.

[2:05 pm, 14/09/2022] +SL: Product/service price increase?

[2:05 pm, 14/09/2022] +Frankie Wee: Why we singaporean got to do with ONEP is he or she has high capital requirements professional

[2:06 pm, 14/09/2022] +Frankie Wee: Human has error no one perfect

[2:07 pm, 14/09/2022] +Frankie Wee: Is it man make in Singapore and pay high their professional. Can he or she creation everything?

[2:13 pm, 14/09/2022] +RH: My take is tt the ONEP shd Not be on a Long Term basis 

Wat I mean is u can propose this but say hv a time limit of , say, 3 years, to review it ? 

Rather than create this and then leave it ther forever. 

Wat I'm trying to say is :

By having the ONEP is to atrract skilled professional talent here to help start, train, coach, complement our local work teams.

In say, 3 years, our loc workforce shd be competent enuff to be promoted & fill the very roles tt the ONEP was brought in for.

In other words, the ONEP shd be seen as a  Temporary stepping stone, Not to be taken advantage of , or used as an excuse to replace capable, more able local talent.

[2:13 pm, 14/09/2022] +L or BL or Locker: I think the point Gov was making was that flexible working is appropriate sometimes and not others, so we should be open to it where it makes sense. Not to force it onto business where it doesn't fit.

[2:13 pm, 14/09/2022] +KSFoong: Does it means those establishments, business, services will only serve their customers for 4 days? Do the public prepare for the reduction of service hours? If not, these establishments would have to hire additional staff to cover these lost hours. I do not expect these business owners will absorb the costs. What will they do? Either close or transfer these costs to condumers!

[2:13 pm, 14/09/2022] +L or BL or Locker: People can then aim for jobs in companies that offer it, or not, depending on their own preferences.

[2:13 pm, 14/09/2022] +RH: We cannot keep saying :

"Cannot find talent in our local labour force..."

[2:13 pm, 14/09/2022] +Frankie Wee: I have seemed EP and SP has mid level skill they doing operator nothing is creation

[2:16 pm, 14/09/2022] +Frankie Wee: I ask a question imagine can ONEP create like movie “back to the future” car can fly?

[2:16 pm, 14/09/2022] +Frankie Wee: Impossible

[2:17 pm, 14/09/2022] +RH: Back to company mindset ...

Need to change.

Must make local hiring a Priority.

Must prove the need for ONEP.

Gov must hv monitoring & review procedures in place to ensure ther is no abuse or mis use of this privilege.

👆🏻I dun see any info on this so far.

How is the MOM gg to ensure fair practice in this context ?

[2:20 pm, 14/09/2022] +RH: Not now, perhaps.

But alredi hv jetpack power for us to fly for short distances ..  .. so flying cars and floating homes may be possible, altho may not be in our lifetime.

Travelling bk in time ... Dun think so tho.  😅😅😅

[2:22 pm, 14/09/2022] +Frankie Wee: Maybe I think our contributions go pay ONEP for creation future in Singapore and outlook economy growth


[2:24 pm, 14/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Operational impact

Business Service


1. Similarly for business who want to adopt 4 days work week.


2. As a business partner, I will expect the business to provide me service Mon-Fri even though a business want to adopt 4 days work week.

I don't care if your staff don't work on Fri - but if I need your service on Fri and you expect me to wait until Mon - will cause my work or project to be delayed - then I will not want your service - and instead go for your competitors that can offer me the service.


3. So business who adopt a 4 days work week - will have to employ 2 shift staff or 1 full time shift and 1 part-time shift staff - to keep their business going.

This means additional business cost to the business .

Business need to stay alive in a very competitive envrionment - wonder which business will want to increase their business cost just to adopt 4 days work week?


4, There could be some business who like the trend and hips about 4 days work week - to attract workers --- and I believe the government shouldn't stop such a practice if the business find that this is how they want to conduct their business.

Ultimately, the key is business survivial. If business can survive in a high-cost 4 days work week - Government should not stop them.

Market forces will decide whether 4 days work week - work for such business as well as for the workers who crave for 4 days work week.

Business in a 4 days work week will have to decide whether they will pay higher salaries to the workers who demand 4 days work week - and whether the business can still survive - ultimately market forces will determine the "moment of truth".


5. For example, customers are demanding banking services, retail services and other business to operate even on Sat and Sun (not to mention 4 days work week).

In malls, we have already be seeing banks opening on Sat and Sun until 7 pm - to fight for customers --- which I believe the banks are operating 2 staff shift.

The business cost for such banks are high - but their business are good to cover the higher cost.

So unless a 4 days week business has similar business model - market forces will decide if the 4 days work week workable for business.


6. Finally, I feel that our Government should not mandate a 4 days work week - but let business decide on their merits. Ultimately market forces will determine if 4 days work week is viable for their business.

Also business will determine if they will employ workers who want 4 days work week or want to pay higher salaries for those who ask for 4 days work week.

---

[2:25 pm, 14/09/2022] +L or BL or Locker: All good points, this is for the business to work out. If it doesn't work for them then they don't do it. Each business is different. Some it makes sense, some it doesn't. There will be infinite examples each way.


[2:27 pm, 14/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/politics/unknowingly-consuming-drugs-overseas-usually-not-an-offence-shanmugam

Unknowingly consuming drugs overseas usually not an offence: Shanmugam.

In Thailand, even tomyam soup, chocolate, candies - the food sellers lace it with cannabis or "Da Ma".


[2:32 pm, 14/09/2022] +L or BL or Locker: Thanks for clarifying this!

[2:59 pm, 14/09/2022] +Ken Loh: You have a lot of rebate… if you have kids, wife, served NS. Etc

[3:07 pm, 14/09/2022] +Smiley face: 14 September, 2022

"The Denormalization of The Workplace"

Unintended Alternatives?

Will there be some that would 'daylighting' for competitor or conflict of interest (aka moonlighting) happened out of this 4 days WW?

[3:09 pm, 14/09/2022] +RH: Ther must be flw up & accountability on the part of the Gov to ensure this scheme is properly executed and gives us the results we wanted.

[3:09 pm, 14/09/2022] +RH: And a 'back door' for us to exit fr this scheme if it does not work out.

[3:10 pm, 14/09/2022] +Ken Loh: How to have so many high level executive? 

