We have collectively involved in stopping 小三灾。

1. 瘟疫

3 of us - I and 2 PuSas have suggested :-

a. Face masks - prevented many infection not only in Singapore but also world-wide.

b. My Aspirant use AI simulation model to predict transmission rate of Delta variants

c. Collectively, we have made 140 suggestions that have been adopted by our Government to tackle covid pandemic.

2. 天灾

a. Present 3 non-charging models.

b. You suggest carbon credit and my another PuSa suggest e-Apps to record the carbon credit.

3. 人祸

a. I have prevented a near nuclear war between Trump and Kim - and they come to sentosa for the 1st peace talk.

b. Urge China - Friends with All, Enemies with None. Observe historical Chinese wholesome values of peace and harmony.

净空法师 1st discourse at 普觉寺 that I Nirvana 7 days later and his subsequent videos you send me on need to prevent 小三灾 - we have collectively delivered.

Hence we have

横渡，竖度。

上度，下度，平度。

360 度，无所不度，左度，右度。

REACH 268 - View on calibrated easing of border and community measures, as Singapore prepares for  transition towards COVID resilience? (SK)

23 Aug 2021 (10am - 7pm)

REACH

[9:53 am, 23/08/2021] +REACH: Dear contributors,

Welcome back! 😊

⏰ We will be opening the chat from 10am to 7pm today. ⏰

House Rules (short version of our Terms of Use) to keep in mind: 

1. Be kind and respectful. We all want to be in a safe space to share our views. 

2. Any and all threatening, abusive, vulgar or racially, religiously and ethnically objectionable content is prohibited.

3. Consider the quiet ones among us and give them a chance to comment.

4. No need to repeat your comment or in different forms (including caps) - we heard you loud and clear the first time.

5. Let’s protect each other’s privacy and keep contact details in this group what it should always be - confidential. 

Full set of Terms of Use: https://go.gov.sg/reach-whatsapp-terms

We will strive to uphold these rules to ensure this is a safe space for all.

Please be assured that the points made by participants during the chat are aggregated and shared with relevant agencies.

The topic will be posted shortly.

Thank you

[9:59 am, 23/08/2021] +REACH: 📢 Topic 📢 

Singapore's reopening is aimed at maintaining its status as a business hub and staying connected to the world, said Finance Minister Lawrence Wong on Friday (Aug 20). 

And with an underlying philosophy that values stability and security, the Republic has taken a more cautious approach towards reopening social and economic activities thus far, he added in an interview with BBC. 

💬 What are your views on the calibrated easing of border and community measures, as Singapore prepares for the transition towards COVID resilience?

On Thursday (Aug 19), Singapore announced quarantine-free entry from next month for vaccinated travellers from Germany and Brunei, provided they test negative for Covid-19. Border restrictions have also been relaxed for travellers from Hong Kong and Macau from Saturday. These measures are part of a plan to gradually reopen borders, and a wider road map to becoming a Covid-19-resilient nation. 

"As much as we want to resume normal life and we are trying as much as we can to do so, we also want to ensure that we keep hospitalisation and ICU cases low, that we continue to ensure that our hospital system is intact, and we get to the end of the pandemic with minimum death and damage to our society," he said. 

Hence, a risk-based approach that calibrates measures according to data, evidence and rigorous assessments of the global situation, he added. 

👉 https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/politics/spores-reopening-focused-on-retaining-business-hub-status-valuing-public-health 

👉 https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/spore-will-stay-open-to-the-world-continue-to-welcome-foreign-contributions-ong-ye-kung

-----

[10:03 am, 23/08/2021] +Kevin: Good morning Megan

[10:07 am, 23/08/2021] +Ah Heng: How dynamic are these borders control given the stats of each countries are changing every week? Is our control as dynamic as to the respective countries infection rate regardless of vaccinated / infection control (note regardless vaccinated or not Covid still gets to that person difference is level of seriousness) aka do we want to see a imported cases again

[10:09 am, 23/08/2021] +Peter T Ng: Think there's merit in trying this out. Personally, think Germany is more 'porous' as part of EU with differing Covid situations, and hence risks are perhaps higher than Brunei's.

Also perhaps for travelling Singaporeans, there need to have clearer information on what to expect should they get infected in eg Germany or Brunei. Are there hospitals? Where will they be required to go? What are insurance terms, and limits of coverage? Don't think they can fly home, or can they?

[10:10 am, 23/08/2021] +Ah Heng: FYI germany just show their number over the weekend 9k infection in a day

[10:10 am, 23/08/2021] +Ah Heng: what about taiwan? new zealand ?

[10:12 am, 23/08/2021] +Ah Heng: not to say closing of borders is the way to go but how fluid the process for us to react to ring fence and reduce and internal growth of numbers again?

[10:33 am, 23/08/2021] +An fan: We open border to Taiwan and New Zealand. But they don’t open to us yet. Just like China.

[10:56 am, 23/08/2021] +Boon: Dear REACH, the easing is a necessary. What are the safeguards in place to minimise/mitigate the risks of re-imported infections, including dependents who are coming in, so that SG has not locked-down/restricted ourselves and the price we paid for "nothing". Who's paying for these safeguards?

[11:08 am, 23/08/2021] +An fan: As I know Incoming travellers have  to buy minimum 30k COVID-19 insurance before they get air pass to come to Singapore.

[11:20 am, 23/08/2021] +Joseph Ong: Process/procedures are useless if they are only pretty on paper. Hope the G can put more focus on implementation and enforcement. And I am not referring to CV19 issues only, but ALL G initiatives/regulations/etc.

[11:27 am, 23/08/2021] +Elena Woo: We don't know if there could be another variant like delta that can cause another wave of community cases. Just the delta alone caused chaos from Apr till now and yet to subside.

[11:30 am, 23/08/2021] +Ah Heng: till covid and cousin subside or till the brains at science world knwo how covid behaves and grow

[11:31 am, 23/08/2021] +Ah Heng: do expect more of its cousin to be out and about

[11:32 am, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

2 more elderly succumb to covid. 1 unvaccinated. 1 partially vaccinated.

49 death. Include 1 fully vaccinated and 1 partially vaccinated.

All elderly.

[11:32 am, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine will get full and final approval on 23 Aug 2012 by US FDA.

MOH should seriously consider making Pfizer-BioNTech vaccines a mandate for compulsory vaccination for the remainder of unvaccinated Singapore population (except age 12 years and below which is still under trial) - in preparation for endemic.

This will push the remaining unvaccinated people over the finishing line and achieve 100% vaccination rate fulfilling the objective of:-

"No one is safe, unless everyone is safe"!

https://www.businesstimes.com.sg/consumer/pfizer-covid-19-vaccine-poised-to-get-full-fda-approval-next-week

[11:32 am, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

MOH speech on Mandatory Vaccination.

Currently, not possible to make vaccination compulsory because the vaccines are still under emergency approval.

Upon granted full and final approval, Countries around the world will consider making vaccination mandatory as countries are moving towards endemic.

https://youtu.be/I_6K59FaOZE

[11:34 am, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Our local medical experts come out strongly to recommend the vaccination of the remaining unvaccinated people - because Delta variants is highly contagious and threaten the unvaccinated.

https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/health/why-the-surge-in-covid-19-deaths-and-what-it-means-for-the-future

[11:37 am, 23/08/2021] +Timothy Low: I recall not all are elderly. There is one Ukrainian seamen who is 36 years old also died of COVID in Singapore

[11:37 am, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

https://sg.yahoo.com/finance/news/stocks-radar-fda-expected-grant-082744310.html

Stocks on the Radar: FDA Expected to Grant Full Approval of Pfizer-BioNTech Vaccine on Monday.

[11:38 am, 23/08/2021] +Timothy Low: 34, not 36 years old. Source: https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/34-year-old-seaman-from-ukraine-dies-of-covid-19-10-new-clusters-emerge

[11:39 am, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Oh I remember incorrectly.

Then should be all elderly except one 36 years old.

[11:44 am, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: https://www.channelnewsasia.com/world/australia-covid-19-lockdown-morrison-record-cases-2128581

Australian PM Morrison defends COVID-19 lockdown strategy as daily cases hit record

[11:44 am, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: https://www.channelnewsasia.com/world/new-zealand-queries-virus-approach-delta-outbreak-grows-2128766

New Zealand queries virus approach as Delta outbreak grows

[11:45 am, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

My close friend comments:-

Under strain to defend a zero covid strategy.

My comments:-

Yes.

Zero covid strategy can no longer be applicable as Delta variants strike.

China also undergo the same situation.

That's why I wrote a long argument yesterday about uncontrolled endemic and zero covid strategy both doesn't work.

I introduce a middle path approach call the vaccinated controlled endemic approach.

New Zealand and Australia need to ramp up their vaccination to achieve it.

China need to add mRNA booster to achieve it.

My middle path approach is taking the cue from what our government are doing.

[11:45 am, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: https://news.google.com/articles/CAIiEMecARygGbA-g9wbSUd2uCEqGQgEKhAIACoHCAowief2CjCJ2dUCMOySxwU?hl=en-SG&gl=SG&ceid=SG%3Aen

HK discover that zero covid strategy is increasingly not beneficial as a business hub - and need to move towards endemic.

[11:46 am, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

University to review plagiarism claims against ‘China’s Dr Fauci’ Zhang Wenhong

Critics say a review section in Zhang’s doctoral thesis is very similar to that in another paper

Supporter says the accusers are deliberately confusing the issue

Guo Rui  in Guangzhou

Published: 9:00pm, 15 Aug, 2021

SCMP

-----

User since Mar 2021

Babe B.

1. Covid will not be totally eradicated. 

2. It will become endemic globally. 

3. Zero covid strategy can only be used temporarily - unless a Country want to cut itself out from the rest of the World by permanently shutting its border and become a hermit country. 

4. Else at some point in time, every Country must learn how to live with covid - with high vaccination rate to protect its population.

Just now

-----

1. Full uncontrolled endemic - to allow full Economy and travel to function like in pre-pandemic is undesirable will result in high infection, high hospitalisation and even death. This uncontrolled endemic model is not desirable.

2. Zero covid strategy - by closing its border to prevent imported infection cases - is also unsustainable - unless a Country want to shut its international flights permanently, ban overseas travelling, ban all oveseas visitors and curb trade, business and investment - to prevent infection from coming from abroad.

The zero covid strategy is only implemented when there are no alternative to prevent covid from infecting the population and lead to high hospitalisation and death.

Now with vaccination, monoclonal anti-body treatment - to transform covid into mild illness - rather than serious illness -- zero covid strategy is no longer the desirable model.

3. Adopting a Middle Path approach to live with the covid as endemic - while reopening the domestic Economy and international Economy will be a longer term sustainable model.

4. Hence I will like to coin the concept of "Vaccinated Controlled Endemic" with high vaccination (100% vaccination if possible) as a baseline to live with the covid as endemic while reopening the domestic and international Economy.

That's step by step reopening with safeguard and not uncontrolled endemic.