Local so easy to find we won’t be looking outwards…

[3:11 pm, 14/09/2022] +Ken Loh: If they back door… also need to pay income tax as foreigner… 

How many 30k back door can anyone afford? Does it makes sense? 😅

Already say is gross no allowance or commission based

[3:32 pm, 14/09/2022] +Smiley face: Foreign Talents Model:

We should be awared of the current geopolitical unrest and the migration of wealth and talents that accompany such an existential trends. They may arrive from Europe, Hong Kong, South Korea, China and other countries.

The basic compensation is $360,000.00 annually with children education and,/or accomodations allowances or none, before bonuses (plus shares option). 

The total compensation of such a talent can amount to $1,000,000.00 or in multiples in a good year?

What's the economics advantages to the company and country? What's the multiplier effects thereon?

[3:33 pm, 14/09/2022] +Smiley face: Singdollar emerges as Asia's best performer: Will it continue to stay strong amid USD rise?

https://www.straitstimes.com/business/economy/singdollar-emerges-as-asias-best-outperformer-against-greenbacks-relentless-rise

Safe Haven!


[3:44 pm, 14/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

If Singapore workers think we can slack and companies will still employ them - this is the moment of truth.


[3:45 pm, 14/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Depends on how much you relied on them… when language is an issue.. people still preferred local. Or Atleast English with min accent

[3:45 pm, 14/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Unless dictate by HQ


[3:46 pm, 14/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Companies won't hesitate to employ remote workers who are cheaper, and more hardworking never mind the 4 days work week don't apply to them.


[3:50 pm, 14/09/2022] +Smiley face: Let talents come in (不怕你来，就怕你不来).

[3:53 pm, 14/09/2022] +Smiley face: 14 September, 2022

"Geography explains the policies of all the Powers."

- - Napoleon 

Migration:

Mankind history was largely storied on migrations. At end of the Ice Age came mass migrations and the flourished continent of Asia from the middle east to India and to China. What a vast geography with social and political significance. Cities formed and cities ended and people moved to elsewhere, so similar to now! People moved to safer places away from calamities both natural and man creates.


[4:49 pm, 14/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

My close friend comments:-

Before anyone asks for 4-day work week, pls be prepared employers ask you for 20% pay cut... 

If you can work from home, someone else from another part of the world can also do your job.

What if he/she can do it better than you and at a lower cost?

Be careful of what you ask for... the world may be heading for a severe recession.


[4:49 pm, 14/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

https://www.businessinsider.com/europe-energy-crisis-inflation-recession-risk-winter-russia-supply-blackrock-2022-9


[4:52 pm, 14/09/2022] +SL: Benefits in kind for the talent; some are taxable, some are not.

[4:52 pm, 14/09/2022] +L or BL or Locker: Tax, secondary spend, infrastructure etc


[4:55 pm, 14/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Tech workers left hanging as Sea e-commerce arm Shopee rescinds job offers.                             https://www.channelnewsasia.com/business/singapore-e-commerce-shopee-sea-rescind-job-offers-2022-2922961


[4:55 pm, 14/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Foodpanda cuts jobs in Singapore as part of move towards profitability.                                                         

More Big Tech cutting jobs .................                                                                                                 https://www.channelnewsasia.com/business/foodpanda-cuts-jobs-singapore-move-towards-profitability-2925286


[4:55 pm, 14/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/food-delivery-firm-foodpanda-lays-off-staff-in-singapore-retrenchment-reportedly-affects-about-60

Food delivery firm foodpanda lays off staff in Singapore, retrenchment reportedly affects about 60.


[4:55 pm, 14/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: https://news.google.com/articles/CAIiEBQHXoYAUfje1Wv0u2b6lKcqGQgEKhAIACoHCAowief2CjCJ2dUCMJuWxwU?uo=CAUiANIBAA&hl=en-SG&gl=SG&ceid=SG%3Aen

China gaming crackdown: ByteDance cuts ‘hundreds of jobs’ from its video game operations in Shanghai and Hangzhou, sources say.


[4:55 pm, 14/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

https://theindependent.sg/foodpanda-retrenches-60-staff-netizens-ask-why-retrenchments-come-just-after-opening-brand-new-regional-office-in-singapore/

foodpanda retrenches 60 staff; Netizens ask why retrenchments come just after opening brand-new regional office in Singapore.


[4:55 pm, 14/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

'Certainly a risk' of US recession, says Treasury Secretary Janet Yellen.

https://www.channelnewsasia.com/business/certainly-risk-us-recession-says-treasury-secretary-janet-yellen-2932136


[4:56 pm, 14/09/2022] +SL: The exchange rate is not the priority of the ultra-rich to consider the suitable country to deposit their assets. It is the security of their assets, transaction movement, and liquidity.

[4:58 pm, 14/09/2022] +SL: Typically a Solution architect is expected to generate five times the salary earned.

[5:01 pm, 14/09/2022] +Poh S. Lim: Official 4-day work work week should be fine so long as we can do the following: 

1. Allow industries to have flexibility to set their own hours according to operational requirements but still remunerate at market rates or better e.g. assembly linear

2. Automate or allow self-service for many daily needs e.g. banking 

3. Increase and/or promote healthy alternative activities for the discretionary time now freed to workers

4. Ensure no one is disadvantaged in compensation arising from the shorter working hours

[5:02 pm, 14/09/2022] +Poh S. Lim: *factory assembly lines

[5:02 pm, 14/09/2022] +SL: The last sentence is a concern; from open source information, this is a relatively hot topic in markets. SOFR will officially replace LIBOR next year. This is an added risk to the market condition.

[5:05 pm, 14/09/2022] +Smiley face: Hi SL, you got it rite, those considerations mentioned perhaps equal to a STABLE currency!

In this highly volatile situations, finding a safe haven to park one's wealth?

Migrations of wealth?

[5:07 pm, 14/09/2022] +SL: The payment gateway is also a consideration. Addition risks such as those generated by Switzerland increased the risks for the ultra rich to deposit their assets there.

[5:09 pm, 14/09/2022] +SL: There was no real safe haven on highly volatile markets at this moment without paying some prices.

[5:10 pm, 14/09/2022] +Smiley face: Luxembourg?

[5:10 pm, 14/09/2022] +SL: and taking the risks


[5:13 pm, 14/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Business pay their workers according to the output produce.

If workers who works on a 4 days week but produce lesser output than workers who work 5 days week - then the 4 days week workers will be expected to fetch a lower salary than the 5 days weeks workers.

Business are started to make profit and not to do charity.

If Singaporean workers are not productive, more costly and less competitive compared to foreign workers - then we will expect local workers to lose their jobs or get pay less.

Singapore business is not only competing locally but also with foreign competitors.


[5:16 pm, 14/09/2022] +SL: Geographically, this country is surrounded by Belgium, France, and Germany. It got so many dependencies and factors for an asset management team to consider putting core assets there based on customers' preferable priorities.

[5:17 pm, 14/09/2022] +Smiley face: https://youtu.be/sVI1_Amq9Po


[5:18 pm, 14/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Singapore is an open economy.

We cannot make ourselves uncompetitive by closing our borders and hype up our workers salary without productivity growth.

Because local customers or overseas customers will punish our business - if our products and services are not competitive.


[5:23 pm, 14/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

To quote an example, a person try to get a 6 figure quotation for a job from a business partner.

But despite numerous messages and even phone calls, the business partner staff did not answer on a Friday working day.

That person finally call up the partner competitor who quote similar competitive price with better service.

Not only that business partner lose that 6 figure business, in future, it has a strong competitor bidding for the same business.

So can government just mandate 4 days week and customers will just accept?

Market forces will determine the 4 days week is good for business or not.

Not whether we want and mandate.

Ultimately, if business fail, local workers get retrenchment.

This is the moment of truth.


[5:24 pm, 14/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Finally that staff call back on the next Monday.

The customer say enjoy your holiday but I have awarded the business to your competitor.


[5:52 pm, 14/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

1. In case a layman don't understand what productivity means, let see a simple example.

2. One worker work 5 days week and produce 1000 durians a month.

I pay him $2000 a month.

I can sell 1000 durians at $10 each earning $10,000 and make a profit of $8,000.

3. Another worker work a 4 days week and produce 700 durians.

I can only sell at $7,000.

Do you expect me to pay this worker $2,000 and I only make $5,000 profit?

4. Even paying him $1,000 will make my profit smaller at $6,000.

5. I rather employ the 1st worker.

6. So a business is not a charity - means mandate 4 days week, equal salary means business must comply.

Or you think charge $20 a durian when customer can get at $10 - will customer buy - just to satisfy a 4 days work week?


[5:58 pm, 14/09/2022] +Timothy Low: 4 days work week can be implemented in a rotational basis. 

Eg, worker A and B are in the same department. Both can cover for each other whenever the other person is on leave. 

I have a friend who works in a company that gives them a day off every two weeks. Whenever he is on day off, his colleague will cover for him. Productivity is not lost as he work one extra hour every weekday. So overall the number of work hours is the same and yet he get to enjoy one extra day off every 2 weeks. Business also won’t lose out to overseas or local competitions who don’t implement such policy, as they  have colleagues supporting and covering for each other during their absence.

[6:00 pm, 14/09/2022] +REACH: 📢 Topic 📢 

Employers and employees in Singapore are strongly encouraged to be open to flexible work arrangements, including four-day work weeks, said Minister of State for Manpower Gan Siow Huang in Parliament on Tuesday.

She added: "As with any work arrangement, a four-day work week may work well for some employers and employees, but not others.

💬 What are your views on flexible work arrangements, including four-day work weeks?

"So far, results appear to be mixed. Some of the key concerns that stakeholders have include the impact on productivity, business costs, and employee well-being," said Ms Gan.

She added that while productivity improvements have been reported in some cases, this depends on the sector and job type.

"In some instances, reduced …

[6:00 pm, 14/09/2022] +Timothy Low: He works for a company in Jurong Island and he stays at the East. Imagine the number of hours saved from travelling back and forth just by implementing a 4 days work week

[6:06 pm, 14/09/2022] +typing: Why would the 4-day-week worker only “produce” 700 durians? On a straight-line basis you would expect him to produce 4/5th of the work of the 5-day-week work (i.e. 800 durians).  

However, many studies have shown that workers with a 4-day-week (i.e. 3-day-weekend) are more efficient and effective and often do the same work in four days as their 5-day-week counterparts.

So if paid the same, you're no worse off (and maybe don't have to operate the plant one extra day a week or another worker uses his workspace on his days off, both of which saves money).

[6:08 pm, 14/09/2022] +YT: Sure, 4-day weeks are good. But something has to give. Just like many are calling for permanent "work-from-home" arrangements. I have no objections but salaries just need to be cut to reflect the fewer days. For those advocating Work-From-Home, salaries need to be cut too as there will be lesser supervision of whether the employee is actually working or out running personal errands. So, workers can demand this and demand that, government like MOS Gan can appease them by saying they support them, at the end of the day, a business is a business. Something needs to give. If employees are willing to settle for lesser pay, then I am supportive of it. If employees insist on same pay but fewer days or permanently work from home, then I would say, go work somewhere else.

[6:09 pm, 14/09/2022] +Caleb: +1, 

I myself have tried to do all the work within 4 days instead of 5 days... and I am able to complete it within 4 days...

[6:13 pm, 14/09/2022] +typing: I could definitely do what I currently do in 5 days in 4 days by getting in a bit earlier and working a bit later and ending unnecessary calls sooner, if I could guarantee that the 5th day remained mine and didn't end up becoming a pseudo 6th day.

[6:16 pm, 14/09/2022] +typing: It's a bit like BlackBerry.... I remember being told it would revolutionise my life because I wouldn't have to stay late in the office to deal with that late-night, last-minute document. Instead it revolutionised my life by making work become 24/7 with permanent connectivity.


[6:18 pm, 14/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Output will determine whether the boss agree that 4 days week is better than 5 days week.

Services is also another determinant.

Ultimately, market forces decides - whether a 4 days week is viable or not.

I am relief that the government maintain a 5 days week.


[6:21 pm, 14/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Eg. If a core person is not around on a particular day - which he or she cannot handover to another person - to me the service is not up to standard if he or she need 3 days to respond.

So she lose the business - and she will need to anwer to her boss.


[6:37 pm, 14/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Coming to recession, a manager is not a boss.

Even how well manager rate a staff, boss will look at his cost, profit and loss.

When he find that staff cost is too high - he will pick staff to cut.

Let see a 4 days week staff survive better than a 5 days week staff - assuming performance is equal.


[6:41 pm, 14/09/2022] +SL: Business exit because of profit generated. Owners can choose to sell the business if ROI is below their expectations.