The middle path between zero covid and full endemic.

"Feeling the stones mindfully, as you cross the river".

======

[11:55 am, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

https://sg.news.yahoo.com/fda-warns-against-using-livestock-201936759.html                            FDA Warns Against Using Livestock Drug To Treat COVID-19.                 Paige Lavender

Sun, August 22, 2021, 4:19 AM

The Food and Drug Administration warned against using ivermectin — a drug often used in the U.S. to treat or prevent parasites in animals — to treat or prevent COVID-19 in humans.

“You are not a horse. You are not a cow. Seriously, y’all. Stop it,” the FDA tweeted Saturday morning, linking to a piece explaining the dangers of self-medicating with ivermectin doses intended for horses.

[11:55 am, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

https://sg.news.yahoo.com/mississippi-poison-calls-soar-vaccine-035845930.html      

Mississippi Poison Calls Soar As Vaccine Skeptics Turn To Livestock Drug swallowing ivermectin For COVID-19.

Medical experts call this people crazy ignoring medical guidelines while believing in anti-vaxx messages.

[11:58 am, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Somehow the MOH chart not in synch with what is announced.

Ong Ye Kung say 1st jab 82%.

2nd jab 77%.

Quite different from the MOH chart.

[0:00 pm, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Wonder why MOH chart not updated to be in synch with the MTF announcement?

It has caused some confusion what is the vaccination rate is when tracking the Vaccination number.

[0:27 pm, 23/08/2021] +Caleb: this is 5 days ago

[0:27 pm, 23/08/2021] +Caleb: when did OYK say?

[0:33 pm, 23/08/2021] +Peter T Ng: What's your denominator

[0:52 pm, 23/08/2021] +Timothy Low: Actually the total doses administered also doesn’t tally

[0:53 pm, 23/08/2021] +Caleb: OYK said include SINOVAC I think

[0:53 pm, 23/08/2021] +Caleb: and those come back from overseas citizens who had jab in overseas

[0:55 pm, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

I work backwards.

It is 5.7 million.

The person who track it has not seen the message to respond.

[0:56 pm, 23/08/2021] +Caleb: this numbers is no. of doses in the national vaccination prog?

[0:59 pm, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

MOH number.

I don't know.

[1:02 pm, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Ok.

Then you are right.

[1:04 pm, 23/08/2021] +Peter T Ng: Ok, so you are saying having used one of the day's pax vaccinated and reported percentage to arrive at total population, and using the total population for other days, it no longer tallies? What's the difference in no like

[1:05 pm, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

I guess is what you say

[1:12 pm, 23/08/2021] +Peter T Ng: Am sure there is a logical explanation on any discrepancy. @+REACH Perhaps the methodology of calculation or at least FAQ on why the % may not tally exactly can be provided

[1:13 pm, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

That's why we want to clarify in REACH to clear the confusion.

Before Sinovac is announced, the number is clear and consistent.

Now there are discrepancy.

[1:27 pm, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: https://www.straitstimes.com/world/israeli-doctors-find-severe-covid-19-breakthrough-cases-mostly-in-older-sicker-patients                                                                                                         Israeli doctors find severe Covid-19 breakthrough cases mostly in older, sicker patients.

[1:29 pm, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Now only 2 groups of people are unvaccinated:-

1. Adults - mainly some elderly and anti-vaxx or vaccines-hesitant people. (10% of the population) 

2. Infant age below 12 years old - still cannot be vaccinated. (10% of the population)

[1:33 pm, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

No breakdown of below 12 years old.

But 0 - 14 years old about 12.3%.

So rough estimate 12 years and below about 10%.

Hence remaining adult population not vaccinated is another 10%.

[1:35 pm, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Hence with US FDA granting full and final approval for Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine today - I will like to urge MOH to seriously consider mandatory vaccination for the last 10% adults.

As for 12 years and below, got to wait for the trial to complete.

To enter into endemic, we need to protect everyone.

[1:40 pm, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Recently there are so many unvaccinated elderly death that maybe avoidable if they are vaccinated.

As these elderly cannot be persuaded due to their fear of vaccines, or ignorance - then as supported by our medical experts - we may want to urge the government to mandate compulsory vaccination to protect these last group of people.

These people don't have to succumb needlessly - just by getting the jabs - by mandatory vaccination if all else persuasion fail.

[1:43 pm, 23/08/2021] +Elena Woo: Yes esp the younger ones. They are the future pillars

[2:57 pm, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

1. For that matter, 10% unvaccinated adults is about 570,000 people.

2. 10% unvaccinated children is another 570,000 children.

So by persuasion, not sure how fast to get 570,009 unwilling adults to vaccinate while we move to endemic.

Time is the essence.

By a stroke of the law, as US FDA has approved the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine - we can mop up the unvaccinated adults quickly - and reduce the strain on our hospital resources and medical staff - who have come under alot of strain and mental stress.

They deserve to be relieved of the unnecessary pressure.

Also less people hospitalised, less budget we need to subsidize the medical costs.

We can wait, but virus won't wait.

It is time to take a decisive step - Mandatory Vaccination!

[2:59 pm, 23/08/2021] +Caleb: Maybe next step first is pay or vaccinated

[2:59 pm, 23/08/2021] +Caleb: Pay for own medical bill if covid positive

[2:59 pm, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

More death at home.

[3:00 pm, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

This infringe the Hippocratic oath.

[3:08 pm, 23/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: What are your views on the calibrated easing of border and community measures, as Singapore prepares for the transition towards COVID resilience?

My views are as follows:

1) Overseas traveller should be profiled from their passport of origin instead of just point of entry (eg all travellers from High Risk countries should be processed as that tier regardless of where their embarkation point is into SG).

2) Even for low risk countries, they should not be allowed to Quarantine at their own place of residence. I strongly urge the policy to be changed as this might be a silent covid infection vector. 

3) Even for locals returning home, we should not be quarantine at home but a few selected premises where it’s wel managed and kept clean. All these could be a nightmare once they spread locally and you can’t contain the spread. Don’t forget that our young (below 12) are still unvaccinated! You will have blood on your hands once this group gets infected if we reopen rashly.

4) I still maintain my stance that WFH should be the default mode until the young can be fully vaccinated or majority of them are vaccinated. This virus is a long con and those who are foolish to think they have it under control and reopen quickly will soon be dealt with another wave.

My 2.14 cents

[4:17 pm, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

https://www.straitstimes.com/world/middle-east/israel-finds-covid-19-vaccine-booster-significantly-lowers-infection-risk                                                                                                       A third dose of Pfizer‘s Covid-19 vaccine has significantly improved protection from infection and serious illness among people aged 60 and older in Israel compared with those who received two shots, findings published by the Health Ministry.

[5:00 pm, 23/08/2021] +Caleb: All employers in Singapore have been urged to consider implementing a regime for existing employees and new hires to get vaccinated or undergo regular tests.

Employers may also ask staff who are eligible but choose not to be vaccinated to pay for regular testing, and exclude them from medical benefits linked to Covid-19, according to guidelines from Singapore’s tripartite partners. https://bit.ly/2Wi33uv

[5:15 pm, 23/08/2021] +REACH: S’pore employers may ask staff who choose not to be vaccinated to pay for regular Covid-19 testing

All employers have been urged to consider implementing a regime for existing employees and new hires to get vaccinated or undergo regular tests. 

As part of efforts to boost vaccination rates, employers may also ask staff who are eligible but choose not to be vaccinated to pay for regular testing, and exclude them from medical benefits linked to Covid-19. 

More: https://str.sg/3igj

[5:54 pm, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

1. Hippocratic oath apply to fair treatment to all people when people get ill. Medical professionals worldwide make such declaration before conferring the certification to become doctors.

2. If a person is not ill, testing I believe don't fall under such oath.

A point of contention and debate - that fall into the grey area.

However, I feel asking people to pay for their own test if they refused to vaccinate does not infringe the oath.

3. Differentiated treatment will cause people to be unhappy - and one of the main purpose is to cajole people to vaccinate. A hard persuasion approach.

4. And if mandatory vaccination with health authority granting approval - will also make people unhappy - but a short and sharp one - jab and done deal - without prolonging people's unhappiness. 

So why not mandate compulsory jabs?

[5:59 pm, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

That's long pain or short pain.

Differentiated treatment is a prolonged pain. And more people will die along the way as people procastinate.

Mandatory vaccination is a short but sharp pain. But less people die as they are protected by the vaccines.

Which one you want?

Long or short?

[6:09 pm, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Politically, long pain (without relieve) will be worst than short pain (when after jabs discover they are protected).

People have short memory on short pain and enduring memories of long pain.

[6:21 pm, 23/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Some People I come across vehemently distrust vaccines.

But being a frontline staff, they either jab or post elsewhere.

So being force to jabs 

Now when ask them how you think vaccination will solve the problem - they say better jab to protect themselves.

So short and sharp pain better than prolonged pain.

Those who refuse to jabs everyday complaining double treatment, sign petition, talk bad.

Politically, mandatory vaccination will have better outcomes.

[6:46 pm, 23/08/2021] +REACH: Dear Contributors,

⏰ We will be closing the chat in 15 minutes ⏰

Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.

Goodnight!

Megan

[6:47 pm, 23/08/2021] +REACH: PM Lee to deliver National Day Rally speech on Aug 29

Prime Minister Lee Hsien Loong will deliver his National Day Rally speech on Sunday evening (Aug 29) at Mediacorp.

He will speak in Malay and Mandarin from 6.45pm to 7.15pm, and in English from 8pm to 9.15pm, the Prime Minister’s Office said in a statement on Monday.

More: https://str.sg/3iMi

[6:49 pm, 23/08/2021] +REACH: Mass flu vaccination drive for Govt workers to reduce toll on Covid-19 testing resources

A flu vaccination drive is being planned for 44 public agencies to ensure that as many employees as possible are protected ahead of the end-of-year flu season.

More: https://str.sg/3iMT

[6:54 pm, 23/08/2021] +Smiley face: https://youtu.be/DUXtT9C93VY

[6:59 pm, 23/08/2021] +REACH: Dear Contributors,

We will be closing the chat for today.

Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.

Goodnight!

Megan 😊

[7:00 pm, 23/08/2021] +Fathul - Ipin: https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/covid-19-cases-north-coast-lodge-dormitory-aug-23-2130031

[7:00 pm, 23/08/2021] +Smiley face: 23 August 2021 

To: Distinguished MTF, DMS and All Honorable Members 

"TRAVEL SAFETY"

Prior to departure, for Singaporeans travelling out of the country, firstly, please take note of the respective Singapore embassy and its REACHABLE (24/7) contact numbers, duty embassy staffs to be trained and briefed on a set of covid medical SOP issued by MFA.

Secondly, travellers must buy adequate travel insurance for emergency air ambulance, fully understand what the exception clauses that varies country to region, each premium and coverage, it is so important! 

Inbound Travel Insurance:

Should any tourist who is infected with covid and needs hospitalisation, is there provision for sickbeds and critically ICU beds? The cost of hospitalisation is non-subsidise and fully borne by tourist and / or their valid and chargeable travel insurance coverages inclusive of covid and covid related claims of S$50,000 up to $1,000,000 for a spectrum of medical services from ambulance, A&E, testings and private hospital stay. These unforeseeable risks must be clearly spelled and in simple explanation prior to arriving into Singapore, all inbound tourists and visitors.

STAY SAFE and TRAVEL SAFE for all travellers! 

Afterwords:

My friend shared this with me... "If you are afraid of covid infections and opening the economy, don't open !" Can we do that? 

我的朋友与我分享了这一点...“如果你害怕冠状病毒感染和开放经济，请不要开放! "  我们能做到吗？

"the 50% of things is a tipping point, thereafter towards glory or gloomy and importantly a point of NO TURNING BACK...!" 

-- Ian T

========

University to review plagiarism claims against ‘China’s Dr Fauci’ Zhang Wenhong

Critics say a review section in Zhang’s doctoral thesis is very similar to that in another paper

Supporter says the accusers are deliberately confusing the issue

Guo Rui  in Guangzhou

Published: 9:00pm, 15 Aug, 2021

SCMP

-----

User since Mar 2021

Babe B.

1. Covid will not be totally eradicated. 

2. It will become endemic globally. 

3. Zero covid strategy can only be used temporarily - unless a Country want to cut itself out from the rest of the World by permanently shutting its border and become a hermit country. 

4. Else at some point in time, every Country must learn how to live with covid - with high vaccination rate to protect its population.

Just now

-----

1. Full uncontrolled endemic - to allow full Economy and travel to function like in pre-pandemic is undesirable will result in high infection, high hospitalisation and even death. This uncontrolled endemic model is not desirable.

2. Zero covid strategy - by closing its border to prevent imported infection cases - is also unsustainable - unless a Country want to shut its international flights permanently, ban overseas travelling, ban all oveseas visitors and curb trade, business and investment - to prevent infection from coming from abroad.

The zero covid strategy is only implemented when there are no alternative to prevent covid from infecting the population and lead to high hospitalisation and death.

Now with vaccination, monoclonal anti-body treatment - to transform covid into mild illness - rather than serious illness -- zero covid strategy is no longer the desirable model.

3. Adopting a Middle Path approach to live with the covid as endemic - while reopening the domestic Economy and international Economy will be a longer term sustainable model.

4. Hence I will like to coin the concept of "Vaccinated Controlled Endemic" with high vaccination (100% vaccination if possible) as a baseline to live with the covid as endemic while reopening the domestic and international Economy.

That's step by step reopening with safeguard and not uncontrolled endemic.

The middle path between zero covid and full endemic.

"Feeling the stones mindfully, as you cross the river".

======

REACH 267 - View on reopening to vaccinated overseas travellers and home isolation (SK)

20 Aug 2021 (10am - 7pm)

REACH

[9:47 am, 20/08/2021] +REACH: Dear contributors,

Welcome back! 😊

⏰ We will be opening the chat from 10am to 7pm today. ⏰

House Rules (short version of our Terms of Use) to keep in mind: 

1. Be kind and respectful. We all want to be in a safe space to share our views. 

2. Any and all threatening, abusive, vulgar or racially, religiously and ethnically objectionable content is prohibited.

3. Consider the quiet ones among us and give them a chance to comment.

4. No need to repeat your comment or in different forms (including caps) - we heard you loud and clear the first time.

5. Let’s protect each other’s privacy and keep contact details in this group what it should always be - confidential. 

Full set of Terms of Use: https://go.gov.sg/reach-whatsapp-terms

We will strive to uphold these rules to ensure this is a safe space for all.

Please be assured that the points made by participants during the chat are aggregated and shared with relevant agencies.

The topic will be posted shortly.

Thank you

Megan 😊

[10:01 am, 20/08/2021] +REACH: 📢 Topic 📢 

The Ministry of Health (MOH) on Thursday (Aug 19) said the higher vaccination rates among the population provide a foundation for the country to introduce vaccination-differentiated border measures for travellers, such as the new Vaccinated Travel Lane (VTL). As part of its gradual shift towards living with the disease, Singapore will start a pilot programme for mildly ill Covid-19 patients to recover at home from Aug 30.

💬 How do you feel about Singapore’s approach to reopening of our borders to vaccinated individuals through the differentiated measures for countries? As we progress towards an endemic COVID-19, what do you think of the new community measures such as, the pilot home isolation scheme, and vaccination of children below 12 years old next year?

Under the new VTL from Sept 8, fully vaccinated passengers to and from Singapore can travel without quarantine. They will instead have to undergo four Covid-19 polymerase chain reaction (PCR) tests, including one to be taken before the flight. This will be the first time residents can go for quarantine-free leisure travel since the Republic shuts its borders in March last year.

People will qualify for the home isolation scheme if they have mild or no symptoms and can be isolated from the rest of the household, said the Ministry of Health (MOH) on Thursday (Aug 19). Giving more details on the home isolation pilot, MOH said all household members will be placed on home quarantine for as long as the patient is isolated.

Booster shots of the Covid-19 vaccine are being studied, while a third dose is being considered for those who have severely compromised immune systems, said the multi-ministry task force on Covid-19 on Thursday (Aug 19).The vaccination of children below 12 years old should also start some time early next year, after the safety and efficacy aspects have been studied.

Health Minister Ong Ye Kung, who co-chairs the task force, said: "We will very likely have to start a booster exercise. (Other) countries started vaccinations earlier than us, and we therefore now have the advantage of observing them and learning from their experiences."

👉 https://str.sg/3iig

👉 https://str.sg/3iiQ

👉 https://str.sg/3iic

👉 https://str.sg/3iiN

------

[10:20 am, 20/08/2021] +Ben: How do you feel about Singapore’s approach to reopening of our borders to vaccinated individuals through the differentiated measures for countries? - Good start. I'd really like to see more flexibility for travel. If someone arrives, with a negative test on departure and arrival, and does 3 day in Q/SDF, then tests negative again they should be free to roam. Then another test 3 days later and if negative again then no more tests.

[10:21 am, 20/08/2021] +Ben: For vaccinated people that is. No entry for non-vax, unless due to a medical condition and then 14 days QO.

[10:23 am, 20/08/2021] +Ben: Good to see under 12's will be vaccinated. As soon as the trials are concluded I hope we have supplies ready.

[10:24 am, 20/08/2021] +Joseph Ong: As always, the policies and measures are sound...on paper.

I worry about the implementation and enforcement bit.

[10:25 am, 20/08/2021] +Ben: I'm confused why we need boosters for mRNA vaccines. Are they improved vaccines? Or just the same again? If we might need boosters does that mean we are not properly protected now, or is it just the some people's bodies don't take to it. More information please.

[10:26 am, 20/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: I strongly agree with this

[10:27 am, 20/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: The different tier countries is a good policy, however travelers might use that to end the country with less restrictions.

[11:08 am, 20/08/2021] +Ben: That's ok because they need to have been in those countries for 21 days before.

[11:09 am, 20/08/2021] +Ben: SO go whereever you like, then spend 21 days in Germany before coming back (if you can)

[11:13 am, 20/08/2021] +Ah Heng: frank already seen on ground how some travellers are beating the system

[11:13 am, 20/08/2021] +Ah Heng: recently i learnt one brit travell to swiss, stay there for 2 weeks den inbound to singapore

[11:13 am, 20/08/2021] +Ah Heng: is like how indians are making their way globally via middle east airports

[11:14 am, 20/08/2021] +Ah Heng: so whatever outside do our onshore defense must not let guard

[11:14 am, 20/08/2021] +Ah Heng: if we need to swap them 12 times so be it

[11:14 am, 20/08/2021] +Ah Heng: all you need is one detected infection and that will reveal how many undetected are roaming again

[11:15 am, 20/08/2021] +Ah Heng: hope we dun go into 3 strike rule which we already used up 2 changi and fishery ......

[11:17 am, 20/08/2021] +Rama: A calculated but necessary move

[11:46 am, 20/08/2021] +Ben: maybe they should show evidence of being in the correct country for 21days?

[11:47 am, 20/08/2021] +Ben: Just flying in from Germany and saying they have been there for 21 days does open up quite an easy back door. Especially since there are not border restrictions in the EU.

[0:14 pm, 20/08/2021] +m6dm6n: Am more concerned how this will impact the non vaccinated kids (below 12). Bear in mind, vaccinated doesn't mean you cannot be a carrier with mild or no symptom. We also seen that today test negative, 3 days later test positive despite being isolated.

[0:36 pm, 20/08/2021] +Smiley face: https://youtube.com/shorts/3NvTvH07Vlg?feature=share

[0:47 pm, 20/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: Yes this was the case previously

[0:55 pm, 20/08/2021] +Smiley face: Risks & Rewards:

The inbound tourism industry and complimentary trades will begin to regain footings and improve with the gradual opening up of approved countries with low covid risk. The risk of cross geography infections of D or future variants of covid are unavoidable risks,, this case all inbound tourists and visitors from approved low risk countries - specifically cat I follows by cat II.

[1:59 pm, 20/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

1. As we hit a high vaccination rate - 77% 2 jabs and 82% 1 jab - it is imperative we need secure our air hub and sea hub quickly - as the longer we wait - the greater the danger that our air and sea hub will be bypass - thus resulting in long term economic damage - in which we thrive on.

2. However, we must take note that there are still 2 vulnerable groups of population that has yet to vaccinate - 1 is the 12 years old and below and 2 is the remaining elderly group that are most vulnerable to covid.

We must not let up our efforts to reach out and vaccinate the remaining elderly (including Mandatory Vaccination if necessary once full and final approval are granted for mRNA vaccines).

As for 12 years old and below, once the trial is completed and safe to vaccinate - this group, estimated to be early 2022 - we must attempt to cover them. 

Meanwhile, the Government must ensure these 2 groups must not be exposed to unnecessary risks - as we slowly open up to overseas travellers.

The recent hospitalisation and death are mainly unvaccinated elderly - thus stronger push (including mandatory vaccination) must be implemented - to protect them maybe necessary. 

Only then the entire population will feel safe and resassure when this particularly vulnerable group is protected - and will not overwhelm the hospital resources and post undue strain to our medical staff and our national resources.

3. It is assuring that the Government will :-

a. Only allow vaccinated overseas travvllers to come to Singapore.

b. Need to conduct PCR tests while they are here to ensure they are not infected

though they will not need to be quarantine. This is the same safety profile as our vaccinated population here.

4. The pilot home isolation for mild or asymptomatic patients - if house at home with the rest of the vaccinated household - without vulnerable people such as elderly or children - should be safe.

5. Though there are some breakthrough cases against the mRNA vaccines, Israel insightful statistics and study reveal that mRNA vaccines are still highly effective in curbing Delta variants - more than 80% to 90% and in some group even 100% efficacy.

Hence will need to carefully study whether the general population needs a 3rd booster jab other than those immunocompromised people.