[6:45 pm, 14/09/2022] +REACH: Dear Contributors,*

⏰ We will be closing the chat in 15 minutes ⏰

Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.

Goodnight!

Megan 😊

[6:45 pm, 14/09/2022] +Say Juan: i think the person who propose it should start up his/her own business and understand what are the challenges in running a business. Everyone thinks every boss is wealthy. Actually, there are many SME bosses who made tremendous sacrifices at the expenses of their family's well being, paid less than their staff, work 60 to 70 hours work week and in the end went bankrupt and lose everything. As rightly pointed out by Danny, we must remain competitive. a fresh graduate IT graduate in Singapore is now earning more than what a 10 to 15 years Senior IT Engineers/Manager earn in Malaysia.

[6:45 pm, 14/09/2022] +SL: In service industry, a customer's contract requires 5 days of support, and they don't care whether the vendor’s workers work 4 days or 5 days; as long there is a headcount standby, it will be the owner of the vendor to decide to have how many additional staff to standby. This will affect the headcount cost

[6:51 pm, 14/09/2022] +SL: Outsourced to offshore staff (a popular choice now) may become a valuable option for owners in specific industries.

[6:59 pm, 14/09/2022] +Smiley face: 14 September, 2022

To: Our Distinguished Leaders, Management & Human Capital Experts and All Honorable Members

"Working Smarter and Covering Bases"

No Sweat Lah?

Shorter work week! It doesn't matter, with planning and training, things will work out well.

How to ensure and enable a smooth transition into a 4-day work week (or even a 3-days WW)?

Staggering operations will cover the gap days with it a Friday or a Monday, this case assuming two gap days for discussion purposes.

By staggering work place into smaller units, starting with Team A and B. Team A will work from Monday to Thursday and Team B will work from Tuesday to Friday. Any unforseeables like urgent leaves or sick leaves, either-or from Team A or B to stand in for such lapse events.

Plan…

[7:00 pm, 14/09/2022] +Poh S. Lim: The idea of productivity is not linear. 

1 worker 1000 durians a week in 5 days is while the same worker 800 durians in 4 days is a linear concept and is not productivity. 

Productivity is about changing the technology so that 1 worker can still produce the same or more in the same amount of time


[7:01 pm, 14/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

5 days week workers will work longer than 4 days week workers in total.

And they are more accessible.


[7:02 pm, 14/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

It is linear


[7:02 pm, 14/09/2022] +REACH: Dear Contributors,

We will be closing the chat for today.

Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.

Goodnight!

Megan 😊


===


Posted by at No comments:

Wednesday, September 7, 2022

REACH 394 - What are your views on the possible lifting of current ban on cats being kept as pets in HDB flats?

(SK)

07 Sep 2022 (10am - 7pm)


REACH

[9:46 am, 07/09/2022] +REACH: Welcome back! 😊

⏰ We will be opening the chat from 10am to 7pm today. ⏰

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We will strive to uphold these rules to ensure this is a safe space for all.

Please be assured that the points made by participants during the chat are aggregated and shared with relevant agencies.

The topic will be posted shortly.

Thank you

Megan 😊

[10:02 am, 07/09/2022] +REACH: 📢 Topic 📢 

Cats could be allowed in HDB flats if a proposed framework to manage felines is implemented. The Animal & Veterinary Service (AVS) is seeking public feedback on its proposed framework to improve the management and welfare of cats, including possibly allowing pet cats in HDB flats. 

Your feedback will help refine the proposed cat management framework. You may click the link to participate in the online survey by NParks: https://go.gov.sg/catsgeng

💬 What are your views on the possible lifting of current ban on cats being kept as pets in HDB flats?

The consultation is part of the larger Forward Singapore movement that aims to refresh the country's social compact and "build a more endearing home", said AVS.

Since 1989, cats are not allowed in the flat as they are generally difficult to contain within the flat and can cause disamenities (i.e. tend to shed fur, defecate in public areas, make caterwauling sounds etc). 

To balance the interests of residents who are pet lovers and those who may be affected, AVS said that the framework aims to safeguard public health, and better protect the health and welfare of Singapore’s pet and community cats. 

The public consultation will run for six months (Sept 2022 to Mar 2023). The three strategies outlined within the framework that the public could share their views on are: 

📌 Improving traceability of the felines

- Expand the existing pet dog licensing and microchipping scheme to include pet cats. 

- This allows (i) cat owners to be held accountable for the responsible keeping of their pets, (ii) mitigate potential issues such as abandonment and associated cat-related feedback, and (iii) AVS to trace a pet diagnosed with an infectious disease, helping the agency to react better in the event of a disease outbreak.

📌 Managing cats in the community

- To extend the Trap-Neuter-Rehome/Release-Manage (TNRM) programme for free-roaming dogs to community cats. 

- Building on the current Stray Cat Sterilisation Programme, AVS is currently conducting research to better understand the population size and ecology of community cats, as well as the social aspects of cat management.

📌 Responsible cat ownership

- Continued partnership with the community and animal welfare groups to explore ways to further promote responsible cat ownership, the adoption of cats, and responsible community cat caregiving.

👉 https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/cna-explains-why-cats-are-not-allowed-hdb-flats-and-how-could-soon-change-2921006

👉 https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/pet-cat-hdb-microchip-avs-survey-welfare-framework-public-consultation-2919451

👉 https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/public-views-sought-on-cat-welfare-as-avs-mulls-over-allowing-cats-in-hdb-flats

👉 https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/environment/st-explains-why-cats-are-banned-from-hdb-flats-and-what-is-being-done-to-change-it

------


[10:03 am, 07/09/2022] +Caleb: Hopefully cats will not jump into other ppl homes

[10:05 am, 07/09/2022] +Valli: Limit to Only 1 pet (cat) to be allowed in each household

[10:11 am, 07/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Cat don’t usually venture to people house… and if they do.. after you chase them.. usually will not come back. 

But shit at the corridors are the common issues 😅

[10:11 am, 07/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Or anywhere with soil example flower pot

[10:13 am, 07/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Newer HDB usually don’t have corridor windows… it is not possible for them to come in at all.