[1:59 pm, 20/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

https://www.covid-datascience.com/post/israeli-data-how-can-efficacy-vs-severe-disease-be-strong-when-60-of-hospitalized-are-vaccinated

Israel insight statistics show that in every granular age groups - Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine has been very effective against Delta variants.

[2:03 pm, 20/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2021/08/covid-19-vaccines-may-trigger-superimmunity-people-who-had-sars-long-ago                                                                                                                       Current covid-19 vaccines may trigger super-immunity that develop anti-bodies not only against covid, but also SARs and other future coronavirus type of virus.

[2:03 pm, 20/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

The vaccines under study is the mRNA vaccines - Pfizer-BioNTech and Moderna vaccines.

[2:06 pm, 20/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Singapore won't reach herd immunity.

Hence 100% vaccination is essential.

https://sg.news.yahoo.com/singapore-wont-reach-covid-herd-immunity-lawrence-wong-141927382.html

[2:06 pm, 20/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

https://sg.news.yahoo.com/covid-vaccines-prevented-nearly-100-133115802.html

Covid vaccines have prevented nearly 100,000 deaths in England, official figures suggest.

[2:13 pm, 20/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

1. Almost all countries health authorities confirm that herd immunity is not possible to stop the delta variants given the high reproduction number reported by the various health authorities.

2. UK initial report R0 = 5 to 8 (smallpox) where herd immunity of 80% vaccination is say to be possible.

3. US report R0 = 8 to 9 (chickenpox) where herd immunity of 90 - 95% vaccination is say to be possible.

4. Malaysia latest report R0 > 10 where only 100% vaccination is essential to stop the Delta variants.

5. Thus 100% vaccination and if necessary through Mandatory Vaccination - to push the remaining harden group over the finishing line will be required - once US FDA grant the full and final approval - should be seriously considered. 

6. No one is safe - unless everyone is safe.

[2:14 pm, 20/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

https://malaysia.yahoo.com/news/best-brains-dr-noor-hisham-070354297.html                                                             Malaysia study - R0 > 10. Higher than US study of R0 = 8 to 9 (chickenpox).

Much higher than UK study of R0 = 5 to 8 (smallpox).

[2:14 pm, 20/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Malaysia medical experts say Delta variants R0 > 10.

Higher than US study of R0 = 8 to 9 (chickenpox).

Much higher than UK study of R0 = 5 to 8 (smallpox).

[2:18 pm, 20/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

https://www.straitstimes.com/world/middle-east/third-pfizer-dose-86-effective-in-over-60s-says-israel-healthcare-provider                                                                                                                                                                       A 3rd jab booster only 86% effective.

[2:18 pm, 20/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

https://www.straitstimes.com/world/united-states/vaccine-effectiveness-against-covid-19-may-wane-say-us-cdc-studies     

US CDC say vaccine effectiveness to prevent covid spreading may wane over times. This can be seen from the breakthrough cases and some elderly with underlying medical conditions succumb to covid despite full Vaccination.

But protection against serious illness or death remains.

US, Israel, Germany and France booster shot are given to those who have weaker immune system such as the elderly, and frontline health care staff - and not the general population - after 8 months of 2nd jab.

Some medical experts however say that the booster shot benefits are minimal - that can easily be provided by wearing a mask.

[2:55 pm, 20/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Note :-

Malaysia vaccination rate < US vaccination rate < UK vaccination rate.

UK vaccination rate is higher hence lower R0.

US vaccination rate is lower than UK hence higher R0.

Malaysia vaccination rate is lower than both US and UK - hence R0 > 10.

[2:57 pm, 20/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

The results show that higher the vaccination rate among the population - the lower the delta spread.

Hence 100% vaccination is essential to stop Delta.

[2:58 pm, 20/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

If Singapore want to go endemic - 100% vaccination is the only solution.

[3:12 pm, 20/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

HK adopt China zero covid strategy. Singapore adopt endemic strategy.

Both are opposite sides of the coin.

China in particular view endemic as Western concept which oppose to China nationalist view.

Hence, Singapore should do "Middle Path" approach to bridge the endemic concept and zero covid concept - so as to start travelling between Singapore and HK and China.

https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/hong-kong-economy/article/3145691/hong-kong-singapore-travel-bubble-differing-covid

[3:16 pm, 20/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Eg. Singapore can promote the concept of "Controlled endemic" with high vaccination (100% vaccination if possible).

That's step by step reopening with safeguard and not uncontrolled endemic.

The middle path between zero covid and full endemic.

[3:17 pm, 20/08/2021] +Thomas: I suspect they adopt zero covid startegy is due to their vaccine efficacy

[3:17 pm, 20/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

HK and China to be East Asia regional nodes may bite

[3:17 pm, 20/08/2021] +Thomas: It will show up if they approach endemic and they are not ready

[3:18 pm, 20/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Yes. That's why China is exploring the mRNA Fosun-BioNTech mRNA vaccines.

[3:18 pm, 20/08/2021] +Thomas: China is talking about Phizer that is mfg under a China name for booster

[3:19 pm, 20/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Only when China approve and roll out this mRNA vaccines - HK will follow suit.

And our middle path control endemic will be a good concept for them.

Because China trust Singapore.

[3:20 pm, 20/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Whether Pfizer or Fosun-BioNTech mRNA vaccines - as long as nationalism don't disrupt the process.

[3:35 pm, 20/08/2021] +~N: Hong Kong is already using Pfizer vaccine. Around the same time that Singapore started using.

[3:37 pm, 20/08/2021] +~N: On 25 January and 18 February 2021 respectively, the Secretary for Food and Health authorized the COVID-19 vaccine by Fosun Pharma/BioNTech (Comirnaty) and that by Sinovac Biotech (Hong Kong) Limited (CoronaVac) for emergency use in Hong Kong in accordance with the Regulation. 

https://www.covidvaccine.gov.hk/en/vaccine

[3:43 pm, 20/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Hk align to China policy.

If China don't use and endorse endemic, HK won't move.

[3:45 pm, 20/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Because HK needs China market.

[3:54 pm, 20/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

It is a political decision

[3:59 pm, 20/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

https://sg.news.yahoo.com/chinas-fauci-probed-plagiarism-questioning-063524643.html

In China, if any views are raised that is contrary to official view - can be probe later as anti-nationalist and subjected to fault finding.

Thus be careful when expressing views on China.

[4:08 pm, 20/08/2021] +Smiley face: https://sg.news.yahoo.com/singapore-wont-reach-covid-herd-immunity-lawrence-wong-141927382.html

[4:12 pm, 20/08/2021] +REACH: 8 eateries ordered to close, 59 people fined for flouting breaching Covid-19 rules

Eight food and beverage outlets have been ordered to close, while 22 eateries and 59 people have been fined for flouting Covid-19 safe distancing rules, the Ministry of Sustainability and the Environment said on Friday (Aug 20).

The eight eateries were ordered to close for between 10 and 20 days for breaching multiple safe management measures.

More: https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/health/8-eateries-ordered-to-close-59-people-fined-for-flouting-breaching-covid-19-rules

[4:27 pm, 20/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

My close friend comments:-

Between a zero-covid approach and an endemic approach, the former is easier to manage. 

The zero covid approach needs 3 key steps -(1) shut the border (2) clean up and (3) wait out.   But few countries can afford this approach in the long run. And Singapore cannot. So it is no choice that we have to brave through the bad weather by taking all precautionary measures that we can imagine to make this endemic phase a success.

This is for survival, not merely a debate of should or should not. 

Once SG takes on the endemic path and starts opening up, we will start to discover gaps and have to take steps to tighten them as we go along. 

Vaccination mandates can come in the form of segmentizing our population whose work require them to face members of public and subjecting them to regular tests. This is to arrest any possible large transmission outbreaks. Also consider mandating them to wear their TT token to facilitate contact tracing quickly as they are likely to be super spreaders.

SG also needs to sharpen our strategy in micro lockdowns for the infected and their close contacts. In an endemic phase, we are maximising the freedom of our people to live , work and play. So the infected, and those possibly infected persons should be "lockdown" and release if their viral load is reduced and no longer threaten wide ranging transmission. So, the part of pilot home isolation runs a contrary to my imagination. I would think that to keep the infected at home risks transmission and even harder to administer their well being and whereabout. This home isolation can perhaps come later when the world or region cases starts to show great improvement.

[4:34 pm, 20/08/2021] +Elena Woo: Whether wfh or wio should take into consideration whether that household has children under age of 12 until vaccinations are opened up.

[4:35 pm, 20/08/2021] +Elena Woo: For e.g. a family has 1 child of 10 yo. Both parents are allowed to wfh fully until end of 2021 when the vaccine for 6yo to 12yo is available. And employers cannot penalise the parents for wfh.

[4:36 pm, 20/08/2021] +Elena Woo: Because we do not know if variants can mutate and end up severely affect the young children or not.

[4:37 pm, 20/08/2021] +Elena Woo: Right now seems no severe effects, but we won't know.

[4:37 pm, 20/08/2021] +Elena Woo: And in cases of families with children younger than 6 yo, then their parents should be allowed to wfh fully until vaccination is available for the less than 6yo children.

[4:39 pm, 20/08/2021] +Suma pamu: +1 

Actually those who can let them WFH till 100% population vaccination done

[4:43 pm, 20/08/2021] +Thomas: See a problem here. The vaccine has to be officially approved by WHO , CDC and MOH before it can be mandated for the population. Current status the vaccine is considered as experimental and no Government mandate to population a experimental drugs or vaccine. But it will take time

[4:43 pm, 20/08/2021] +Thomas: * for approval

[4:44 pm, 20/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: unfortunately that's not the case right now

[4:55 pm, 20/08/2021] +Ben: Good point - WFH should be an option for all parents with under 12s

[4:58 pm, 20/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: How do you feel about Singapore’s approach to reopening of our borders to vaccinated individuals through the differentiated measures for countries? As we progress towards an endemic COVID-19, what do you think of the new community measures such as, the pilot home isolation scheme, and vaccination of children below 12 years old next year?

1) For incoming arrivals with different categories for high, medium and low risks countries I applaud the policy. However, there are loopholes about waiting to be exploited. As long as the authorities are fast to detect cases and plug the loopholes I’ve no qualms about it.

2) Here, there are two parts. Community measures like home isolation scheme is very hard to monitor and control. And the last thing we want is to have c…

[5:11 pm, 20/08/2021] +Suma pamu: When i read this kind of news ...againa and again i am scared ...not only about my child... But all other children..

Only FOCUSING ON ELDERLY ..and Forgetting about children...?!

What's the Use? 

https://www.cnn.com/2021/08/07/health/children-covid-19-protection/index.html

[5:15 pm, 20/08/2021] +Suma pamu: The other day i read some comment here that Children Won't have long covid!!

But The Article wrote otherwise.

So As we don't have FULL DATA

Please don't conclude that CHILDREN Won't Get any Long covid.