[10:17 am, 07/09/2022] +Simon: Cats are not the problem usually. It's the owners. Have seen cases of owners dumping their cat litters raw into the chute and getting stuck on inside of the metal covers instead of bagging it before disposal

[10:19 am, 07/09/2022] +L or Lock or BL: In favour of allowing cats, no reason to limit the number particularly, but 3 should be OK. Cats are quieter than dogs, as long as they are neutered. They shed less fur than dogs. They are tidier than dogs, except... dog owners (mostly) clean up the mess. Cats can be a great comfort, especially for older people who may not be able to manage a dog.

[10:20 am, 07/09/2022] +L or Lock or BL: Cats should be chipped, same as dogs.

[10:20 am, 07/09/2022] +L or Lock or BL: Owners should complete a 'quiz' at least to prevent the problems people have expressed here, such as not using a bag when empying the litter tray.

[10:21 am, 07/09/2022] +L or Lock or BL: Cats should be neutered too. So there will be a cost to cat ownership!

[10:23 am, 07/09/2022] +L or Lock or BL: Perhaps cats should also have to wear a collar with owners tel number, if they are roaming. That way we know 1) they are not a stray and 2) if they cause a problem we can trace back to the owner without needing to go to a vet to read the chip.

[10:24 am, 07/09/2022] +L or Lock or BL: and cats found without a collar, may lead to a fine

[10:25 am, 07/09/2022] +L or Lock or BL: Maybe even on online cat database with picture and address of each cat, so it's easy to track down owners whose cats use the flower pots for a toilet!

[11:25 am, 07/09/2022] +REACH: Dear Contributors,

We want to HEAR MORE from YOU on today’s topic! We have had good feedback from this group, and we hope that we can keep the discussion robust and active!

Megan

[11:32 am, 07/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Only chip ones is allowed then yes I agree no limit… but if it becomes a health hazard. Or the cat are in poor health. 

Easy to trace back who is responsible

[11:40 am, 07/09/2022] +L or Lock or BL: Yes should all be chipped, like dogs, perhaps even more important for cats, and also cats to be sterilised

[11:41 am, 07/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Sterilised to me not really requirement since is your own pet… don’t see we sterilised hamster lol

[11:41 am, 07/09/2022] +L or Lock or BL: female cats very noisy though, and male cats spray and it's very smelly!

[11:41 am, 07/09/2022] +L or Lock or BL: Hamsters are very quiet and in their cages or homes all day.

[11:42 am, 07/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Lol sure? Have you kept them in big numbers before?

[11:42 am, 07/09/2022] +Ken Loh: They squeak a lot lol.. like female cat

[11:42 am, 07/09/2022] +L or Lock or BL: also male and female cats make kittens who will then likely be abandoned

[11:43 am, 07/09/2022] +L or Lock or BL: ha yes, but no one can hear them outside lol

[11:43 am, 07/09/2022] +Ken Loh: And always fight.., older ones get cranky attack other hamster

[11:43 am, 07/09/2022] +Ken Loh: Is a mess…

[11:49 am, 07/09/2022] +Timothy Low: As a cat owner, I’m fully supportive of allowing cats to be kept in HDB flats. This will help encourage ownership and hopefully decrease the number of community cats. However, the number of cats kept should be capped at max 8, to avoid overcrowding

[0:29 pm, 07/09/2022] +RH: Agree

[0:29 pm, 07/09/2022] +RH: Agree

[0:32 pm, 07/09/2022] +Jun: My ex had this neighbor one floor down this auntie who has MANY cats. Everytime I visited the entire stairwell above and below her flat stank to the high heavens

[0:32 pm, 07/09/2022] +Jun: It was the most insane smell ever

[0:33 pm, 07/09/2022] +Jun: I love cats btw

[0:33 pm, 07/09/2022] +Jun: So maybe just 1 neutered cat per home is fine

[0:35 pm, 07/09/2022] +RH: I m Not in support of changing the law.

Sori, cat lovers, no offence.

But I hv had too many bad encounters with cats in my whole life and I m now absolutely terrified of them ... Esp black coloured ones.

I hv had nightmares abt them too.

Cats r a nuisance.

They pee in your potted plants, they walk into yr house uninvited if the gate is open , and I hate the sound of them howling all nite non-stop! 

I cringe whenever tt happens.

Worse, their owners r unreasonable and hard to reason with. 

Like I said, I hv had too many bad experiences which I can relate in detail if anyone wishes, but here is not the place.

So, ther, dun hate me but this is my one vote against.

😳

[0:37 pm, 07/09/2022] +jimmy chew: My area has community cats. There are two neighbours who are fighting for attention. They don't want cat's at home but don't mind feeding them below. The cats are well taken care 🤣

[0:39 pm, 07/09/2022] +jimmy chew: I stay in HDB. Some household have big dogs, our neighborhood very friendly so no disputes. The Big Dogs are very quiet and obedient

[0:43 pm, 07/09/2022] +Jun: My community cats damn manja too

[0:44 pm, 07/09/2022] +RH: I once had a nbr who put his potted plants on the corridor.

We lived on the 8 flr.

He was very proud of his plants.

Then, fr nowhere a black cat loved to pee & defecate in his pots. He was devastated!

The smell of the urine & faeces also irritated me as his plants were along the corridor outside my door.

Another day, as I was coming hm fr work (ard 1am - I used to work shifts), I was gg down the stairs fr the common lift on 10 flr.

A black object was coming up the stairs towards my direction. It was tt same stupid black cat! 

We met head on on the stairs! It gv me the worst fright of my life!

At tt time of nite, why wud a stupid cat be allowed to roam around the nbrhood?!?!?! 😠

I found out the cat belonged to the 9 flr. When I confronted the owner, he just stared at me blankly & slammed the door in my face!!

Things got very bad as my nbr told me other nbrs too had similar bad experiences.

After some time, we both heard tt someone had done the cat in! 👏🏻👏🏻

I wud hv done it too if I didn't hv a conscience.

[0:48 pm, 07/09/2022] +Jun: 8 is crazy cat lady numbers. 1-2 neutered kitty per home is fine

[0:52 pm, 07/09/2022] +RH: Anyway, b4 this, I didn't know we r not allowed to keep cats in HDB flats.

So, if ppl r quietly keeping them anyway, why change the law?

Since no one is enforcing it ... 

Had I known this law existed then (as I m sure many non pet owners also dunno), I wud hv reported that owner to the authorities!

[0:56 pm, 07/09/2022] +L or Lock or BL: At the moment technically it's not allowed, but you can have it if they are not a nuisance and no one complains :)

[0:56 pm, 07/09/2022] +L or Lock or BL: To all the people upset at the noise and smell -yes you are correct. This is why they need to be sterilised. Then they don't make a noise and don't pee everywhere!

[1:13 pm, 07/09/2022] +jimmy chew: 🤣 This is like the 377A all the deviation to the law is being made legal. So now I can have two cats or dogs or iguana

[1:13 pm, 07/09/2022] +jimmy chew: I have a neighbor who has an iguana. All the kids are excited by it

[1:14 pm, 07/09/2022] +RH: If u wanna make changes, may I suggest tt u educate, remind, reinforce in the cat lovers' brains about their social responsibility and consequences towards the public.

Hiding behind "it is the cat's nature to roam ard freely" doesn't mean the cat owner is not responsible for wat it does on its roaming trips!

If I had known abt the law then, I wud hv taken the owner to court (and many others who hv let their cats loose to roam ard the estate).

Hv mandatory classes for pet owners , conduct in all 4 languages.

As for those who love the animal but dun wanna own them ... Ther shd be a law against feeding all strays & such (incl birds).

In another incident, ther were 10+ stray cats in the nbrhood (landed).  Ther was this lady whom I saw feeding & stroking them every evening .... The cats made a lot of noise at nite ... 😠

Impose fines on anyone caught feeding or encouraging strays to breed.  

SPCA / AWARE can help - hv more stringent patrols & keep these strays off the streets??

Those who love to volunteer can also help keep a lookout for such strays & alert the authorities.

[1:16 pm, 07/09/2022] +L or Lock or BL: Yes, part of this change to law should mean that we don't allow feeding of strays.

[1:33 pm, 07/09/2022] +jimmy chew: Aiyoh a lot of oldies will be upset. They are from the Kampong and love cats but can keep too much at home

[1:37 pm, 07/09/2022] +jimmy chew: *can't

[1:38 pm, 07/09/2022] +RH: Yes and no.

Honestly, Gov, u got nothing better to do, is it?

Wat law do u wanna change next - law on cannabis .... ? 🤦🏼‍♀️🤦🏼‍♀️

[1:39 pm, 07/09/2022] +RH: Law 377A - humans w humans.

This one here - humans and animals.. 😳


[1:39 pm, 07/09/2022] ☸️  Danny 心: 

1. I like cats and dogs.

But I don't know how to handle them - in fact, I have not touched a cat or a dog all my life.


2. But both cats and dogs are adorable - as they are very close to humans.

Whenever I see dogs or cats - I will either wow or meow to them - like saying "hello".

Many of them will respond, wowing or meowing back - some will get close to me and some will even follow me home - but i will normally back off - because I don't know how to handle them or afraid to touch them.


3. I feel that allowing 1 cat or 1 dog at home - the maximum 2 pets in a HDB - should be ok.

More than these number could be a nuisance - as pet owners will be very difficult to take care of them, such as walking them out, feed them, or clear their waste or they could bark or meow causing too much noise disturbing the neighbors.


4. Also all the cats and dogs should be license and micro-chipped - to ensure owners are responsible for the well-beings and health of their pets, must be neuter to prevent uncontrol breeding.


[1:45 pm, 07/09/2022] +RH: Gov, do u hv any 'unofficial' stats or figures to show how many ppl ir households own cats right now?

Without enforcing the law, ther r alredi so many complaints.  R u sure tt changing the law, u are not opening a can of worms?

I say "let sleeping cats lie" (pun intended).

Don't change the law, but take it step by step.

Make the owners show social responsibility first.

If u wanna keep a pet, then pay for watever damages your pet causes.

U can't always hide behind "it is their nature". 

If you treat your pet as part of yr family, then if yr child offends someone, shd you not teach yr child to apologise ? If yr child hurt someone, shd you not be responsible for the damages caused?

Likewise, if u won't accept the responsibility, then dun own a pet!!

[1:45 pm, 07/09/2022] +RH: * or households

[1:47 pm, 07/09/2022] +RH: Community service like picking up cat or dog poo in public places can also be used a form of deterrent on those who are not able to pay fines.

[1:48 pm, 07/09/2022] +RH: This way, they wl then learn how inconsiderate they are when they dun do it & allow their pets to roam all over the place!

[2:09 pm, 07/09/2022] +REACH: 📢 Topic 📢 

Cats could be allowed in HDB flats if a proposed framework to manage felines is implemented. The Animal & Veterinary Service (AVS) is seeking public feedback on its proposed framework to improve the management and welfare of cats, including possibly allowing pet cats in HDB flats. 

Your feedback will help refine the proposed cat management framework. You may click the link to participate in the online survey by NParks: https://go.gov.sg/catsgeng

💬 What are your views on the possible lifting of current ban on cats being kept as pets in HDB flats?

The consultation is part of the larger Forward Singapore movement that aims to refresh the country's social compact and "build a more endearing home", said AVS.

Since 1989, cats are not allowed in …

[2:25 pm, 07/09/2022] +Smiley face: 7 September, 2022

To: All Pet Lovers, Our Policymakers and All Honorable Members

"Pet and the Love for Pets

(宠物和宠物爱者)"

Why cats not allowed?

Owning a pet can be comfortable and a mellow past time. In a communal living situation, are cats nuisance compared to dog or bird? Fact, there are growing numbers of Cat lovers and buying a cute kitten these days can cost up to $10,000! Afterall, Cat is a pet too.

One more thing, let's meet in between, one or two cats in a flats is ok than feeding a whole lot downstairs? There's really a need to balance ownership and overly owning all sorts of pet (purring, barking or chirping) in one's dwelling, this case of more than two kind of pet in one's home is overcrowded.

One last thing, should AVA regulates homed pets other than dogs which are tagged and licensed? What's the permissibles and don't for all pets including cat, public awareness? 

More important, to pet owners (lovers) , please take responsibilities of the larger common living environment, don't litter and please don't abandon your "loved one" aka your pet!

[2:39 pm, 07/09/2022] +RH: Reaching out to the human owners is not enuff .. Tt is too soft an approach.

Ther r responsible ppl & ther r Irresponsible ones.

On the Irresponsible ones, ther shd be stiffer penalties, incl community service, to educate & reinforce the msg of social responsibility & consideration of others .

[2:55 pm, 07/09/2022] +Smiley face: More than Cats & Dogs?