[5:18 pm, 20/08/2021] +Ah Heng: who say child do not have long covid

[5:19 pm, 20/08/2021] +Ah Heng: think it was already stated anyone who got covid will have issue

[5:19 pm, 20/08/2021] +Ah Heng: what make children so special once they have covid and recover will not have symptoms

[5:20 pm, 20/08/2021] +Ah Heng: is just like how majority swear by their lives vaccine of aa bb is good but look at the daily reports and u know vaccine are like fighting among themselves to prove which is better and need extra boosting

[5:21 pm, 20/08/2021] +Ah Heng: end of the day no one have the sligtest clue what is happen each is just making the best of the situation only

[5:22 pm, 20/08/2021] +Ah Heng: important is as a society we should not divide ourselves up on the pretext we are protecting others because is proven vaccine ppl too can spread regardless of whatever level

[5:23 pm, 20/08/2021] +Ah Heng: society must do what we do best be as a cohesive , those can vaccine yes please go vacc, those with legit reason try to understand with them there will be a way for them one day, and also everyone in the society must be responsible once u are out of your lovely home mask on properly please ..

[5:25 pm, 20/08/2021] +Suma pamu: Not sure.. i Think i read here in this group (may be i am mistaken from other group)

[5:26 pm, 20/08/2021] +Ah Heng: :) no issue but i did read from US / UK site kid too will be expose to the after effects

[5:26 pm, 20/08/2021] +Ah Heng: we might not be sure what effects is that but from those who recover can hear from their testimony

[5:27 pm, 20/08/2021] +Suma pamu: Yes :(

[5:27 pm, 20/08/2021] +Ah Heng: i not going to say much in case speculating or wrong info , baseline is still please do our part when in the open

[5:30 pm, 20/08/2021] +Suma pamu: Here .. 

Just found it .

[5:34 pm, 20/08/2021] +Ah Heng: aiyo this one i think is saying current situation

[5:34 pm, 20/08/2021] +Ah Heng: post covid hard to say if it is immediate or after a while den surface

[5:34 pm, 20/08/2021] +Ah Heng: but go oversea news site sure can read

[5:35 pm, 20/08/2021] +Suma pamu: Yes

[5:49 pm, 20/08/2021] +Elena Woo: Yes agree... seems like govt ignore the pleas to protect the next gen and continue to move to endemic. Like that one more factor for couples hesitating to give birth.

[5:50 pm, 20/08/2021] +Elena Woo: And variants can mutate

[6:10 pm, 20/08/2021] +REACH: 36 new locally transmitted Covid-19 cases in Singapore, 14 unlinked

https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/health/36-new-locally-transmitted-covid-19-cases-in-singapore-14-unlinked

[6:11 pm, 20/08/2021] +REACH: S'pore's reopening focused on retaining business hub status, valuing public health stability: Lawrence Wong

Singapore's reopening is aimed at maintaining its status as a business hub and staying connected to the world, said Finance Minister Lawrence Wong on Friday (Aug 20).

More: https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/politics/spores-reopening-focused-on-retaining-business-hub-status-valuing-public-health

[6:46 pm, 20/08/2021] +REACH: Dear Contributors,

⏰ We will be closing the chat in 15 minutes ⏰

Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.

Goodnight!

Megan

[6:50 pm, 20/08/2021] +Kevin: Good night Megan

[7:00 pm, 20/08/2021] +REACH: Dear Contributors,

We will be closing the chat for today.

Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.

Goodnight!

Megan 😊

======

REACH 266 - View on new normal (SK)

18 Aug 2021 (10am - 7pm)

REACH

[10:00 am, 18/08/2021] +REACH: Dear contributors,

Welcome back! 😊

⏰ We will be opening the chat from 10am to 7pm today. ⏰

House Rules (short version of our Terms of Use) to keep in mind:

1. Be kind and respectful. We all want to be in a safe space to share our views. 

2. Any and all threatening, abusive, vulgar or racially, religiously and ethnically objectionable content is prohibited.

3. Consider the quiet ones among us and give them a chance to comment.

4. No need to repeat your comment or in different forms (including caps) - we heard you loud and clear the first time.

5. Let’s protect each other’s privacy and keep contact details in this group what it should always be - confidential. 

Full set of Terms of Use: https://go.gov.sg/reach-whatsapp-terms

We will strive to uphold these rules to ensure this is a safe space for all.

Please be assured that the points made by participants during the chat are aggregated and shared with relevant agencies.

The topic will be posted shortly.

Thank you

Megan 😊

[10:09 am, 18/08/2021] +REACH: 📢 Topic 📢 

Providing an update on the Vaccine Injury Financial Assistance Programme (VIFAP) on Monday (16 Aug), the Ministry of Health (MOH) said that a total of $782,000 has been paid out, or is in the process of being paid out, to 144 applicants.

Out of which, two patients suffering from serious side effects related to the vaccine have each received the highest payout of $225,000 in government financial aid so far.

💬  As more in our community are getting fully vaccinated as we approach endemic COVID in Singapore, what are your expectations of the new normal?

One of them is a 16-year-old boy who suffered a cardiac arrest after his first dose of the COVID-19 vaccine. MOH also said that the myocarditis was likely a serious adverse event caused by the vaccine, which may have been aggravated by the youth's strenuous lifting of weights and high consumption of caffeine through energy drinks and supplements.

There were a total of 52 new locally transmitted COVID-19 cases reported on Tuesday (17 Aug). Of the local cases, 35 were linked to previous cases and already quarantined, and another three linked cases were not in quarantine when they tested positive.

A 90-year-old man who was fully vaccinated but had a history of chronic kidney disease and hypertension died from COVID-19 complications on Tuesday (17 Aug). He is the first fully vaccinated person to die from issues linked to Covid-19 in Singapore.

👉 https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/health/highest-financial-aid-of-225k-paid-to-two-patients-for-serious-side-effects-from

👉 https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/community/90-year-old-man-dies-from-covid-19-complications-the-first-death-of-fully

-------

[10:31 am, 18/08/2021] +Caleb: Countinue Maintain personal hygiene like hand washing ect. 

Wearing mask regardless if it's mandatory by law.

[10:35 am, 18/08/2021] +Caleb: seamless check-in where business can just scan my TT app/token or NRIC to check my vaccination/COVID status.

Now if I use TT token, I still have to show either hard/soft copy of my vaccination cert

[10:49 am, 18/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: As more in our community are getting fully vaccinated as we approach endemic COVID in Singapore, what are your expectations of the new normal?

1) Mask mandate indefinitely with harsher fines and penalties for repeated offenders.

2) WFH as default, if clusters are detected in certain industry sector, thorough inspection of premises and lockdown for that industry might be needed.

3) Swabbing test for everyone on regular basis if possible. If not as many as possible.

[10:49 am, 18/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: My 2.14 cents

[11:15 am, 18/08/2021] +Elena Woo: We should not be approaching endemic if the young (less than 12 years old) are still not able to be vaccinated.

[11:27 am, 18/08/2021] +m6dm6n: +1

[11:34 am, 18/08/2021] +Boon: +1

[11:40 am, 18/08/2021] +CQ: +1

[0:07 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ken Loh: Agreed

[0:17 pm, 18/08/2021] +REACH: Workers to start returning to offices as COVID-19 restrictions ease for workplaces

As the COVID-19 situation in Singapore stabilises and with vaccination rates climbing, companies in Singapore are preparing for a partial return to the office with some intending to retain flexible working arrangements.

More: https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/covid-19-back-office-work-home-wfh-2119871

[0:22 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

1. Get everyone vaccinated 100%. Mandate vaccination if necessary when final approval is granted.

a. Because herd immunity is no longer possible as many medical experts say so even if 95% are vaccinated.

b. Even if 10% unvaccinated will have 570,000 people unvaccinated and put pressure on our hospital resources.

c. Adopt 100% vaccination like other dangerous virus pandemic such as smallpox measles mumps rubella diphtheria polio TB etc.

[0:25 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

2. Make mask mandatory.

3. Continue to source for treatment drugs for covid-19.

4. Maintain but adjust social distancing measures as situation deem fit eg. WFH, social events, dine-in, vaccine-differentiated measures etc.

[0:26 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

5. Explore if 3rd shot booster that can prevent Delta and other strains is necessary.

[0:29 pm, 18/08/2021] +Sally: Agreed 👍

[0:32 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/covid-19-vaccine-breakthroughs-effectiveness-ncid-chief-2117826

Breakthrough of vaccines only 1000 infected against more than 4 million vaccinated (0.00025%). 

Also unvaccinated have 17% people develop serious illness, need oxygen support or ICU versus 1% for vaccinated. 

Thus vaccination is not ineffective - but is the only solution to tackle covid.

[0:33 pm, 18/08/2021] +Suma pamu: +1

[0:33 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: https://www.straitstimes.com/world/united-states/the-world-may-never-reach-herd-immunity-against-covid-19                                                                                                                                The world may never reach herd immunity against Covid-19. 100% vaccination is required.

[0:34 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

https://sg.yahoo.com/news/us-could-see-200-000-200622525.html                                              US could see 200,000 Covid cases a day again: ‘Unvaccinated are sitting ducks’

[0:35 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: https://www.channelnewsasia.com/world/covid-19-fiji-compulsory-vaccination-civil-servants-no-jab-no-job-2113456     

Fiji civil service - no jab no job - Mandatory Vaccination for civil servants.

Many countries have join the rank to impose mandatory vaccination for various sectors to tackle covid pandemic and end the economic sufferings.

[0:39 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: https://www.channelnewsasia.com/world/british-columbia-mandates-covid-19-vaccines-staff-long-term-care-and-assisted-living-homes-2109576                                                                            Canada join US to mandate vaccination for staff of long-term and assisted living homes.

Canada also mooting the idea of mandatory vaccination for all federal workers.

[1:02 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ben: We should mandate vaccination for teachers and those in contact with under 12s, until they can be vaccinated too.

[1:03 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ben: If not,can we be told what % of teachers are vaccinated?

[1:03 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ben: We are told how many seniors are. Please advise about health care workers and teachers, since they are in contact with vulnerable.

[1:03 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ben: Don't have to specify which vaccine

[1:05 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ben: In suspicious about the need for a booster. mRNA should be effective against any covid virus with the spike protein, which includes Delta. mRNA programs the body, not like old fashioned anti body vaccines.

[1:06 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ben: Being mRNA means that your body produces the antibodies to any cell with the spike protein . You don't need antibodies present in your blood  , unless your body isn't very good at producing them in which case you will need a booster every 6 months.

[1:09 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ben: Should be obligatory to let parents know if commercial private teachers in contact with kids are vaccinated or not, since it's not mandatory for them to be

[1:17 pm, 18/08/2021] +Smiley face: 18 August, 2021 

To: Distinguished MTF, DMS And All Honorable Members 

Annual Vaccination Initiative (AVI):

Proposed Booster japs to be implemented starting January 2022, the first pioneer(Feb-March 2021) batch of 15% will be invited and there onwards every batch of 15% on a targeted monthly basis. 

Main:

For individuals who have completed PARTIAL vaccination regardless of brands, the booster jap will count as a valid fully vaccinated status. 

Individuals whom DECLINE the coming BOOSTER will have their vaccinated status cancelled. Inclusively, whatsoever reasons thereafter, these individuals will be able to REINSTATE their status once they have taken this booster jap. 

EXEMPTION will be given to individuals whom are adverse from the initial 1st or 2nd or both japs. There will be three categories of exemption, first is a 6 month exemption, second 1 year exemption and the third a full exemption. These exemptions will be given to individuals by MOH registered medical clinics and certified medical practitioners - private & public. 

This booster japs initiative will be an ANNUAL renewal of vaccination STATUS minus those who are partially or fully exempted.

[1:29 pm, 18/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: Students and staff can return to school once they or their close contacts test negative for Covid-19

https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/parenting-education/students-and-staff-can-return-to-school-once-they-or-their-close

[1:30 pm, 18/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: I still strongly disagree with this as new silent clusters may be formed as more vaccinated ppl return to office and get infected without any onset of severe symptoms.

[1:32 pm, 18/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: WFH should be the default unless no choice. If can WFH, must work from home. If allow 50%, then bosses will ask everyone to come back and you will have hard time enforcing the rules.

[1:33 pm, 18/08/2021] +Jack: Agree

[1:33 pm, 18/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: And with more ppl in ICU and critical condition, the “Endgame” should not be a priority.

[1:33 pm, 18/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: Almost one death in every two or three days iirc

[1:34 pm, 18/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: Curb all these down to single digit ICU first and let community cases down to the 10s then we can talk about “Endgame”

[1:37 pm, 18/08/2021] +Sally: Agreed

[1:54 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ken Loh: MNC should have not so much issue.

Is more for SME, but then again they have 1 whole year to transit to WFH. Technically should be able to be done. 

But the bonding and working physically is required for more effective communication… meeting online is hectic and many time drag on, then face to face interaction.

[1:55 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ken Loh: WFH I really don’t know new colleague as physically not there.. specially those new one that join on site. 😅

Many do not have computer access, over time will have barrier and won’t be in touch with people on the ground

[1:56 pm, 18/08/2021] +Caleb: Adults can return to work also?

[2:01 pm, 18/08/2021] +Jack: I have concern if go office then always take public transport with so many people.. what is I got covid with no symptoms and my family with two young children with no vaccination also inspected.. there big issues.. with Delta variant many people death.. who is going to take responsibility..

[2:03 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Many elderly have yet to be vaccinated.

So unless they are persuaded or mandated to vaccinate - elderly who are more vulnerable will more likely to overwhelm the hospitals.

All the current statistics show that elderly are the one that are hospitalised.

[2:05 pm, 18/08/2021] +Jack: Young children will get also. You see US so many young children got it

[2:06 pm, 18/08/2021] +Jack: These two group of age should consider vaccination

[2:10 pm, 18/08/2021] +Kevin: https://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/threads/omg-wfh-going-to-end.6580869/

[2:10 pm, 18/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: I agree. Myself have a newborn last year and everyday when she cough or have flu I always worry

[2:10 pm, 18/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: And I work onsite everyday at Changi Airport

[2:11 pm, 18/08/2021] +Kevin: https://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/threads/if-dont-want-go-back-ofc-tomorrow-can-give-what-excuse.6580928/

[2:12 pm, 18/08/2021] +Suma pamu: MOE and MOH keep on Saying children are safe .. may be they know better than those Experts in USA and Europe. 

No focus on Children....

[2:12 pm, 18/08/2021] +Kevin: Work from home too long become like that

[2:30 pm, 18/08/2021] +An fan: Our doctors tried this Ivermectin?

https://covid19criticalcare.com/ivermectin-in-covid-19/

[3:12 pm, 18/08/2021] +REACH: Integrated Shield Plans will cover only MOH-approved outpatient cancer treatment from 2023

People who have bought Integrated Shield Plans (IPs) from private insurers may not be able to claim for certain drugs used in outpatient cancer treatments from April 2023.

More: https://str.sg/3wFP

[3:21 pm, 18/08/2021] +Elena Woo: Same... i just gave birth recently and this is one of my concerns as well...

[3:22 pm, 18/08/2021] +Elena Woo: Exactly it is just that this never got into the alert radar of high risk, which I think it becomes too complacent.

[3:23 pm, 18/08/2021] +Elena Woo: DISAGREE with this as this can create potential hidden clusters that become easily out of control.

[3:24 pm, 18/08/2021] +Elena Woo: Actually my main concern is not on vaccination for adults, but vaccination for young children. My entire household is alr vaccinated except my newborn baby. 😥😥

[3:25 pm, 18/08/2021] +Elena Woo: And somemore moving into endemic when young children cannot be covered at this point of time? I really doubt the thought process is complete.

[3:30 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: https://finance.yahoo.com/news/column-major-study-ivermectin-anti-222751048.html?fr=sycsrp_catchall&guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly9zZy5zZWFyY2gueWFob28uY29tLw&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAGI1rnLZy1QX1BYcw8vflDofKvZF0N-CWHLX__bFq37-ZHsU8PFjiRH3zC7xzKH4Fmy-0XmYjs9kVj9yjiUXh300TVEzMhbHlkjFp5LBG07OT4qFqUPM5w8iAe87kyz6ZbIJxSdqbROROM1VEe6bhB9UclbKRx70fYzLjWdQ2Wi2                                                                                                          Ivermectin - the magical covid drug - touted by the anti-vaxx group - is a complete flop.

[3:30 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

https://www.who.int/news-room/q-a-detail/coronavirus-disease-(covid-19)-hydroxychloroquine 

WHO does not recommend hydroxychloroquine to prevent COVID-19 - another drug touted by the anti-vaxx group. All these bizzare anti-vaxx group touted drugs have somehow link to Trump's big lies.

[3:30 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: https://news.google.com/articles/CAIiEIxtjGoT-pk35PMpgD2UwSYqFggEKg0IACoGCAowm_EEMKAiMOfsywM?hl=en-SG&gl=SG&ceid=SG%3Aen

The Vaccine Scientist Spreading Vaccine Misinformation

Robert Malone claims to have invented mRNA technology. Why is he trying so hard to undermine its use?

[3:31 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: https://www.straitstimes.com/opinion/covid-19-endemic-time-for-a-frank-conversation      

Our public health experts name 2 groups that will be crucial in our endemic roadmap. 

1 is the seniors and the 2nd is the children below 12 years old. Vaccination of both these 2 groups are imperative - for the endemic road map.

Don't be surprise mandatory vaccination will be on the way when US FDA grant the full and final approval.

[3:32 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/health/none-of-the-children-infected-with-covid-19-require-oxygen-support-or-are-in-the                                                                                                    124 children in hospital or community care - but none in ICU. All unvaccinated.

Majority infected by own household.

They also don't experience long covid - symptoms that lingers 4 weeks or more.

[3:34 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: https://www.channelnewsasia.com/world/who-trial-three-drugs-treat-covid-19-2106446

WHO trial 3 treatment drugs for covid-19 patients.

[3:34 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: https://www.channelnewsasia.com/world/covid-19-australia-victoria-state-steady-rise-cases-lockdown-2104856                                                                                                                                      Australia get tough on vaccination. No jab no job.

[3:34 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/context-important-risks-covid-19-mrna-vaccine-benjamin-ong-1935161                                                                                                                              Medical experts on covid vaccine side effects. Important to view covid vaccines side effects into the right context. Else Singapore will not be able to take advantage of its access to effective COVID-19 vaccines if people react to “every alarmist sort of viewpoint that comes up”.

[3:34 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

https://sg.yahoo.com/news/picture-shifting-vaccines-transmission-shaping-164407331.html        

Vaccination no longer focus on blocking transmission as vaccinated people can still transmit covid-19 - but re-shaping how to learn to live with covid.

That's using vaccines as protection from developing serious illness as cannot depends on the wall of herd immunity to stop covid from spreading.

[3:34 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

https://sg.news.yahoo.com/cdc-recommends-pregnant-women-covid-160200924.html                                    

CDC recommends pregnant women get COVID-19 vaccine

[3:34 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: https://www.channelnewsasia.com/asia/malaysia-record-covid-19-new-cases-pregnant-women-vaccine-2108286                                                                                                                                   Malaysia urge pregnant women to get vaccinated as 70 pregnant women die from covid.

[3:47 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ken Loh: Mummy chat group most are scared and not taking

[3:48 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ken Loh: Any miscarriage in resultant of vaccine wavier form need to be signed. Hence most think twice. 

Specially those IVF couples

[3:51 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Singapore government have not promote vaccination for pregnant women.

But US, UK, Israel, Indonesia, Malaysia all recommend pregnant women vaccinate.

[3:52 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ken Loh: Promoting don’t mean people will take 😅

IVF couple takes effort to get pregnant, if they ask for wavier don’t in turn give confidence to the couple which spend over $10 k or so

[3:52 pm, 18/08/2021] +Joseph Ong: Maybe G needs to consider intensive media blasts to educate people about mRNA and counter misinformation surrounding the issue. 

I am still amazed that many think mRNA is new/experimental when it has been researched and worked on for almost 40 years. 

Small bite sized information blasts .. intensive and sustained … over multiple media platforms.

[3:56 pm, 18/08/2021] +Caleb: +1

[3:59 pm, 18/08/2021] +Joseph Ong: People are considering in isolation, the risk of the vaccine potentially causing harm to pregnant women and/or unborn child but fail to consider the risk if they catch CV19 while unvaccinated. 

There is no perfect solution. Both carries risks, but it seems the decision being taken now is based on a lack of proper understanding and hence, a “mis-assessment” of the different risks involved.

[4:02 pm, 18/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: This is true

[4:02 pm, 18/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: I would think a couple who tried so hard to conceive won't take the risk

[4:02 pm, 18/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: however, pregnant ladies are encourage to take some cold and cough vaccines

[4:03 pm, 18/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: i think whooping cough vaccine or something

[4:05 pm, 18/08/2021] +An fan: http://www.wral.com/coronavirus/duke-unc-see-unexpected-covid-19-clusters-among-vaccinated-students/19824920/

[4:06 pm, 18/08/2021] +Joseph Ong: if the G is confident and/or have strong scientifically back evidence/data showing that CV19 impact on the young is not something to be concerned about, then now is the time to share it!

If it doesn’t, or there is nothing to support the current confidence that we can move into endemic stage without having a viable vaccine for the young and no proven therapeutics in the event one catches CV19, then we should reconsider the decision to open.

[4:09 pm, 18/08/2021] +Suma pamu: +1

[4:16 pm, 18/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: I think fully opening up right now is not a good idea too.

[4:18 pm, 18/08/2021] +Joseph Ong: Vaccinated does not mean cannot catch CV19

What the vaccine does is that it makes it harder for the virus to invade our cells and multiply. 

Viral load will be lower - over same timw period - compared to unvaccinated. 

Viral shed will be less. 

Result = Vaccinated people:

1. tend not to get as ill/sick. 