Going forward, 2030 onwards, the dynamic trains of our Demographics will be one of the many drivers for Policymakers and variety/voices of stakeholders' to derive solutions, it can be environments and/or societies and/or governance.

[5:15 pm, 07/09/2022] +REACH: Dear Contributors,

💬 What are your views on the possible lifting of current ban on cats being kept as pets in HDB flats?

We want to HEAR MORE 

from YOU on today’s topic! We have had good feedback from this group, and we hope that we can keep the discussion robust and active!

Megan

[5:32 pm, 07/09/2022] +SL: Accountability of the owner is very important. Cat fur management maybe a topic.

[5:42 pm, 07/09/2022] +~N: I don't think it makes a difference whether this ban is lifted or not. I'm not sure if this ban had prevented anybody from keeping a cat in their home and I haven't heard of neighborly disputes due to households having pet cats, except when the household/neighborhood hygiene or when the safety of the pets are in question. The current rules for responsible pet ownership can apply for cats. I am surprised this is a topic in Forward Singapore as an issue under social compact. Personally I think discussion on neighborhood environmental noise, use of common spaces would be more meaningful in making for cordial living spaces.

[5:45 pm, 07/09/2022] +Caleb: +1. And smoking issue too ...

[6:04 pm, 07/09/2022] +L or Lock or BL: Yes, use of common space, littering and smoking are def more troublesome than cats. 🐈

[6:10 pm, 07/09/2022] +REACH: 📢 Topic 📢 

Cats could be allowed in HDB flats if a proposed framework to manage felines is implemented. The Animal & Veterinary Service (AVS) is seeking public feedback on its proposed framework to improve the management and welfare of cats, including possibly allowing pet cats in HDB flats. 

Your feedback will help refine the proposed cat management framework. You may click the link to participate in the online survey by NParks: https://go.gov.sg/catsgeng

💬 What are your views on the possible lifting of current ban on cats being kept as pets in HDB flats?

The consultation is part of the larger Forward Singapore movement that aims to refresh the country's social compact and "build a more endearing home", said AVS.

Since 1989, cats are not allowed in the flat as they are generally difficult to contain within the flat and can cause disamenities (i.e. tend to shed fur, defecate in public areas, make caterwauling sounds etc). 

To balance the interests of residents who are pet lovers and those who may be affected, AVS said that the framework aims to safeguard public health, and better protect the health and welfare of Singapore’s pet and community cats. 

The public consultation will run for six months (Sept 2022 to Mar 2023). The three strategies outlined within the framework that the public could share their views on are: 

📌 Improving traceability of the felines

- Expand the existing pet dog licensing and microchipping scheme to include pet cats. 

- This allows (i) cat owners to be held accountable for the responsible keeping of their pets, (ii) mitigate potential issues such as abandonment and associated cat-related feedback, and (iii) AVS to trace a pet diagnosed with an infectious disease, helping the agency to react better in the event of a disease outbreak.

📌 Managing cats in the community

- To extend the Trap-Neuter-Rehome/Release-Manage (TNRM) programme for free-roaming dogs to community cats. 

- Building on the current Stray Cat Sterilisation Programme, AVS is currently conducting research to better understand the population size and ecology of community cats, as well as the social aspects of cat management.

📌 Responsible cat ownership

- Continued partnership with the community and animal welfare groups to explore ways to further promote responsible cat ownership, the adoption of cats, and responsible community cat caregiving.

👉 https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/cna-explains-why-cats-are-not-allowed-hdb-flats-and-how-could-soon-change-2921006

👉 https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/pet-cat-hdb-microchip-avs-survey-welfare-framework-public-consultation-2919451

👉 https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/public-views-sought-on-cat-welfare-as-avs-mulls-over-allowing-cats-in-hdb-flats

👉 https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/environment/st-explains-why-cats-are-banned-from-hdb-flats-and-what-is-being-done-to-change-it

[6:18 pm, 07/09/2022] +Smiley face: Be considerate to one another and everyone. Maybe, many things would turn out better and lessen conflicts same time continue the conversations of engaging, that's one path to consensus and further consideration.

[6:22 pm, 07/09/2022] +Smiley face: The 5 C's?

Conflicts

Conversations

Considerations

Consensus

Coexisting

[6:47 pm, 07/09/2022] +REACH: Dear Contributors,

⏰ We will be closing the chat in 15 minutes ⏰

Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.

Goodnight!

Megan 😊

[6:58 pm, 07/09/2022] +Smiley face: 7 September, 2022

To: Our Distinguished Leaders and All Honorable Members 

"The Coming Clash of Supplies and Demands?"

"Everything has a rational price to pay for, any irrationality of pricing will mean a dislocation of the economics of demand."

- - annoymous

Backdrops:

The global GDP is estimated to be $90T, the US equities valuation is $11T and the over stimulated (overspanning) economics packages of the pandemic cost more than $20T. The current economics reveals that out of the 44 advanced economies, 37 are fighting the  doubling of inflations. With the unstoppable Ukraine war, global supplies shock and the rising prices of  commodities to oil to raw materials and consumers' staples.

Since the 1970s, corporate America has outsourced it's manufacturing to cheaper countries that have lower cost of productions and the ROI of more than 50% decade to decade to the benefits of the US conglomerates, likewise other nations joint in this low cost strategy of productions.

Since the last financial crisis of 2008, there were several rounds of QE by the central banks (FED, ECB, BOE, BOJ) to the amount of over $30 Trillions in booked value. What will be the impact of a repricing for the global equities markets and the bottom lines should a correction or a few rounds of correction were to happen and the beginning of all things broken!  Regardless of the immediate short term economics or the longer future, oil price will firm at $100/barrel. It's the sole interest of OPEC+ to control their productions and price would follow the flow of this "Tap" economics, that's itself is another complicated geopolitics of pricing mechanism and reaching towards a win-win outcome (since 12th Centuries, Coal known to be one primary source of energy).

In the US, 2022, more than half of the global businesses are facing redundancy in supply chains, almost half are facing shipping and logistic issues, close to half are finding harder to absorb rising labor cost and raw materials cost, nearly half are finding supplies shortage and costly logistic harder to manage and three quarters are adjusting to wage increases. One decoupling process of US-China/Russia, is this a resourcing move, the Chips4 game plan and moving it's manufacturings out of china into elsewhere that is cheaper in production costs and most importantly, to friendly and trusted nations.