2. recover faster

3. less infectious compared to unvaccinated

Similar to a kid who has taken the chicken pox vaccine; does not mean will not catch chicken pox, but when he/she does, the symptoms are much milder and recover faster. 

Please bookmark 

Very tiring to keep having to remind whenever you come across a headline that seem to support your decision to not vaccinate. 😂

[4:18 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ah Heng: the decision to open is nail dead

[4:19 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ah Heng: reuters had an article on us opening to vaccination pax (air travel)

[4:20 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ah Heng: in all society we have people who wants and do not want to open globally, the same for vacc and do not want to vacc whatever reason

[4:21 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ah Heng: end of the day is vacc or no vacc are we able to have all outside their house put on properly the mask to protect both sides of the camp

[4:21 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ah Heng: dun forget unvacc includes the sick and child besides the stubborn

[4:22 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ah Heng: mask is here to stay and frankly whats the unholy thing about putting on mask, does it shorten one's life? does it make u look uglier forever? does it gives a stigma you are the sick one ?

[4:23 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ah Heng: we are a very funny society ... when sick dun wan see doctor , when knowing certain sickness is airborne dun wan put on mask, now with advisory to put on mask still dun wan put on properly

[4:24 pm, 18/08/2021] +Joseph Ong: My worry is not about opening to vaccinated travelers, rather, it’s about the procedure to check/verify authenticity of vaccination status and enforce QO/SHN. 

Recent sharing by close friends about how MOH staff seems overwhelmed and uncoordinated in their efforts resulting in head scratching screw ups is a real cause of concern. 

No use having “foolproof” plan on paper when implementation/enforcement is not up to scratch.

[4:24 pm, 18/08/2021] +An fan: About Chicken pox I fully agree. My kids got the chicken pox vaccine  job when they were one year old. When my nephew who stayed with us got it from school or someone my kids were not infected at all. But all these COVID-19 vaccines are still experimental to me. We do not know is there are Long term side effects.

[4:24 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ah Heng: more reports of fake papers on sale now

[4:24 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ah Heng: even in usa they caught one medical staff selling these

[4:24 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ah Heng: for 10 usd per piece

[4:25 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ah Heng: not to mentioned asia countries where well we are famous for copy cat

[4:26 pm, 18/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: I think all we are saying is fully open is not a good idea now and yet we are not close.

[4:26 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ah Heng: best to be cobservative like what we had been doing

[4:27 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ah Heng: dun jump the over the drain so fast wait fall into it again ... this time is no joke

[4:27 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ah Heng: see whathappen from changi -> red hill

[4:27 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ah Heng: and since then is every day 14 15 unrelated

[4:27 pm, 18/08/2021] +Joseph Ong: mRNA has been researched and worked on for almost 40 years. 

Given the number of people globally who have already taken the vaccine and for the period of time since. 

*It is the largest, widest and most comprehensive “trial” ever, spanning  geography, ethinicity, age, physical condition, etc…in the entire history of the world. *

If this is insufficient for you, nothing will.

[4:31 pm, 18/08/2021] +An fan: The technology used on vaccines is the first time right?

[4:33 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

But you are promoting unapproved drugs like ivermectin and hydroxychloroquine that have no effect and even have cause deaths.

[4:33 pm, 18/08/2021] +An fan: Really appreciate all  the global brave people, have to say.

[4:35 pm, 18/08/2021] +Joseph Ong: by the way, your statement that your “kids were not infected at all” is definitely wrong. 

I am sure they did not exhibit symptoms nor breakout in blisters, but that does not mean the vaccine prevented the chicken pox virus from entering their body. 

More likely than not, there was some physical separation of your nephew and your kids as soon as physical symptoms showed. And the vaccine made it more difficult to multiply quickly enough to overwhelm the system and allow your children’s immune response to counter the virus, resulting in no physically observed symptoms. 

I am also very sure that you know of cases where children vaccinated against chicken pox caught it anyways but with milder symptoms and quicker recovery times.

[4:35 pm, 18/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: My suggestion is instead of using words like Endemic or Opening, use the word “Pre” in front. Eg Pre-Endemic or Pre-Opening. It’s like a transition phase before we reach the “Endgame” yet there’s some small steps to slightly allow more activities in a very calibrated and cautious approach. See NZ lockdown after having 1 covid case again. My 2.14cenrs

[4:37 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

You seem to display that you have better medical knowledge than all the Countries health authorities & time and again - what you suggest have proven wrong - where you pick up all your misleading information from the anti-vaxx message.

[4:38 pm, 18/08/2021] +An fan: I am not a doctor, in no position to promote anything. Sharing websites info only. Because someone people did get well by that kind medicines. But also there are many people recovered without any medicine.

[4:39 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

But unfortunately your website are disapproved by WHO and all Health Authorities.

[4:39 pm, 18/08/2021] +Smiley face: Regarding the antiparasitic drug "ivermectin", it shows the number of infections and deaths of the new corona in a country that is prophylactically administered for another disease in Africa. It is necessary to thoroughly study the clinical trial, but it seems that we are at the stage where it is okay to have the patient give an informed outlet and get permission to use it. "

https://www.tokyo-np.co.jp/article/123988

[4:40 pm, 18/08/2021] +Joseph Ong: The reason mRNA is so effective and important, is because it is highly adaptable due to the way it works.

Our DNA and RNA instructs our cells - which are the building blocks of life - on what to do. 

That is why, mRNA, is so (unexpectedly) effective. 

Granted that it’s the first time it has been applied to vaccines, it does not negate any of the other facts that i had stated earlier. 

This vaccination “trial” - according to you - *is the largest, widest and most comprehensive ever, spanning  geography, ethinicity, age, physical condition, etc…in the entire history of the world. *

[4:41 pm, 18/08/2021] +An fan: You are right in a way. When my nephew shared the same room with my son, he did not show symptoms. Only when he went home he developed symptoms

[4:42 pm, 18/08/2021] +Rama: Well done

[4:43 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

And compiling all what you have posted - it is very typical of those anti-vaxx message posted by those ultra-antivaxx group from the West - mainly related to Trump supporters anti-vaxx group.

[4:43 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ben: This ties in with the earlier topic about sharing disinformation. People - please check the source of the website and if not accredited, or if in doubt - don't share! :)

[4:45 pm, 18/08/2021] +An fan: Trump got  it right? What medicine did he use? He recovered so fast. Out doctors ever used the same medicine? Or too expensive

[4:45 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

So you are better than all the medical authorities.

[4:46 pm, 18/08/2021] +Joseph Ong: The bright side of CV19 pandemic, is that it reignited interest in, and most definitely accelerate the study ans eventual use of mRNA in medicine and therapy to counter ailments like cancer and genetical anomalies in people. 

And maybe, IF ..  there are side effects from the vaccine showing up later on… mRNA may be also be the answer to reversing it.

[4:47 pm, 18/08/2021] +Smiley face: Updates:

Israel REQUIRES Covid-19 tests for aged 3+ as infections SURGE (Report)

Children as young as 3 will need to show a negative result to enter schools, swimming pools, hotels and gyms from the start of next Wednesday. (AFP)

The move comes as the Delta variant of Covid rips through Israel – despite an extensive vaccination program for adults.  Mandatory quarantine for travellers, including fully vaccinated from most countries of the world starts on Monday.

Israel already requires children aged 12 and over to show a Green Pass, which was re-introduced last month.  PM Naftali Bennett said the sate would fund unlimited tests for children aged 3-11.

[4:53 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

You are reckless in promoting disapproved drugs and misleading people.

[4:54 pm, 18/08/2021] +Rama: Dotard didn't get anything right!

[4:55 pm, 18/08/2021] +65 8248 8959: Dear contributors, please be reminded to keep to the topic that is being discussed. We have had good feedback from this group, and we hope that we can keep the discussion robust and active!

[4:55 pm, 18/08/2021] +Joseph Ong: Chicken pox is contagious from the time symptoms such as squeezing, runny nose and/fever shows. This usually precedes the appearance of blisters by 1-2 days. Even then, it requires physical exchange of fluids for the virus to transfer/spread to another host. So, if your nephew was not even exhibiting symptoms such as squeezing/fever when he was at your place, then he was not even contagious at that time.

[4:56 pm, 18/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: ICYMI here

[4:56 pm, 18/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: Here too

[4:57 pm, 18/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: And final one

[4:57 pm, 18/08/2021] +An fan: He looked very tired then. No running nose. We thought he was so lazy

[4:59 pm, 18/08/2021] +Joseph Ong: Trump's Covid-19 treatment: What is Regeneron's antibody cocktail? 

https://www.straitstimes.com/world/united-states/what-you-need-to-know-about-regenerons-covid-19-treatment

Bear in mind as well that Trump caught the original variant of CV19. 

The delta variant that is ravaging across the globe now is quite different and much more infectious and harmful.

[5:06 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ben: Expectations of the new normal: 3 day quarantine when arriving from overseas until under 12s are vaccinated, then no quarantine with a negative test, and another negative test 3 days later.

[5:07 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ben: Masks to be worn indoors, but not needed outside, once under 12s are vaccinated

[5:08 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

Mask must be worn even outdoors as long as it is in public.

[5:08 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ben: Night clubs closed until under 12s are vaccinated (yes I know under 12s don't go to clubs, but older siblings do!)

[5:09 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ben: Yes correct at the moment, but I've been asked what my expectations are for the new normal.

[5:09 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ben: Only vaccinated allowed at indoor dining, expand to groups of 8

[5:11 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ben: Cinemas to allow f&b in screenings where are audience are vaccinated

[5:12 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ben: We need to allow Singaporeans to travel and return with a 3 day quarantine if they are vaccinated and test negative. That's my hope!

[5:12 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ben: 14days makes no sense to me any more.

[5:13 pm, 18/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: Masks is here to stay perhaps for another year

[5:14 pm, 18/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: Isn't Temasek giving out free N95 masks?

[5:14 pm, 18/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: N95 is worse than surgical masks tbh lol

[5:16 pm, 18/08/2021] +Thomas: Trump is treated with Regeneron which is experimental at that time.

[5:17 pm, 18/08/2021] +Elena Woo: But you don't forget the long term effects of covid post recovery that can stay on. This is unknown part.

[5:18 pm, 18/08/2021] +Thomas: Those with Covid-19 recovered has long term effect

[5:18 pm, 18/08/2021] +Thomas: The vaccine and treatment drugs are all experimental until official apporved

[5:19 pm, 18/08/2021] +Thomas: So along the line of worry like Anti-vax .... we should not be treated even we get Covid ?

[5:19 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ah Heng: glad to see we still have people who remember abt the long term effect

[5:19 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ah Heng: of covid hahahahaha

[5:20 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ah Heng: thus personnel i think to protect one self like  WHO advert

[5:21 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ah Heng: we need different layers of protection starting with the basic -> intermediate (vaccine) -> secondary (social distant, social culture masking / sick go see doctor ) -> finally national care

[5:22 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

My close friend comments:-

We need to be realistic what endemic will look like in SG:

(1) let's not forget that the world around us is reeling from the damages of Delta variant. 

We are a tiny speck on the world map.

If we covid-proof sg like a bubble, we want SG to be a hub of many things and everything - goods, services and people moving in and out of SG. so let's be prepared to see much higher imported cases and they will spill over to community and remember not to deem the higher case numbers as failures. 

Then when do we know we are going to fail, or failing is the big question. 

(2) We once thought that vaccines will put this pandemic to an end. 

But Delta variant proved to be a game changer and rewound the clock.

We are back to heighten alerts phases and so are the rest of the world. 

Our vaccine turn out to be an imperfect vaccine and now mathematically speaking impossible to reach herd immunity. 

So the world and human race have to be on a constant lookout for the next Black Swan variant which defies traditional knowledge in infectious controls.

 I last counted there were 19 variants and our vaccines may not elicit  immunity against all of them.

[5:22 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ah Heng: of cos the best outcome is got get visit by covid with all these in place but again globally we have flaws and resistance in basic / intermediate and secondary .....

[5:23 pm, 18/08/2021] +Thomas: https://nocamels.com/2021/07/sanotize-covid-nasal-spray-israeli-pharmacies/

[5:24 pm, 18/08/2021] +Thomas: Sanotize may sell in Singapore once phase 3 proven to work. Maybe there is a light at then end of the tunnel for treatment. This is for early stage of catching Covid

[5:25 pm, 18/08/2021] +Thomas: https://www.straitstimes.com/world/middle-east/israel-nz-give-interim-approval-for-sale-of-coronavirus-nasal-spray-says-company

[5:25 pm, 18/08/2021] +Thomas: With this plus ART , we can safely open

[5:27 pm, 18/08/2021] +Joseph Ong: There will be more to come. Therapeutics together with vaccinations is what’s needed for us to achieve endemic status

[5:27 pm, 18/08/2021] +Elena Woo: With vaccine too

[5:34 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ah Heng: More than 8,700 people in Israel tested positive for COVID-19 on Tuesday, the highest number in a single day since January.

[5:34 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ah Heng: 8mins ago news

[5:35 pm, 18/08/2021] +Thomas: This pandemic; the development of drugs and vaccine is so fast that is unprecedented. Mind you, all are experimental drugs with monoclonal etc. Treatment for early, mild to severe stage of the Covid is being tested and developed. Using AI technology to seek existing drugs combination is really fascinating.

[5:35 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ah Heng: lost rack if they have social measures measures in place all these while

[5:35 pm, 18/08/2021] +Thomas: Interesting see their death rate. If low, means the Vaccine works

[5:35 pm, 18/08/2021] +Smiley face: Latest Israel SMM:

Under the new orders, private gatherings are capped at 100 people outdoors and 50 people indoors, while at event venues, the cap is 500 outdoors and 400 indoors.

Additionally, no event can surpass 75 percent of a venue’s full capacity. Mass events where there are no marked seats are capped at 1,000 people indoors and 5,000 people outdoors.

Face masks are mandatory in all closed spaces, apart from one’s place of residence, as well as in outdoor gatherings of at least 100 people. Masks were already mandatory in public indoor spaces.

Malls and other businesses were ordered to enforce social distancing and limit the number of shoppers allowed indoors.

[5:39 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ah Heng: hmm and we are seeing less report of certain countries also

[5:39 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ah Heng: so what is truth what is not and in the end is the society fighting among ourselves hahahaha

[5:43 pm, 18/08/2021] +Thomas: This is what we r doing 😊

[5:45 pm, 18/08/2021] +Suma pamu: Definitely opening up now is BIG MISTAKE

I sincerely hope i am Wrong 🙏🏽

[5:45 pm, 18/08/2021] +Thomas: On the other extreme where NZ lockdown for one case. Not a long term strategy. They will not open for couple of years which by then business will die and citizens frustrated. No society can close up for long and us , as we r international hub

[5:45 pm, 18/08/2021] +Caleb: +1

[5:46 pm, 18/08/2021] +Smiley face: ATTENTION ALL MEMBERS:

https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2021/08/grim-warning-israel-vaccination-blunts-does-not-defeat-delta

Uri Shalit, a bioinformatician at the Israel Institute of Technology (Technion) who has consulted on COVID-19 for the government. “One of the big stories from Israel [is]: ‘Vaccines work, but not well enough.’”

Numbers:

Sampling as at August 16, 2021:

154.7 severely ill patients in Israel were unvaccinated.

48.4 severely ill patients were partially vaccinated

19.8 severely ill patients were fully vaccinated

https://datadashboard.health.gov.il/COVID-19/general

https://www.google.com/search?q=israel+death+toll+covid&rlz=1C1CHBF_enSG813SG813&oq=israel+death+toll+covid&aqs=chrome..69i57j0i390l2.9489j0j4&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

[5:47 pm, 18/08/2021] +Thomas: We need a booster sooner, as virus mutates

[5:53 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

My close friend comments:-

3. So moving into endemic is necessary for SG after we have hit our highest vaccinated rate as practically as possible. 

Just remember that there's no proven path, we have to  feel every step of the riverbed as we cross the river (摸着石头过河)。

Every step of the way is a judgement call, let's stay together and not be divided if things don't turn out well as hoped or expected.

[5:57 pm, 18/08/2021] +An fan: I see only one guy wears mask. Curious

[5:58 pm, 18/08/2021] +Rama: Fast

[5:59 pm, 18/08/2021] +Ah Heng: hahahahahahahahahahaha assume is the report 600+ cases these will spread to the country they touch down....... open the cargo door and virus spread liao

[6:07 pm, 18/08/2021] +Rama: Destination  - beware !

[6:11 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: https://nocamels.com/2021/07/sanotize-covid-nasal-spray-israeli-pharmacies/

Israel develop very promising nasal spray drug that can prevent transmission, block infection of lungs and can help as treatment drugs in recovery.

Elderly and vaxx hesitant people may be coax to use this.

As some countries have given interim approval should HSA also explore this?

Elderly may feel less hesitant to take it if it is prove to be effective.

[6:14 pm, 18/08/2021] ☸️  Danny 心: 

This one can prevent transmission and cure also.

It can last 6 months.

After 6 months, spray again.

[6:35 pm, 18/08/2021] +Rama: Briton caught on video not wearing mask given 6 weeks in jail https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/courts-crime/briton-caught-on-video-not-wearing-mask-resisted-arrest-and-said-covid-19-was?utm_source=Telegram&utm_medium=Social&utm_campaign=STTG&utm_source=whatsapp&utm_medium=social-media&utm_campaign=addtoany

[6:45 pm, 18/08/2021] +REACH: Dear Contributors,

⏰ We will be closing the chat in 15 minutes ⏰

Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.

Goodnight!

Megan

[6:52 pm, 18/08/2021] +Alvin Lim: Gdnite Megan

[6:55 pm, 18/08/2021] +Smiley face: Closest to us, from highly reliable sources, Malaysia official covid death numbers could be much higher. Among the significant group is the 70 years and above with well over 70% reported cases of covid death not taking into consideration of the health conditions / stage of vaccination. Its big geographical landscape, no fault to its reporting systems as the state of medical emergencies is the order of each day!

Note: confidentiality disclaimers

[6:59 pm, 18/08/2021] +Smiley face: 18 August, 2021 

To: Our Distinguished MTF, Min-MFA Min-LAW, DMS And All Honorable Members 

Watch "新加坡力拚與病毒共存　4階段路徑圖曝光 @寰宇新聞 頻道" on YouTube

https://youtu.be/a_B9sIv4t4g

Thesis:

A Happy One Percent Problem Towards Normality. 

Perhaps Singapore is transiting to becoming an International Centre for tourists and visitors to buy vaccines of all choices from AZ to Sinopharm. The power of abundance and uniquely Singapore! 

"Simply, for each INTENDED consequence comes along one FREE UNINTENDED !"

Main:

Incoming Taiwanese tourists and visitors upon passing the PCR swab TEST (up to 99% accuracy) in Changi Airport can roam freely. If they wish to vaccinate, it will be FOC too. An unintended outcome which is good for soon to expire vaccines to productive use, this instance our tourists. 

For Taiwanese tourists that are receiving their first dose of vaccine, how about the second dose, what is the number of days under this VISA issued to Taiwanese, this case up to a month of Visa may be needed. 

Unvaccinated or partially vaccinated tourists can dine freely, it is unnecessary for tourists or visitors to PCR daily to access all of our F&B from hotels to hawker centres. 

One unintended outcome will be the partially vaccinated and the unvaccunated Singaporeans need the  PCR negative test (up to 99% accuracy) 24 hours prior to publicly dine in with family other than hawker centres and coffee shops which is capped at two person per table. 

Perhaps, the MTF should CLARIFY these small details should these allowance of conveniences be extended to all inbound guests regardless of nationalities. In the YouTube video, a Taiwanese reporter interviewed and presented quick facts on our inbound policy. Is it true or misunderstood or needs POFMA this video? 

https://covidvax.live/location/twn

Taiwan Citizens:

1) Proof of Vaccination status is not required 

2)  Passed PCR upon arrival into Changi Airport are free to roam. For positive cases, 14 days quarantine. 

3)  continuously stayed within Taiwan for the past 21 days

4)) FOC Vaccination 

Risks & Rewards:

The inbound tourism industry will begin to improve with the gradual opening up of approved countries with low covid risk. The risk of cross geography infections of D or present or future variants of covid are unavoidable risks,, this case all inbound tourists and visitors from approved countries. 

Should any tourist who is infected with covid and needs hospitalisation, is there provision for sickbeds and critically ICU beds? The cost of hospitalisation is non-subsidise and fully borne by tourist and / or their valid and chargeable insurance coverages for a spectrum of medical services from ambulance, A&E, testings and hospital stay. These unforeseeable risks must be clearly spelled and in simple explanation prior to arriving into Singapore, all inbound tourists and visitors. 

Assumption of up to 100,000 tourists and visitors in Singapore for up to 5 nites stay per week. What are the available hotel rooms less the existing reserved for quarantine purpose which is 20,000 rooms or more. A standby alternative, perhaps, allowing EMPTY private apartments or condominium units to accommodate these inbound guests. New ruling reagarding short stay of up to ONE month may be allowed subject to PRE approval from the proper authority, it can be IRAS which will be handy in collecting these short stay licenses ($20) & taxes (10%). 

Summary:

It is an amicable humane gesture to extend free vaccination to tourists and visitors. There are risks and rewards attached to each factor, there are unintended consequences or unforeseeable ones too. Holistically, a road map towards the direction of normality, perhaps, there is a greater need to standardise choices, decisions and inclusively account to our citizens, in covid times, ALL FOR ONE and ONE FOR ALL.              

                 - - END - -

[6:59 pm, 18/08/2021] +REACH: Dear Contributors,

We will be closing the chat for today.

Thank you very much for being part of our WhatsApp chat and participating actively.

Goodnight!

Megan 😊

======