What will it be like comes a time to choose side when doing business with the US? Will efficiency of the markets be compromised? One sure thing, that is finished products will cost more and consumers will not benefit from this game of 'no choice' and in the end, 'who needs who most'? Isn't this inflation? The best thing, is to seek cooperation, moderate each other actions and thoughts, and a fair play.

What if the domino effect happens?

Crisis don't just happened, it happens over time. When times are bad naturally a weaker economy will have consequences like unemployments, lower spendings and shrinking demands for goods and services, in general, prices will ease off that's deflation coupled with interventions of one currency against the rest.

One early warning of bad times, if it is declining, the Consumers' confidence (CPI) and their purchasing power continue on a down slope trajectory across three continents namely US, Europe, and Asia. The general concept of equilibrium of things and money say, " it is an interdependent reaction on one part to the next fews and coupled with substitutes or complements, that's alot to digest before multiple strikes into any price equilibrium". 

Besides the rising cost of utilities (may persist into 2026). Rental is the next foretelling indicator of the short term economics and social impacts to watch for especially in a run off of the CPI in the next four quarters, rentals value of all properties will follow downwards and the valuations  of these assets class may then find it new price equilibriums. The next four quarters, what will be the corporate America quarterly results likely be robust or likely losing their steam engines of growth capacity?

The Rational Men?

The Fed is using interest rates and FXs to balance trades and recall it's M2 money supplies out from the global MONEY markets to reach a stable pricing for all tradeables or tradeoffs. With the limited attempts in adjusting upward the trajectory of the Fed interest rates game plan and trying to "out run inflation" is one tough job. One sure thing is the cost of funds will be dearer and fundings will be pull back so much so that the business of M&A will hit a low point in 2023. How about private equities and many sizeable international projects? These are leading indicators of bad timing or boom time.

What are the impending damages and uncertainties to the world?

First, only if too much inflations, it will burst, it will then stabilise and next maybe a prolonged deflationary in the making that may stretches into 2025 or longer. All assets class from fixed to liquid and short term to the longer term would be devalued sooner than later, aka the"domino effects"!

Second, this highly globalised markets come with higher dependency among all major and minor economies and their tradeables. Thereafter, many socio-economic impacts to each developed nation follows by the lesser developed nations. While the global pricing of useables and edibles things would be higher, from energy to oil to wages will be under seiged and the outlook of reaching a price equilibrium of these goods and services will be a painful and meandering process. One outlier now that will yeild a further discount of at least 30% off the current valuations is the equities markets. The long habits of low inflation and easy access to abundant of cash are no longer sustainable from lenders to borrowers.

Third challenges are, happening, the unstable climate change from the north pole to the south pole, the shortage of supplies, the unstoppable war situations in Europe coupled with the recent acting up in the middle east region specifically Iran, Iraq and Israel all of these factors of fearfulness will further the global complexities of recovering from the Covid pandemic and an even higher probability of a massive and deep recessions in Europe, US and Asia. How about China's internal and external debts and many unsolved problems? A handful of winners and a whole lots of losers!

The day after tomorrow?

Cash-Equities-Bonds, these 3 investment vehicles are yeild driven, given the volatility and uncertainty of the present markets, holding cash in the short term (not too long and not long term) maybe a prudent move solely because of the expected returns from equities and bonds (assuming 3% returns) isn't attractive enough to bet on these two and not a safe haven to park one's money. In forex, one nation's currency exchanges with the other nations is another paradigm of change to come, what's the future exchanges among the US-China-Europe-Japan-India be like and who benefits and who will be competitively disadvantaged out of devaluation of their currencies? Will some nations currency  devalued into worthless and gold becoming golden? How about gold?

The Final Countdowns?

There is no quick solutions to resolve these multi and bilateral interests of each nation. How to navigate these massive mess and the time bomb of prices? 

1) Wronged and more wrongs?

One, policymakers and central banks to continue supporting (printing new money) the global economies using new technologies, fintech and digital monies to book-in these interventions through the use of  off-balance sheets model of tradings. 

2) First World nations versus the rest?

Two, not involving any intermediary (brokers, interest groups and corporations), a long string of interventions between G to G to unpack the complexities of certain existing tradeables and tradeoffs, nation to nation and region to region, into a special global agreement to reset prices of staples and importantly the primary energy with a cooling period for implementations without the enlarged market speculations (including futures contract and hedging activities = antitrust acts) to achieve the targeted prices.

3) Fight it out?

Three, if ONE and/or TWO failed, hopefully it will not escalate into WW3? It maybe a massive war in the making, this time, the big fight will be over resources from food to energy to water (F.E.W. as previously presented) for one action will lead to a few reactions, that's a fact, one plays fair while others may not be fair to you!

When will be the next World Order, 2045?

After WW2, since 1945, the US is the leader of the new world order. If we expand the time span from 1945 to 2025, it is 80 years of progressions from economics, technologies, and socio-political changes. If we divide this 80 years into first 30 years and the next 50 years (or 40-40), what will the world become by 2045, that's exactly 100 years. AI will be the smartest among all of us,  what's other leading technologies and breakthroughs from medical to military, consumers, commerce to ESG? 

Will it turnout to be a disordered world? One might guess, the global trades will disintegrate into geographical regions from the Americas, the Europeans and the Asians. In any trades, route and currency are two key considerations. By distance, one closest trading partners to the furthest, the physical geography will driver trades and no longer globalisation. Perhaps by 2045,  there will be another new world power in play, this coming time may or may not be solely the US or more likely it maybe three big and powerful nations coupled with two major currencies of exchange, many nations would be en-trapped with decades of debts, a series of renegotiated free trade agreements, the future of ESG and maybe a new WTO renamed to International Fair-Trades Council (IFC) incorporating ESG in it? 

Is the world coming to a stop?

Back to the future, in 2045, did the world stopped? No, just like what Isaac Newton said, "all things go up will have to fall back", that's itself is a force, one basic evolution principles of humanity. 

One more thing, where is the moral and how about ethics in many major Democratic societies, these "walking and talking" stakeholders? More importantly, forever, Water, Energy and Food (W-E-F) are the three Life lines of this world! Isn't this true?

     - - in progress - -

[7:08 pm, 07/09/2022] +REACH: Dear Contributors,

We will be closing the chat for today.

Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.

Goodnight!

Megan 😊


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